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Post Reply Kuroshitsuji (Black Butler) Manga WARNING SPOILERS
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Posted 12/5/15 , edited 12/5/15

Sogno- wrote:

what do you guys make of the not-so-subtle BL undertones?


As much as I think Bassy is hot, I don't really read this for the HoYay. TBH, I find the HoYay between Ciel and Bassy a little too Michael Jacksonish at times.


I just like Toboso and the fact that I love Gothic stories. I really like the fact that Toboso is up on her English literature with her references and the fact that she's a good artist/writer.


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Posted 12/6/15
When I first started reading this manga I absolutely adored it. And it's still my favourite manga. I just love the characters so much. But in the latest arc



WHAT IS HAPPENING?! DO THEY NOT TEACH HISTORY IN JAPAN?!
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Posted 12/7/15 , edited 12/7/15

eclair-lumiere wrote:

When I first started reading this manga I absolutely adored it. And it's still my favourite manga. I just love the characters so much. But in the latest arc



WHAT IS HAPPENING?! DO THEY NOT TEACH HISTORY IN JAPAN?!


Actually, sarin gas and mustard gas were around in the Victorian era. I read that even Toboso-san was surprised to learn that. Of course, she does use a lot of anachronism. A Nintendo-like game within the first chapter of the entire series, for one. There is soon after a reference to a TV show, and that Ciel has a TV prototype, but nothing like that would have been available yet (and how would he get a program to watch?).

And yeah, she's got 1880's Germany using tech not available until WWII (those tanks)... And gearing up for war, but again anachronisms abound in this series. In order to get around it, she invented the Campania, since the Titanic didn't happen until 1912, and it's too famous to suggest it happened any earlier.

I've seen the Ciel twin theories, and though it's not quite definitive, there is some major evidence to support the claims.

Undertaker tells Diedrich that Vincent is "still with us", but I think he might have committed suicide before the dismemberment and fire. If that's the case, then he could now be a newly recruited reaper....

I strongly believe that Undertaker is related to the Phantomhives, in fact I think he's a direct ancestor of Ciel. He's too old to be Ciel's grandfather... Unless he actually fathered a child after becoming a reaper, and that's a bit too odd, even for me. I think he might be up another generation, like Cloudia Phantomhive's father. Either way, Undertaker was definitely betrayed by a woman, probably leading to his suicide. His obsession with Bizarre Dolls who are better now that their mouths don't tell lies.... Oh, he was betrayed, all right.
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Posted 12/9/15



Actually, sarin gas and mustard gas were around in the Victorian era. I read that even Toboso-san was surprised to learn that. Of course, she does use a lot of anachronism. A Nintendo-like game within the first chapter of the entire series, for one. There is soon after a reference to a TV show, and that Ciel has a TV prototype, but nothing like that would have been available yet (and how would he get a program to watch?).

And yeah, she's got 1880's Germany using tech not available until WWII (those tanks)... And gearing up for war, but again anachronisms abound in this series. In order to get around it, she invented the Campania, since the Titanic didn't happen until 1912, and it's too famous to suggest it happened any earlier.

I've seen the Ciel twin theories, and though it's not quite definitive, there is some major evidence to support the claims.

Undertaker tells Diedrich that Vincent is "still with us", but I think he might have committed suicide before the dismemberment and fire. If that's the case, then he could now be a newly recruited reaper....

I strongly believe that Undertaker is related to the Phantomhives, in fact I think he's a direct ancestor of Ciel. He's too old to be Ciel's grandfather... Unless he actually fathered a child after becoming a reaper, and that's a bit too odd, even for me. I think he might be up another generation, like Cloudia Phantomhive's father. Either way, Undertaker was definitely betrayed by a woman, probably leading to his suicide. His obsession with Bizarre Dolls who are better now that their mouths don't tell lies.... Oh, he was betrayed, all right.


hearing that mustard gas was around in the Victorian era makes me feel better. That is accurate at least then I suppose.

As for the things like the reference to the tv, they do really bother me. Of course I can't control what any mangaka does with their work but I strongly believe that if you pick a certain time period then you should stick to it and not throw in stuff from the future. The Campania thing doesn't annoy me though because even though it is based on the Titanic which didn't happen until much later, it's a ship that sank when hitting an iceberg. In the victorian era they had ships and they had icebergs so that could still of happened.
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Posted 12/9/15

eclair-lumiere wrote:




Actually, sarin gas and mustard gas were around in the Victorian era. I read that even Toboso-san was surprised to learn that. Of course, she does use a lot of anachronism. A Nintendo-like game within the first chapter of the entire series, for one. There is soon after a reference to a TV show, and that Ciel has a TV prototype, but nothing like that would have been available yet (and how would he get a program to watch?).

And yeah, she's got 1880's Germany using tech not available until WWII (those tanks)... And gearing up for war, but again anachronisms abound in this series. In order to get around it, she invented the Campania, since the Titanic didn't happen until 1912, and it's too famous to suggest it happened any earlier.

I've seen the Ciel twin theories, and though it's not quite definitive, there is some major evidence to support the claims.

Undertaker tells Diedrich that Vincent is "still with us", but I think he might have committed suicide before the dismemberment and fire. If that's the case, then he could now be a newly recruited reaper....

I strongly believe that Undertaker is related to the Phantomhives, in fact I think he's a direct ancestor of Ciel. He's too old to be Ciel's grandfather... Unless he actually fathered a child after becoming a reaper, and that's a bit too odd, even for me. I think he might be up another generation, like Cloudia Phantomhive's father. Either way, Undertaker was definitely betrayed by a woman, probably leading to his suicide. His obsession with Bizarre Dolls who are better now that their mouths don't tell lies.... Oh, he was betrayed, all right.


hearing that mustard gas was around in the Victorian era makes me feel better. That is accurate at least then I suppose.

As for the things like the reference to the tv, they do really bother me. Of course I can't control what any mangaka does with their work but I strongly believe that if you pick a certain time period then you should stick to it and not throw in stuff from the future. The Campania thing doesn't annoy me though because even though it is based on the Titanic which didn't happen until much later, it's a ship that sank when hitting an iceberg. In the victorian era they had ships and they had icebergs so that could still of happened.

Well, I recently read on Tumblr that in Volume I of the manga, Toboso-san says that the world she's created is parallel to ours, not the exact same world. She uses that to explain how Ciel has or sees things that didn't exist at that time in our world/universe....

Still a bit weak, but that's apparently the "reason".

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Posted 12/10/15



Well, I recently read on Tumblr that in Volume I of the manga, Toboso-san says that the world she's created is parallel to ours, not the exact same world. She uses that to explain how Ciel has or sees things that didn't exist at that time in our world/universe....

Still a bit weak, but that's apparently the "reason".




Not a very good excuse really.

I recently read about the Weston College arc in the manga. Yana Toboso did a huge amount of research to find out what traditions they had in that time period, and to find out all the complex rules of cricket and various loopholes you could use to cheat. I find it odd that she put that much research into that yet throws in things like tvs and tanks later on.
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Posted 12/10/15

eclair-lumiere wrote:




Well, I recently read on Tumblr that in Volume I of the manga, Toboso-san says that the world she's created is parallel to ours, not the exact same world. She uses that to explain how Ciel has or sees things that didn't exist at that time in our world/universe....

Still a bit weak, but that's apparently the "reason".




Not a very good excuse really.

I recently read about the Weston College arc in the manga. Yana Toboso did a huge amount of research to find out what traditions they had in that time period, and to find out all the complex rules of cricket and various loopholes you could use to cheat. I find it odd that she put that much research into that yet throws in things like tvs and tanks later on.

The tanks are later, yes but the Nintendo-like game, the game controller, and the tv are in the very first volume. Seems she's doing a bit less of the anachronistic stuff as the series continues, but it's obviously not quite out of her system.... I also find it odd that she's does SO MUCH research, but throws in unnecessary futuristic stuff.

I accept it with the reapers only because it's very funny that they have access to stuff that didn't exist yet, like electric lawn mowers and chainsaws. It would be somewhat interesting if the reason for all this turns out to be intervention that's not so divine....
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Posted 12/10/15



The tanks are later, yes but the Nintendo-like game, the game controller, and the tv are in the very first volume. Seems she's doing a bit less of the anachronistic stuff as the series continues, but it's obviously not quite out of her system.... I also find it odd that she's does SO MUCH research, but throws in unnecessary futuristic stuff.

I accept it with the reapers only because it's very funny that they have access to stuff that didn't exist yet, like electric lawn mowers and chainsaws. It would be somewhat interesting if the reason for all this turns out to be intervention that's not so divine....


The reapers having up to date technology I'm okay with for some reason. But when the human characters have modern technology it does bother me a little.

I own all the black butler manga volumes so far but I don't remember the nintendo-like game. I think I'll have to reread it then... I remember seeing an image of Sebastian holding a nintendo game on a tray but I think that was just a promotional image for the Black Butler nintendo game.
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Posted 12/10/15 , edited 12/10/15
In the first chapter, a toy factory owner/manager from Italy comes to talk business and bring Ciel the game he'd requested. It was a Nintendo-like game called Mouse3.
I think it's in the next chapter where, we learn a bit about Funtom, and if you look closely at the pic of stuff they make, at the upper right of that pic is a game controller....


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