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To Quarantine Or Not To Quarantine?
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21 / M / California
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Posted 10/30/14
37315 cr points
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M
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Posted 10/30/14
Better safe, than sorry.
Rohzek 
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Posted 10/30/14 , edited 10/30/14

PhantomGundam wrote:


Rohzek wrote:

They should quarantine. But seriously, when they do, they should make the health workers as comfortable as possible. They should get every luxury they request while under quarantine. They haven't committed a crime, and it seems to me they are sometimes treated like prisoners.


The thing about that is that the quarantine guidelines were updated on Sunday so that the quarantine can be done from the comfort of their own homes and they can even have visitors too. They get paid during this brief period of time and this nurse is STILL shouting "MY HUMAN RIGHTS ARE BEING VIOLATED! HELP ME!"


How effective are these tests though? Isn't the whole point of the quarantine period to make sure someone really does not have the disease, thus implying the tests are not really good indicators at the early stages? If so, then yes she should be quarantined. The idea of visitors is stupid. What kind of quarantine is that?

If anything, I would ask the nurse, "What about other people's rights? We, as a society, have a reasonable and specific suspicion that you may very well pose a threat to the surrounding area's health." Until then, she should be quarantined. It seems perfectly legal to me and is within the bounds of classical liberalism's tradition. Her rights aren't being violated.
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Posted 10/30/14
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20 / M
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Posted 10/30/14

Rohzek wrote:


PhantomGundam wrote:


Rohzek wrote:

They should quarantine. But seriously, when they do, they should make the health workers as comfortable as possible. They should get every luxury they request while under quarantine. They haven't committed a crime, and it seems to me they are sometimes treated like prisoners.


The thing about that is that the quarantine guidelines were updated on Sunday so that the quarantine can be done from the comfort of their own homes and they can even have visitors too. They get paid during this brief period of time and this nurse is STILL shouting "MY HUMAN RIGHTS ARE BEING VIOLATED! HELP ME!"


How effective are these tests though? Isn't the whole point of the quarantine period to make sure someone really does not have the disease, thus implying the tests are not really good indicators at the early stages? If so, then yes she should be quarantined. The idea of visitors is stupid. What kind of quarantine is that?

If anything, I would ask the nurse, "What about other people's rights? We, as a society, have a reasonable and specific suspicion that you may very well pose a threat to the surrounding area's health." Until then, she should be quarantined. It seems perfectly legal to me and is within the bounds of classical liberalism's tradition. Her rights aren't being violated.


You're right. Tests don't turn up positive until after the symptoms are present. You can test negative for an entire week and then start feeling sluggish the very next day like that doctor in NYC. From what I know, visitors are closely monitored and their visits have to be approved by health care workers first. Not sure how effective that is, though.

What I like about this is that this isn't being turned into a liberal vs conservative fight. Both Democrats and Republicans are on the same side for once and the only ones arguing against this completely logical move are people in the white house and the CDC. I just saw a former NYC mayor, Giuliani, talk about the science backing up the decision, saying that the 21 days rule was the number given by scientists and that it's not something politicians made up.

This nurse really isn't making any valid points. Even people in her small town are calling her stubborn and say they don't understand why she's doing this. She doesn't even have to wait 21 more days. Her last contact with an ebola patient in West Africa was 10 days ago. She just has to stay at home until November 10. I don't get why she's complaining so much when she only has to keep her distance from people for 11 days, she would get paid during her time in quarantine, if she does get sick she could get treated immediately, and the risk of endangering her community (including her boyfriend who has literally been by her side since her return) is minimized.
Sogno- 
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Posted 10/30/14
ok i want to know who drew up ebola-chan because by now i've seen her a gazillion times

i am for quarantine. um i don't feel there's a need to discuss why
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21 / M / My Couch
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Posted 10/30/14
Personally I think that people have this crazy notion that they are more important than people they don't know. As silly as it sounds, society has such a focus on the individual that it makes it hard for people to see what is really the best choice. If I were in the place of that nurse, I would gladly go into quarantine. Why should a child, a mother, a father, whoever, die because of my selfishness? Just because I don't personally know the people, doesn't mean their lives are meaningless. To me, the resistance against these quarantine countermeasures is putting the nation and countless lives of people, who each have loved ones and a life they live, at risk just because people value their time so greatly (when they would probably waste waste that time in ridiculous ways.)

I don't understand what Obama is doing by going against the quarantine. I understand there may be things that I just don't know and that it's easy for me to speak because I'm a bystander, but ebola kills. The safety of the people should be far more important than political standing or possible criticism. All that I have said comes down to one simple age old phrase,

An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.
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44 / M / Verginia
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Posted 10/30/14
alot of this argument comes from sheer ignorance about biology and disease transmission in general. not too surprising when you conceder Americans rank lower than most 3rd world countries in math and science. fact: ebola requires direct bodily fluid to mucus membrane contact to spread. unlike the common flu that is airborne and will kill 30,000 Americans this year. cars will kill 35,000 americans this year. ebola has only killed less than 6,000 people world wide so far. granted the 50% mortality rate is alarming. doctors and nurses are trained medical professionals with 4 to 8 years of collage and odds are actually understand math and science better than 90% of Americans.
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31 / M / Bellingham WA, USA
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Posted 10/30/14
The whole situation is just beyond embarassing at this point.

First, in August we smugly asserted that there was no danger of Ebola coming into the US and that calls to ban travel from West Africa were ridiculous. So what happens? We become the first developed nation to ever have a case of Ebola. WHAT. THE. ****?

We continue to act like it's no big deal while treating that lying asshole Thomas Duncan and LO AND BEHOLD two nurses catch it. WHAT. THE. ****?

Then a returning doctor lies about being in quarantine and instead goes to visit basically every public place in NYC. He is in critical condition. Who knows if he infected anyone or not? WHAT. THE ****?

Obama then appoints an Ebola Czar, because of...reasons. And he's as qualified on Ebola as I am. Good job Obama, lets just throw Czar's at the problem. Speaking of, why the **** are we allowing our elected representatives to hire their own underlings on the tax payers dime? I'm pretty sure that form of government is called an Oligarchy, and that is not what we are. But I digress...

So we get more serious about quarantine...sounds pretty rational right? That brings us to the selfish little twerp named Kaci Hickox. A returning nurse who has fought tooth and nail against quarantine since she stepped off her plane 6 days ago.

She feels that her civil rights are being trampled on because she had to endure the harsh conditions of a NJ quarantine for a whole two days before having to endure yet more hardship being quarantined in her own living room. It's a real sob story right? Boofreakinghoo for her :'(

You know, even if she were to honor her new quarantine (LOL HEY GUYS WATCH ME RIDE MY BIKE IN THE NAME OF CIVIL RIGHTS I'M CERTAINLY NOT PISSING OFF A MAJORITY OF THE POPULATION OR ANYTHING LOL) I don't think she should have ever been allowed out of her quarantine tent in NJ. Should we really be subjecting municipal sewer systems to the stool and urine of potentially infected individuals? Aren't we actually pretty ****ing screwed if ebola were to get into our rodent population? But noooo. That would just be too irrational to be concerned over something so trivial as that.

Why is our left being so eminently stupid about all of this? I look at someplace like Australia (which is practically a socialist nation), and they've banned travel from West Africa. You know? That thing we should have done initially? So I'm really freaking confused about why this is a partisan issue. Is showing a consensus about something so horrible in our divisive political climate that we can just neglect the wishes of the citizens as well as potentially their public health?
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44 / M / Verginia
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Posted 10/30/14 , edited 10/30/14

Balzack wrote:

The whole situation is just beyond embarassing at this point.

First, in August we smugly asserted that there was no danger of Ebola coming into the US and that calls to ban travel from West Africa were ridiculous. So what happens? We become the first developed nation to ever have a case of Ebola. WHAT. THE. ****?

We continue to act like it's no big deal while treating that lying asshole Thomas Duncan and LO AND BEHOLD two nurses catch it. WHAT. THE. ****?

Then a returning doctor lies about being in quarantine and instead goes to visit basically every public place in NYC. He is in critical condition. Who knows if he infected anyone or not? WHAT. THE ****?

Obama then appoints an Ebola Czar, because of...reasons. And he's as qualified on Ebola as I am. Good job Obama, lets just throw Czar's at the problem. Speaking of, why the **** are we allowing our elected representatives to hire their own underlings on the tax payers dime? I'm pretty sure that form of government is called an Oligarchy, and that is not what we are. But I digress...

So we get more serious about quarantine...sounds pretty rational right? That brings us to the selfish little twerp named Kaci Hickox. A returning nurse who has fought tooth and nail against quarantine since she stepped off her plane 6 days ago.

She feels that her civil rights are being trampled on because she had to endure the harsh conditions of a NJ quarantine for a whole two days before having to endure yet more hardship being quarantined in her own living room. It's a real sob story right? Boofreakinghoo for her :'(

You know, even if she were to honor her new quarantine (LOL HEY GUYS WATCH ME RIDE MY BIKE IN THE NAME OF CIVIL RIGHTS I'M CERTAINLY NOT PISSING OFF A MAJORITY OF THE POPULATION OR ANYTHING LOL) I don't think she should have ever been allowed out of her quarantine tent in NJ. Should we really be subjecting municipal sewer systems to the stool and urine of potentially infected individuals? Aren't we actually pretty ****ing screwed if ebola were to get into our rodent population? But noooo. That would just be too irrational to be concerned over something so trivial as that.

Why is our left being so eminently stupid about all of this? I look at someplace like Australia (which is practically a socialist nation), and they've banned travel from West Africa. You know? That thing we should have done initially? So I'm really freaking confused about why this is a partisan issue. Is showing a consensus about something so horrible in our divisive political climate that we can just neglect the wishes of the citizens as well as potentially their public health?


stop..just stop...stop listening to the media hype being propagated by liberal arts majors in the media who failed math and science in high school. they in their complete and absolute ignorance of biology are simply hyping this up for ratings. as i stated above...the common flu will kill 30,000 Americans vs the 2 Americans Ebola has killed.
mandating everyone gets a flu shot will save more lives than some hyped up bull shit quarantine crap based on political and media ratings propaganda.
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31 / M / Bellingham WA, USA
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Posted 10/30/14

bernardwheelerjr wrote:


Balzack wrote:

The whole situation is just beyond embarassing at this point.

First, in August we smugly asserted that there was no danger of Ebola coming into the US and that calls to ban travel from West Africa were ridiculous. So what happens? We become the first developed nation to ever have a case of Ebola. WHAT. THE. ****?

We continue to act like it's no big deal while treating that lying asshole Thomas Duncan and LO AND BEHOLD two nurses catch it. WHAT. THE. ****?

Then a returning doctor lies about being in quarantine and instead goes to visit basically every public place in NYC. He is in critical condition. Who knows if he infected anyone or not? WHAT. THE ****?

Obama then appoints an Ebola Czar, because of...reasons. And he's as qualified on Ebola as I am. Good job Obama, lets just throw Czar's at the problem. Speaking of, why the **** are we allowing our elected representatives to hire their own underlings on the tax payers dime? I'm pretty sure that form of government is called an Oligarchy, and that is not what we are. But I digress...

So we get more serious about quarantine...sounds pretty rational right? That brings us to the selfish little twerp named Kaci Hickox. A returning nurse who has fought tooth and nail against quarantine since she stepped off her plane 6 days ago.

She feels that her civil rights are being trampled on because she had to endure the harsh conditions of a NJ quarantine for a whole two days before having to endure yet more hardship being quarantined in her own living room. It's a real sob story right? Boofreakinghoo for her :'(

You know, even if she were to honor her new quarantine (LOL HEY GUYS WATCH ME RIDE MY BIKE IN THE NAME OF CIVIL RIGHTS I'M CERTAINLY NOT PISSING OFF A MAJORITY OF THE POPULATION OR ANYTHING LOL) I don't think she should have ever been allowed out of her quarantine tent in NJ. Should we really be subjecting municipal sewer systems to the stool and urine of potentially infected individuals? Aren't we actually pretty ****ing screwed if ebola were to get into our rodent population? But noooo. That would just be too irrational to be concerned over something so trivial as that.

Why is our left being so eminently stupid about all of this? I look at someplace like Australia (which is practically a socialist nation), and they've banned travel from West Africa. You know? That thing we should have done initially? So I'm really freaking confused about why this is a partisan issue. Is showing a consensus about something so horrible in our divisive political climate that we can just neglect the wishes of the citizens as well as potentially their public health?


stop..just stop...stop listening to the media hype being propagated by liberal arts majors in the media who failed math and science in high school. they in their complete and absolute ignorance of biology are simply hyping this up for ratings. as i stated above...the common flu will kill 30,000 Americans vs the 2 Americans Ebola has killed.


That would be a compelling argument if only the flu liquified organs and made people's eyes bleed while having a family-wiping-out fatality rate of 50%.
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44 / M / Verginia
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Posted 10/30/14 , edited 10/31/14

Balzack wrote:


bernardwheelerjr wrote:


Balzack wrote:

The whole situation is just beyond embarassing at this point.

First, in August we smugly asserted that there was no danger of Ebola coming into the US and that calls to ban travel from West Africa were ridiculous. So what happens? We become the first developed nation to ever have a case of Ebola. WHAT. THE. ****?

We continue to act like it's no big deal while treating that lying asshole Thomas Duncan and LO AND BEHOLD two nurses catch it. WHAT. THE. ****?

Then a returning doctor lies about being in quarantine and instead goes to visit basically every public place in NYC. He is in critical condition. Who knows if he infected anyone or not? WHAT. THE ****?

Obama then appoints an Ebola Czar, because of...reasons. And he's as qualified on Ebola as I am. Good job Obama, lets just throw Czar's at the problem. Speaking of, why the **** are we allowing our elected representatives to hire their own underlings on the tax payers dime? I'm pretty sure that form of government is called an Oligarchy, and that is not what we are. But I digress...

So we get more serious about quarantine...sounds pretty rational right? That brings us to the selfish little twerp named Kaci Hickox. A returning nurse who has fought tooth and nail against quarantine since she stepped off her plane 6 days ago.

She feels that her civil rights are being trampled on because she had to endure the harsh conditions of a NJ quarantine for a whole two days before having to endure yet more hardship being quarantined in her own living room. It's a real sob story right? Boofreakinghoo for her :'(

You know, even if she were to honor her new quarantine (LOL HEY GUYS WATCH ME RIDE MY BIKE IN THE NAME OF CIVIL RIGHTS I'M CERTAINLY NOT PISSING OFF A MAJORITY OF THE POPULATION OR ANYTHING LOL) I don't think she should have ever been allowed out of her quarantine tent in NJ. Should we really be subjecting municipal sewer systems to the stool and urine of potentially infected individuals? Aren't we actually pretty ****ing screwed if ebola were to get into our rodent population? But noooo. That would just be too irrational to be concerned over something so trivial as that.

Why is our left being so eminently stupid about all of this? I look at someplace like Australia (which is practically a socialist nation), and they've banned travel from West Africa. You know? That thing we should have done initially? So I'm really freaking confused about why this is a partisan issue. Is showing a consensus about something so horrible in our divisive political climate that we can just neglect the wishes of the citizens as well as potentially their public health?


stop..just stop...stop listening to the media hype being propagated by liberal arts majors in the media who failed math and science in high school. they in their complete and absolute ignorance of biology are simply hyping this up for ratings. as i stated above...the common flu will kill 30,000 Americans vs the 2 Americans Ebola has killed.


That would be a compelling argument if only the flu liquified organs and made people's eyes bleed while having a family-wiping-out fatality rate of 50%.


you do know the movie "outbreak" was just a movie right? it has nothing to do with reality as the writers were liberal arts majors creating a piece of entertainment for the masses who in general barely comprehend junior high school lvl science.

ebola does not "liquify" organs. it does cause systemic organ failure due to septic shock.
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31 / M / Bellingham WA, USA
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Posted 10/30/14
Why is it that when advocating reasonable precautions, the big argument against is always "DON'T BE HYSTERICAL THE FLU WILL KILL WAY MORE PEOPLE."

I'm not hysterical, and I don't think I'm going to catch Ebola. But the price that has to be paid to keep me in that mind set is to have adequate preventions in place. A three week quarantine isn't going to kill anyone, but there is a chance however small it may be that it could save some lives.

Our system has failed. We were promised Ebola would never touch our shores. It did. We believed people when they said they didn't have ebola and that they were undergoing a quarantine. They lied. The CDC has changed their tune on how the disease works several times already. Yet I'm supposed to trust their word as gospel?

Cleaning up after those two messes alone have cost a fortune. Do we need to do this over and over again? That alone stressed our systems out enough, do we really need to test the limits here? A quarantine is the best solution from every angle.

Have fun being an armchair biologist and arguing against reasonable precautions bernard. I know a guy in the white house who you could be great friends with.
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25 / M / NYC Metro Area
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Posted 10/30/14 , edited 10/31/14
Pro quarantine, all you need is one of this medical professionals to fail to report and start sneezing all over the NYC subway to bring the epidemic close to home. Bodily fluids includes snot and water particles from coughing. I am still not buying the "its not a big deal argument" we are getting from the Feds. FYI The government issued a mandatory quarantine order for military personal. Look you get to stay at home, the government is willing to provide protections so people cannot get fired and will pick up the tab for their salaries, what more do you people want?


The disease has a 50-70 percent fatality rate, if this breaks out in the US it will make the flu look like child's play.
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