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Post Reply Are we caught up in an illusion?
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Posted 7/23/15
A few years ago my friend told me about how he took 8 doses of LSD and experienced an ego death. I had no idea what that meant, so i looked into it and found that what he was describing was what the zen Buddhists call nirvana. After that i started to become really curious and started listening to a lot of Alan Watts.

So my question is, are we caught up in an illusion of separation between what we identify as our self and our true self being the entire universe? And are we making the voluntary and involuntary to be something separate? And is it wrong for the govt. to make tools like LSD and shrooms, which can be used as a microscope for exploration into our subconscious, illegal?

Here's a quote from a Japanese Zen master.

"One day I wiped out all the notions from my mind. I gave up all desire. I discarded all the words with which I thought and stayed in quietude. I felt a little queer – as if I were being carried into something, or as if I were touching some power unknown to me … and Ztt! I entered. I lost the boundary of my physical body. I had my skin, of course, but I felt I was standing in the center of the cosmos. I spoke, but my words had lost their meaning. I saw people coming towards me, but all were the same man. All were myself! I had never known this world. I had believed that I was created, but now I must change my opinion: I was never created;

I was the cosmos; no individual Mr. Sasaki existed."


Keep in mind I'm not advocating illegal drug use in any way. In fact, meditation is a much more effective way into seeing reality. I'm only trying to raise a discussion.
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Posted 7/23/15 , edited 7/24/15

Take the Redpill my friend.
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Posted 7/23/15
You can only find a state of mind out of reality, a place where you begin to question everything and also nothing, but reality will only suck you back in, and life will only dim
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Posted 7/23/15
Depends.

Everybody who takes LSD has a different trip. And if you are really comfortable with who you really are, it won't be so bad, but if you aren't, then it can get a bit weird. LSD, X and a couple other drugs can be used to help "reset" a broken mind, as crazy as that sounds because you have to face shit you've buried. Do it in the wrong place, wrong frame of mind, and start to lose your shit, and if you're lucky, you'll only get locked in a trunk of a car so you can't self harm yourself.
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Posted 7/23/15

CSPower wrote:

You can only find a state of mind out of reality, a place where you begin to question everything and also nothing, but reality will only suck you back in, and life will only dim


What on earth are you talking about...?


VZ68 wrote:

Depends.

Everybody who takes LSD has a different trip. And if you are really comfortable with who you really are, it won't be so bad, but if you aren't, then it can get a bit weird. LSD, X and a couple other drugs can be used to help "reset" a broken mind, as crazy as that sounds because you have to face shit you've buried. Do it in the wrong place, wrong frame of mind, and start to lose your shit, and if you're lucky, you'll only get locked in a trunk of a car so you can't self harm yourself.


Of course LSD isn't for everyone. But does that mean it should be illegal? Alcohol isn't for everyone either. In my opinion it should be legal but you have to be 18 or 21 to buy it. Just like alcohol.
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Posted 7/24/15
These type of questions can't really be answered, we can't possibly know the outcome of things until we leave this existence.

As for the illegal stance of certain psychedelics i can see why they are, but that shouldn't be the governments choice in the matter it should be whoever is taking them's choice.

I fully believe in the power of psychedelics when used in the right way to open ones mind and only in the right setting. Meditation is also a great way to expand the consciousness of the mind, but most people dont understand the proper way to go about it or care to do it in the first place. True meditation isn't just about sitting on your floor with your palms up in the air. It can be a "more" effective tool but the issue arises do you live in a place or are able to go to a place where you can be free of all distractions? More than likely for the majority of beginners, that would be a no.

Nirvana,Shangri-Lai, enlightenment call it what you will, most people can barely cope with reality let alone a higher state of being. Is the human race ready for enlightenment?
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Posted 7/24/15

Haruna-kai wrote:

These type of questions can't really be answered, we can't possibly know the outcome of things until we leave this existence.

As for the illegal stance of certain psychedelics i can see why they are, but that shouldn't be the governments choice in the matter it should be whoever is taking them's choice.

I fully believe in the power of psychedelics when used in the right way to open ones mind and only in the right setting. Meditation is also a great way to expand the consciousness of the mind, but most people dont understand the proper way to go about it or care to do it in the first place. True meditation isn't just about sitting on your floor with your palms up in the air. It can be a "more" effective tool but the issue arises do you live in a place or are able to go to a place where you can be free of all distractions? More than likely for the majority of beginners, that would be a no.

Nirvana,Shangri-Lai, enlightenment call it what you will, most people can barely cope with reality let alone a higher state of being. Is the human race ready for enlightenment?


I don't think you have to be "ready" for enlightenment, because enlightenment is realizing and seeing reality for what it is. In Zen they say that everybody is the Buddha, they just don't know it. So your saying that people might not be ready to live truly but I have to say I don't quite understand that. Wouldn't it be better for people realize realness instead of living and suffering for no reason?
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Posted 7/24/15

ibrahim2712 wrote:


CSPower wrote:

You can only find a state of mind out of reality, a place where you begin to question everything and also nothing, but reality will only suck you back in, and life will only dim


What on earth are you talking about...?


VZ68 wrote:

Depends.

Everybody who takes LSD has a different trip. And if you are really comfortable with who you really are, it won't be so bad, but if you aren't, then it can get a bit weird. LSD, X and a couple other drugs can be used to help "reset" a broken mind, as crazy as that sounds because you have to face shit you've buried. Do it in the wrong place, wrong frame of mind, and start to lose your shit, and if you're lucky, you'll only get locked in a trunk of a car so you can't self harm yourself.


Of course LSD isn't for everyone. But does that mean it should be illegal? Alcohol isn't for everyone either. In my opinion it should be legal but you have to be 18 or 21 to buy it. Just like alcohol.


No bitches about that here. I've heard studies that a good hit of X can help people "reset" PTSD and shit like that. I've tripped the light fantastic enough in my youth that I don't believe it's a problem, then again, I don't try to be Hunter S Thompson and dose myself to the moon every day. That's the problem with a bunch of the fellow idiots around you, zero self control and zero planning.
Posted 7/24/15
No, thank you sir, reality is chaotic enough as is to not want difficulty discerning what is real, and I don't like the idea of "bad trips", either, they say those can sometime take years to overcome, and would still get flashbacks.
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Posted 7/24/15

ibrahim2712 wrote:

I don't think you have to be "ready" for enlightenment, because enlightenment is realizing and seeing reality for what it is. In Zen they say that everybody is the Buddha, they just don't know it. So your saying that people might not be ready to live truly but I have to say I don't quite understand that. Wouldn't it be better for people realize realness instead of living and suffering for no reason?


Buddhism has many offshoots depending on the country you visit, I dont claim to know if any are right or wrong or that one has more answers than the other. From my understanding Zen is an offshoot of Tibetan and it has a slightly different view if I'm remembering it correctly, hardly an expert or follow it much but my mom was into and still is for the most part i would assume. Tibetan states that one achieves enlightenment through a series of trials throughout life and you eventually reach that state. Like i said I dont know what is right or wrong but most people dont want to accept reality as it is now or maybe as some claim the illusion of reality. Either way a person has to accept it and overcome that obstacle to truly reach a higher state.

People just aren't ready to reach the higher existence in reality, whether we just have to reach out and grab it or have to overcome obstacles throughout life and multiple lives if thats the case. People should realize it but the problem is other religions that interfere with that teaching.

I dont think anyone has the right or wrong answer and I believe that anything is possible.
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Posted 7/24/15
OP, are you on LSD right now? Drugs are bad for you.

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Posted 7/24/15 , edited 7/24/15
When coming to religion I dunno, maybe he experiences that because he felt happy at the moment of taking it. Many people always question the forms outside of reality and what's really reality? or Do we really exist? Why when the impossible happen and discard as miracles? I don't think Buddhist take drugs. lol
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Posted 7/24/15

PhantomGundam wrote:

OP, are you on LSD right now? Drugs are bad for you.






Drugs? In my anime chat?
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Posted 7/24/15 , edited 7/24/15
According to Freudian Psychology, the human psyche is composed of three theoretical parts: 1) The Id, 2) the ego, and 3) the super-ego. The id is the set of uncoordinated instinctual trends; the super-ego plays the critical and moralizing role; and the ego is the organized, realistic part that mediates between the desires of the id and the super-ego.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Id,_ego_and_super-ego

The ego more or less is the perception of ourselves that we present to society. For various reasons we can't always act out the animalistic desires of ID or moral desires of the super-ego, otherwise we wouldn't be able to function in society, so we have an ego that limits both.An ego death is when that regulatory/limiting/restrictive part of our minds seizes functioning.

Not sure if any of that was relevant but I hope it helps. As for whether or not drugs should be legal, they should be. The government should not mandate what its citizens put and do not put in their body's.
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Posted 7/24/15
"...our true self being the entire universe", what does that even mean...? You sound as though you've had experience involving your "true self" and the "entire universe". Can you give a more detailed explanation? Pretty vague if you ask me.
Also, I don't believe it is wrong for the government to put restrictions on said hallucinogens. You're just thinking from your own point of view. Consider what other people would think.
The only illusion is what you, yourself, create to be an illusion.
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