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Is It Wrong To Hate A Show Because It Is Wish Fulfillment?
Posted 12/27/14
I mean, isn't a lot of anime wish fulfillment in some way? I hate NGNL primarily due to the fact it is wish fulfillment and promotes, escapism, but I feel it's not very fair considering I might like other shows that could be wish fulfillment.

Edit: Yes, I made a similar thread, but I made an oopsies in the title, and you all did it wrong.
Posted 12/27/14 , edited 12/27/14
How did you edit your post without editing?

On topic: It's the same as hating any other show for its genre. Not wrong, just narrow. In your case it doesn't seem like you hate the genre itself, but rather the message the particular show sends because of it.
Posted 12/27/14
?
Posted 12/27/14

applestash wrote:

How did you edit your post without editing?


I edited it before I edited it, so I don' t need to edit it later on.
Posted 12/27/14
So you hate it because it "glamorizes" escapism?
Posted 12/27/14

severticas wrote:

So you hate it because it "glamorizes" escapism?


It preys on the concept of it or something, Iunno, two losers being kings of the world without having to get over their distorted view of their home world seems iffy to me. I mean, come on, the leads are losers who just happen to be good at video games but not much else.
Posted 12/27/14

PeripheralVisionary wrote:


severticas wrote:

So you hate it because it "glamorizes" escapism?


It preys on the concept of it or something, Iunno, two losers being kings of the world without having to get over their distorted view of their home world seems iffy to me. I mean, come on, the leads are losers who just happen to be good at video games but not much else.


I haven't seen No Game No Life.

You just gotta avoid the ones you think are just gonna have you whining about them...

Then again...
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Posted 12/27/14 , edited 12/27/14
It's just "a lot of anime"- it's more like "anime itself" is a means of wish fulfillment and escapism. At least, that's the case for some people...
Same with books, movies, games, sports, other arts, and just about every form of culture and entertainment. That's what "entertainment" is.
In fact, since the reality is that humans die, everything done for survival fulfills wishes and escaping reality.
And, you could even throw in religion and philosophy to make the argument even more complicated. Right?

...no.


In the end, anime is a form of art/entertainment; things that promote escapism just appeal to a certain group while drawing disgust from another. It's not wrong, just a difference in taste.
Same with wish fulfillment- I'm sure you've already got a good idea what that's used for.
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Posted 12/27/14 , edited 12/27/14
I think it's a balance.

If you dislike something because it seems to be preaching something your set against, then come to dislike it after factoring all its other points into the equation. To provide an example, an eroge or doujinshi can have meaningful things to say about war and slavery, yet still have panty shots and absurd fanservice. Ultimately, it comes down to whether you're willing to go through with one for the sake of the other.

In NGNL, there's a king who is shamed throughout his life as a failure, but it turns out his persistence allowed his predecessor to accomplish what that king did not have the ability to. The anime, which had mostly had a single-minded focus on the protagonists up until then, glorified a normal person and said the couple were imperfect. A gross contrast from the usual fanservicing and kitty-eared girls that made the watch worth it for me.
Ikitou 
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Posted 12/27/14 , edited 12/27/14
You can hate a show for whatever reason you like! Nothing 'wrong' about it.

I do think disliking something because it "promotes escapism" is a very strange reason though. It's a work of fiction. Don't they all do that? I mean - I'm going off your avatar here - Seitokai Yakuindomo is a show about a high school boy attending a school where he is hopelessly outnumbered by attractive women who invite him onto the student council and then don't stop talking about sex.

That's a 'wish fulfilment' anime just as much as NGNL.
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Posted 12/27/14
I'll only start to hate a wish fulfillment show if the fanbase becomes unbearable. Example , if I criticize the show for bad execution the fans start getting on my case for having an unbiased opinion.
Posted 12/27/14
I can sort of imagine what type of escapism annoys you... You want them to promote something that's hard hitting and stops people from day dreaming .

Tbh, nobody can help you and anime cannot somehow help someone to wake up and take control of their life.
Posted 12/27/14

Ikitou wrote:

You can hate a show for whatever reason you like! Nothing 'wrong' about it.

I do think disliking something because it "promotes escapism" is a very strange reason though. It's a work of fiction. Don't they all do that? I mean - I'm going off your avatar here - Seitokai Yakuindomo is a show about a high school boy attending a school where he is hopelessly outnumbered by attractive women who invite him onto the student council and then don't stop talking about sex.

That's a 'wish fulfilment' anime just as much as NGNL.


I don't get it myself. Somethings bothers me about a show where losers are lauded as being superior and morally infalliable without anyone saying "Hey, isn't your view of the world distorted?" Because in honesty, their view of the world is distorted. They're losers who are good at videogames, yet lack the will to make a living for themselves or even function in normal life. That just seems wrong to me. I'm not normally a guy against harems, I watched Henneko, gave it a 6 and enjoyed it, Haganai a 6 and enjoyed it, and enjoyed it, but NGNL? I'm not sure what I hate about it. This is the most likely explanation I have come acrossed, but my explanation feels iffy. I try to avoid hypocrisy whenever possible. Despite this, there are HUGE Gulfs between shows like Seitokai Yakuindomo and the fetish pandering of KissxSis, where every character basically exists to fulfill a certain fetish. I don't give KissxSis a decent score? Why? Because characters exist merely to pander to whatever fetish they're meant to cater to. Most other people gave it a bad score mainly because of similar factors as well.
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Posted 12/27/14
Well, I don't think you're disliking it "because it is wish fulfilment," alone because then yeah, you would hate every harem ever made.

Sounds to me that in the case of NGNL you resent the characters for being rewarded for what you see as a "wrong" way to live. It's not that you have something against wish fulfilment in general, you just have something against these characters having their wish fulfilled.
Posted 12/27/14 , edited 12/27/14

Ikitou wrote:

Well, I don't think you're disliking it "because it is wish fulfilment," alone because then yeah, you would hate every harem ever made.

Sounds to me that in the case of NGNL you resent the characters for being rewarded for what you see as a "wrong" way to live. It's not that you have something against wish fulfilment in general, you just have something against these characters having their wish fulfilled.


I'm a logical person, I accept there is wish fulfillment in a lot of anime, and for the most part I enjoy a majority of them, but as you said, I might hate wish fulfillment when it is so blatantly misrewarded or something. I wonder, is wish fulfillment a valid point to hate an anime? I've seen the term thrown around alot when people were writing reviews for SAO, so I am wondering what that is about.

That, and I came to a realization, it is entirely possible to hate some aspects of wish fulfillment and not others. One could love harems, but could hate asspulls. I mean, is that hypocritcal or not?

It like you like the ending but not the means to the ending or whatever I am saying.
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