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Post Reply Company milking for money
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Posted 2/11/15 , edited 2/11/15
Oh, so I just read this on Polygon http://www.polygon.com/2015/2/11/8018591/evolve-dlc-cost-buy-everything.

Companies have always tried to make crazy amounts of profit on stuff (even anime companies). Normally a company can't get a profit on their products alone... But then they release other products around it so they can cover the losses and then get some, with things like merchandise. And I'm 100% ok with that since it doesn't taint the experience for a consumer who doesn't choose to buy it.



However... Tortlerock and take2 decided it would be a good idea to make a product where you pay for a retail price and then in-product purchases (i.e free2play) plus season pass and then DLC... Therefore meaning that you won't get the full product unless you're willing to throw up 130$ at them.

So what do you think about this?

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Posted 2/11/15
save us free market
Posted 2/11/15 , edited 2/12/15
milking the money cow over and over again, the cow will die then dude
Dragon
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Posted 2/11/15
Personally, I choose not to buy DLC, and if too much of a game is locked behind paid DLC, I don't buy the game, either.

If people want the full $130 experience and are willing to pay, that's great for them, and great for the company who produced a product that people are willing to pay that much for. I've spent more on anime boxed sets in the past, and felt that I got my money's worth, after all. I'm guessing there are those out there who will feel the same about this game and all its DLC. Just look at all the Sims expansion packs and how much money those made.
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Posted 2/11/15
Just don't buy it and they'll be forced to find a more reasonable sales method.
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Posted 2/11/15

MakotoKamui wrote:

Personally, I choose not to buy DLC, and if too much of a game is locked behind paid DLC, I don't buy the game, either.

If people want the full $130 experience and are willing to pay, that's great for them, and great for the company who produced a product that people are willing to pay that much for. I've spent more on anime boxed sets in the past, and felt that I got my money's worth, after all. I'm guessing there are those out there who will feel the same about this game and all its DLC. Just look at all the Sims expansion packs and how much money those made.


Ok, it seems like I wasn't clear with my question in this thread.

Some game companies release games with DLC where they take away assets from a full product only to sell later. (This is a extreme comparison) How would you feel if you bought a Blu-Ray copy of Fate/zero believing it to be a full anime release only to reliaze that it's without sound and color once you start to play it... And then you look at Ufotable/Aniplex website where they claim you have to pay extra for color, voice-acting and sound. You would get rather pissed at that, wouldn't you? But now anime companies are smart and make merch to cover lost profit and then earn a bit extra after that.

So in other words the question I tried to ask was, how do you feel about companoes looking away stuff from a product only to sell it to you later at a additional cost.
Dragon
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Posted 2/11/15

As a former game dev, I may be able to answer some of that.

You seem to be saying - the disc has the assets/levels/abilities/etc that are "unlocked" by buying DLC. So they're on the disc all along, why should we pay extra, right?

This is quite true. In most cases, DLC doesn't download much, at least for the first several months of a game's lifecycle. Those assets were pre-planned as post-release items, just like "exclusive" items are. They're bundled into the assets all along. A few exceptions are for bug fixes and such, but those are usually available for everyone, even if they don't buy the DLC, in case of multiplayer setups.

But the developers and publishers planned it that way intentionally. By putting those things on the source disc, they are guaranteed - no download restrictions, the developers know they work with the game with no bugs, and so on. This helps the publisher and developer - if the developer goes under or has moved on to another project, those DLC items can still become available and bring interest back to the game.

This would be like seeing a copy of Fate/Zero, reading the back of the box, and deciding to buy it. Then, I find out later that if I pay a price, I can also watch Carnival Phantasm on that disc. The data was there, but I didn't think I was getting it for my purchase price. That still seems fair to me.
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Posted 2/11/15
I get annoyed with games that want me to pay retail then expect me to shell out for dlc that should have either been included or added for free. Even more so when you need an extra subscription fee to be able to play said retail game online. If you want to nickle and dime me than don't expect me to pay to play at the start.

I also don't like when unfinished games are released when it is clear they are going to release a more polished version with slightly more content a year later and the only way to get it is to pay full retail again. At least one of the little perks to living in the USA is with many games by the time they get around to releasing here, instead of getting the vanilla version we get to jump strait to the ultimate version with all dlc included.
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Posted 2/11/15
I'd say it's more akin to if anime producers billed you extra for additional language tracks, and outtakes/special features than not including sound or color..

Anyway, DLC and microtransaction models seem to be the popular trend with game developers these days. What may be even worse is the Early Access and crowdfunding abuse we're starting to see as well.

Just makes you appreciate the odd ducks like CD Projekt RED more.
Posted 2/11/15
Hmm games started this after the first few MMOs started in game stores and people would buy digital items like crazy.. If they will buy pixels for a character they will play a few months or years at most then they will certainly buy upgrades to their games etc and think it is worthwhile.. I dont buy them, never have never will.. The only DLC I own is from games I didnt buy till a collectors or GOTY edition came out.

Personally dont think that this trend will last forever... Current US games seem to be made for the lowest common denominator when it comes to challenge so I really hope the gaming market makes a big change again soon.
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Posted 2/11/15

MakotoKamui wrote:


As a former game dev, I may be able to answer some of that.

You seem to be saying - the disc has the assets/levels/abilities/etc that are "unlocked" by buying DLC. So they're on the disc all along, why should we pay extra, right?

This is quite true. In most cases, DLC doesn't download much, at least for the first several months of a game's lifecycle. Those assets were pre-planned as post-release items, just like "exclusive" items are. They're bundled into the assets all along. A few exceptions are for bug fixes and such, but those are usually available for everyone, even if they don't buy the DLC, in case of multiplayer setups.

But the developers and publishers planned it that way intentionally. By putting those things on the source disc, they are guaranteed - no download restrictions, the developers know they work with the game with no bugs, and so on. This helps the publisher and developer - if the developer goes under or has moved on to another project, those DLC items can still become available and bring interest back to the game.

This would be like seeing a copy of Fate/Zero, reading the back of the box, and deciding to buy it. Then, I find out later that if I pay a price, I can also watch Carnival Phantasm on that disc. The data was there, but I didn't think I was getting it for my purchase price. That still seems fair to me.


I'm accully in a education for game design, I currently know how to use Autodesk software and Unity to some extent plus programming in C#, Java and HTML... So that's that... Anyhow, back to the point.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that DLC is a bad thing. Infact, I like the idea of DLC when made right. If you look at Sony's Soul Sacrifice, Nintendo with Hyrule and a bunch of other companies then they tend to release free DLC after release sometimes at a small fee and other times 100% free of charge. What I'm saying is that I'm against companies looking away such a big portion of a product and then selling it to you later. It's not like Take2 and Turtlerock is the only criminals when it comes to bad DLC, Ubisoft and Capcom are 2 examples of compnaies making bad DLC... I mean, have you looked at the Watch_Dogs spreadcheet?



I as an consumer shouldn't have to buy diff versions of the same product to get everything... Plus I defentatly shouldn't need a spreadcheet to help me decide what version of a game I'm picking up.
Posted 2/11/15
I've been having a lot of Youtube comment arguments (Ugh I hate internet arguments) about the new game Evolve and its BS scummy practices. I dislike when companies at least in gaming, sell you the full product and try to shove dlc down your throat.
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Posted 2/11/15
Some DLC is definitely worth it. The expansions in Morrowind, and to a lesser extent Oblivion and Skyrim, are so huge that some companies would release them as full-price games. While other companies, like BioWare, charge $15-20 for DLC that lasts an hour.

If they keep on making great games (and localizing them in some cases) I will gladly keep throwing money at companies such as Namco and Square Enix. Square especially gives a ton of value for FF XIV. Each quarter they add a massive patch full of tons of things to do, and its free. Sure you have to pay a subscription fee, but with how long people play the game they hardly buy any others and end up actually saving money.
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Posted 2/12/15
If someone has the money and choses to buy it then fine.
If they get tricked into buying it not realising, then not ok...
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Posted 2/12/15
Evolve is pretty bad, it's concerning but nothing new either I suppose.
Also Polygon is one of the worst sites out there
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