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Post Reply The Legend of Korra Discussion
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I actually think what Korra's going through right now isn't development at all, but major character regression. It's like Korra's been gone so long that her head's now up her rear, and she doesn't understand that you can't reason with people like Kuvira. The world works in that the strong prevail and trying to get everyone to hold hands and sing Kumbaya doesn't work. In many anime worlds, that concept is even more true, because you have people who are literally many times stronger than everyone else, sometimes to the point of being gods, where others have to listen to them because they can't defeat them. Now Kuvira isn't a god or anything, but she's an immense bender, and part of the Avatar's job is to take people like Kuvira out, who can't be handled by a group like Republic CIty. And the only way for Korra to do that is by force If discussing and talking and all that were the way to get Kuvira to back down, then they wouldn't have needed the avatar to begin with. I'm surprised Korra's even trying to reason with her, and it may very well bite her in the butt very soon.
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Posted 11/1/14

rpgothic wrote:

I'm starting this series tonight and finishing Legend of Aang series (I know I know, I'm late to the party)


Better late than never!
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Posted 11/1/14

Felstalker wrote:

That's the problem. Its all about "Her".
Korra can do no wrong! When everybody decides they have to do something to help Airbenders, Tenzen takes a scene to make sure Korra knows SHE is the reason they're doing this. You're awesome Korra! No decisions you make fail! No need for other Avatars either! You oviously know better than them past lives, full of experience and knowledge. Wan was just an idiot, why not make a split decision to undo his primary accomplishment in life?

Feeling bad Korra? Well since its all about you... Why not run away?

Season 3 also ruined Bumi's entire Season 2 arc. He's not a bender! He lives his life trying to show people this...and fuck it super powers! The same powers we deliberately created you without as a basis for your character.



The writing in Korra is all over the place, contradicting themselves constantly and providing character development that resets like the God of War games do each iteration.


The writing for the show has been all over the place, but it has been consistent since season 3. You can't say that she never does any wrong as she's made bad decisions throughout the show. One of the problems with season 2 was it obsessed with her character flaws to the point I wondered why I was supposed to be rooting for her.

I don't see why it is a problem that Tenzin supported her decision, its not like they haven't disagreed in the past. I would also say that Wan's accomplishments were becoming the Avatar, defeating Vatu and settling humans across the earth. But either way, why is Wan not allowed to be wrong? Why does Korra always have to be? Korra's decision also was not exclusively positive as it created the main source of conflict in the season, like I said it was about her taking responsibility for what she did.

Korra has been wrong enough that I don't see why it is a problem for some of her decisions to be good ones. As the protagonist it would seem natural for her to do something right once in a while.
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Posted 11/1/14

MysticLeviathan wrote:

I actually think what Korra's going through right now isn't development at all, but major character regression. It's like Korra's been gone so long that her head's now up her rear, and she doesn't understand that you can't reason with people like Kuvira. The world works in that the strong prevail.


That is a failure of writing and character.

Can't reason? Why not? Why can't we reason with her? Azula had a reason. She was a perfectly reasonable individual whose personal goals lay in complete opposition to our protagonists. She wants power and approval, she seeks the position of Firelord and approvql /attention of her father, she obtains this position but not the approval. Breakdown happened.

Zuko was an angry prideful person. He saight the avatar to regain his honor and earn the respect of his father..only to learn that he didn't need that damn fatherly approval as he grew older and wiser over the events of the show.

Why is Kuvira the bad guy here? Why are we unable to reason with her?
Part if what made Amon so fucking fantastic lies with the fact that he WAS a diplomat. He WOULD talk. You just never wanted to hear it, damned Bender's acting all elitist. So they turned the revolution violent.

Part of why I hated Episode 12 of Korra, the most spectacular fuck up in the history of Cartoons, they dropped Amon's character and his entire rebellion at the drop of a hate, THISE WERE ACTUAL REAL ISSUES! YOU DONT SOLVE UT BY KILLING THE ONE IN CHARGE! THIS ISNT NAZI GERMANY THIS IS REVOLUTIONARY FRANCE!
Top that off with a Korra who turns away her romantic man-friend because "I'm not the avatar", then "Aang gice s powers back YoU ARE AVATAR!" and "O that's right I am aavatar let's fuck!" In the span of 4 minutes.

They can do better!
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Posted 11/1/14

Felstalker wrote:


MysticLeviathan wrote:

I actually think what Korra's going through right now isn't development at all, but major character regression. It's like Korra's been gone so long that her head's now up her rear, and she doesn't understand that you can't reason with people like Kuvira. The world works in that the strong prevail.


That is a failure of writing and character.

Can't reason? Why not? Why can't we reason with her? Azula had a reason. She was a perfectly reasonable individual whose personal goals lay in complete opposition to our protagonists. She wants power and approval, she seeks the position of Firelord and approvql /attention of her father, she obtains this position but not the approval. Breakdown happened.

Zuko was an angry prideful person. He saight the avatar to regain his honor and earn the respect of his father..only to learn that he didn't need that damn fatherly approval as he grew older and wiser over the events of the show.

Why is Kuvira the bad guy here? Why are we unable to reason with her?
Part if what made Amon so fucking fantastic lies with the fact that he WAS a diplomat. He WOULD talk. You just never wanted to hear it, damned Bender's acting all elitist. So they turned the revolution violent.

Part of why I hated Episode 12 of Korra, the most spectacular fuck up in the history of Cartoons, they dropped Amon's character and his entire rebellion at the drop of a hate, THISE WERE ACTUAL REAL ISSUES! YOU DONT SOLVE UT BY KILLING THE ONE IN CHARGE! THIS ISNT NAZI GERMANY THIS IS REVOLUTIONARY FRANCE!
Top that off with a Korra who turns away her romantic man-friend because "I'm not the avatar", then "Aang gice s powers back YoU ARE AVATAR!" and "O that's right I am aavatar let's fuck!" In the span of 4 minutes.

They can do better!


I can't really agree with this. You can't reason with a crazy person, that's how the world is, even today. Sometimes you just need ot kill the person off or imprison them or whatever, though last time we had big time criminals put in prison, they broke out and caused chaos in the world, so killing them is the only real solution to their problem. However, in the real world, being as people don't have bending powers, prison would work.

I actually think all of the villains have been really solid. They're great in that they aren't crazy just because, but they have their own ideals, that while make sense as an ideal, they take them to an extreme or twist them in a way. Unfortunately, what you don't understand is that talking and diplomacy doesn't do jack, it's only the threat of action against someone or the action itself that does anything. I mean look at North Korea, one of the worst regimes in modern history, yet all the diplomacy hasn't done a darn thing. The only thing that would end their messed up system would be to take them over by force. That's how the real world works.

Now i'm not quite sure what you're trying to say in regards to your Nazi Germany vs. French Revolution. You're saying to not kill people in charge, but that's precisely what they did in Revolutionary France, so unless you meant something different, I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

I think Korra's been all over the place here. She was better when she was doing her job as avatar by taking advantage of her being able to use all 4 elements to defeat her foes by force. All this hippie diplomacy garbage can stay in the swamp >.>
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Posted 11/1/14

MysticLeviathan wrote:

I actually think what Korra's going through right now isn't development at all, but major character regression. It's like Korra's been gone so long that her head's now up her rear, and she doesn't understand that you can't reason with people like Kuvira. The world works in that the strong prevail and trying to get everyone to hold hands and sing Kumbaya doesn't work. In many anime worlds, that concept is even more true, because you have people who are literally many times stronger than everyone else, sometimes to the point of being gods, where others have to listen to them because they can't defeat them. Now Kuvira isn't a god or anything, but she's an immense bender, and part of the Avatar's job is to take people like Kuvira out, who can't be handled by a group like Republic CIty. And the only way for Korra to do that is by force If discussing and talking and all that were the way to get Kuvira to back down, then they wouldn't have needed the avatar to begin with. I'm surprised Korra's even trying to reason with her, and it may very well bite her in the butt very soon.

To be honest, though Kuvira I think taking out Kuvira like that will lead to more chaos because of the amount of support she has. I mean its the same way Aang would handle it without needless violence which may lead to more violence. Especially with the Earth Kingdom on the brink of another war.

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Felstalker wrote:


h9902014 wrote:

She did kinda of get devlopement, it's just that her personality is kind of grating, and she acts self important even now. But I feel this episode, she showed a lot of growth, hopefully she'll be able to maintain that.

But personally I like Aang better.


I'm good at arguing! I'm just partially distracted at this moment so I will quote and type laterish.


Laterish is now nao.

The initial problem with Koraa's character lies in the writers indecisiveness. Korra is strong and courageous and doesn't think ahead. Uses power to do what she wants and shouts 'I'm the avatar, I do what I want!"

So... How do you develop this? She is already phsycially powerful. She's bullheaded, but can you change this while still keeping her Korra?

Aang had a huge character story right from the start. He was conflicted. He wanted to be "Aang" not "The Avatar". Aangs entire story was about him growing up, forced into a role he himself didn't like.

He learns not only to accept his role as Avatar, but of realize that he himself can still be Aang.

Korra....she thinks being the Avatar means your the official King pimp of Earth. You do nothing but punch people who disagree with yo . It's not her fault either! The writers think that being the opposite of Aang is enough, but its not!
Korra needs to learn that doing her own thing and just pushing through isn't a viable strategy, perhaps stop giving her villains like Tarlock, Tarlock 2.0, evil Avatar edition,
and Totally not Amon the Air bending Terrorist.

Perhaps have he solve a problem with talking? Perhaps dont drop the super exciting racism and classist debates in season 1 as "Crazy Nazi shit" and replace with super generic White vs Black or Nazi Terrorist Hippies or whatever you would call Season 3 and 4



I pretty much agree with everything u said in red. In season 3, I kinda do think she get's some development but not much. Also I thought S3 was the best out of all of them. I think it's fine to have a clear cut good vs. evil story with great action. I don't really think those Villains were too generic eitehr.

Also, Kuvira isn't too bad of a villain either. In the last episode Korra actually does try to talk things out as opposed to the norm.
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Posted 11/1/14

ta11ey wrote:


MysticLeviathan wrote:

I actually think what Korra's going through right now isn't development at all, but major character regression. It's like Korra's been gone so long that her head's now up her rear, and she doesn't understand that you can't reason with people like Kuvira. The world works in that the strong prevail and trying to get everyone to hold hands and sing Kumbaya doesn't work. In many anime worlds, that concept is even more true, because you have people who are literally many times stronger than everyone else, sometimes to the point of being gods, where others have to listen to them because they can't defeat them. Now Kuvira isn't a god or anything, but she's an immense bender, and part of the Avatar's job is to take people like Kuvira out, who can't be handled by a group like Republic CIty. And the only way for Korra to do that is by force If discussing and talking and all that were the way to get Kuvira to back down, then they wouldn't have needed the avatar to begin with. I'm surprised Korra's even trying to reason with her, and it may very well bite her in the butt very soon.

To be honest, though Kuvira I think taking out Kuvira like that will lead to more chaos because of the amount of support she has. I mean its the same way Aang would handle it without needless violence which may lead to more violence. Especially with the Earth Kingdom on the brink of another war.



There will be chaos regardless. She's already putting people into detention camps and using the villages as slaves. You either let her take over and you'll have chaos within the earth kingdom, or you resist her and you'll have chaos fighting her. It's a lose-lose situation, but if you had to choose a side, I'd choose Korra's and Republic City's.

It's naive to think that you're going to be avoiding conflict with any of the options on the table.
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Posted 11/1/14

MysticLeviathan wrote:


ta11ey wrote:


MysticLeviathan wrote:

I actually think what Korra's going through right now isn't development at all, but major character regression. It's like Korra's been gone so long that her head's now up her rear, and she doesn't understand that you can't reason with people like Kuvira. The world works in that the strong prevail and trying to get everyone to hold hands and sing Kumbaya doesn't work. In many anime worlds, that concept is even more true, because you have people who are literally many times stronger than everyone else, sometimes to the point of being gods, where others have to listen to them because they can't defeat them. Now Kuvira isn't a god or anything, but she's an immense bender, and part of the Avatar's job is to take people like Kuvira out, who can't be handled by a group like Republic CIty. And the only way for Korra to do that is by force If discussing and talking and all that were the way to get Kuvira to back down, then they wouldn't have needed the avatar to begin with. I'm surprised Korra's even trying to reason with her, and it may very well bite her in the butt very soon.

To be honest, though Kuvira I think taking out Kuvira like that will lead to more chaos because of the amount of support she has. I mean its the same way Aang would handle it without needless violence which may lead to more violence. Especially with the Earth Kingdom on the brink of another war.



There will be chaos regardless. She's already putting people into detention camps and using the villages as slaves. You either let her take over and you'll have chaos within the earth kingdom, or you resist her and you'll have chaos fighting her. It's a lose-lose situation, but if you had to choose a side, I'd choose Korra's and Republic City's.

It's naive to think that you're going to be avoiding conflict with any of the options on the table.


And that's the main complexity of this season. Do they risk a war or let Kuvira take over?
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Posted 11/1/14
Oh damn, I didn't see this. Thank you for making this sonic!

Also long hair Korra is better.
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Posted 11/1/14

LoomyTheBrew wrote:

Oh damn, I didn't see this. Thank you for making this sonic!

Also long hair Korra is better.


You long haired extremists have gone too far with this statement! Everyone knows that short hair is a mark of excellence!
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Posted 11/1/14

MysticLeviathan wrote:
She's already putting people into detention camps and using the villages as slaves.

It's naive to think that you're going to be avoiding conflict with any of the options on the table.


Why is she doing that? What purpose or reasoning is there?

If a character doesn't have reasoning behind their actions, they might as well be an embodiment of all the evil and chaos in the world, which is stupid.

AND Season 2 already did that plot!

What happened to the Nonbender problem? Do nonbenders just not exist anymore?
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Posted 11/1/14

Felstalker wrote:


MysticLeviathan wrote:
She's already putting people into detention camps and using the villages as slaves.

It's naive to think that you're going to be avoiding conflict with any of the options on the table.


Why is she doing that? What purpose or reasoning is there?

If a character doesn't have reasoning behind their actions, they might as well be an embodiment of all the evil and chaos in the world, which is stupid.

AND Season 2 already did that plot!

What happened to the Nonbender problem? Do nonbenders just not exist anymore?


The reasons are pretty simple. She wants to keep the dissenters quiet, as well as she needs more workers for her projects, whatever they may be. Her ideals make perfect sense and she's very calculated and smart. That doesn't make her any less evil. She's also right in that she's helping to bring order to the Earth Kingdom.

LoK has great villains, I'm surprised you don't see this.
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Posted 11/1/14

Felstalker wrote:


MysticLeviathan wrote:
She's already putting people into detention camps and using the villages as slaves.

It's naive to think that you're going to be avoiding conflict with any of the options on the table.


Why is she doing that? What purpose or reasoning is there?

If a character doesn't have reasoning behind their actions, they might as well be an embodiment of all the evil and chaos in the world, which is stupid.

AND Season 2 already did that plot!

What happened to the Nonbender problem? Do nonbenders just not exist anymore?


I can think of several reasons why. The main one being that shes trying to exert her authority over the earth kingdom. As for the nonbender issue Raiko himself is a nonbender and presumably he passed some laws to help with the nonbender issue.
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Posted 11/1/14

MysticLeviathan wrote:

I can't really agree with this. You can't reason with a crazy person, that's how the world is, even today. Sometimes you just need ot kill the person off or imprison them or whatever,



I actually think all of the villains have been really solid. They're great in that they aren't crazy just because, but they have their own ideals, that while make sense as an ideal, they take them to an extreme or twist them in a way.


All this hippie diplomacy garbage can stay in the swamp >.>


Color coded.

That entire segment was the base argument for Aang's story. Is the world actually like that? Do you HAVE to do that? Can peace not be solved diplomatically?
The question was better argued in that previous season, so we currently don't need to talk about it here. Its a long debate, let's talk about the better topics here.


Red talk, some of the villains have a solid character, others are horrible reharshes. All of them fail in several important aspects, failures avoided by Zuko and Azula.
Amon was fantastic, but they hard stopped his character in Season 1 Finale through turning him into a revenge focused tragedy. Instead of being the empathetic villain, he randomly decides to attack a subordinate rather than explain the situation. Instead of the equalists continuing to rage against the oppressive system of government, they just snap out of it like they were brainwashed.
Its the trope where the Villain makes a really good and visible point, but the hero still has to win and they alter the villain to suit the plots needs. Amon was a talkative and diplomatic character, one with the power and drive to force his way when necessary.

You just quoted me, I read later.

Season 2 hosted a giant red poop as the super evil chaos creature that threatened the world. And we have Uncle Tarlock 2.0 who wants to revive him...because people evil, spirits good. Evil spirit good friend.
Instead of telling a solid story with uncle, they told a generic and overused good vs evil plot.
In the same damn season, we get this motherfucker -

This guy is a good villian! He has a motive to his actions. A goal to strive for and a personality beyond that goal. Failure or victory is not an end to his person, he simply moves on to the next idea.

Stop putting bullshit words into my mouth. My argument isn't for peace. Its that the villains are so one dimensional that the simple act of thwarting their goal drops them from the show as sure as an actual death. They aren't people, they're plot points with names. Take over the world with 10,000 years of Darkness? REALLY?
And they top it with a Extremist Terrorist who wants to kill the Avatar and Government because "new world shit"?


What the fuck happened to the Equalists? People who wanted equal representation in their government? That was a whole political movement! A plot with lasting effects and a gray mortality!
You can't just "kill" social unrest, no mater how much they want to pretend Amon never happened.
THAT SHIT IS FUCKING IMPORTANT, WHY ARE WE IGNORING IT? YOU NEVER FIXED THE PROBLEM! YOU JUST SWEPT IT UNDER THE RUG!

I don't want peace, I want a villian that's more than just "evil"
power is not an end, its a means.
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