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Post Reply Iran Nuclear Deal
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Posted 9/10/15
I spent the last hour writing up an explanation of this, how this happened, and what this means for the future. Just as I was finished typing and getting ready to post, the tab closed. I don't have time right to write all of that again so here's a short (well, shorter than what I originally wrote) summary of what this deal does.

- Iran will have all of their sanctions removed before they can prove they'll even cooperate honestly.
- Iran will be allowed to play with nuclear energy all they want while pretending to go along with the restrictions imposed on them.
- Iran will have the authority to police themselves if they're ever suspected of building a bomb. The IAEA (International Atomic Energy Agency) will be able to inspect them, but they have to wait until long after the evidence has already been tampered with.


Basically, this deal gives Iran far too much freedom in building nuclear weapons. The public overwhelmingly disapproves of this deal and so does Congress, but they failed to block it today in the Senate. They voted 58 - 42 in favor of turning this deal down. Unfortunately, they lacked the 2 votes needed to block this deal. Most of the senators who voted in favor of the deal either blindly took Obama's word that this deal is safe or they were scared by Obama's threat of war if he didn't have things his way. He claims that this deal will keep nuclear weapons out of Iran's hands, even though the conditions of the deal easily allow them to get away with building a bomb.

The republicans were all united against it and several democrats sided with them. However, even though the democrats who supported the deal were divided and were in the minority, they still came out on top... which is pretty counterproductive to a democracy. Even the democrats who voted in favor of the deal were split. There are those who blindly agree with it just because Obama says so, and there are those who don't honestly support the deal but did so anyway because they bought Obama's bluff about going to war if the deal was blocked. In other words those who do in fact support this deal make up such a small minority that Obama had to go around threatening his own party to support it these last few weeks.

Here's a list of the senators who voted for/against the deal and their reasons:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/politics/where-lawmakers-stand-on-iran/

Notice how a lot of the democrats said more or less "if this deal does what Obama says it does (which it doesn't and unfortunately does the exact opposite), then I suppose I'll give it a try." So they're pretty much just taking Obama's word for it and nothing else. Others were skeptical that this deal would work but believed Obama's scare tactic that there'll be war as the only alternative.

Meanwhile, Iran's government is celebrating that they'll finally get nuclear weapons, virtually delivered to their doors as a result of this deal. The Ayatollah (Iran's supreme leader) announced this week that he has every intention of attacking Israel and that this deal now helped assure him that Israel will cease to exist within 25 years.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/10/middleeast/iran-khamenei-israel-will-not-exist-25-years/

Keep in mind that this is coming from CNN, one of the most liberal-leaning news outlets in the nation. Not even CNN is denying Iran's reaction to this deal.

TL;DR - Obama is blatantly handing Iran nuclear weapons despite the fact the majority of Americans oppose this deal and even his own party is skeptical of it. I honestly wish this was a joke, but sadly it became reality today. This deal is so absurd, I'm shocked it's succeeding. This is even scarier than when Obama tried passing The Trans-pacific Partnership (at least that move ended in a failure).
Posted 9/10/15
gg Obama
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26 / M / Cloud 9.
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Posted 9/10/15
inb4 ww3
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13 / F / California
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Posted 9/10/15
https://youtu.be/pyMNIFZTQkg

Pretty much sums up my thoughts on the subject.
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Posted 9/10/15
It still baffles my mind how something this crazy is going to pass with minimal support. I remember there was a point that Obama kept the existence of the side deals a secret until they were discovered by republicans. Then republicans demanded Obama explain the side deals. Now Obama's saying he has nothing to hide... despite the fact that he's still not telling us what these side deals are.

http://www.businessinsider.com/there-are-2-secret-side-deals-on-top-of-the-iran-nuclear-agreement-2015-7

http://www.nationalpost.com/m/wp/blog.html?b=news.nationalpost.com//full-comment/national-post-view-iran-deal-seems-to-get-worse-every-week
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Posted 9/10/15 , edited 9/11/15
Just keep living life as usual because politics is crazy and absurd. People cast their votes; however, the electoral votes is what counts. This is a f'ed up world we live in, and we are just going to have to deal with it. The president is suppose to be the voice of the people, but are our voices being heard? This is where I stop and watch anime until the day I die. Enjoy what you have now because one day a mushroom cloud will vanquish life before your eyes.
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23 / M / Saint Charles, Mi...
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Posted 9/10/15
I heard, but haven't confirmed, that part of one of the side deals is that if Iran's nuclear facilities are attcked the US has to aid in their defense... This deal is ridiculous and atrocious, and both parties are completely ignoring the American people.
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27 / M / Ark-La-Tex
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Posted 9/10/15 , edited 9/11/15
I don't understand what all the fuss is about. Iran scales back their nuclear program and gives up 97% of its enriched uranium supply, the inspectors now have increased access to Iran's major nuclear sites, and the lifted sanctions kick back in immediately if Iran doesn't abide.

It's perfectly fine to be against the deal, but please provide a good reason why letting Iran go unchecked - because that's what would happen without the deal - is a better alternative.

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21 / M / Chicago, Illinois
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Posted 9/10/15 , edited 9/11/15
Sophomore year of high school I read the book "Persepolis" by Marjane Satrapi. It's an autobiography on a girl growing up during the revolution that took place in the former Shahdom of Iran, the war between Iraq and Iran, etc. There's a good reason why she fled the country to Austria after the revolution that created the currently ruling "Islamic Republic of Iran".

This deal, whether you like/hate the president, is absurd. If you support it, it just goes to show you're a bangwagon Obama supporter. If he publically stated he doesn't recognize Israel as a sovereign state, his supporters would be completely fine with it. This is a country that held Americans hostage back in the 80s, ousted the original perfectly fine Shahdom of Iran, forcing the Shah and his family to flee and live their lives in exile. Ayyetollah Khameini everyday on Twitter throws borderline hate speech out, saying how this is a victory for Iran, and that his stance on the US and Israel will not change. The president bypasses congressional approval, knowing they won't approve, because it's obvious that this absolutely has nothing in our favor. They hold 5 Americans hostage, want to destroy Israel, and the US, and in return we let them create a public nuclear program? Iran is devious, who cares if people will inspect the nuclear sites? For one they won't let American supervisors there, and a check every 30 days leaves them a large window to hide and start stockpiling weapons. Our strategy against Iran was perfectly fine, just like what we were doing with Cuba, and what we are doing currently with North Korea: we force them into isolation, no diplomatic relationships, no deals, no nothing. Oh, and lots and lots of sanctions.
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Posted 9/10/15

geauxtigers1989 wrote:

I don't understand what all the fuss is about. Iran scales back their nuclear program and gives up 97% of its enriched uranium supply, the inspectors now have increased access to Iran's major nuclear sites, and the lifted sanctions kick back in immediately if Iran doesn't abide.

It's perfectly fine to be against the deal, but please provide a good reason why letting Iran go unchecked - because that's what would happen without the deal - is a better alternative.



It's actually the other way around. This deal let's Iran go unchecked. They're the ones who get to monitor themselves before anyone else can inspect them. Their sanctions are lifted entirely before they can prove their trustworthiness. The sanctions return only if they're caught doing something wrong, which would be pretty hard to do since it's Iran that ultimately decides if they want to get caught. This deal depends on Iran being honest, which no one should honestly expect given their track record and the fact that they're currently celebrating getting nuclear weapons from this deal.

Look at this this way:

An infamous serial killer is in court. The judge says "we'll let you go free as long as you promise not to harm anyone again. If you break this promise, we'll arrest you again. If you're suspected of having killed another person, you can conduct the investigation yourself before the police investigate you." It shouldn't take more than 3 seconds to realize this judge is insane and spouting nonsense.
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20 / F / Hotel California
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Posted 9/10/15 , edited 9/10/15
I think you guys give that country a bad rap. I mean, sure it's next to places like Iraq, but believe it or not from what I've hear they are actually very wealthy in the oil industry. The chance to do trade with countries like US would be kinda amazing, think of all the oil they would sell for cheep in order to keep good relations with us. Gas prices would even lower than they are now.

Besides, even if they do get attacked what's stopping us from helping them (NOT TROOPS, but instead supplying them with weapons and providing support drone strikes), we're a powerhouse nation we would have no problem. And if these enemy territories are allied by others, we can inform our allies about the threat and get massive assets.


AND ANNNNNNNNNND I think they've learned their lesson after so many years of sanctions, call me crazy but i don't think they'll think of betraying us. That is, if we welcome them for open arms like we do our allies and not continue to be stubborn and shun them.
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27 / M / Ark-La-Tex
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Posted 9/10/15 , edited 9/11/15

PhantomGundam wrote:



It's actually the other way around. This deal let's Iran go unchecked. They're the ones who get to monitor themselves before anyone else can inspect them. Their sanctions are lifted entirely before they can prove their trustworthiness. The sanctions return only if they're caught doing something wrong, which would be pretty hard to do since it's Iran that ultimately decides if they want to get caught. This deal depends on Iran being honest, which no one should honestly expect given their track record and the fact that they're currently celebrating getting nuclear weapons from this deal.

Look at this this way:

An infamous serial killer is in court. The judge says "we'll let you go free as long as you promise not to harm anyone again. If you break this promise, we'll arrest you again. If you're suspected of having killed another person, you can conduct the investigation yourself before the police investigate you." It shouldn't take more than 3 seconds to realize this judge is insane and spouting nonsense.


http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-33521655

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2015/sep/08/politifact-sheet-6-things-know-about-iran-nuclear-/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/cameron-hollande-and-merkel-why-we-support-the-iran-deal/2015/09/10/a1ce6610-5735-11e5-b8c9-944725fcd3b9_story.html

The other five nations that negotiated with the U.S. approved the deal unanimously. What are you seeing that they aren't?
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Posted 9/10/15


If you didn't notice, Iran has a very powerful, very well-funded military, easily a top-10 military power in the world. If they start using this nuclear energy the US allows them, and if they do attack a nation, even if all of NATO gangs up on them, there will be heavy casualties. Russia will aid them too, they're their arms dealer after all, and the US doesn't have good relations with them at the moment, and they are another top 10 military power.

So do you still think it's worth the risk sir?

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Posted 9/10/15
So I am admittedly not the most well read on the subject, but browsing through the policy as well as some non-opinionated accounts of the deal, it really doesn't sound terrible in contrast to continuing without a deal.

-You get Iran to give up 97% of its Enriched Uranium stockpile and 14k of its centrifuges as well as dismantling its plutonium reactor
-You get the time it will take for Iran to construct a weapon pushed back
-You get over 100 inspectors in the country, monitoring the main facility 24/7
-Numerous other restrictions in areas related to weapon manufacturing
-Potential path to some establishment of diplomacy

On the other hand, without the deal you get:
-Several countries lifting sanctions on Iran anyways
-Iran continuing its nuclear program, where they could feasibly have a bomb in 2-3 months

Of course there is more that everyone would have liked to see in the deal, but if you can't get Iran to agree to it, it wont do any good.
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Posted 9/10/15

geauxtigers1989 wrote:


PhantomGundam wrote:



It's actually the other way around. This deal let's Iran go unchecked. They're the ones who get to monitor themselves before anyone else can inspect them. Their sanctions are lifted entirely before they can prove their trustworthiness. The sanctions return only if they're caught doing something wrong, which would be pretty hard to do since it's Iran that ultimately decides if they want to get caught. This deal depends on Iran being honest, which no one should honestly expect given their track record and the fact that they're currently celebrating getting nuclear weapons from this deal.

Look at this this way:

An infamous serial killer is in court. The judge says "we'll let you go free as long as you promise not to harm anyone again. If you break this promise, we'll arrest you again. If you're suspected of having killed another person, you can conduct the investigation yourself before the police investigate you." It shouldn't take more than 3 seconds to realize this judge is insane and spouting nonsense.


http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-33521655

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2015/sep/08/politifact-sheet-6-things-know-about-iran-nuclear-/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/cameron-hollande-and-merkel-why-we-support-the-iran-deal/2015/09/10/a1ce6610-5735-11e5-b8c9-944725fcd3b9_story.html

The other five nations that negotiated with the U.S. approved the deal unanimously. What are you seeing that they aren't?


And yet Israel has been the largest critic of this deal because it gives their worst enemy nuclear weapons. If this deal really does keep nuclear weapons out of Iran's hands, that would mean Israel is safe. Everybody who is going along with this deal is placing too much trust in a regime that is constantly talking about nuking Israel as a direct result of this deal as I type this. There's also the fact that this deal clearly states Iran will be a nuclear power in 10-15 years by the time these false restrictions have been lifted.

Why do you think Obama had to resort to threatening his own party with war in order for them to not oppose this deal?

If this deal stopped Iran from gaining nuclear weapons, Israel would be the most vocal supporter of this deal whereas Iran would never agree to such terms. Don't fall for Obama's propaganda. He claims the sky the green and the grass is blue with this deal. Taking his word for it is a terrible way to assess the effectiveness of this deal. Iran is being given far too much freedom here and it's Israel and the U.S. that are paying the price. Obama only has a year and 4 months left in office so of course he's not concerned about his own safety. When Iran has been discovered to have completed a bomb, he'll be in Hawaii laughing his ass off at the problem he left for his successor.
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