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Where does consciousness come from?
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Posted 12/13/14
How does a reductionist explain consciousness, Lala wonders?
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36 / M / Small Wooded town...
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Posted 12/14/14

RedExodus wrote:


Darkphoenix3450 wrote:


themeliorist wrote:

I don't think consciousness is spontaneously created. I think it is slowly developed as the brain and sensory organs develop.

If you get hit in the head the right way you're not you anymore. Same if you suffer late stage Alzheimer's. Everything about the mind has a physical basis, or else injury and disease would not affect it. If it were entirely non-physical (like, say, a ghost) then it would not be able to interact with your physical body and pilot it. Memories are the result of physical structures in your noggin, which is why they can be destroyed. This is why I find the idea of "remembering past lives" absurd: even if, and I'm being very generous here, you are reincarnated as a different person, your new brain doesn't have the neurons and synapses your old one did, so none of the memories of your past life could be encoded there.

I don't see any reason to think that consciousness is more than the sum of its parts. It's a very useful evolutionary trait. And it's not unique to us.


'It is not unique to us. It is proven that all the great ape family have consciousness and self awareness. ' so do a other animals.. we are not the only ones.


Then it's possible to prove consciousness and self-awareness in AI?


I would go as far as to say we could most likely be able to replicate self-awareness and consciousness in a program so yes. I also say its more than possible to create a self learning program for an AI as well. (would we do that.. Most people do not like the idea of a self-aware computer that can learn over time by learning from its experiences. (but I would love to build one and place that AI into a Android made to be a maid/butler. I love to have the help around the house, and to aid with the shopping.
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27 / M / ihlok
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Posted 12/22/14

BlueOni wrote:

A combination of electrochemical signals in your brain and from various receptor cells throughout your body results in the experience of consciousness by giving you characteristics such as body mapping, tactile sensation, depth perception, and balance. The experience of emotion is effectively a stimulus-response signaling chain which functions by regulating your neurotransmitter concentrations. Your cognitive reasoning and risk assessment capabilities are handled by the frontal lobe of your brain. Your memories are regulated by several regions of the brain, and damage thereto can induce amnesia. In other words, consciousness is a full body experience which centers on the brain and is fed by receptors and transmitters across electrochemical networks dispersed throughout the body.

Everything from our development of a central nervous system, to our emphasis on vision above all other senses, to the limits on either side of our specific range of visible wavelengths of light, to our experiences of emotion serve some biological function (or at least don't inhibit any of the important ones). For example, our emotions have developed in a way which has facilitated the establishment and maintenance of social groups (which are of great utility for keeping us safe and fed). For another, our ability to see the colors we see allowed for quicker and more frequent seizure of food items by keeping them visible and distinguishable from non-food items (like poisonous berries and mushrooms). The experience of consciousness is the cumulative action of all your survival mechanisms.


good one.
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Posted 12/22/14
Well, in 1 Samuel 28 there's a record of what is presumably a ghost having a conversation with a human.
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=1+Samuel+28&version=ESV

So, technically, we don't need a brain or a nervous system or anything to have consciousness. Although it really comes in handy.
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Posted 12/22/14
Consciousness comes from the well-developed brain, the evolution of man-kind if wanting to upload an actual consciousness of a living being would be to extract their brain and go from there.
Posted 12/22/14 , edited 12/22/14

severticas wrote:


RedExodus wrote:

the mind's ability to understand our position in relation to space and time. This means if you build AI with only outward functions in mind, perhaps it won't be conscious since it's lacking in internal information integration.
.


this makes me think of experiments such as those carried out by Karen McCombs, Tetsuro Matsuzawa, Pierre Pica, Brian Butterworth etc... that give good understanding into how and why humans and animals intuition favor approximate understanding of numbers.

things like fear of immigrants for example, lead me to think that it's a case of human's fear of larger numbers.. even if wrong to think of it as an invasion, some people would because they're survival instincts are wrongly triggered when the reality is that the numbers aren't as large as they think or as worrisome. for example, Andreas Neider conducted experiments to find out what happens when we hold numbers in our head.. larger numbers triggered more number-sensitive neurons that were and were not associated with the number... for example, we'd think of 30 and neurons that prefer surrounding numbers would be active too causing a chaotic sense of the number but when we think of smaller numbers there was less chaos .


that's really interesting; i'm afraid of large numbers especially if they have no zero's.

decimals are even more frightening.

___

to answer the OP's question... a zombie's favourite food.
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Posted 12/22/14
Uranus



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Posted 12/22/14 , edited 12/22/14
My idea of consciousness starts with the first things I remember. I remember things from when I was about a year old...

When you look in the mirror and you stop thinking the reflection is someone-else.

When you think of the people around you as more than mere tools or obstacles.

Some people I've met demonstrate that they have none.



Where it comes from? That is a loaded question.
Posted 12/23/14 , edited 12/23/14

GayAsianBoy wrote:


severticas wrote:


RedExodus wrote:

the mind's ability to understand our position in relation to space and time. This means if you build AI with only outward functions in mind, perhaps it won't be conscious since it's lacking in internal information integration.
.


this makes me think of experiments such as those carried out by Karen McCombs, Tetsuro Matsuzawa, Pierre Pica, Brian Butterworth etc... that give good understanding into how and why humans and animals intuition favor approximate understanding of numbers.

things like fear of immigrants for example, lead me to think that it's a case of human fear of larger numbers.. even if wrong to think of it as an invasion, some people would because their survival instincts are wrongly triggered when the reality is that the numbers aren't as large as they think or as worrisome. for example, Andreas Neider conducted experiments to find out what happens when we hold numbers in our head.. larger numbers triggered more number-sensitive neurons that were and were not associated with the number... for example, we'd think of 30 and neurons that prefer surrounding numbers would be active too causing a chaotic sense of the number but when we think of smaller numbers there was less chaos .


that's really interesting; i'm afraid of large numbers especially if they have no zero's.

decimals are even more frightening.

___

to answer the OP's question... a zombie's favourite food.


it's interesting even thought you're trying to be funny lol. (more unrelated stuff) what was interesting to me was that animals in the experiment seemed to have photographic memories and i imagine if they inserted "human glial cells" into the brains of other animals besides mice (if it works) , animals could end up potentially smarter than humans.

in the post you quoted, its relation to consciousness was sort of forced as i was going off what RedExodus's post reminded me of, and that post could entirely be off base.

I have, some pages back, posted that we don't actually know where consciousness comes from.
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Posted 12/23/14 , edited 12/23/14
I don't believe that consciousness is generated by the brain. I believe that consciousness is what generates the brain.

As for where it comes from, I do not know. I do not know where our inner most immaterial nature comes from.
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Posted 12/23/14
Do Plants Have Consciousness is a more interesting question. But we have brains and that just makes everything easier imo.
Posted 12/23/14 , edited 12/23/14

-Paul- wrote:

Do Plants Have Consciousness is a more interesting question. But we have brains and that just makes everything easier imo.


they could and in a sense the plant's design, which seems more specific, might have more insight to its purpose than we do and plants seem to follow a manual, claim territory, adapt etc... imo. might even be more conscious than humans.
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M / HI
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Posted 12/23/14

Wihl wrote:

Consciousness comes from life.


Thank God. This is a simple answer. All the ones above are like AETHTRJJYJSTYJDR^JVUUCNCNHBE%YBHCYYE%H to me.
Posted 12/23/14

PeripheralVisionary wrote:

Some believe consciousness doesn't really exist to begin with except as an illusion and whatnot of otherwise hulking bodies of meat. I doubt flies and most other insects have a consciousness worth speaking of.



making this up but the existence of paradoxical illusions could be brought forward from awareness. so say, being self-aware created the double standard in our approach to how we judge other things in comparison to the self and separate what we accept (which most likely requires placing the self at center stage).
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16 / M / Puerto Rico
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Posted 12/23/14
For some people consciousness comes from the ass.
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