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Post Reply Madoka Magica and why I don't like it as much as everyone else.
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Posted 4/17/14
A thought that i keep bringing up: For those who love Madoka, why do you hate School Days?

I mean, if all you look for in anime are twists and a dark theme, shouldn't those two be you favorites?
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Posted 4/17/14
Too lazy to read it all right now, so just skimmed through it.
Well, for me, what made me love Madoka so much were its character interactions, that outstanding Animation, that freaking beautiful OST that I just don't get tired of listening to, and those tear-jerking scenes.(Probably lots more different aspects too, but my brain is half dead right now).
For the dark part, as a fan of cuteness and fluffiness I would've honestly been happier with a happier plot development with this quality, but the series was still a masterpiece and I surprisingly loved the dark plot, and since it's still an on-going project I can expect some happy endings, if Urobuchi has a change of heart that is.
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Posted 4/17/14 , edited 4/17/14

BLACKOUTMK2 wrote:


Insomnist wrote:

Before reading, will any of these spoilers be for the third movie, or just the TV series?

Just the TV series. This topic is entirely about the TV series alone based on its own merit.
Gotcha, I just didn't want to start reading and end by kicking myself.

It's been a long time since I watched the series so I can't speak about specific pacing issues, but something that struck me from it was how the plot deftly interwove surprise ("result of an expectation that is revealed to be incorrect") and suspense ("a delay in fulfilling an established expectation") throughout the series.

    If form is a pattern of elements, we would expect that those elements fulfill functions. They do something in the larger whole. Of any element in a film we can ask, "What are its functions?" ... In asking about formal function, therefore, we ask ... "What is this element doing there?" and "How does it cue us to respond?"

For example, the series initially invests itself in drawing a parallel between Mami and Homura. Mami is the happy, go-lucky magical girl, while Homura is a figure of menace. When Mami died it wasn't just for shock factor, all the happy themes she embodied died with her, plunging the series into a darker place with Homura as its guardian.

It's like if there were two parallel train tracks; we throught we were on the Mami track, but when it turned off we kept going straight. It turns out we were on the Homura track all along, hence surprise. Later the series parallels Miki and Sakura. And then there are the Homura reveals and flashbacks, which add complexity by breaking chronology.

The structure of the thing is just really well put together, in my mind. It's like asking someone why they liked The Sixth Sense. They'll often talk about the big twist at the end, but really what they mean is the pattern of events, of which the big twist is the climax. For example, Shyamalan's The Village also had a big twist. But the pattern wasn't as strong.

Also, shocking events in the series have deeper meaning as they are used to punctuate key points in the pattern.

After Mimi and Homura, there were still unanswered questions. We knew the story was dark, but we didn't know if it was going to be hopeful or not. This is where Miki and Sakura step in, with their contrasting viewpoints and diegetic experiences. The story could've given Miki a happy ending, and when it didn't it punctuated a key juncture in the pattern.

These are just examples, but the patterns in Mahou Shoujo Madoka Magica are well thought out, and are presented in a more complex manner than your usual fare. Much of Homura's causal motivation is also withheld for a significant amount of time until just the right moment, further heightening suspense before the impending Walpurgis Night.

There are some people who just like on these kind of intricacies, and who will like a show that embodies them. In a way, it's a mode of storytelling that's akin to being its own genre. By intricate and complex I don't mean you need to be a rocket scientist, you might not even have to think hard about it. But you can appreciate the pattern all the same.

Much as though it were a piece of embroidery, I guess.

Looking at embroidery isn't difficult, but you can still appreciate the skill behind it. Same with appreciating a painting.
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Posted 4/17/14

GoldTStar wrote:

A thought that i keep bringing up: For those who love Madoka, why do you hate School Days?

I mean, if all you look for in anime are twists and a dark theme, shouldn't those two be you favorites?


School days is a harem, and Makoto is a douche. Then again, Madoka can be a harem, and Kyuube is the douche.

#logic
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Posted 4/17/14 , edited 4/17/14

GoldTStar wrote:

A thought that i keep bringing up: For those who love Madoka, why do you hate School Days?

I mean, if all you look for in anime are twists and a dark theme, shouldn't those two be you favorites?


Wait, School Days was a twist? I mean after nailing so many insane chicks, the chances of a man getting out alive reduces to 0.01 hahaha
As for being dark eh not so much, at least got to see an aired harem with getting laid.

Side Note: <--Does not hate School Days, one tof the epitome of harems, Mako got shit done while still being brainless as F.
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Posted 4/17/14
Anyways it's been a while since I've watch Madoka, but if I had to think of things other than it being dark that I enjoyed it would be the pacing of the show.

In regards to Mami, if I remember correctly the show talked about how they started going on patrol with her which lead me to believe that there was a slight time skip of a few weeks/months.

In addition it seemed like Homura's use of time travel was causing some of the prior Madoka's memories to bleed into the current one. Though, the only example I can think of off hand would be Madoka seeing the final fight right at the start of the first episode in a dream and being able to somewhat recognize Homura because of it. So it's possible that part of the reason Madoka took Mami's death so hard was because bits and pieces of her adventures with Mami from other timelines were in her subconscious.

Of course I could be wrong =P
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Posted 4/17/14

AnimeKami wrote:


GoldTStar wrote:

A thought that i keep bringing up: For those who love Madoka, why do you hate School Days?

I mean, if all you look for in anime are twists and a dark theme, shouldn't those two be you favorites?


School days is a harem, and Makoto is a douche. Then again, Madoka can be a harem, and Kyuube is the douche.

#logic


Best logic.
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Posted 4/17/14 , edited 4/17/14

GoldTStar wrote:

A thought that i keep bringing up: For those who love Madoka, why do you hate School Days?

I mean, if all you look for in anime are twists and a dark theme, shouldn't those two be you favorites?


If you assume that some people like something more than you because they're shallow, then... well, that's the sort of question you're going to ask. The OP seems to make largely the same point. Yes, some people do like Madoka just because it's dark and subversive and shocking. Some people like Game of Thrones because it's violent and supposedly there are boobs in it; that doesn't mean the show itself has no substance.

I like it for very personal reasons, and because it is not merely dark and horrifying, but instead meshes very dark content with very hopeful and inspiring content better then anything else I've ever seen. If you prefer a gigantic intellectual analysis, this series is quite good.
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Posted 4/17/14
I havent read anything here, because I haven't watched this yet.

But Im very sad I didnt get to watch this as it aired. Cause by this point Ive heard so much about its mood whiplash kind of wish I didnt know.
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Posted 4/17/14 , edited 4/17/14
I saw Madoka for the first time about 2 weeks ago. I agree that it was dark and had a pretty good plot to it. My problem with the show however...was the character's interactions with one another.



I give this show a 7/10. It was good but I don't think it was as great as everyone says it is, but then again this is all based on my own experience with the show. I will say this however, I have grown to like it a little more once I finished it. I can't really describe it...this is the first series that I find it hard to get off my mind and move on. It certainly has a lingering effect like I was mindf**ked so hard that it saturated my cognitive thinking...if that makes any sense to anyone.
Posted 4/17/14 , edited 4/17/14

BLACKOUTMK2 wrote:
I'd also prefer if we can keep this civil and not go fullmetal elitist.


LOL at that term.

Anyways, your wording saved you. Topic title says spoilers, but I'd feel guilty if anyone accidentally clicked the link and saw my post, so..


I do agree with you a little because every post I ever see says it is great for the same reasons you mostly cited and I'd relate it to other things that appear as moeblob just to contrast with all the blood and gore that THAT story has (I'm being vague to not start a flame war - a few stories that fit that I collect the merchandise for it, others I think just tried to use the shock factor tastelessly).


Edit-
Accidentally divided what I wanted in the spoiler - fixed it.
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Posted 4/17/14

Insomnist wrote:
There are some people who just like on these kind of intricacies, and who will like a show that embodies them. In a way, it's a mode of storytelling that's akin to being its own genre. By intricate and complex I don't mean you need to be a rocket scientist, you might not even have to think hard about it. But you can appreciate the pattern all the same.


That's very much true in my case. There are lots of little details that are easily missed in the show. For instance, there are a number of visual references to Western art. The incorporation of Guernica was particularly inspired. Themes and symbolism can provide a lot of extra depth to a show. I tend to appreciate it when a show aspires to do more than just the typical fare we get.

If it was solely about darkness or shock, other shows do that better, like Bokurano as xxJing said. That show is a dark train-wreck gut punch.
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Posted 4/17/14
I found the series enjoyable even though it felt short and Madoka finally transformed but at the end of the series.
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Posted 4/17/14
Same with me.

I watched it and I was entertained from the very first episode to the last one. However I did not see anything extraordinary about it, the plot twists did not surprise me, and I found the characters particularly average. One thing I thought was outstanding was the music. HOly shit the music was amazing.
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Posted 4/17/14 , edited 4/17/14

deadpanditto wrote:


Insomnist wrote:
There are some people who just like on these kind of intricacies, and who will like a show that embodies them. In a way, it's a mode of storytelling that's akin to being its own genre. By intricate and complex I don't mean you need to be a rocket scientist, you might not even have to think hard about it. But you can appreciate the pattern all the same.

That's very much true in my case. There are lots of little details that are easily missed in the show. For instance, there are a number of visual references to Western art. The incorporation of Guernica was particularly inspired. Themes and symbolism can provide a lot of extra depth to a show. I tend to appreciate it when a show aspires to do more than just the typical fare we get.

The OP to Elfen Lied is similar if on a smaller/more compact scale. All the paintings in it are real.

It added an interesting commentary on the characters within the context of the paintings.
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