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Feminists...
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Posted 6/3/14
I am a feminist, of course, because it would be silly not be, as I am a woman. I was raised to believe that I could be anything I wanted and that I was important, just the same as my brother. And there may have been some feminist fairy tales read to me... But when I got old enough to become aware of the world as something larger than my own small circle, as all children eventually do, I discovered that I had not been born into a world that valued me equally, and it made me kind of angry. Which is reasonable, and not particularly productive. Eh. There are lots of things that annoy me. It's annoying that I have to be careful around strange men. I like men and it would be nice if I could treat you all with out suspicion. It's annoying that women are paid less than men. It's annoying that women are blamed for violence done to them. It's annoying that women and young girls are sold into sex slavery on a massive scale. And it's annoying that these are women's issues! These are human issues. Frankly, it's way beyond annoying.

I don't really want to speak for other women. Everyone has her own story and her own reasons for believing what she does. When faced with the immense frustration of a world built to discriminate against you for reasons you cannot control, anger is a pretty normal response. I imagine this is a feeling experience by racial minorities as well. If you are not a white male, things are set up in subtle and not so subtle ways to work against you, and success is that much more difficult to attain. I would like to point out, this is no one individual's fault . So quit acting like it's a personal attack. It's not at all useful, and it makes you look like a jerk. Instead, how about saying to yourself, I did not make this, I did not choose for things to be this way. But now I have the opportunity to help fix things, so I will.

I understand why many white men feel disturbed by movements like feminism, because, while feminism is only seeking equality, that will mean that men will lose something. It is not a fair exchange. But it is a just one, and in the end I think men and women will be better off.
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Posted 6/3/14

Korzz wrote:

I agree completely. I'm so fed up withthis feminism-bullshit. I used to be a feminist, at a time when it was about equal rights. Now it's more about shoving us men down in the dirt while they stand strong and act like martyr's for the society to feel bad for them. It's embarrassing what this world has come to.


You know how there are people in this world that can follow a religion and learn love and understanding from its teachings, while others can come away from the experience feeling they need to do harm anyone who doesn't believe the same thing?

Or how you could have an extremely liberal friend who, while they defend the right for a woman to be able to choose whether or not to have an abortion, they still find the decision to do so abhorrent?

Or maybe you've seen, oh, let's say a white man who has pride in being white. Many people of many ethnicities find pride in their heritage and it's never seen as inherently racist, but doesn't it become racist when the white man does it? White pride?

Do you see how asinine it sounds to suggest a person is a racist just because they have pride in who they are? Or that every liberal minded individual has to share the exact, same values as every other liberal minded individual? Or that just because you're a Christian, Muslim or Jewish person, that means you have to be either violent or ignorant, because there are many examples of people being those things in the name of religion over the course of history?

I think where a lot of this problem starts is at the ground level here. We can't even get to the topic at hand if people merely hear a word like "feminist" and assume they already know everything a person feels or represents. It's an extremely ignorant way of thinking and, personally, I feel it's a bigger issue than purely the topic of inequality. At least immediately, seeing as how we never get to any real discussions, because people get stuck on labels and whatever ill-informed connotations that come along with them.
Korzz 
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Posted 6/3/14 , edited 6/3/14

Kunami_Mata wrote:


Korzz wrote:

I agree completely. I'm so fed up withthis feminism-bullshit. I used to be a feminist, at a time when it was about equal rights. Now it's more about shoving us men down in the dirt while they stand strong and act like martyr's for the society to feel bad for them. It's embarrassing what this world has come to.


You know how there are people in this world that can follow a religion and learn love and understanding from its teachings, while others can come away from the experience feeling they need to do harm anyone who doesn't believe the same thing?

Or how you could have an extremely liberal friend who, while they defend the right for a woman to be able to choose whether or not to have an abortion, they still find the decision to do so abhorrent?

Or maybe you've seen, oh, let's say a white man who has pride in being white. Many people of many ethnicities find pride in their heritage and it's never seen as inherently racist, but doesn't it become racist when the white man does it? White pride?

Do you see how asinine it sounds to suggest a person is a racist just because they have pride in who they are? Or that every liberal minded individual has to share the exact, same values as every other liberal minded individual? Or that just because you're a Christian, Muslim or Jewish person, that means you have to be either violent or ignorant, because there are many examples of people being those things in the name of religion over the course of history?

I think where a lot of this problem starts is at the ground level here. We can't even get to the topic at hand if people merely hear a word like "feminist" and assume they already know everything a person feels or represents. It's an extremely ignorant way of thinking and, personally, I feel it's a bigger issue than purely the topic of inequality. At least immediately, seeing as how we never get to any real discussions, because people get stuck on labels and whatever ill-informed connotations that come along with them.


I agree with you completely. I just wish i would've expressed my thoughts in a different way. What I mean is that i hate what feminism stands for nowadays. Its been associated with all the wrong things. People who are extremists call themselves normal feminists. And this is the reason that I no longer see myself as a feminist. Because lately the meaning of the word "feminist" seem to have changed. Im not saying that all feminists are extremists but im saying that a lot of people hide behind the "Im a feminist"-phrase, to express their extremist beliefs and opinions.

I really understand what you mean and I know that I phrased myself horribly, I'm just so pissed off at the moment because all of these extremists are turning something really important and awesome, into something dreadful. <3
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26 / F / Spring, TX
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Posted 6/4/14
I don't consider myself a feminist. I consider myself an equalist. You have the right to buy a drink from a bartender, but don't flash your genitals for a freebie. You have the right to hire who you think is most qualified, but don't give them pay based on their sex. I suppose it's a lot like the gay marriage argument. Gay people should have the right to be as miserable and frustrated as the rest of us
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Posted 6/4/14
GK Chesterton about a hundred years ago complained about the feminists as well and while he was wrong in his views that women should not have the vote, he was right to point out that feminism doesn't have an end. It seems a new end is developed each time the old cause is won or lost. What is that modern feminists want exactly? Have they not already got equal pay? The right to vote? Get abortions whenever and why. The right to divorce whenever and for whatever reason?

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Posted 6/4/14
I go on Tumblr a lot, and there have been plenty of male-hating posts on there that I have seen circulating. They seem to blame those who raise the men to 'disrespect' women, yet when it comes down to it, only YOU can determine how you act. Your parents may raise you and influence your behavior, but it's ultimately up to the person who is acting. I honestly feel, however, that feminists have gotten a bad reputation because of these anti-male feminists who say the most ridiculous things ever. It pisses me off, because they are the ones who make the rest of the feminists look bad, when, in reality, they are just idiots.
In regards to the extreme protesting, it's really hard to get a point across when you have a ton of opposition who criticize you no matter what you say.
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Posted 6/4/14
I find it funny that most of the feminists people have spoken to are online, but the best descriptive word people can come up with is "loud". anchore is right, inequality is a systemic problem, not situational. The reason why "situational" problems exist is because society breeds them. That is systemic

Syndicaidramon wrote:

I see some people in this thread have a depressingly hard time differentiating between actual, true feminism and the modern tumblr feminism (feminazism)...
Feminist do disagree with each other. They comes in different ranges, there is no such thing as acting like a truer feminist (or less modern feminist ). By making blanket statements like that it stereotypes a large group of people, and thus silences them.
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26 / M / Pandemonium
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Posted 6/4/14 , edited 6/4/14

FlyinDumpling
Feminist do disagree with each other. They comes in different ranges, there is no such thing as acting like a truer feminist (or less modern feminist ). By making blanket statements like that it stereotypes a large group of people, and thus silences them.


Pretty sure female supremacy is not what real feminism is about, though...
Besides, acknowledging feminazis as true feminists is detrimental to the feminist cause. No feminist should want to be associated with feminazis.
Feminazis are to regular feminists as what Pat Robertson and Rush Limbaugh are to moderate, intelligent christians. No one likes them, and they ruin things for everyone else.
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F / Behind You
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Posted 6/4/14
Feminism is the radical notion that women are people. - Marie Shear
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22 / M / Ames, Iowa, USA
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Posted 6/4/14 , edited 6/4/14
the biggest thing blocking feminism in my opinion are all of the protection they get. Example, there was a journalist, I forget for what, who wrote an article about the men who have sex with women when they are drunk past all rational thought. He does not defend these guys for their actions, however he does point out the fact that when two people who are shit faced get together and have sex and regret it in the morning, more often than not it is the man who has to take the blunt beating from the media as well as the law. It gives off the impression that women can get as smashed as they want, and it is the men's job to look out for these girls (which both sides should agree is wrong) sure there is fallout for the women, but it usually occurs privately. I forget who said the quote but "feminism," (the bullshit we aren't equal, we're better/all men are evil) can be summed up by a comedian;
"You want equality? NO YOU DON'T. You don't want to be treated like a man, you want to be treated like a woman, and PAID like a man."
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Posted 6/4/14

Iconodule wrote:

What is that modern feminists want exactly? Have they not already got equal pay?


No.

http://www.bls.gov/opub/ted/2011/ted_20110216.htm.


The right to vote?


Yes.


Get abortions whenever and why.


Does the name Texas State Senator Wendy Davis ring a bell? She was important recently. You should look into why.


The right to divorce whenever and for whatever reason?


You honestly think that there aren't those out there that want to modify "no fault" divorce proceedings to require mutual consent? That there's no discussion to be had anymore, no point in advocacy?
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Posted 6/4/14

Syndicaidramon wrote:


FlyinDumpling
Feminist do disagree with each other. They comes in different ranges, there is no such thing as acting like a truer feminist (or less modern feminist ). By making blanket statements like that it stereotypes a large group of people, and thus silences them.


Pretty sure female supremacy is not what real feminism is about, though...
Besides, acknowledging feminazis as true feminists is detrimental to the feminist cause. No feminist should want to be associated with feminazis.
Feminazis are to regular feminists as what Pat Robertson and Rush Limbaugh are to moderate, intelligent christians. No one likes them, and they ruin things for everyone else.
The word feminazi is not seriously used and its purpose is to alienate people who identify as a feminist. Labeling people as femnazi is also a common way to dismiss things that people don't want to hear. It allows people who don't believe in feminism to decide what the feminist cause should be by deduction. I'm against it because anything that feminist say that people don't like can be sweep under the rug by calling them feminazis
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26 / M / Pandemonium
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Posted 6/4/14 , edited 6/4/14

FlyinDumpling wrote:


Syndicaidramon wrote:


FlyinDumpling
Feminist do disagree with each other. They comes in different ranges, there is no such thing as acting like a truer feminist (or less modern feminist ). By making blanket statements like that it stereotypes a large group of people, and thus silences them.


Pretty sure female supremacy is not what real feminism is about, though...
Besides, acknowledging feminazis as true feminists is detrimental to the feminist cause. No feminist should want to be associated with feminazis.
Feminazis are to regular feminists as what Pat Robertson and Rush Limbaugh are to moderate, intelligent christians. No one likes them, and they ruin things for everyone else.


The word feminazi is not seriously used and its purpose is to alienate people who identify as a feminist. Labeling people as femnazi is also a common way to dismiss things that people don't want to hear. It allows people who don't believe in feminism to decide what the feminist cause should be by deduction. I'm against it because anything that feminist say that people don't like can be sweep under the rug by calling them feminazis


I have a hard time relating to this. When has this ever happened? It makes no sense.
And how is feminazi used to describe anything other than the extremists?

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Posted 6/4/14

Syndicaidramon wrote:

I have a hard time relating to this. When has this ever happened? It makes no sense.
And how is feminazi used to describe anything other than the extremists?
Are you a feminist?
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26 / M / Pandemonium
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Posted 6/4/14 , edited 6/4/14

FlyinDumpling wrote:


Syndicaidramon wrote:

I have a hard time relating to this. When has this ever happened? It makes no sense.
And how is feminazi used to describe anything other than the extremists?
Are you a feminist?


Well I support equal rights and equal treatment of women, as well as breaking down arbitrary and pointless gender roles and expectations, as well as encouraging women to take more part in traditionally male dominated professions. Like science for instance... Does that make me qualified?
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