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Target Pulls GTA V off shelves due to....
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Posted 12/3/14 , edited 12/3/14

Felstalker wrote:

First, these are not Critics. They're regulators. They regulate the content rather than critiquing it. It's a bit different.


No, it wasn't about regulators. It was about upset consumers. From the article in the OP:


Citing customer concerns over "the game's depictions of violence against women", Target stores in Australia are no longer selling Rockstar's Grand Theft Auto V.



But over at ABC.net.au they offer a different perspective on the story. They cite a Change.org petition from a trio of anonymous women — Nicole, Claire and Kat — calling for the retailer to ban the game from sale. The petition, with over 41,000 signatures so far, is labeled "Target: Withdraw Grand Theft Auto 5 – this sickening game encourages players to commit sexual violence and kill women."


I'm not saying that the women in question don't have legitimate complaints against GTA V or portrayals of violence against women in media, either. I'm simply questioning their methods and Target's decision.


Second, they have not gone to far. They decided that GTAV violates a specific standard they have set and have removed it from the shelves.

GTA5 isn't illegal, it's simply not being sold in Target.

You can still get GTA5 in Australia, which itself is a rather amazing feat.


Who said it had been made illegal? I'm criticizing Target's decision, not the Australian government. It is good that Target is responding to consumer criticisms, and it is good that consumers are offering them. What I'm really looking at is the long-term impact of this case. Maybe I'm looking at it wrong, maybe this will encourage further introspection on the part of video game publishers. This could be a good thing after all. I'm just concerned it may go the other direction and further reinforce the image of feminists as "social justice warriors" out to deal with "imaginary" causes.


Additionally, the game came out a year ago, this isn't a big deal.


If you say so. I'm not freaking out over a single retailer in Australia pulling a game from its shelves in response to consumer complaints, and I'm not asking you to either. But I am wondering whether the decision to call for Target to pull the game from its shelves entirely, and further whether Target's decision to do so, might cause problems later down the road.

Edit:

The natural question which would follow is what I would have had done instead. A boycott maybe, but the method actually used (the petition) has proven effective in meeting its aims. I say again, I could be worrying over nothing and looking at this whole thing wrong. Maybe this will be very constructive, which would be great.
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Posted 12/3/14
lmao it's just a game
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Posted 12/3/14

metalshiflet96 wrote:


Shnooze wrote:


Felstalker wrote:


Shnooze wrote:

It's a shame, really. The game, from what I've played over a duration of over 150 hours, doesn't have any direct violence against women throughout the entire story mode. Either that or I just somehow missed a gigantic portion of the game that contains this violence against women.

Hopefully this only ends up spreading to Target and only Target.


I find their refusal to include a female protagonist in a game about multiple perspectives of multiple people a sort of indirect violence against women.


I mean come on! Where are the female protagonists? The Mexican protagonists? Hell, an Asian protagonist?

Or do i have to go over to Saints Row to find that shit?


Really? What didn't you like about the characters you had to choose from? Honestly I found them to be pretty entertaining and interesting. Each of them, be it Trevor, Michael or Franklin, were filled with character and things to learn about them compared to previous characters like the boring Niko Bellic. What exactly would it change if one of them were female? It seems unnecessary to me, and a little shoehorned in.

I'd love to hear the possibilities that a female protagonist would bring to the table with GTA V, because at the moment I'm not seeing much.

Well, for one thing, it would bring a completely new view. Females behave and think different in most cases, so what would it not bring to the table is a better question.


In most cases? That's a little generalizing, huh? Do you mean females as a whole or do you mean typical North American females? I'm confused as to what people are trying to do with this. I mean the entire time I was playing the game I never stopped to think that these guys were "so different" to me just because of what's between our legs. What else is to experience different beyond what people know from stereotypes?
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Posted 12/3/14
This isn't surprising if you know anything about Australia and how they are about video games.

Actually, I think lolicon and shotacon anime porn is illegal there, even.

Now, I don't care for that type of anime porn, and I don't care for games like GTA V and don't like that it has some pretty explicit violence against women (in the game), but Australia is too restrictive to me. It is like the government is trying to be a 'nanny' to all of its citizens.
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Posted 12/3/14 , edited 12/3/14
It's just a video game, dammit.


Btw, here I am creating some chaos.
Posted 12/3/14 , edited 12/3/14
Fuck Anita Sarkeesian and the utter stupidity that she has brought down upon the gaming community.
Posted 12/3/14
dunno about other gaming aussies, but i certainly don't get my games from target...

it's probably a good thing it was pulled off from target. personally think only little kids or parents who have no idea about gaming shop there for games for their kids.


a veteran gamer wouldn't get their games from Target, tbh.

Posted 12/3/14
Power of the FEMNAZI!

The gripping sensation that is sweeping all nations! FUCK YOU!
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Posted 12/3/14 , edited 12/3/14
TBH I've never seen rape in the game, you can have sex with prostitutes but that's not rape also violence against women, well you can also kill men and the enemies in the game are men so stop trying to force that point. (Not to any of you) I just think it's stupid as the game is an 18 and over and mentions it has violence.

Edit: also just remembered, everyone you kill in the game story wise is a guy so if you do kill the women isn't that equalism... Just something to think about.
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Posted 12/3/14 , edited 12/3/14

xDeadlyDollx wrote:

Fuck Anita Sarkeesian and the utter stupidity that she has brought down upon the gaming community.


Target hasn't disclosed precisely which consumer complaints are responsible, but it's likely a successful petition submitted by three anonymous women complaining that the game's content was disturbing and troubling to them given their personal experiences which ultimately prompted the decision. Whether their complaints merited the action that Target has taken or not was ultimately Target's decision, though we're all certainly free to express our own ideas on what Target should or shouldn't have done. As for me, the more I stop and think about this decision the more it makes sense to me.

Here's the press release announcing and explaining the decision as far as Target is concerned:

http://www.target.com.au/medias/marketing/corporate/PDF/media-release/GTA-Media-Release-v2.pdf

The decision makes good business sense from a public relations standpoint. Responding to a petition which has at this point gathered more than 41,000 signatures (formerly a sufficient number to prompt an official response from the White House through its "We the People" service and not far from halfway to the current threshold of 100,000 signatures) indicates to the general public that Target is interested in and will respond to consumer feedback, which is always a plus for one's PR. Furthermore, in making this particular decision at this particular time Target has given the impression that it is genuinely concerned about violence against women. The money they've lost from the sales figures for a single (albeit high profile) video game title which is presently a year out from its release can't buy that kind of publicity. To have direct action on the part of the company which can back up its claim to be interested in its customers' concerns and violence against women is priceless.

Of course, in the bigger picture this simply means that the game is available at one less retailer in Australia. It's not as if the petition resulted in the game's total disappearance from all retailers' shelves (though I'm sure that's an item on the agenda of those who succeeded here). It's nothing for Australian fans of the game to be too terribly upset about at this point since the game is still accessible, and it's an encouraging sign for those who might previously have been concerned that retailers were indifferent to their feedback. It's also encouraging to feminists since this decision means that complaints specifically about portrayals of women in media will be heard and acted upon if sufficient sympathy is garnered, and further that it is possible to garner sufficient sympathy to prompt a response.

Maybe this was the issue to gather that sympathy for, maybe it wasn't. That's not for anyone to say definitively since the relative importance of a particular issue is entirely subjective. All that can be said for sure is that it would seem a large enough amount of Australians felt this was the moment to act, and that their collective action was enough to make Target change course. We're all free to disagree and say that this wasn't that moment, but disagreement alone doesn't make those who felt otherwise wrong.

I don't think there's any harm in consumers having acted on this and Target responding the way it has apart from having slightly inconvenienced Australian shoppers wanting a specific game from a specific store and having stirred the bee's nest that is the anti-feminist movement in close enough time to one another as to add to the latter's ranks for no good reason (and no, this is not a good reason). I've rethought my previous opposition to Target's decision based on concerns over that matter, too. What I came up with is that the anti-feminist movement would be just as upset at another moment, any other moment, as they are over this one. I further concluded that if one is so close to becoming an anti-feminist that they will do so simply because they're slightly inconvenienced in their pursuit of a video game they were pretty much already there to begin with. One therefore might as well simply act whenever the moment seems right and not concern themselves terribly much over upsetting people who have already made up their minds anyway.
Posted 12/3/14

nemoskull wrote:

well, on the thoughts of rape in entertainment....
if its critial part of the story (btoom comees to mind) thin im okay with it. same if its in a game, as long as its in a cut scene.
if its something the player can or must do, then no im not okay with it.

just my .02


I agree, but only in mainstream gaming. If it is an erotic game I couldn't care less.
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Posted 12/3/14

BlueOni wrote:


xDeadlyDollx wrote:

Fuck Anita Sarkeesian and the utter stupidity that she has brought down upon the gaming community.


Target hasn't disclosed precisely which consumer complaints are responsible, but it's likely a successful petition submitted by three anonymous women complaining that the game's content was disturbing and troubling to them given their personal experiences which ultimately prompted the decision. Whether their complaints merited the action that Target has taken or not was ultimately Target's decision, though we're all certainly free to express our own ideas on what Target should or shouldn't have done. As for me, the more I stop and think about this decision the more it makes sense to me.

Here's the press release announcing and explaining the decision as far as Target is concerned:

http://www.target.com.au/medias/marketing/corporate/PDF/media-release/GTA-Media-Release-v2.pdf

The decision makes good business sense from a public relations standpoint. Responding to a petition which has at this point gathered more than 41,000 signatures (formerly a sufficient number to prompt an official response from the White House through its "We the People" service and not far from halfway to the current threshold of 100,000 signatures) indicates to the general public that Target is interested in and will respond to consumer feedback, which is always a plus for one's PR. Furthermore, in making this particular decision at this particular time Target has given the impression that it is genuinely concerned about violence against women. The money they've lost from the sales figures for a single (albeit high profile) video game title which is presently a year out from its release can't buy that kind of publicity. To have direct action on the part of the company which can back up its claim to be interested in its customers' concerns and violence against women is priceless.

Of course, in the bigger picture this simply means that the game is available at one less retailer in Australia. It's not as if the petition resulted in the game's total disappearance from all retailers' shelves (though I'm sure that's an item on the agenda of those who succeeded here). It's nothing for Australian fans of the game to be too terribly upset about at this point since the game is still accessible, and it's an encouraging sign for those who might previously have been concerned that retailers were indifferent to their feedback. It's also encouraging to feminists since this decision means that complaints specifically about portrayals of women in media will be heard and acted upon if sufficient sympathy is garnered, and further that it is possible to garner sufficient sympathy to prompt a response.

Maybe this was the issue to gather that sympathy for, maybe it wasn't. That's not for anyone to say definitively since the relative importance of a particular issue is entirely subjective. All that can be said for sure is that it would seem a large enough amount of Australians felt this was the moment to act, and that their collective action was enough to make Target change course. We're all free to disagree and say that this wasn't that moment, but disagreement alone doesn't make those who felt otherwise wrong.

I don't think there's any harm in consumers having acted on this and Target responding the way it has apart from having slightly inconvenienced Australian shoppers wanting a specific game from a specific store and having stirred the bee's nest that is the anti-feminist movement in close enough time to one another as to add to the latter's ranks for no good reason (and no, this is not a good reason). I've rethought my previous opposition to Target's decision based on concerns over that matter, too. What I came up with is that the anti-feminist movement would be just as upset at another moment, any other moment, as they are over this one. I further concluded that if one is so close to becoming an anti-feminist that they will do so simply because they're slightly inconvenienced in their pursuit of a video game they were pretty much already there to begin with. One therefore might as well simply act whenever the moment seems right and not concern themselves terribly much over upsetting people who have already made up their minds anyway.


The only effect it has on me, and quite a few people around me, is that we´re effectively reminded of the game's coming release on pc. If I could, I would have just preordered it on steam as a direct result, but unfortunately, it´s not up there yet :-(

Oh well I will just go watch some anime instead *goes to find some funny sexy ecchi harem series on crunchyroll*
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Posted 12/3/14
Why is this news? Who cares it's a game. Play it or don't it's pretty simple.
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Posted 12/3/14 , edited 12/3/14

eragon2890 wrote:

The only effect it has on me, and quite a few people around me, is that we´re effectively reminded of the game's coming release on pc. If I could, I would have just preordered it on steam as a direct result, but unfortunately, it´s not up there yet :-(

Oh well I will just go watch some anime instead *goes to find some funny sexy ecchi harem series on crunchyroll*


There you have it, then. No serious harm done to consumers since they can still get the game, Target gets a PR boost, consumers in general and feminists alike get a confidence boost, this seems like a nearly win-win-win situation. Of course, Rockstar Games isn't likely to be happy about having lost the Australia market for one of its flagship franchises in a major retailer, but maybe (hopefully) that will give them cause to reflect on the content they're putting out.

...

I've rethought that optimism I expressed in regard to that issue as well. It probably won't. But whatever, that just means that someone should produce a more female-friendly open world crime game. A female protagonist, as Fel rightly pointed out earlier, would in and of itself be a huge improvement.
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Posted 12/3/14

BlueOni wrote:


eragon2890 wrote:

The only effect it has on me, and quite a few people around me, is that we´re effectively reminded of the game's coming release on pc. If I could, I would have just preordered it on steam as a direct result, but unfortunately, it´s not up there yet :-(

Oh well I will just go watch some anime instead *goes to find some funny sexy ecchi harem series on crunchyroll*


There you have it, then. No serious harm done to consumers since they can still get the game, Target gets a PR boost, consumers in general and feminists alike get a confidence boost, this seems like a nearly win-win-win situation. Of course, Rockstar Games isn't likely to be happy about having lost the Australia market for one of its flagship franchises in a major retailer, but maybe (hopefully) that will give them cause to reflect on the content they're putting out.

...

I've rethought that optimism I expressed in regard to that issue as well. It probably won't. But whatever, that just means that someone should produce a more female-friendly open world crime game. A female protagonist, as Fel rightly pointed out earlier, would in and of itself be a huge improvement.


oh, don´t worry, the only thing that will happen in Australia is that it will be sold more, much more, at other retailers. The only one unhappy will be Target. Rockstar is hanging the flags out right now. And there´s no PR boost. Because most of those consumers are not gamers. They only care about this one game because of their so called issue. It's not like they will buy their other games at target now or anything, because they don´t give a fuck about games. Don´t forget a lot of those complainers are probably your average old religious-or-not conservative loonies who think that everyone who plays GTA wants to shoot their school up. Only thing that's gonna to happen to target is they´re going a lose a lot of gamer consumers, and that´s it. They might be able (MIGHT) to minimize the damage of consumer / internet rage by quickly backtracking on their decision, tough.

I really don't give a fuck about this tough XD It's not like anyone is trying to keep me from playing it or anything, so I don´t see any reason to get angry. Ignoring is the best defense or well, ignoring and buying it when it comes out so they make a 100 million or something dollar profit again . They already got almost perfect critic reviews :-)

If you really think Rockstar will lose consumers over this,.. I think about as many as all those times the USA government tried to outright ban them in various states only to lose on constitutional grounds? :P

I am gonna watch http://www.uppicweb.com/x/i/ia/103048689.jpg now tough, looks like a fun sexy harem series. Really, later, now
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