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Post Reply New Animators $1.20 Hour
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Posted 3/10/15 , edited 3/10/15

sonic720 wrote:

No one forces anyone to become an animator. They go into this line of work because they are passionate about making anime. As to being underpaid, that is a labor dispute that should be worked out between the animators and those they work for. It's sad they are being underpaid so poorly for their efforts, but ultimately it is their choice to remain working for an employer that values their talents that little or not.


I like the lack of noting any culpability of the consumers. Howard Roark would be proud.
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Posted 3/10/15
I can't belive that's actully a thing
Posted 3/10/15

maxgale wrote:


I like the lack of noting any culpability of the consumers. Howard Roark would be proud.


none of the points you mentioned have nothing to do with why they are paid shit wages. it doesn't matter how shitty the anime is, they are still drawing it & the consumer has nothing to do with this. actually the demand for shit "otaku" shows keeps the animators employed, cause they are able to draw for another show.

they are called starving artist for a reason, cause no matter what media you are an artist in you get paid next to nothing. like it has already been said, it's a labor dispute between the employers & employees, they can all ban together and stop drawing, don't know if that will help if someone else is willing to step right in for shit wages.
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Posted 3/10/15

-mockingbird wrote:


maxgale wrote:


I like the lack of noting any culpability of the consumers. Howard Roark would be proud.


none of the points you mentioned have nothing to do with why they are paid shit wages. it doesn't matter how shitty the anime is, they are still drawing it & the consumer has nothing to do with this. actually the demand for shit "otaku" shows keeps the animators employed, cause they are able to draw for another show.

they are called starving artist for a reason, cause no matter what media you are an artist in you get paid next to nothing. like it has already been said, it's a labor dispute between the employers & employees, they can all ban together and stop drawing, don't know if that will help if someone else is willing to step right in for shit wages.


Son, here's a quick economics lesson.

A sandwich shop with a decent customer base across demographics decides to stop producing clubs and subs in order to chase after a very specialized but profitable audience, those who prefer the Shit Sandwich. (Due to the saturation of this word in your reply, thought it would be best to speak in a language you could understand).

However, the sandwich shop realizes that if this fickle audience doesn't like its expensive Shit Sandwich they are screwed. ASo they lower costs by paying employees less and crank up production of Shit Sandwiches so even if one batch flops they have another one ready.

This leads to over worked, under paid employees. So the company takes on students and newbies and under the guise of "training" them gives them a workload that would and should be the responsibility of those with more talent and experience.

But it still ain't enough. Bosses know eventually people will grow weary of eating Shit Sandwiches so they are bailing out, while having their employees take on work contracted out from third parties to pay for those nifty golden parachutes.


Get work somewhere else? Where.

Everyone is making the same shit sandwich, and the rest of society is leery of the entire sandwich market because that shit stinks.

In another industry?

Sorry, bucko, not with that shit clinging to your resume.

"My name is Shinji and my previous job was drawing slutty little sisters."

But hey, its great to be a consumer.

Shit Sandwich buffet.

And if anyone notes you're kinda to blame for ruining an entire industry, you can sit back with a Shit Sandwich-eating grin and blame the market, while totally ignoring you ARE the market!

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Posted 3/10/15
They get paid per image. So their hourly pay is up to them. It's a hard career, and if you are one of those artist that like to take their time you are out of luck.
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Posted 3/10/15

maxgale wrote:


-mockingbird wrote:


maxgale wrote:


I like the lack of noting any culpability of the consumers. Howard Roark would be proud.


none of the points you mentioned have nothing to do with why they are paid shit wages. it doesn't matter how shitty the anime is, they are still drawing it & the consumer has nothing to do with this. actually the demand for shit "otaku" shows keeps the animators employed, cause they are able to draw for another show.

they are called starving artist for a reason, cause no matter what media you are an artist in you get paid next to nothing. like it has already been said, it's a labor dispute between the employers & employees, they can all ban together and stop drawing, don't know if that will help if someone else is willing to step right in for shit wages.


Son, here's a quick economics lesson.

A sandwich shop with a decent customer base across demographics decides to stop producing clubs and subs in order to chase after a very specialized but profitable audience, those who prefer the Shit Sandwich. (Due to the saturation of this word in your reply, thought it would be best to speak in a language you could understand).

However, the sandwich shop realizes that if this fickle audience doesn't like its expensive Shit Sandwich they are screwed. ASo they lower costs by paying employees less and crank up production of Shit Sandwiches so even if one batch flops they have another one ready.

This leads to over worked, under paid employees. So the company takes on students and newbies and under the guise of "training" them gives them a workload that would and should be the responsibility of those with more talent and experience.

But it still ain't enough. Bosses know eventually people will grow weary of eating Shit Sandwiches so they are bailing out, while having their employees take on work contracted out from third parties to pay for those nifty golden parachutes.


Get work somewhere else? Where.

Everyone is making the same shit sandwich, and the rest of society is leery of the entire sandwich market because that shit stinks.

In another industry?

Sorry, bucko, not with that shit clinging to your resume.

"My name is Shinji and my previous job was drawing slutty little sisters."

But hey, its great to be a consumer.

Shit Sandwich buffet.

And if anyone notes you're kinda to blame for ruining an entire industry, you can sit back with a Shit Sandwich-eating grin and blame the market, while totally ignoring you ARE the market!



Thank god you wrote this before me, I was about to make a post pretty much exactly like this.
This also makes me think of that "no poaching" (http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-11-19/apple-google-no-poaching-evidence-triggers-more-lawsuits) situation in America's tech sector. But that's a whole 'nother can of worms.

Considering animators typically go through college training or equivalent, it's freaking disgusting we have people with starvation wages in first world countries. And artists are doing so much these days to remove the perception that they should be paid appropriately for their talents and hard work just like any other job.

I honestly hope that the people of Japan can fight for better working conditions. Their political atmosphere is much different than in the USA though, so we probably won't see mass protests or anything of the sort. Hopefully the workers in that industry don't let it just simply get "swept under the rug."
Posted 3/10/15 , edited 3/10/15

maxgale wrote:





zzzzzzz

again, the quality of the show is not proportionate to how much they make per image. even the "better" shows (which may not be a good show in your view) pay bad rates. the consumer doesn't determine their salary, the company and employee do. if the show is not profitable, it's not profitable, doesn't change the rates for all the other shows.
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Posted 3/10/15

-mockingbird wrote:


maxgale wrote:





zzzzzzz

again, the quality of the show is not proportionate to how much they make per image. even the "better" shows (which may not be a good show in your view) pay bad rates. the consumer doesn't determine their salary, the company and employee do. if the show is not profitable, it's not profitable, doesn't change the rates for all the other shows.


Consumers do have the power to influence businesses and markets. Protests and boycotts exist for a reason.
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Posted 3/10/15 , edited 3/10/15
....
I for one, am all for developing software that does most of the heavy work for them.
Something will give. People need to eat. Companies need to make money.
Posted 3/10/15

KupoBird wrote:


Consumers do have the power to influence businesses and markets. Protests and boycotts exist for a reason.


i can agree with that, but the assertion that consumers share blame for animators wages as they stand is a stretch. really the animators should have stood up long before this but different cultures and all. really the ideal situation is like the article you linked.

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Posted 3/10/15





Nobody forced them to become animators. That job has enough applicants as it is and I bet it is hard to even get the job in the first place.
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28 / M / USA! USA! USA!
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Posted 3/10/15
It always amazes me how entitled anime fandom can be, and then I remember just how many try to justify literally stealing the fruits of others labor, so I'm guessing it shouldn't be that surprising.

Pathetic, sure, but not surprising.
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Posted 3/10/15
Sad, if you are making so little I guess finding a place to live and paying rent is way out of the question. I guess rent is cheap in Japan?

On a side note though it might be getting worse soon if things don't tone down a little... With anime going more and more ecchi it won't be long and some parent down in the bible belt of america will walk in on their kids watching CR because after their kid saw it advertised talked their parents into getting it and just like most the people around me they just compare it to American cartoons, which is way off. After this it will blow up all over facebook and be on morning talk shows within a week.
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Posted 3/10/15
i wonder where the 80$ worth of 3 episodes on BR goes to?
xxJing 
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Posted 3/10/15
I feel for these guys, but at the same time I think the business model is a little messed up.

I mean the anime companies are apparently just barely scraping by making animes of which the blu-rays cost about $60 for a 2 episode blu-ray. That would be unimaginable in the States. The ENTIRE first season of a US sitcom on Blu-Ray is only $45.

To me it seems like they have gotten themselves caught in some horrible loop where everyone is miserable just trying to keep their heads above water.

As much as I enjoy watching World Break, I can assure you... I wouldn't pay more than $30 for an entire 1 cour 12 episode season of it. I think they have come to a place where they need to change their business practices... even if it means no more crappy anime targeted at a niche demographic... For godsakes, these anime air at like 3AM, how much more niche can you get.
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