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Is an Order absolute!?
Posted 7/12/14
Nothing is absolute.... Except for that last phase.... Which is absolute.... About stating the impossibility of anything being absolute...
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22 / M / Ames, Iowa, USA
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Posted 7/12/14
No order is absolute. Just look at the Jedi
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Posted 7/12/14
If it goes completely against my morals, such as harming anyone in anyway, then I will not follow pursuit.

... But, in general, not all the time. I feel like within any order given, a mistake can easily be made, forcing situations to change. And perhaps they get the longer end of the stick and whoever issued the orders are content with the way things went? ;D
Jonexe 
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Posted 7/13/14 , edited 7/13/14

Chopsuey9444 wrote:


BlueOni wrote:

I will obey any lawful order coming from the person placed in command of me. If I am issued a lawful order from any other superior which either conflicts with my standing orders or requires my commander's judgment prior to proceeding, I will check with said commander prior to obeying it. If I am given the go-ahead in that situation, I obey the order. If I am not, I don't.

The point is that orders aren't absolute, but lawful orders obtained from legitimate authorities must be obeyed.


Even if the order is unethical?


In the US military, where the above view point is actually military law; an unethical order is very... very likely not a lawful one.

Extreme example: You are not following a lawful order when told to kill an unarmed civilian. You are not following a lawful order when told to beat a prisoner. Etc etc.

This is the very reason why "I was only following orders" is not an acceptable excuse in a court martial/war crimes trial. You are expected to use good judgement and ethical thinking before blindly following any order.
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It doesn't matter.
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Posted 7/13/14
I would never agree to fight someone else's battles for them and if I were conscripted, I'd escape.
War decides who's left, instead of right.
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29 / M / Traviling The Voi...
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Posted 7/13/14
It depends on who ordered you if its your commanding officer then yes but if the order is outrages and you know its eather going to get you killd or ur unit killd then u dont follow it and there are military laws that allow you to break a order if it does something like that
Posted 7/13/14 , edited 7/13/14
If it was to save humanity, of course I would do it. Ten million people is much less than 7.024 BILLION.
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23 / M / CO, USA
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Posted 7/13/14 , edited 7/13/14
Tools obey without question. Sentient beings ask before acting. Or so I hope.

But this is a rather bad question to ask a Misanthropist...
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Posted 7/13/14

Jonexe wrote:

In the US military, where the above view point is actually military law; an unethical order is very... very likely not a lawful one.

Extreme example: You are not following a lawful order when told to kill an unarmed civilian. You are not following a lawful order when told to beat a prisoner. Etc etc.

This is the very reason why "I was only following orders" is not an acceptable excuse in a court martial/war crimes trial. You are expected to use good judgement and ethical thinking before blindly following any order.


Bingo. And in the event that I was issued an order that is simultaneously lawful and something I consider to be morally wrong, I'd have to ask how serious the conflict between my ethics and my orders were. The fact is that I would not disobey lawful orders I was issued even if I did consider them to be abhorrently unethical, but such a situation would leave me to question whether I ought to consider leaving my position.

The appropriate course of action in such a situation is to complete the order, then take up any concerns I may have with my superior after the fact.
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28 / M / Clinton, NY
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Posted 7/13/14

Anamalous wrote:

Will you follow blindly any order you were given!!!!!!!


must you always follow and carry out that order!!!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

in this hypothetical situation.............

you were told (ordered/commanded) to Literally nuke a city a kill off approximately over 7 million ppl

and then let another 3 million die slowly

and your being told its for the sake of humanity


and say if you don't listen your family will be killed

or you would be made King of the country

or given 13 trillion dollars or something

for doing it


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

you don't have to use that situation

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


for me if i was given an order that would conflict with my morals and value


i simply will not follow even if i become the world most wanted traitor



if i must turn into an emiya kiritsugu (form fate/zero) i will lol

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

i have been reading a lot of manga that have this conflicting nature

+ watching anime


This is implying I am not the one giving the orders. I am the man behind the curtain.
Vodash 
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Posted 7/13/14 , edited 7/13/14
Depends on the order. If it's life/death related, I'm of the belief that the cost should always be less than the gain.

For example, if I were asked to press a button that would kill 5 people, and by not pressing it 10 people would die, I would press the button.

Another example would be if you were in Nazi Germany and were ordered to pull the switch that activates the gas chamber. I would actually accept this order on the reasoning that if I don't, I and everyone else who declines to pull the switch will be killed until someone accepts to do it. Meaning that I would theoretically be saving at least some people by pulling the switch myself.

I won't lie though, if people I deeply cared about were directly involved, I'm sure I would make entirely different decisions than I would normally.

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21 / SABER
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Posted 7/13/14

kamaitachi5587 wrote:


Anamalous wrote:

Will you follow blindly any order you were given!!!!!!!


must you always follow and carry out that order!!!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

in this hypothetical situation.............

you were told (ordered/commanded) to Literally nuke a city a kill off approximately over 7 million ppl

and then let another 3 million die slowly

and your being told its for the sake of humanity


and say if you don't listen your family will be killed

or you would be made King of the country

or given 13 trillion dollars or something

for doing it


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

you don't have to use that situation

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


for me if i was given an order that would conflict with my morals and value


i simply will not follow even if i become the world most wanted traitor



if i must turn into an emiya kiritsugu (form fate/zero) i will lol

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

i have been reading a lot of manga that have this conflicting nature

+ watching anime


This is implying I am not the one giving the orders. I am the man behind the curtain.


well i did leave it vague for many reasons lol

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28 / M / Clinton, NY
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Posted 7/13/14
If you want your command obeyed all you have to do is put sudo in front of it.
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24 / M / U.S.
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Posted 7/13/14
Depends if I'm the one giving out order or getting the order
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Posted 10/1/14
There is a set of military laws set out for the behavior of military personnel, called the Uniform code of military justice, or UCMJ for short. Besides these basic laws there is also rules and laws set forth by the Geneva conventions, and the basic rules of military orders which states a lawful order being:

Conforming to UCMJ
Conforming to Geneva conventions
Coming from a competent and right of mind leader
Promoting Military Customs or Promoting sanctioned military action.

Within these it prevents from the most trivial matter of lawful orders (the minimum size of an object you can force someone to clean with being 1 square inch) to the most extreme, (launching a nuclear missile that was not fully verified due to communication down time and an upset or trouble captain)
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