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Some considerations regarding rape.
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Posted 12/5/14 , edited 12/7/14
Considering other than police brutality and sexism, rape tends to pop up high on the general discussion list these days, here's a few things I think are worth consideration:

1. Rape is difficult to prove. There's often little evidence, unless there's witnesses, or there's force (which leaves bruises) or physical *ahem* remains of the act. The more time that progresses between the act and the reporting means that evidence rapidly starts disappearing, often leading to cases of he said/she said.

2. Accusations of rape can damage a person for a lifetime. Even if you are proven innocent, the accusations are like a scarlet letter which you wear every day of your unless you physically move from where you reside, and start a completely different job. With the internet, that still may not be enough. This is mainly because a simple accusation is often taken as being a "guilty until proven innocent" crime in the eyes of the public, if not the court. It's even worse when the jury of your peers is pulled from that same public.

3.The punishment of the crime MAY be something someone might consider a bit too severe because it is often a case of he said/she said, and juries may side with the victims (see the fact that in the eyes of the public how you're automatically assumed guilty). Being convicted of rape means long prison sentences and possibly a lifetime registration on a list of sex offenders. It's a hefty crime, but it's also a hefty fine if you're falsely acquitted. (I doubt it's often the case, but if it were to happen, I'd not want to be one of the innocent yet convicted).

4. With how much people like to shed personal responsibility and safety these days (and often state it's someone else's fault), and how much is assumed that the "victim" is always right, it's actually incredibly damaging for both the accused and victims, as the chances of being falsely accused are high in certain situations, as well as actually getting raped because you willfully put yourself in a situation where you have impaired judgement (seriously. don't drink and have sex, or drink to the point where you will have sex with anything or anyone you might regret).

EDIT:

5. LINGUISTICS: http://youtu.be/3-son3EJTrU

Watch the video. Linguistics and veiled requests play a HUGE role in how we communicate consent. This in turn affects what is and is not considered consent.

So go ahead, feel free to discuss those points.
Iregi 
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Posted 12/5/14 , edited 12/7/14
I'll just hit number 4. Not gonna touch the rape subject just the victim mentality.

Everyone is always the victim just ask them. It's a huge meme in society right now. I can list a million personal anecdotes of people starting shit and then claiming they were the victim for some reason or another.

I got fired because my boss hates me! Obviously it wasn't because you showed up to work late all the time and took 30 minute smoke breaks and 2 hour lunches, nope couldn't be that.

That guy talked shit that's why I swung at him! He talked shit after laying you out with a clean tackle after you had been jaw jacking before the match and during the match.

My mom spanked me that's child abuse! You stole candy from the grocery store and got the swat you deserved. Shut up.

I'm being bullied they cut me from the XXXX team! No you suck, go practice and come back better.

I can't believe the boss wrote me up for being late once! You showed up late and hungover it's called consequences.

The list goes on and on. Just look at what people are trying to sue other people for. My kid was running around the store like a maniac and smashed into a display and hurt himself! I'M SUING!!!

/shrug if the victim mentality doesn't go away nothing will change. I have no real faith in humanity so I'm of the belief that we will sink to the lowest common denominator if allowed to.... So yeah I don't see anything changing.
Posted 12/5/14 , edited 12/6/14
This thread.

Is going to turn into WW3.
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Posted 12/5/14

SoldierSangria wrote:

This thread.

Is going to turn into WW3.


why don´t they close threads like this?? I want these forums to be fun places to discuss silly go happy otaku things, not serious stuffs like these thingies. It´s depressing and all that~ Oh well like usual I will just act like this thread doesn´t exist *goes to post in the ´I wanna build a snowman thread * XD
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Posted 12/5/14

SoldierSangria wrote:

This thread.

Is going to turn into WW3.


I don't know. It may get buried.

At least I got my say.. :P

And honestly, they're points often overlooked. I think it's all stuff people honestly would rather not discuss. It's a lot easier to say that it's a simple for/against problem with an obvious side to be on, rather than consider the nuance and implications of an absolutist view.
Posted 12/5/14 , edited 12/6/14
I spend my days watching Law and Order SVU these days, and can say I've learned a lot from the show and how they handle and portray rape and rape victims. It's great.

All I know is this...Rape is a weapon. It's a weapon of control. Rapists rape to control the victim. To take away their control.

As for the prison sentences, again all I know is a year or so ago a string of rapes happened in my neighborhood and I definitely would've wanted nothing less than to see public castration, but that's not our decision is it.
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Posted 12/5/14
so this is about rape in general, not man on woman, man on man, statutory or date, just plain ol' rape.

hmm .. I'm gonna need some time to collect my thoughts on all of this.
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Posted 12/5/14
Like I said in a thread recently, most rapes in America aren't "some mad man leaping from the bushes and raping a woman" or something like that. The majority of the time, it is two people who know each other, and then some time they are together and maybe something like the two of them begin to have some intimacy and then one person moves to intercourse while the other doesn't really want it, intercourse happens (without violent force and violent opposition), and there you have it, rape occurs. Something like this is technically non-consensual, but it isn't like the oft thought stereotype of, say, a guy violently forcing himself on a woman while she screams for help and struggles to get out from under him.
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Posted 12/5/14
I guess I can't make a joke if this is an actual serious topic

You lucked out, I think rape is the form of sex without the others' consent, duh.
What cave you came out of?
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Posted 12/5/14

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Posted 12/5/14 , edited 12/6/14
Oh look. A discussion about rape. Welp, I'm outta here.
Posted 12/5/14
but what you also have to realise is that rape victims usually don't come out to confess... as they feel very shameful... they only say it like 10 to 20 years later when they have the courage etc.
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Posted 12/5/14
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Posted 12/5/14 , edited 12/7/14

AiYumega wrote:

I spend my days watching Law and Order SVU these days, and can say I've learned a lot from the show and how they handle and portray rape and rape victims. It's great.

All I know is this...Rape is a weapon. It's a weapon of control. Rapists rape to control the victim. To take away their control.

As for the prison sentences, again all I know is a year or so ago a string of rapes happened in my neighborhood and I definitely would've wanted nothing less than to see public castration, but that's not our decision is it.


And if the person you publicly castrated was innocent? Would you want that blood on your hands?

That's why the current system is "innocent till proven guilty". Because as part of founding this country we decided that heuristically, false negatives were far more acceptable than false positives. Especially when it can mean someone's life. of you're wrong.


GayAsianBoy wrote:

but what you also have to realise is that rape victims usually don't come out to confess... as they feel very shameful... they only say it like 10 to 20 years later when they have the courage etc.


Which is why it comes down to a case of he said/she said. And why it's not very easy to prove.

I'm not justifying it when it happens, I'm trying to explain the justice system, and why it exists as it does and why it's handled the way it is.
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Posted 12/5/14 , edited 12/6/14

Dubnoman wrote:

Like I said in a thread recently, most rapes in America aren't "some mad man leaping from the bushes and raping a woman" or something like that. The majority of the time, it is two people who know each other, and then some time they are together and maybe something like the two of them begin to have some intimacy and then one person moves to intercourse while the other doesn't really want it, intercourse happens (without violent force and violent opposition), and there you have it, rape occurs. Something like this is technically non-consensual, but it isn't like the oft thought stereotype of, say, a guy violently forcing himself on a woman while she screams for help and struggles to get out from under him.


I would very much like to say that if there is no effort to resist AND no verbal issuance of the command "STOP FUCKING DOING THAT!!!" in the scenario you provided, how is the advancing party supposed to know they are doing something wrong?

I'm afraid to have sex again if something like that is rape. Your saying all someone has to do is not like the experience, there is a difference between being raped and choosing a lousy partner.


GayAsianBoy wrote:

but what you also have to realise is that rape victims usually don't come out to confess... as they feel very shameful... they only say it like 10 to 20 years later when they have the courage etc.


The bigger issue in the U.S. is that rape examinations are generally viewed as being extremely invasive, and they are, they have to be to obtain the evidence required to prosecute. Also if not conducted within 120 hours, any evidence collected will probably be dismissed in court.
Rape is unique in that if everyone who believed they were assaulted would just go to the hospital immediately following and be examined to prove contact, if the events constitute rape, you would likely have a conviction every time.

There is no reason to be ashamed of reporting that someone has committed a crime against you.
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