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Post Reply Should anime/manga shift more toward being intellectual?
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31 / M / The Abyss of Time
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Posted 9/14/15 , edited 9/14/15
After going through a few stories (one of which was Spec Ops: The Line) and after reading a specific quote:


I don't agree making sex become casual is a way of "maturing" society. Sex is an animalistic part of humans after all. I prefer we cultivate our brainy part instead. Make intelligent shows, not sex-oriented shows.
it made me think and this thread is the result.

Should anime shift away from sex appeal and more toward things like prejudice/discrimination, what it means to be human, philosophies, ideologies, space exploration, deep relationships (emotion level not b.s. sex level), "war is hell", social inequality, multi-dimension theories , and etc. In other words moving closer to shows like: Ghost in the Shell franchise, Psycho Pass, Steins;Gate, Zetsuen no Tempest, live-action tv-wise Mr. Robot, and game-wise Spec Ops: The Line (amongst many others). Basically shifting the focus from Hugh Hefner to Neil Degrasse Tyson in a sense.

I personally think that it should, while keeping the other side of the spectrum satisfied as well. We should have anime that make us want to become more intelligent and even can teach us about certain concepts.

Side question: Do you think society itself would be better shifting towards intelligence over libido?

Again personally I say yes, since our libido is a primitive instinct that won't lead to our future survival like striving to find solutions to issues via intellect advancing would. We shouldn't revert to animals but strive to evolve to something even greater.
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25 / F / New Jersey, USA
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Posted 9/14/15
Either way I'd watch it.
Posted 9/14/15 , edited 9/14/15
Well, i'd say having more shows that could be considered "intellectual", as you put it, certainly can't hurt. But as you mentioned, there are already a few shows out there like that. In addition to the ones you mentioned, there's stuff like Serial Experiments Lain, Haibane Renmei, Ergo Proxy, etc etc. They may not be very common but I wouldn't exactly call them rare.

I also agree that anime currently appeals a little too much to the libido. I was just looking at the upcoming shows for the Fall season earlier and was somewhat disappointed by how many shows seemed to be going down that route. I think that demographic should have a few shows, but I also think that the amount they get is is a little too disproportionate.

However, as for me personally, i'd rather see a reduction in those types of shows that leads to a more even distribution of shows that appeal to all tastes, not just intellectual shows. I mean, don't get me wrong, I love the idea of anime furthering our intellectual horizons as viewers, but at the end of the day it's also entertainment. Since it's entertainment, i'd argue diversity of material is even more important. But as I said, given the current distribution, increasing diversity and adding more "intellectual" shows is probably the same thing right now

This is coming from someone who actually doesn't watch all that many of them though. I don't think that i've seen too many others aside from the ones I mentioned at the beginning. My personal taste is skewed in favor of shows that teach you everyday morals without using heavy topics - shows like Aria, Barakamon, Usagi Drop, Shugo Chara, Erin, etc. These shows don't cater to the libido at all, but also aren't exactly "intellectual" either. This is why I said that I don't look at it as a dichotomy and would prefer an even and diverse distribution.

But broadly speaking, I agree with you.
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26 / M / In a dumpster wit...
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Posted 9/14/15 , edited 9/14/15
Not that I disagree, but there's probably a lot of people who'd argue that shit like this...



Is more intellectual than shit like this...



Sometimes I don't even know if they ever passed grade school and learned about why they call it being intellectual. It requires you to turn your brain on. Not sit back and drink chocolate milk while possibly "too young for you" girls are doing random perverted stuff together or doing stupid random stuff together...
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27 / M / Vancouver WA
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Posted 9/14/15 , edited 9/14/15
I have kinda started thinking about this lately, and i would have to agree. I'm getting a little tired of the "1st year in high school ecchi harem, or middle school stuff, animes" and they need to put more out in an intellectual genre. Maybe i'm just getting older.
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20 / M / North Pole
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Posted 9/14/15 , edited 9/14/15
I think you're absolutely right, although I do like some of these shows, I'd appreciate it if they'd make it more intellectual.
Especially like the ''space exploration'' that would be cool to see. Gargantia and Valvrave got a little bit of that which is nice.
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30 / M / Ontario
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Posted 9/14/15 , edited 9/14/15
Is it not possible that people come home after long days being lawyers, nurses, pharmacists, civil rights leaders, doctors, politicians and just watch something a little bit absurd to ease their day?

Besides all that. I enjoy a bit of mucking about when it comes to my anime and it does not even need to be sexual or even relevant to the anime itself. I would argue that at times it takes more brains to make a romantic comedy work than a space exploration on the simple fact that i hate most rom-coms.
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25 / M
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Posted 9/14/15 , edited 9/14/15

TheKaiserKnight wrote:

Not that I disagree, but there's probably a lot of people who'd argue that shit like this...



Is more intellectual than shit like this...



Sometimes I don't even know if they ever passed grade school and learned about why they call it being intellectual. It requires you to turn your brain on. Not sit back and drink chocolate milk while possibly "too young for you" girls are doing random perverted stuff together or doing stupid random stuff together...


Hey, don't insult yuru yuri! It's one of my favorite series, and me (and all my friends and 90% of otaku's/crunchy subscribers/people who's bussiness keeps this site in existence) are really looking forward to the new season! I am so happy they made a third :3

I love yuru yuri, can't wait for more of the awesome crazy kawaii madness!

I love gits and psycho pass and such too, but moeblobs are also awesome , so I really really love shows like gochuumon, oreimo, Yuru yuri (!!), lucky star etc. too. Moeblobs are awesome! Happy, energetic, crazy, funny, cute girls, sometimes with cat ears, what more do you want~

So they better not stop making those type of shows. If that would be everything I would get bored too, but there are still quite a few more serious shows such as psycho pass, code geass, arslan, fma etc :)

But if crunchyroll would decide on purpose to not stream moeblobs and such anymore then I'd dump them, go watch on an "alternative streaming site' , probably joined by the majority of the userbase, and they'd be out of business in a month.

I do agree they should show all sorts of anime tough. I also love a show which makes me think. So I want both. A lot of both. And I especially love mecha/sci-fi But also a good ecchi harem...

------------------

Just look at the comments here: http://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/2015/09/12/video-latest-valkyrie-drive-mermaid-anime-preview-posted Vast majority of people here like these shows. D: so it's good they are also made :)

I am personally really looking forward to both yuru yuri and valkyrie drive mermaid
elux72 
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Posted 9/14/15 , edited 9/14/15
As you say, xCrimsonEX, the libido is a primitive instinct, but satisfying it by watching that type of anime (among other things) could be considered important.

I'll admit to watching a certain number of the 'lowbrow' shows, but I find it's easy to grow tired of or even disgusted with them, and yearn for something more complex. It could be age, I suppose. I haven't been in high school or middle school for a very long time, and find it nearly impossible to identify with the characters and situations presented in high school anime, unless it happens to be serious and very well done.

At the very least, I wouldn't mind watching slice-of-life or ecchi/harem type anime with adult characters. In these, there might be a small hope that amid all the shenanigans, one could at least have some identification with the characters. Take Wakakozake, for example. It's merely a woman eating and drinking, but it resonates more with me than any of the high school shows.

So, I'd have to agree with your suggestion that more complex, intelligent, adult (in a positive way, not pornography), and challenging anime should be made.
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Posted 9/14/15
A more intellectual show does not mean moving the setting from middle school/high school to an adult setting. It would not even be mutually exclusive with ecchi/harem. It would mean giving us plots and characters that are more complicated. Characters that have more depth. Stories that required thought and perhaps multiple viewings to fully grasp.

I would love to see more intellectual anime.
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31 / M / The Abyss of Time
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Posted 9/14/15 , edited 9/14/15

seekerperson7 wrote:


I'm actually more toward 'equal distribution', its just that intellectual type shows as it stands now have a minority in comparison to the others thus the 'shifting' the equation. I wouldn't want the other genres to disappear (since I can and do enjoy those just as much) just want to get to an equalization point. Ergo Proxy is one I've seen and definitely would put in the intellectual category but I haven't seen Lain or Haibane.


TheKaiserKnight wrote:


While I wouldn't call Yuru Yuri per se intellectual, I would say its entertaining and compared to some anime out there extremely tame xD I would say there's a place for each just would like for the ratio to shift towards a point where those stories that do make you think aren't as over-eclipsed.


iris-bo-biris wrote:


rofl, I totally agree on the getting older. As I get older my expectations and standards shift, to the point where I feel like I should be waving a cane as I yell "Back in my day..." xD


Luukee wrote:



I like plenty of non-intellectual type shows myself, I'd just rather have a more equal focus instead of having so many non-intellectual ones. I actually had the thought of 'space exploration' because of the commercial (and from what I've heard of) for "The Martian" xD


Ghostxi wrote:


Nope, that's completely possible all I'm saying is that instead of the entire medium being aimed at them spread it out a little.


eragon2890 wrote:


I think both types are needed and give a breather from each other, and actually imo raise each other. After spending a large amount of tie with something like GitS, sitting down to watch a Yuru Yuri is fun and relaxing; and going from Yuru Yuri to GitS makes the ideas/concepts in GitS standout and make you think even more. For me its not about subtracting any particular genre or type rather trying to add more to a lesser utilized one. I just think its all about balance.

I'm also a fan of Yuru Yuri because its just an entertaining light-hearted series.


elux72 wrote:


My issue is more with the over-saturation towards appealing to the libido at the expense of the brain. I just would rather have a more balanced pool (so to speak).

For me ecchi shows have the result you mention. Though I would say all genres have a place just a matter of trying to form a balance, since if all I saw were intelligent type shows eventually I'd grow tired of them and want something just to relax with.
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34 / M
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Posted 9/14/15 , edited 9/14/15
Anime is not a single genre. It is not a single studio. It also follows trends of what is being sold within japan and whatever merchandise and books and manga sales will be increased by whatever production is being made.
For the most part it is a creative industry driven by the trends of what is selling(much like hollywood goes through....there will be attempts by studios to follow whatever trends...but there will always be rom com and generic b grade action churned out to keep the money flowing in)

You may find that the intellectual anime you have seen are made by a few certain studios, more often studios with established credibility and fan bases that allow them the freedom to pursue different genres.

Or they are made by a studio that made their money doing fan services or kids shows who can now afford to risk going away from what they normal did by licensing something original and more high brow.

Here's something to think about....allot of mangaka are starting off doing h works.....that gets them established(because sex sells)..they then move onto doing fan service series or jump straight to doing serial manga. The creator of ghost in the shell started off this way.

My thought is accept that not all anime will be to your tastes and support the series with content you want....because just like hollywoods output there will always be mindless stuff being produced following each other till the next trend comes along.
But anime unless it is a co-production will follow whatever is selling in japan.

So in short sometimes the fan service stuff that is hated will allow the creators or studios to do the stuff you love(though sometimes they leave in the fan service just to make sure they can sell statues and posters).



Please forgive my rambling....I am currently dealing with 3 slipped discs in my neck and am not very well.

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23 / M / UK
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Posted 9/14/15 , edited 9/26/15
In one word: no

What is the main objective of any television show? Entertainment. If an anime fails to entertain its audience then it has failed at its raison d'etre. I hate to break to some of you but anime is not an intellectual thing, it’s a collection of low brow cartoons coming from Japan that serve as entertainment for the masses and that, is completely fine. If I want something intellectual I'll read an academic book or a journal or find something similar in a library.

What is even more amusing is the examples of anime that you would consider "intellectual ": Steins Gate and Ghost in the Shell (I have not seen Psycho Pass). Steins Gate contained significant amounts of childish behaviour and humour "I am mad scientist so cool son of a bitch" (so deep). The show is not deep or anything close to being intellectual simply because the way it handles time travel All You Need Is Kill aka edge of tomorrow did that in 2004. Ghost in the Shell is not intellectual film because the protagonist wonders whether she is still human due to her entirely synthetic body. Under your own sophomoric logic it can be argued that Oreimo is intellectual due to its exploration of unorthodox relationships.

Want a show that looks at prejudice/discrimination? Go watch Elfen Lied or Black Bullet

What to see what happens when extreme ideologies take over a country? Watch Shimoneta: A Boring World Where the Concept of Dirty Jokes Doesn’t Exist. My sincerest apologies that the show may contain sex jokes.

Want an example of war is hell? Go watch Hellsing ultimate, Attack on Titan or Btooom

My point is that these sorts of shows have been made, are made and will continue to be made in the future. Hell I could probably Bullshit about half the shows I watched are intellectual and so deep bro if I had the desire to.

The real question here is: why should anime and manga shift more towards being intellectual? It has a fan base that loves it for what it is.

Or to put it in a more humours way:
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25 / M
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Posted 9/14/15 , edited 9/14/15

Voc666IV wrote:

In one word: no

What is the main objective of any television show? Entertainment. If an anime fails to entertain its audience then it has failed at its raison d'etre. I hate to break to some of you but anime is not an intellectual thing, it’s a collection of low brow cartoons coming from Japan that serve as entertainment for the masses and that, is completely fine. If I want something intellectual I'll read an academic book or a journal or find something similar in a library.

What is even more amusing is the examples of anime that you would consider "intellectual ": Steins Gate and Ghost in the Shell (I have not seen Psycho Pass). Steins Gate contained significant amounts of childish behaviour and humour "I am mad scientist so cool son of a bitch" (so deep). The show is not deep or anything close to being intellectual simply because the way it handles time travel All You Need Is Kill aka edge of tomorrow did that in 2004. Ghost in the Shell is not intellectual film because the protagonist wonders whether she is still human due to her entirely synthetic body. Under your own sophomoric logic it can be argued that Oreimo is intellectual due to its exploration of unorthodox relationships.

Want a show that looks at prejudice/discrimination? Go watch Elfen Lied or Black Bullet

What to see what happens when extreme ideologies take over a country? Watch Shimoneta: A Boring World Where the Concept of Dirty Jokes Doesn’t Exist. My sincerest apologies that the show may contain sex jokes.

Want an example of war is hell? Go watch Hellsing ultimate, Attack on Titan or Btooom

My point is that these sorts of shows have been made, are made and will continue to be made in the future. Hell I could probably Bullshit about half the shows I watched are intellectual and so deep bro if I had the desire to.

The real question here is: why should anime and manga shift more towards being intellectual? It has a fan base that loves it for what it is.

Or to put it in a more humours way:



*hands you a cookie and the free copy of the internet you just one*

+9001

Seriously, i LOVE anime as it is, crazy, cute, sexy, cool fights, beautifull an funny and dont really want it to change! I think that goes for most of the fanbase :3

And sexy anime chicks with skimpy outfits ,big boobies, and lots of (striped! :3) pantsu shots are always a good thing!
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24 / M / USA
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Posted 9/14/15
The sexual kind is simply what people go out and buy DVD and Blueray for. There's a higher demand for it. It's just a matter of entertainment.

While I don't mind the sexual stuff, I most certainly find stories of personal trial and memorable characters much more entertaining. I don't normally care for deep, highly intellectual and intricate plots. Everyone is different though.

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