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Post Reply A Theory About Gods Existence?
Posted 4/30/15 , edited 5/20/15

pandrasb wrote:


What's your definition of heaven?
For this example I'm gonna go for something kind of standard-ish. A place good people go after they die, to live blissfully for eternity. (or after live)

how can heaven exist without God?
Just for this example. (let's say it just exist)
Thought it would be interesting to see what would people do if there was a Heaven but no God there. Also curious as to what would you do if God is there?




I have a different idea of heaven. I base everything I'm going to say on my understanding of the Bible, I don't go to church and don't listen to any pastor/studies.

First of all, people say that only "good" people will go to heaven but the Bible says that no one is good. The ones who will go to heaven are the ones chosen by God, regardless of their actions. (If you want me to quote the Bible I can) so the fact that I do good in our understanding (like helping people, never stealing etc) is not a guarantee that I will be chosen, just like someone who killed, stole, or lied can be chosen if God wants to. To choose and forgive can be done at any moment. God could have forgiven you before you were born, right now or 2 seconds before you die.

Heaven for me is a place where all the souls worship God for eternity, like the angels and God is the King. That's why heaven would be pointless if there is no God because it would be the same as in Earth and right now (according to the Bible) God is not the ruler of the Earth, satan is.

Posted 4/30/15 , edited 5/21/15
When I think of the god of the bible this guy is the perfect representation of him/her.


I rather take Hestia has my god. than a murdering sociopath of a god.


And I feel the same way has Stephen Fry. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-d4otHE-YI Any god is better than the bible god. Translation. Even if the god of the bible is real, I rater implode than to worship that narcissist of a god.
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Posted 4/30/15 , edited 4/30/15

KarenAraragind I feel the same way has Stephen Fry. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-d4otHE-YI Any god is better than the bible god. Translation. Even if the god of the bible is real, I rater implode than to worship that narcissist of a god.


Yyyyyyep...Anglican. (Forced to memorize Old Testament lessons for most of his Hogwarts boys-school years.)
Sheesh, Brit-comic atheists are dull jackasses. They think the entire rest of the world had to take tests on Deuteronomy before their rugby practice, because that was the only state church apart from the Irish.

It's often joked that only atheists ever talk about Hell and the Old Testament because they think everyone else does too.
And for the large part, that's pretty much true--Even the Catholics pretty much gave up on the traditional Hieronymus Bosch image of Hell years ago, and does anyone know of a non-fundamentalist Protestant denomination that still even reads the "How God beat up the Philistines" OT anymore, except for Isaiah?
(No, seriously, been Lutheran for years, and I have absolutely no idea what happened between David slaying Goliath, and Psalms, apart from the a few of the NT-appropriate prophets. None. Should probably get around to reading that sometime, just for completion.)
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Posted 4/30/15

Ssomething wrote:


pandrasb wrote:


What's your definition of heaven?
For this example I'm gonna go for something kind of standard-ish. A place good people go after they die, to live blissfully for eternity. (or after live)

how can heaven exist without God?
Just for this example. (let's say it just exist)
Thought it would be interesting to see what would people do if there was a Heaven but no God there. Also curious as to what would you do if God is there?




I have a different idea of heaven. I base everything I'm going to say on my understanding of the Bible, I don't go to church and don't listen to any pastor/studies.

First of all, people say that only "good" people will go to heaven but the Bible says that no one is good. The ones who will go to heaven are the ones chosen by God, regardless of their actions. (If you want me to quote the Bible I can) so the fact that I do good in our understanding (like helping people, never stealing etc) is not a guarantee that I will be chosen, just like someone who killed, stole, or lied can be chosen if God wants to. To choose and forgive can be done at any moment. God could have forgiven you before you were born, right now or 2 seconds before you die.

Heaven for me is a place where all the souls worship God for eternity, like the angels and God is the King. That's why heaven would be pointless if there is no God because it would be the same as in Earth and right now (according to the Bible) God is not the ruler of the Earth, satan is.



I see I see, Thank you for answering

I only wish people would get all the stories straight, religion has become, a he says, she says. Where, I believe this, this is my interpretation, I don't like this part let's throw it out. Becomes common practice. And, so... where is the truth.
Is there not only one heaven and hell, where heaven and hell don't care for our interpretations?
Posted 4/30/15

Ejanss wrote:


KarenAraragind I feel the same way has Stephen Fry. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2-d4otHE-YI Any god is better than the bible god. Translation. Even if the god of the bible is real, I rater implode than to worship that narcissist of a god.


Yyyyyyep...Anglican. (Forced to memorize Old Testament lessons for most of his Hogwarts boys-school years.)
Sheesh, Brit-comic atheists are dull jackasses. They think the entire rest of the world had to take tests on Deuteronomy before their rugby practice, because that was the only state church apart from the Irish.

It's often joked that only atheists ever talk about Hell and the Old Testament because they think everyone else does too.
And for the large part, that's pretty much true--Even the Catholics pretty much gave up on the traditional Hieronymus Bosch image of Hell years ago, and does anyone know of a non-fundamentalist Protestant denomination that still even reads the "How God beat up the Philistines" OT anymore, except for Isaiah?
(No, seriously, been Lutheran for years, and I have absolutely no idea what happened between David slaying Goliath, and Psalms, apart from the a few of the NT-appropriate prophets. None. Should probably get around to reading that sometime, just for completion.)


I deal with a lot of Christians all the time. This how most conversation happen. God die for ours sins.
Me.


If you don't believe in god you will go to hell. You will burn for all eternity. People will stop talking to you.
Me.


You are going to hell !!! Repent you fool and give yourself to Jesus Christ.
Me.
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Posted 4/30/15

KarenAraragi wrote:


EjanssIt's often joked that only atheists ever talk about Hell and the Old Testament because they think everyone else does too.
And for the large part, that's pretty much true--Even the Catholics pretty much gave up on the traditional Hieronymus Bosch image of Hell years ago, and does anyone know of a non-fundamentalist Protestant denomination that still even reads the "How God beat up the Philistines" OT anymore, except for Isaiah?
(No, seriously, been Lutheran for years, and I have absolutely no idea what happened between David slaying Goliath, and Psalms, apart from the a few of the NT-appropriate prophets. None. Should probably get around to reading that sometime, just for completion.)


I deal with a lot of Christians all the time. This how most conversation happen.
If you don't believe in god you will go to hell. You will burn for all eternity. People will stop talking to you.


Okay, so you don't get out in the real world much. You could've just said that, and saved the bandwidth.
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Posted 4/30/15

kimchino wrote:

oh god, another religious "debate" thread, im out of here


same, i feel ya.
Posted 4/30/15

Ejanss wrote:


KarenAraragi wrote:


EjanssIt's often joked that only atheists ever talk about Hell and the Old Testament because they think everyone else does too.
And for the large part, that's pretty much true--Even the Catholics pretty much gave up on the traditional Hieronymus Bosch image of Hell years ago, and does anyone know of a non-fundamentalist Protestant denomination that still even reads the "How God beat up the Philistines" OT anymore, except for Isaiah?
(No, seriously, been Lutheran for years, and I have absolutely no idea what happened between David slaying Goliath, and Psalms, apart from the a few of the NT-appropriate prophets. None. Should probably get around to reading that sometime, just for completion.)


I deal with a lot of Christians all the time. This how most conversation happen.
If you don't believe in god you will go to hell. You will burn for all eternity. People will stop talking to you.


Okay, so you don't get out in the real world much. You could've just said that, and saved the bandwidth.


I do go out a lot, but the thing is


And people in my family and people where I live like to listing to pastors talking bullshit or making shit up, So regardless if I go out, I still surrounded by idiots
Posted 4/30/15 , edited 4/30/15

pandrasb wrote:

I see I see, Thank you for answering

I only wish people would get all the stories straight, religion has become, a he says, she says. Where, I believe this, this is my interpretation, I don't like this part let's throw it out. Becomes common practice. And, so... where is the truth.
Is there not only one heaven and hell, where heaven and hell don't care for our interpretations?


I understand your point, I have wondered the same thing^^ this is why I asked if you need quotes because everything is clear from the Bible but I didn't want to sound too religious, especially in this forum. I don't know where people got all these different ideas about heaven, hell etc and this is also the reason why I don't go to church because they like to make things up a lot. For example, Christmas is not in the Bible and no one knows when Jesus was born, plus, that holiday came from the pagans.

I liked what you said in bold, it doesn't matter what we think. Just live, do good and be happy, enjoy life.
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Posted 4/30/15 , edited 5/20/15

Ssomething wrote:


pandrasb wrote:

I see I see, Thank you for answering

I only wish people would get all the stories straight, religion has become, a he says, she says. Where, I believe this, this is my interpretation, I don't like this part let's throw it out. Becomes common practice. And, so... where is the truth.
Is there not only one heaven and hell, where heaven and hell don't care for our interpretations?


I understand your point, I have wondered the same thing^^ this is why I asked if you need quotes because everything is clear from the Bible but I didn't want to sound too religious, especially in this forum. I don't know where people got all these different ideas about heaven, hell etc and this is also the reason why I don't go to church because they like to make things up a lot. For example, Christmas is not in the Bible and no one knows when Jesus was born, plus, that holiday came from the pagans.

I liked what you said in bold, it doesn't matter what we think. Just live, do good and be happy, enjoy life.


Thank you for taking your time to reply.

And I think that is a great idea.
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Posted 4/30/15
He's not.

/theory
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Posted 4/30/15
A couple of reasons of why I believe that God exists are the laws of probability and moral law.

"Several years ago, evolutionist Harold Morowitz of Yale, and currently professor of biology and natural philosophy at George Mason University, estimated the probability of the formation of the smallest and simplest living organism to be one in 10 to the 340,000,000 power(1970, p. 99). A few years following Morowitz’s calculations, the late, renowned evolutionist Carl Sagan made his own estimation of the chance that life could evolve on any given single planet: one in 10 to the 2,000,000,000 power (1973, p. 46)". I believe that intelligent design had to have occurred, it being basically impossible for an mere explosion to have created something so mind-blowingly intricate.

Also, if the big bang actually happened and we are just products of chance, then what worth do we have as people? Also, what right would we have to say that something is right or wrong, and have only our "conscience" to support our viewpoint? Just looking at how that world, we can realize the damage of doing whatever is right in our own eyes rather than God's. That's why I believe a moral law has to exist, and with that, the Author of the moral law. No human could establish a perfect law, we ourselves being imperfect and having different views. Any issue like homosexuality is clear proof that not only can't every man agree on pivotal issues, their reasons for believing the way they do make them believe they are right. I don't think that outside of God and His law, man can determine what is right and what is wrong. Consequently, I believe that the lack of belief in the God of the Bible has caused chaos in the world. Without God, there can really be no absolute law, and even with the belief that there is a God, there are so many religions out here that have different views of who He really is.
One of the reasons why I believe that Christianity is the true religion is because the Bible itself is the most historically accurate doctrine of all time, and many of its prophecies have been fulfilled.
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Posted 4/30/15
You've been watching way too much anime!
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Posted 4/30/15

31899 wrote:

A couple of reasons of why I believe that God exists are the laws of probability and moral law.

"Several years ago, evolutionist Harold Morowitz of Yale, and currently professor of biology and natural philosophy at George Mason University, estimated the probability of the formation of the smallest and simplest living organism to be one in 10 to the 340,000,000 power(1970, p. 99). A few years following Morowitz’s calculations, the late, renowned evolutionist Carl Sagan made his own estimation of the chance that life could evolve on any given single planet: one in 10 to the 2,000,000,000 power (1973, p. 46)". I believe that intelligent design had to have occurred, it being basically impossible for an mere explosion to have created something so mind-blowingly intricate.

Also, if the big bang actually happened and we are just products of chance, then what worth do we have as people? Also, what right would we have to say that something is right or wrong, and have only our "conscience" to support our viewpoint? Just looking at how that world, we can realize the damage of doing whatever is right in our own eyes rather than God's. That's why I believe a moral law has to exist, and with that, the Author of the moral law. No human could establish a perfect law, we ourselves being imperfect and having different views. Any issue like homosexuality is clear proof that not only can't every man agree on pivotal issues, their reasons for believing the way they do make them believe they are right. I don't think that outside of God and His law, man can determine what is right and what is wrong. Consequently, I believe that the lack of belief in the God of the Bible has caused chaos in the world. Without God, there can really be no absolute law, and even with the belief that there is a God, there are so many religions out here that have different views of who He really is.
One of the reasons why I believe that Christianity is the true religion is because the Bible itself is the most historically accurate doctrine of all time, and many of its prophecies have been fulfilled.


Your belief system is fine and I respect your right to express it.You need no justification for your faith and I respect that also,but I disagree that the Bible is the most historically accurate document ever written.First off the canon has been added to and edited by every monk zealot,reformer,not to mention Pope,and every denomination, (prior to the printing press), for 2000 years.The King James version that a lot of people use was compiled by a guy that thought burning witches was a reasonable pastime. A giant game of post office. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
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Posted 4/30/15
All hail the Parking God! He is almighty and grants the wishes of those who are in need of a parking spot.

Be wary all ye nay sayers, for the Parking God is ever watchful.

Really... He's looking for more followers...

If I am the only one who worships him, does that make me a prophet?
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