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Bullying VS Online Bullying
Posted 9/2/15


bruh you just said ''i expect this from someone who blah blah nicki minaj''
dont talk or quote me if you can't understand what i say
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Posted 9/2/15

ignitingmemories wrote:

why would you get offended or cry about what someone says about you if you know its not true????


I am mostly unaffected by psychological torment. The thing I had to watch out for growing up was turning into a bully in response. My natural reaction was to walk up, confront them, and if they didn't back down, make them with force. I learned to better control my temper and largely ignore them or use verbal methods to put them in their place. Not everyone is built like me though, I am not emotionally or neurologically normal to begin with. I am not negatively impacted by some things that are a big deal for most people. Several others only impact me briefly when they cause long term or life long issues for others. If I hold everyone to my standards that is not fair, appropriate, or moral.

Earlier it was suggested that people should stand up for others. I did that in high school as well. At one point I was ganged up on by a large number of people in response and the incident involved serious injuries on both sides before it was over. My school allowed carrying knives up to four inches for "sharpening pencils". I had a rough high school career. Sometimes I felt more like I was in some bad gangland movie than real life. Standing up for others is not risk free. Not all bullies are easily put in check. Some come in packs and are armed. I've had to hurt people and have been hurt. I wouldn't be so cavalier in asking others to put themselves in that kind of position. One of the guys wore a bailing ring to school and wasn't called on it until he had used it in his fifth fight in a row. It is literally a small knife attached to a simple steel ring with a little bolt. It's for cutting the twine binding hay bails.

Not every life is the same. I have understood for a long time that parts of my experience won't even be superficially similar to that of many other people. It isn't fair or good to assume that because your experience indicates something it will hold true for someone else. Many people will prove stronger than you in some areas and weaker in others. You also can't usually control other people, so if the entire group believes rumors that cause them to avoid, mock, and refuse to accept you that will have real and meaningful impact on what you can accomplish and how far you can get.

As to cyber bullying specifically, it is not just limited to the online world anymore. There have been cases where they have threatened someone with real world consequences (like credit damage, etc. and the FBI can't always find these guys quickly or sometimes ever) and blackmailed the person for nudity then faxed said nudes to work places or schools. To believe it is always simple to handle is naive. Even if you protect yourself reasonably well, there are people whose attention will hurt you. My real life issues may have been harsher than most cyber bullying, but that doesn't make cyber bullying chump change.
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Posted 9/2/15

PrinceJudar wrote:


Doomedfox wrote:
I think this particular case makes my point nobody forced her to go check out the side it was her decision to do so she decided to let it affect her she could have ignored it never go there and read it but she made the decision in favor of being bullied.
The people responsible for the side should be punished severely but it doesn't change the fact that they did not force her to go to the side and read it.


You're right she didn't have to read it. That's just not how human nature normally works though. Most people almost feel a need to at least know what's being said about them behind their backs. How many people can you think of that you have met that actually care about what other people think of them? How many people have you met with low self esteem? How many of them tend to be younger? How many people can you think of that may be in a fragile moment of their lives?

Those people are usually the victims. It's not like they want to hate themselves, it's just a product of their minds. People can and will contribute to the way and manner people think.

If you don't' care what people think, you've been taught right. However, where did you learn it from? Friends? Family? Life experience?

Not everyone has that. There's a reason most victims are younger.


ignitingmemories wrote:
never said it wasn't


I'm confused. You've made it clear you think cyberbullying isn't real. Though you're saying it's a problem. How is something imaginary a problem?



I honestly can not think of anyone who would fit the criteria you described maybe its a generation thing maybe location has something to do with it or maybe i just picked the right people to surround me with.
However you yourself said bullying is something that is hard to avoid or get away from than you present a situation who had the victim taking an active role to even get bullied by visiting her side.
It seems to me like you did prove my point it can not be the same as bullying if you can choose to be affected.
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Posted 9/2/15 , edited 9/2/15

LordDust wrote:


Well written. Lovely post.




Doomedfox wrote:

I honestly can not think of anyone who would fit the criteria you described maybe its a generation thing maybe location has something to do with it or maybe i just picked the right people to surround me with.
However you yourself said bullying is something that is hard to avoid or get away from than you present a situation who had the victim taking an active role to even get bullied by visiting her side.
It seems to me like you did prove my point it can not be the same as bullying if you can choose to be affected.


Mate. Just because she didn't visit the site wouldn't mean people would stop talking about it at school lol.
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Posted 9/2/15

LordDust wrote:


ignitingmemories wrote:

why would you get offended or cry about what someone says about you if you know its not true????


I am mostly unaffected by psychological torment. The thing I had to watch out for growing up was turning into a bully in response. My natural reaction was to walk up, confront them, and if they didn't back down, make them with force. I learned to better control my temper and largely ignore them or use verbal methods to put them in their place. Not everyone is built like me though, I am not emotionally or neurologically normal to begin with. I am not negatively impacted by some things that are a big deal for most people. Several others only impact me briefly when they cause long term or life long issues for others. If I hold everyone to my standards that is not fair, appropriate, or moral.

Earlier it was suggested that people should stand up for others. I did that in high school as well. At one point I was ganged up on by a large number of people in response and the incident involved serious injuries on both sides before it was over. My school allowed carrying knives up to four inches for "sharpening pencils". I had a rough high school career. Sometimes I felt more like I was in some bad gangland movie than real life. Standing up for others is not risk free. Not all bullies are easily put in check. Some come in packs and are armed. I've had to hurt people and have been hurt. I wouldn't be so cavalier in asking others to put themselves in that kind of position. One of the guys wore a bailing ring to school and wasn't called on it until he had used it in his fifth fight in a row. It is literally a small knife attached to a simple steel ring with a little bolt. It's for cutting the twine binding hay bails.

Not every life is the same. I have understood for a long time that parts of my experience won't even be superficially similar to that of many other people. It isn't fair or good to assume that because your experience indicates something it will hold true for someone else. Many people will prove stronger than you in some areas and weaker in others. You also can't usually control other people, so if the entire group believes rumors that cause them to avoid, mock, and refuse to accept you that will have real and meaningful impact on what you can accomplish and how far you can get.

As to cyber bullying specifically, it is not just limited to the online world anymore. There have been cases where they have threatened someone with real world consequences (like credit damage, etc. and the FBI can't always find these guys quickly or sometimes ever) and blackmailed the person for nudity then faxed said nudes to work places or schools. To believe it is always simple to handle is naive. Even if you protect yourself reasonably well, there are people whose attention will hurt you. My real life issues may have been harsher than most cyber bullying, but that doesn't make cyber bullying chump change.


I don't dispute that cyber bullying can be a problem but unlike rl bullying it can only impact you if you made yourself a target first.
In your post you mentioned the consequences for standing up to bullys but they are not the same in cyber bullying.
If you do not give out private information over the internet there is no way it could affect you in any way.
They can not threaten your credit score or send pictures or whatever else you were thinking about if you did not give them the necessary information's first.
Physical bullying you can not avoid most of the times you do need to go to school (as example) after all but you really do not need to NOR SHOULD YOU EVER give out personal information's carelessly online.
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Posted 9/2/15

Doomedfox wrote:
I honestly can not think of anyone who would fit the criteria you described maybe its a generation thing maybe location has something to do with it or maybe i just picked the right people to surround me with.
However you yourself said bullying is something that is hard to avoid or get away from than you present a situation who had the victim taking an active role to even get bullied by visiting her side.
It seems to me like you did prove my point it can not be the same as bullying if you can choose to be affected.


Never mind that if everyone in the school believes the rumors this will have a measurable impact on the girl whether she reads it or not. Cyber bullying seldom stays entirely online. A vaguely similar incident occurred at my school when I was in high school. Some of the teachers began to believe the rumors about the girl's "sexual exploits". Despite complaints filed by her and her parents no legal actions were ever taken against the perpetrators. She did drop out of school and I know she attempted suicide at least once. A concerted campaign conducted against someone online can indeed have real world consequences. In more recent years the ante has been upped by those who are skilled enough to affect credit history and public image. These kinds of things have cost people jobs and caused other hardship. Cyber bullying is real and more complex than you might imagine. Real physical threats may be harsh, but the things that can be done largely online these days are no laughing matter. You can't always avoid the consequences by simply ignoring them.
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Posted 9/2/15 , edited 9/2/15
I don't consider it bullying online if there isn't at least one of the following:
1. Element of duress or trickery that can lead to actual consequences, like loss of employment, leaking private information to family and friends and such. I consider hacking and obtaining classified information to be a type of trickery since it is dishonest.
2. A real threat and possibility of physical harm.
3. Sending online messages to victim's friends/acquaintances/family that, with or without proof, aim to damage a person's relationships. The victim can always control what he/she takes with a grain of salt but his./her circle of people may not know what or what not to believe.

Additionally, I'm more inclined to consider it bullying if there is repeated behavior by the same person (or group of affiliated people) intended to make the "victim" feel uncomfortable and/or threatened in addition to at least one element above.

Anything else is just gibberish and there's no obligation for a person to answer to the hostile party and almost no likelihood of the messages manifesting into real consequences.

Trolls and rude people aren't quite up there yet since they don't usually have the means to cause any harm. If you read something online and are merely offended, I'm sorry, but you have to just deal with it. The world is a rough and tumble place but that doesn't mean you're being seriously attacked every time you feel offended. Don't give bullying the same treatment as rape. Like when people pretend to be raped and come up with stuff like mind rape, stare rape, virtual rape, etc. That sort of meaningless nonsense. It doesn't help actual victims and causes people to take the matter more lightly.
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Posted 9/2/15

Doomedfox wrote:


LordDust wrote:


ignitingmemories wrote:

why would you get offended or cry about what someone says about you if you know its not true????


I am mostly unaffected by psychological torment. The thing I had to watch out for growing up was turning into a bully in response. My natural reaction was to walk up, confront them, and if they didn't back down, make them with force. I learned to better control my temper and largely ignore them or use verbal methods to put them in their place. Not everyone is built like me though, I am not emotionally or neurologically normal to begin with. I am not negatively impacted by some things that are a big deal for most people. Several others only impact me briefly when they cause long term or life long issues for others. If I hold everyone to my standards that is not fair, appropriate, or moral.

Earlier it was suggested that people should stand up for others. I did that in high school as well. At one point I was ganged up on by a large number of people in response and the incident involved serious injuries on both sides before it was over. My school allowed carrying knives up to four inches for "sharpening pencils". I had a rough high school career. Sometimes I felt more like I was in some bad gangland movie than real life. Standing up for others is not risk free. Not all bullies are easily put in check. Some come in packs and are armed. I've had to hurt people and have been hurt. I wouldn't be so cavalier in asking others to put themselves in that kind of position. One of the guys wore a bailing ring to school and wasn't called on it until he had used it in his fifth fight in a row. It is literally a small knife attached to a simple steel ring with a little bolt. It's for cutting the twine binding hay bails.

Not every life is the same. I have understood for a long time that parts of my experience won't even be superficially similar to that of many other people. It isn't fair or good to assume that because your experience indicates something it will hold true for someone else. Many people will prove stronger than you in some areas and weaker in others. You also can't usually control other people, so if the entire group believes rumors that cause them to avoid, mock, and refuse to accept you that will have real and meaningful impact on what you can accomplish and how far you can get.

As to cyber bullying specifically, it is not just limited to the online world anymore. There have been cases where they have threatened someone with real world consequences (like credit damage, etc. and the FBI can't always find these guys quickly or sometimes ever) and blackmailed the person for nudity then faxed said nudes to work places or schools. To believe it is always simple to handle is naive. Even if you protect yourself reasonably well, there are people whose attention will hurt you. My real life issues may have been harsher than most cyber bullying, but that doesn't make cyber bullying chump change.


I don't dispute that cyber bullying can be a problem but unlike rl bullying it can only impact you if you made yourself a target first.
In your post you mentioned the consequences for standing up to bullys but they are not the same in cyber bullying.
If you do not give out private information over the internet there is no way it could affect you in any way.
They can not threaten your credit score or send pictures or whatever else you were thinking about if you did not give them the necessary information's first.
Physical bullying you can not avoid most of the times you do need to go to school (as example) after all but you really do not need to NOR SHOULD YOU EVER give out personal information's carelessly online.

You do know it is possible to track an IP to a location and it is also possible to find out who is paying for that access? Unless you use illegal methods the only way to be so safe that they CANNOT get your info is to only go online through public sources or other's internet. Although most devices have unique identifiers they automatically offer up, which can be used to track access patterns and allow you to find out where someone is likely to be. No one I know of is careful enough that they are untouchable. Your info is out there. I am very careful with mine, google gives almost nothing with my full name. I do know how to get info on someone as well protected as I am though. The internet is not as anonymous as you think. I'm not even that good at this stuff, there are many people better educated and more skilled than I am in regards to cyber security.
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Posted 9/2/15

PrinceJudar wrote:

It certainly can be. Bullying of any type isn't for the strong. People physically bully the physically weak and psychologically bully the mentally weak. That's just how it is and the type they target.



Exactly, some people are more prone to bullying than others and usually bullies will go after those people. On the same note, there are some people who are very strong physically but weak mentally and vice versa.


On another note, wtf happened to this thread?? Like geeze.



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Posted 9/2/15

PrinceJudar wrote:


LordDust wrote:


Well written. Lovely post.




Doomedfox wrote:

I honestly can not think of anyone who would fit the criteria you described maybe its a generation thing maybe location has something to do with it or maybe i just picked the right people to surround me with.
However you yourself said bullying is something that is hard to avoid or get away from than you present a situation who had the victim taking an active role to even get bullied by visiting her side.
It seems to me like you did prove my point it can not be the same as bullying if you can choose to be affected.


Mate. Just because she didn't visit the site wouldn't mean people would stop talking about it at school lol.


Well did they?
If they would talk about that in school anyways its even more reason not to get the extra put down and visit the side.
If her schoolmates wanted to tell her the things they said online to her face it stands to reason they did so long before the side was up if they did the side shouldn't have hurt her anymore than rl already did and if they did not she was dumb to go there.
Bullys are a terrible disease and harm a lot of people but they will never change the only way it could stop is if the weak minded get stronger and stop being victims.
Bully victims in a way are like the starving man you could give a fish or teach to fish and i for one much rather would live in a world of fishermen than a world of starving beggars.

My point is that while bullying is terrible it doesn't help to always cuddle the victims make excuses for them and what not if you know a victim don't cuddle her/him tell her/him to grow a pair and focus on whats important.
Posted 9/2/15



On another note, wtf happened to this thread?? Like geeze.

idk you tell me
Posted 9/2/15


Morbidhanson wrote:

I don't consider it bullying online if there isn't at least one of the following:
1. Element of duress or trickery that can lead to actual consequences, like loss of employment, leaking private information to family and friends and such. I consider hacking and obtaining classified information to be a type of trickery since it is dishonest.
2. A real threat and possibility of physical harm.
3. Sending online messages to victim's friends/acquaintances/family that, with or without proof, aim to damage a person's relationships. The victim can always control what he/she takes with a grain of salt but his./her circle of people may not know what or what not to believe.

Additionally, I'm more inclined to consider it bullying if there is repeated behavior by the same person intended to make the "victim" feel uncomfortable and/or threatened in addition to at least one element above.

Anything else is just gibberish and there's no obligation for a person to answer to the hostile party and almost no likelihood of the messages manifesting into real consequences.

Trolls and rude people aren't quite up there yet since they don't usually have the means to cause any harm. If you read something online and are merely offended, I'm sorry, but you have to just deal with it. Don't give bullying the same treatment as rape. Like when people pretend to be raped and come up with stuff like mind rape, stare rape, virtual rape, etc. That sort of meaningless nonsense. It doesn't help actual victims and causes people to take the matter more lightly.




exactly what i was trying to say.
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Posted 9/2/15 , edited 9/2/15

LordDust wrote:

You do know it is possible to track an IP to a location and it is also possible to find out who is paying for that access? Unless you use illegal methods the only way to be so safe that they CANNOT get your info is to only go online through public sources or other's internet. Although most devices have unique identifiers they automatically offer up, which can be used to track access patterns and allow you to find out where someone is likely to be. No one I know of is careful enough that they are untouchable. Your info is out there. I am very careful with mine, google gives almost nothing with my full name. I do know how to get info on someone as well protected as I am though. The internet is not as anonymous as you think. I'm not even that good at this stuff, there are many people better educated and more skilled than I am in regards to cyber security.


Oh sure its possible in TV anyways in rl tho nah not likely.
Its possible sure but you need more than your average bully to find out that information. An IP address offers less information than people give it credit for.(most of the time all you will find out is the owner of the IP block)
Sure you can get a area code but that's not helping much if that's all you have to go on all the other information regarding your ip are not readily available(unless your Bully gets a court order....) and if people have the means to get to them they are not bully's they are criminals
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Posted 9/2/15

    That kind of abuse stems from the same place, with the same malevolent intentions, so it's the same thing. The difference is that you have a choice in the matter, online. While it's true, if something bad arises in an online community you're fond of it may be hard to leave, but escape is still very possible. Though I can chalk up a lot of "online bullying" to what seems like trolling, it's still offensive and inherently nasty. The biggest problem with cyber bullying is that the anonymity of the internet allows people who wouldn't otherwise physically bully someone a gateway to that type of behaviour.
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Posted 9/2/15
They're both pretty bad and dangerous, but I would f**k with twice as bad. The difference is that vengeance is sweeter on the internet than in real life. If bullies are high and mighty as if they're like Superman, then just prepare and find their weakness. Get something that can hurt them as bad as kryptonite.
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