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New, Fate/Stay Night PV by Ufotable
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Posted 12/29/13

MadGuru636 wrote:
Pretty sure that it's a fake...


Well all the shown clips are from Ufotable, so if it is them, I'll believe it.
I mean, they probably pulled a "Kingdom Hearts 3" on us, which is to say use old clips and stuff to psych us out while they sit in the office shouting OH GOD WHAT DO WE DOOOO, WE'RE NOT MAKING ANY PROGRESS GAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH!
LIke that KH2 HD footage when they announced KH3....damn Square Enix thinks they can fool me, but I know better!



JadeAmberTwins wrote:

You actually bring up a couple of good points here and speaking from an anime only view your kinda right, but the point the other guy was trying to make is that HF had two routes of build up to it which greatly strengthened the impact of some of the scenes while others wouldn't make sense without them. Its one of the reasons why adapting a VN is usually so difficult, if you choose one route then your going to be missing elements that were exclusive to another route, if you try and stuff everything into a single anime your usually left with pacing issues and a disjointed plot.

The point he was trying to make is that changes would have to made to HF for it to make sense and have the same impact if they desired to go down that route and only do that route, while they wouldn't if they just adapted everything(which wouldn't meet too much complaint since most fans of the VN don't like the other adaptions too much).

However your absolutely right on one thing. Most of the anime community isn't going to be looking at it like Fate Zero is a prequel to Stay Night rather its going to be Stay Night is a sequel to Zero.... if that makes sense. So Stay Night should tie up several things in Zero rather than Zero merely serving as an extension of Stay Night.... even though that was the original intention. Everything would be tied up nicely if they adapted everything but that would take time and effort I'm not sure they have, on the other hand the other option would be to go straight up original... maybe focusing on a certain aspect of one route but otherwise original content. Sorry to say anime isn't exactly known to handle that kind of adaption well...


Fate/Stay is rather unique as far as Visual Novels go. It's 3 arc's are exclusive to each other, but not to the experience. So you HAVE to know all the information given in Fate to properly enjoy UBW, and you require the struggle presented in UBW to fully feel HF. The stories do not overlap however, they're each different.

The impact/build up required by Heavens Feel has already been given through Fate/Zero. Archers story as presented in UBW is foreshadowed decently in Deen's anime adaptation. I learned everything I needed to about Archer without it being shoved down my throat, and his character can be explored properly through Ufotables upcoming adaption.

We know several things will be present in the adaptation. Among these include a conclusion to Saber's quest, continuation of Kotomine's awesome, the exploration of Archers character, and the introduction of Shirou.

What we don't know, is where they will focus the story. If they don't want to retell Fate/Zero with a disjointed mess of a plot, they should stay away from UBW, as it's Fate/Zero all over again. I'll rather they explore Rin, Sakura, and Shirou as opposed to the old-timers again. As I won't shut up about.

Not all anime studio's are able to provide original material in their adaptations, I really hope Ufotable works hard and does exactly that. Simply setting the story a week or two before the VN events can provide loads of character development and introduction to Shirou and Sakura. Which can really help the flow of the entire Anime. It's well known that episode 1 of Fate/Zero was exposition overload, as they really wanted to get that stuff out of the way. The exposition isn't important to the characters, but it's important to the audience. We know all of that, so lets sit back and enjoy our characters this time around.

Ufotable is already spending time and effort on exactly this, I'm sure they're provide us a great adaptation. I'm fearful of which they adapt, but I'm sure they'll handle multiple routes rather well. Deen didn't do too bad at adapting all of the routes, but they had plenty of other problems.
The Wise Wizard
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Posted 12/30/13

MadGuru636 wrote:

Pretty sure that it's a fake...

It is the same video that is on the official website.

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Posted 12/30/13

Felstalker wrote:

Fate/Stay is rather unique as far as Visual Novels go. It's 3 arc's are exclusive to each other, but not to the experience. So you HAVE to know all the information given in Fate to properly enjoy UBW, and you require the struggle presented in UBW to fully feel HF. The stories do not overlap however, they're each different.

The impact/build up required by Heavens Feel has already been given through Fate/Zero. Archers story as presented in UBW is foreshadowed decently in Deen's anime adaptation. I learned everything I needed to about Archer without it being shoved down my throat, and his character can be explored properly through Ufotables upcoming adaption.

We know several things will be present in the adaptation. Among these include a conclusion to Saber's quest, continuation of Kotomine's awesome, the exploration of Archers character, and the introduction of Shirou.

What we don't know, is where they will focus the story. If they don't want to retell Fate/Zero with a disjointed mess of a plot, they should stay away from UBW, as it's Fate/Zero all over again. I'll rather they explore Rin, Sakura, and Shirou as opposed to the old-timers again. As I won't shut up about.

Not all anime studio's are able to provide original material in their adaptations, I really hope Ufotable works hard and does exactly that. Simply setting the story a week or two before the VN events can provide loads of character development and introduction to Shirou and Sakura. Which can really help the flow of the entire Anime. It's well known that episode 1 of Fate/Zero was exposition overload, as they really wanted to get that stuff out of the way. The exposition isn't important to the characters, but it's important to the audience. We know all of that, so lets sit back and enjoy our characters this time around.

Ufotable is already spending time and effort on exactly this, I'm sure they're provide us a great adaptation. I'm fearful of which they adapt, but I'm sure they'll handle multiple routes rather well. DEEN didn't do too bad at adapting all of the routes, but they had plenty of other problems.


I'm saying that I agree with you on the point of the original content, if done correctly it can be done fantastically and yes a lot of the setup for it has been provided by F/Z; I'm also saying that I wouldn't mind them simply adapting the whole visual novel. A lot of fans harp on the anime version of Fate that DEEN did but its mostly hot air... it wasn't a horrible adaption but I wouldn't call it a good one either and the movie of UBW lacked a lot impact that the route did simply due to time constraints so I wouldn't call it a shining example of an adaption either even if it looked pretty. Because of this I don't really feel as though redoing the two routes DEEN touched upon is a horrible idea since many fans are dissatisfied with them and a full adaption would still provide the proper follow up to F/Z so that isn't too big a deal. Maybe I might be too stuck in the mindset of F/Z being the prequel rather than F/SN being the sequel which is the case of the anime ufotable is doing but I thoroughly enjoyed the F/SN VN (my favorite series is Fate after all) so I can't really see how doing everything would be a bad thing since I found all three routes to be good but I can see your point about some redundancy in doing so (Kiritsugu was based on Archer for example... although personally I find their similarities more tragic than redundant though).

Logically making an original story is the best choice but while Ufotable has been known for making good adaptions, but those good adaptions have never really done original content. They can't do that with one route here because like you said you need those other routes to fully appreciate the series. Like they can't simply make a faithful of only the HF and have it be... faithful, as we would have no resolution to Saber (essentially made into a mini boss in this route) Archer would not be touched upon with the depth needed but we would have Kotomine be awesome (he was beyond epic in the HF route) and I honestly fear this kind of adaption more than I'd like to admit.

TL;DR I agree that original content is probably the best way but if they just adapted everything I'd be happy and it would properly follow up the F/Z anime, but under no circumstances can they simply copy paste one route into an anime and expect it to properly follow as a sequel to the F/Z anime.
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Posted 12/30/13
What's interesting is I think Shiro's reputation is almost as bad as Shinji's, albeit for different reasons. It might just be a state-side thing, but I wonder if they'll have any trouble selling him as a protagonist to a generation that's grown up making fun of him on the internet. Even just watching the PV, I kinda winced every time I saw him.

I haven't seen DEEN's Fate/Stay Night though, so maybe he's not that bad. His reputation isn't the best, though.
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Posted 12/30/13

Insomnist wrote:

What's interesting is I think Shiro's reputation is almost as bad as Shinji's, albeit for different reasons. It might just be a state-side thing, but I wonder if they'll have any trouble selling him as a protagonist to a generation that's grown up making fun of him on the internet. Even just watching the PV, I kinda winced every time I saw him.

I haven't seen DEEN's Fate/Stay Night though, so maybe he's not that bad. His reputation isn't the best, though.


ooh, Shirou has the benefit of a "the adaptation was bad" excuse. He's just as bad as Shinji, but for different reasons.

First and foremost, he's not a generic protaganist, he's his own person. When he makes a decision I wouldn't make, I'm cool with it.
Every decision he makes, is sexist and really really stupid. Like, don't fight Saber, you're a mystical hero who's impervious to death, killed thousands, and you're only alive right now to fight an epic fight with other epic heroes....but you're a woman...so no fighting! Bad Saber! Leave that to the men!

And you know, he wants to be the character Kiritsugu was in Fate/Zero, but lacks any of the skills or abilities to do such.

Fate/Stay Night was about Shirou's growth as a character, and Ufotable is in the position to make it great. The original Deen adaptation really failed in this, which so did the source material.


In the original VN, you HAD to play each route in order to unlock the next. So you saw the end of Fate before you ever saw Unlimited Blade works, and you saw UBW before you ever touched Heavens Feel.

Chronologically, Heavens Feel is experienced last. It's the grand ending to the entire Visual Novel, and it provides that same feel. Some of the characters don't get the happy go lucky endings they did in previous routes, some of them are straight up killed and the spotlight shifts towards someone else.

Yeah, every one of my posts are the same, but damn it I want some Heavens Feel adaptations going on! Those who think differently please do keep trying to convince me otherwise, because I'm still fearful they're not doing Heavens Feel.
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Posted 12/30/13
But why would a Japanese trailer have only English words in it?
The Wise Wizard
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Posted 12/30/13

MadGuru636 wrote:

But why would a Japanese trailer have only English words in it?

Type-Moon and ufotable would normally be in English text even in Japan (just check credits of any show they are associated with). English text has a "cool" factor in Japan, and far more Japanese have at least a passing understanding of it than most Americans do of any second language. Keep in mind we are discussing a series that has its own title in large stylized English text.

Except for "THE STORY...CONTINUED...FOR...NEXT.. GENERATION...CHILDREN" and "THE HOLY GRAIL...RETURN" (rather typical Engrish), that is it for English text, then there is this:



So it isn't even "only English words".


Keep in mind news sites such as ANN have reported on this and linked to the video.

You also have provided no explanation for why the official website has the same video (although you would need a VPN or proxy to view that one).
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Posted 12/30/13
In that case I'm hyped!
EmpReb 
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Posted 12/30/13
As someone who Saw Fate/Zero with ZERO no back ground in Fate/Stay night... I just want them to make it flow straight from Zero into this new Stay night smoothly. Because of that I really don't care about the route as much as they pull off what Zero was again... which means maybe they do a lot more original plot than everyone thinking its one route or another from the VN.
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Posted 12/30/13

EmpReb wrote:

As someone who Saw Fate/Zero with ZERO no back ground in Fate/Stay night... I just want them to make it flow straight from Zero into this new Stay night smoothly. Because of that I really don't care about the route as much as they pull off what Zero was again... which means maybe they do a lot more original plot than everyone thinking its one route or another from the VN.


That's why we're arguing. Fate/Zero was written with Fate/Stay Night in mind.
Fate/Stay had a lot of exposition and blanks left over, which they explore themselves. Fate/Zero is all "Yo dawg, I heard you like prequels" on us. Think Star Wars and how they flow better if you haven't seen the prequels, Darth Vader's epic reveal is always best when you're viewing it from Luke's perspective.

This time however, they've the chance to run as tho Fate/Zero is the back ground. They can't ignore the stories to come, and they shouldn't have too. The themes of both shows are parallel here, Fate/Stay Night always acted like all it's characters were reliving the previous(Fate/Zero's) war's events ALL OVER AGAIN, and it was up to them to prevent the same mistakes. Some routes they did, some they didn't.

Seriously, I'm on edge. I want this to go well damn it. I want to remove Fate/Stay Night OFF the Guilty Pleasures list and onto the must recommend.
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Posted 12/30/13 , edited 12/30/13

Felstalker wrote:

Oh, it WILL be difficult. Unlike Fate/Zero, they are adapting the original Fate/Stay Night Visual Novel. Artistic License will be invoked heavily.
Now, the first 2 routes have already been adapted by other companies, and Ufotable would be re-hashing old content back in viewers faces. It'll be like Rebuild Evangelion Movie 1 or Zeta Gundam New Translation 1 all over again. We don't need that, I couldn't sit through the unlimited Bladeworks movie without skipping the first 10 minutes.


Watching the original adaptations of the Fate/Franchise, I've seen a bunch of things. I don't want to see most of them again. I'll be honest and say I'm only partially through with the VN, probably a third through Fate, as i just started just before Christmas.

I want to see a story about Shirou and Sakura, and I believe this adaptation has the ability to tell this story WITHOUT stepping on the shoes of other characters. We know Saber, don't rehash her. We saw Gilgamesh, don't flaunt him again.

Fate's greatest reveals and twists depended on us not knowing/seeing Fate/Zero's story. It introduced a setting Fate/Zero has already done.
UBW's retells the story of Kiritsugu, and perhaps gives a more positive ending to the same choices. I believe that cheapens Fate/Zero and Shirou's character as a whole. Archer doesn't need to change, but Shirou does. UBW exists primarily to assist Heavens Feel and the impact HF makes on the viewer.
Heavens Feel provides a proper conclusion to all of the character's, Shirou, Sakura, Rin, and Saber.

Besides, who doesn't want to see more Dark Saber? Perhaps you feel Saber's character isn't served as well as it could be in Heavens Feel?

Sorry for the long response, I simply feel this is the better story option, and small things can be properly introduced, explained, or edited. They have the ability to make a good adaptation, and I feel Fate and UBW's are poor adaption choices by default. The setting has already been introduced, this can be a Fate/Zero sequel. Relationships are something often seen in Seinen anime, and god damn do they have a chance to go that route, please Ufotable do go that route and make me care!



You and Me seem to have two opposite views on Kiritsugu ideals.


Onto the changes needed to be made: you are bassically advocating ufotable doing exact same thing Studio DEEN did and that is stuffing ~50-60 hours of VN material into a single route, which in itself invalidates the key deus ex machina of that route AND Ataraxia itself. I am not sure its even possible and it would come out no better than previous adaptation, although with less latex.

Onto F/0 focus:
F0 had FOUR focus points:
- Kerry's ideal.
- Saber's Wish/idealism.
- Matou nihilism.
- Tohsaka cynicism/pragmatism.

The first directly connect to all three routes, while other three get handled per route. Saber is just as much of a focus as those other points and Waver plotline arguablye is extension of Saber's development.

Onto Shirou's character:


Now onto Sakura and insults - with all due respect every heroine not getting her story finished is insult.


The last thing ufotable should do is try to mix and match a complex 60 hour work that focuses on three parallel realities and relies on them to make sense of its plot. As shown by DEEN, it simply does not work. F/0 already had some problems in characterization for cutting out certain scenes near the end and that was just a few scenes in F/0 - and let me remind you that F/0 length is pretty much around ONE route. And you are proposing doing what damaged F/0 a bit to the content three times that amount. It just would not work in any way shape or form.



Felstalker wrote:

Fate/Stay is rather unique as far as Visual Novels go. It's 3 arc's are exclusive to each other, but not to the experience. So you HAVE to know all the information given in Fate to properly enjoy UBW, and you require the struggle presented in UBW to fully feel HF. The stories do not overlap however, they're each different.

The impact/build up required by Heavens Feel has already been given through Fate/Zero. Archers story as presented in UBW is foreshadowed decently in Deen's anime adaptation. I learned everything I needed to about Archer without it being shoved down my throat, and his character can be explored properly through Ufotables upcoming adaption.

We know several things will be present in the adaptation. Among these include a conclusion to Saber's quest, continuation of Kotomine's awesome, the exploration of Archers character, and the introduction of Shirou.

What we don't know, is where they will focus the story. If they don't want to retell Fate/Zero with a disjointed mess of a plot, they should stay away from UBW, as it's Fate/Zero all over again. I'll rather they explore Rin, Sakura, and Shirou as opposed to the old-timers again. As I won't shut up about.

Not all anime studio's are able to provide original material in their adaptations, I really hope Ufotable works hard and does exactly that. Simply setting the story a week or two before the VN events can provide loads of character development and introduction to Shirou and Sakura. Which can really help the flow of the entire Anime. It's well known that episode 1 of Fate/Zero was exposition overload, as they really wanted to get that stuff out of the way. The exposition isn't important to the characters, but it's important to the audience. We know all of that, so lets sit back and enjoy our characters this time around.

Ufotable is already spending time and effort on exactly this, I'm sure they're provide us a great adaptation. I'm fearful of which they adapt, but I'm sure they'll handle multiple routes rather well. Deen didn't do too bad at adapting all of the routes, but they had plenty of other problems.




And with this I will forever disagree.

The only connection between F/0 Ideals and Shirou ideal is ARCHER. Shirou version of the ideal is never touched upon as it is explored in fate. And the conflict of ideal versus the world is skimmed upon as Kerry is someone who ALREADY arrived to his OWN conclusion. For Shirou to simply repeat the same exact thing would be overall bad writing. That's why you have to have other two routes in terms of ideal.

HF focuses SOLELY on:


Frankly with filler-RIn plotlines in F/0 that ufotable added I am even more sure they are not just planning to do HF.

As you said yourself. Its an epilogue part of the VN. But that's in terms of concepts and narrative, not storyline. It answers questions given in other routes(and NOT F/0). But the questions need to be asked first ,hence the need of other routes.

Also F/0 is meant to be watched AFTER FSN, its not meant to replace it. It just fills in even more gaps just like HF, but it can't replace a 60 hour narrative work of FSN.


EmpReb wrote:

As someone who Saw Fate/Zero with ZERO no back ground in Fate/Stay night... I just want them to make it flow straight from Zero into this new Stay night smoothly. Because of that I really don't care about the route as much as they pull off what Zero was again... which means maybe they do a lot more original plot than everyone thinking its one route or another from the VN.




This is VERY hard to do as F/0's plotlines are essentially solved in THREE different parallel universes that FSN covers. The whole point of Fate Stay Night is that the actions of the character lead to three different outcomes, exploring three different aspects of F/0.

Doing original plot yet again would be controversial. The previous adaptation tried that and failed spectacularly(and frankly if ufotable pulled anything like that majority of type moon fanbase would be against them adapting Tsukihime when that eventually happens) and frankly ufotable so far has been VERY faithful with its adaptations only cutting out some stuff or expanding other stuff.
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Posted 12/30/13
Looks pretty good XD
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Posted 12/30/13 , edited 12/30/13

Kitanishi wrote:



You bring up a lot of good points and I can't edit them out. I'll have to use a big old spoiler over the thing and try not to type too much.

Keep in mind, we're talking about a full sized anime adaptation here. Fate/stay Night is a 60-80 Hour VN, split across 3 routes. Removing the exposition, be it introduction exposition episode or sequel to Fate/zero ignore exposition, will give time them time to work out some extra kinks.

The 3 "parallel universes" of the Fate franchise are something I tend to call 'indecisive writing" They're not repeating universes, the knowledge given in Fate and UBW are important, but they do not make the story run. Fate/stay Night isn't Muv-Luv and Muv-Luv Alternative. The story here does not require a rehash and a repeat. The characters of Archer and Saber can be explored, the series will have time for this, creative writing will be invoked, but VN's HF route had the space to ignore their stories. They were already told were they not?

Looking over the three routes, they will have a lot of editing ahead of them. Shirou presented in Fate is an infamously bad character, while I find UBW to be waaaay too focused on Archer and bad "pretend Fate already happened" story telling. You are right when you say the first two routes are required knowledge for Heavens Feel to have the proper effect. I do not feel those two routes should to be told to their ending.
I've always found Fate's ending to be rather lacking, and UBW to lack an ending. Heaven's Feel is still the ending I'll suggest they go for, and the reason we're getting no news is they're probably debating this exact same thing. It's a lot of work, the ending most suited for Fate/Zero, and the one un-animated route, should provide the most viewer interest.

Deen's heavy handed Adaptation might be horrible and bad, but it did convey the information required. It included characterization for Shirou, Saber, Archer, and Rin.
Deen decided to drop Sakura and everything associated with her.
Ufotable has already set up Sakura's character. Rin's character arc easily ties into Sakura.

The primary question, is how can they keep Saber and Archers stories when going for a Heavens Feel route. I think they can do it.
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Posted 12/31/13
so does anybody in here that follows Ufotable on twitter got a PM,?

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I can't wait for it to come out. But am dissapointed at how movies/anime go through a series then add another series which starts befor the originals. eg STAR WARS. FNSN. ????? it also makes it hard to follow plot/storyline.
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