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Post Reply Digimon series - Problems with Digimon Tamers.
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Posted 9/28/15 , edited 12/28/15
May have spoilers

(Edited)

Ok. So I watched all the episodes of Digimon Tamers and now I'm on Digimon Frontier, I would like to discuss with people what I think went wrong with Digimon Tamers and now how I understand why Digimon isn't as popular as Pokemon. I'll be honest the final showdown and the introduction to the final showdown was a train wreck. And to save the series they probably should've cancelled it at episode I forget which one 36 or 39 but that was where they met the sovereign and discovered the true enemy. And to have one of the kids become possessed by the D-Reaper the way did really screwed the whole damn thing up also why is there a girl named Jeri? I thought that was a boy name?

In speaking of possessed I thought this was! A kids show? Namco Bandai must hate little kids or something. Maybe they don't want kids to like something that can become a craze maybe they just want them playing Tekken? Anyway they had this really aweful plottwist of having jeri become possessed or partially possessed by the D-reaper and using her feelings and mind to become more powerful.

Mewtwo didn't need to do that, all u need is Mewtwo! Then it just got worse by having her scream every single episode because she lost Leomon. Seriously there is a problem! If Darth Vader were there he'd say,"Your lack of inspiration is disturbing." I didn't wanna hear that screaming all the time look I get why you wanna have flashbacks in your show but you can also over do it!

If they actually got creative they could've had a better story plot twist if they just had to fight the sovereign. Afterall the sovereign should be just about as powerful as Mewtwo. All they needed is a rockstar kickass Mewtwo-like showdown and Digimon Tamers would've been awesome and by the way the sovereign were right the humans are the enemy because they created the D-reaper! So it would've been a perfect reason to fight. But they had to make the D-reaper become a godzilla sized blob that ended up making the final hours of the entire Digimon Tamers story just plain silly or worse stupid.

Now I was a kid when I was going through this phase I wanted to be done with the Pokemon anime and the cards, to take a guess I was 13. I went through a phase of not liking and then liking it again until I finally burned it in my head that I really didn't like it. Now I'm only playing te games. But when I try to look back and watch the anime just shortly I notice an intolerance is rising. Then I just give up, but I wanted to get into Digimon cuz my dad told me on the phone he remembers I hated Digimon. I had forgotten all about that! So I watched it and I'm glad I did. Knowing the story is important I didn't like it cuz I thought it was copying Pokemon whatever the case may be its all different now since I'm a grown man watching kids shows lol!

So what do you think? Am I right that Namco Bandai screwed uo their own story and flushed it down the toylet or am I wrong? Where do you think they screwed up? That would explain the reason it did not go down the same way successfully that Pokemon did. I only keep bringing up Pokemon because they both came out at the same time. They were both meant to feed off of eachother's success and both were supposed to strive. If one didn't there's something wrong. Even if I'm wrong about my arguments I'm right there's something wrong with the series.
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Posted 12/28/15
Alright, where to begin with this one?
>Jeri being a boys name
Cause that definitely mean it'll be a boy's name in another language? Kids show? The original was a lot more darker. Things don't need to be sugarcoated for kids. The world isn't all sunshine and rainbows. Also yeah, having a friend being killed in front of your eyes in cold blood is definitely something you should shrug off. Especially if they already enough problems as is growing up. Also Mewtwo is not on the same as the Sovereign. Also what do you mean not go down the same way? Popularity? Blame marketing.
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Posted 12/28/15
I have to strongly disagree with the thoughts on Tamers.

And to have one of the kids become possessed by the D-Reaper like way did really screwed the whole damn thing up! Also why is there a girl named Jeri? I thought that was a boy name?

You have to remember first of all that this is coming over from a different language. But even with that, there are plenty of names that are gender neutral and can go either way. It's not like the girl was named David or William or something.

In speaking of possessed I thought this was! A kids show? Namco Bandai must hate little kids or something. Maybe they don't want kids to like something that can become a craze maybe they just want them playing Tekken? Anyway they had this really aweful plottwist of having jeri become possessed or partially possessed by the D-reaper and using her feelings and mind to become more powerful.

It's not as if Digimon didn't already have some dark themes. Think about how many of the Digimon were killed over the first two seasons of the series, Whalemon and Leomon for example. I thought it was actually an interesting take on a digital monster with it actually taking over a protagonist.

Mewtwo didn't need to do that! All u need is Mewtwo! Then it just got worse by having her scream every single episode because she lost Leomon. Seriously there is a problem! If Darth Vader were there he'd say,"Your lack of inspiration is disturbing." I didn't wanna hear that all the time look I get why you wanna have flashbacks in your show but you can also over do it!

Yeah she was upset because Leomon died a few episodes prior to that.

If they actually got creative they could've had a better story plot twist if they just had to fight the sovereign. Afterall the sovereign should be just about as powerful as Mewtwo! All they needed is a rockstar kickass Mewtwo-like showdown and Digimon Tamers would've been awesome and by the way the sovereign were right the humans are the enemy because they created the D-reaper! So it would've been a perfect reason to fight. But they had to make the D-reaper become a godzilla sized blob that ended up making the final hours of the entire Digimon Tamers story just plain silly or worse stupid.

I can understand criticizing the giant blob, and agree that that it could have been handled a little better. I can't agree with the rest, though. Why do you keep bringing up Mewtwo? Would you want Digimon to just blatently copy what Pokemon already did? On top of that, the first two seasons of Digimon already had epic showdowns with these types of villains, Myotismon, Piedmon and Apocalymon.

Knowing the story is important and I think now maybe I know why I didn't like Digimon or maybe I didn't like it cuz I thought it was copying Pokemon whatever the case may be its all different now since I'm a grown man watching kids shows lol!

So what do you think? Am I write that Namco Bandai screwed uo their own story and flushed it down the toylet or am I wrong? Where do you think they screwed up? That would explain the reason it did not go down the same way Pokemon did.


The thing is, despite the similar names, Pokemon and Digimon are vastly different series with different goals. Pokemon follows a show of a protagonist who is trying to catch animals to compete in a regulated tournament system. Digimon on the other hand follows a group of protagonists who are teamed up with animals (who can speak) and have to ultimately save the world.

I honestly think Digimon Tamers was one of the best seasons that the series produced. It branched off from the original two seasons, had new solid characters with depth and dealt with some pretty dark themes, while still providing a good sense of adventure. Plus, the fusion digivolve was a great idea that was introduced.
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Posted 12/28/15
Oopss! Sorry for the typos. Ill fix that.
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I have to strongly disagree as well. First off, you keep comparing Digimon to Pokemon, and that's probably your biggest mistake right there. Just like Apples are not Oranges, but they are both fruit, Pokemon and Digimon are different, but both considered kids shows. The biggest difference is that Pokemon is for young kids with positive themes, while Digimon is for the slightly older kids, maybe beginning pre-teens, with themes that are not always happy-go-lucky and at times more mature than what you will see in Pokemon, which is one of the reason I love Digimon.

As for Tamers, like many fans I consider this one of the best seasons. They didn't treat children in the anime, and children watching the show with kid hands. They showed that the world can be a scary and dark place, but Tamers showed us that you don't have to (for lack of a better phrase) fall to the dark side. Many kids kids growing up have lost friends or people they know, and I think the whole Leomon death subplot with Jeri sort of says that even though someone is gone they'll always be within you. In a way that's Digimon's main theme with the kids growing up and saying goodbye to their digimon in the first season, and how whenever a digimon dies they are reborn. Also, lots of kids television shows that are revered have mature and dark themes. In Avatar the last airbender the Firelord practically abuses his son Zuko. Gargoyles had death and real world problems. Young Justice treated their audience with respect and created plots that are seeded throughout the whole season. Just because it's a kids show doesn't mean it needs to be goofy-goofy-fart joke-time.

Oh and lastly, Jeri can be a girl's name too. In fact I've met a few girls who went by Jeri. Although I think they spelled it Jerry. Anywho, it's a gender neutral name that is really nitpicky for you to complain about. I think I addressed everything by now.
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Posted 12/28/15 , edited 12/28/15
First of all, Digimon Tamers has Chiaki J. Konaka involved as a writer, who is known for Serial Experiments Lain. I'm not too familiar with his previous projects before that but his involvement leads to darker and more reality themes. Not only that, his experimentation with Lovecraftian products is probably what inspired the creation of the D-reapers.

I kinda think the show is aimed at a slightly older audience. The first half of the show took place in the real world if I could remember and the atmosphere is much more solemn compared to previous season. The military, secret organization, and even death (yes, destruction of Digimon where they are permanently gone) can be viewed as more mature context.

When the kids went to the Digital World, the atmosphere has a familiar feel of the first two seasons but later shifted into more darker again with Jeri's role. Now I would talk more about that but it would be spoilers. The final arc involving the D-Reapers also dealt with many real life issues like social anxiety, isolation, self doubt, etc. From the Japanese version, there are also some mature scenes.

We should also stop comparing Pokemon and Digimon. They are not really alike from a lot of view points but that's a different story. In essence, I loved Digimon Tamers and is my favorite from the franchise. It feels different and is in general a show that isn't for everyone though.

Edit: I took a glance at other projects Chiaki J. Konaka were involved in and it's obviously stuff that appeals to darker themes.

Examples: Texhnolyze, Shadow Star, even Princess Tutu.


TheNotoriousLID wrote

It's not as if Digimon didn't already have some dark themes. Think about how many of the Digimon were killed over the first two seasons of the series, Whalemon and Leomon for example. I thought it was actually an interesting take on a digital monster with it actually taking over a protagonist.


Actually from what I remember, Digimon from the first two seasons are merely deleted when they are destroyed rather than "killed". Kind of like a file from a computer, they can be restored. I recall this from a conversation (can't remember exact episode # where they talked about it before) Digimon Tamers' deaths are actually real where they do not come back.


blzreaper7 wrote

As for Tamers, like many fans I consider this one of the best seasons. They didn't treat children in the anime, and children watching the show with kid hands. They showed that the world can be a scary and dark place, but Tamers showed us that you don't have to (for lack of a better phrase) fall to the dark side. Many kids kids growing up have lost friends or people they know, and I think the whole Leomon death subplot with Jeri sort of says that even though someone is gone they'll always be within you. In a way that's Digimon's main theme with the kids growing up and saying goodbye to their digimon in the first season, and how whenever a digimon dies they are reborn. Also, lots of kids television shows that are revered have mature and dark themes. In Avatar the last airbender the Firelord practically abuses his son Zuko. Gargoyles had death and real world problems. Young Justice treated their audience with respect and created plots that are seeded throughout the whole season. Just because it's a kids show doesn't mean it needs to be goofy-goofy-fart joke-time


Great post. This is exactly how I feel about the show after watching it twice.
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Posted 12/28/15 , edited 12/28/15
For those wondering, the show is actually on Crunchyroll.

I watched the English version over a decade ago when it was airing on TV and finished watching it on CR three years ago here. It's a great series, recommended even if you have no knowledge of Digimon. (helps a bit if you watch the previous season but not 100% required).

Hmm. Might of been the English version on CR as well. I can't remember if the Japanese (sub version) were ever here before. Been too long.
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Posted 12/28/15

stark700 wrote:

Actually from what I remember, Digimon from the first two seasons are merely deleted when they are destroyed rather than "killed". Kind of like a file from a computer, they can be restored. I recall this from a conversation (can't remember exact episode # where they talked about it before) Digimon Tamers' deaths are actually real where they do not come back.



Very true, I spaced on that from the first two seasons. Still, I think the point can be made, though, that there were definite, heavy consequences for the actions in the show. It certainly wasn't a quick fix for the most part. But you're right, at least they could be restored.
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Posted 12/28/15
Ok so maybe the whole jeri argument was misguided thinking I'm used to jeri or jerry being a boys name I do see your point that there can be cultural differences. Maybe in some country there's a girl named John or brian. I have yet too meet a girl named Jeri I'll let u know when I do!

I do get the fact that Digimon has dark themes in it. But then if they wanted to make it dark to begin with shouldn't they have upped the target age group and put older characters in it? I still don't know why you guys are saying Pokemon and Digimon can't be compared so then what is it to be compared with? Neopets, Cubix, Medabots, Monster Rancher, Dragon Drive, Yugio(oh), Bakugan.

If something was a kids show but meant for a slightly older audience then maybe I should compare ur to Dragon Drive.
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Posted 12/28/15
You guys do have to admit that overdoing those episodes with Jeri remembering Leomon's death was really unecessary. I think a dedicated fanbase would remember that. I bet tey were using that as a timefiller to kill the show.
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Posted 12/28/15 , edited 12/28/15
Jeri Ryan(american television actress best know for seven of nine on star trek voyager, Geri Halliwell brit b celeb and former spice girl.)....

Be it with a "g" or a "j" it is a unisex name that is pretty old(means rules with spear ). Jerry Geri Jeri the different spelling comes of the name depends on history and region of Europe. Originates from the name Geraldine/Gerald.

There are allot of older names passed down or that have gone out of use have variants that are unisex or gender variants.(ever heard the name Brianna for a girl)
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Posted 12/28/15 , edited 12/28/15

Gameenderz wrote:

I do get the fact that Digimon has dark themes in it. But then if they wanted to make it dark to begin with shouldn't they have upped the target age group and put older characters in it? I still don't know why you guys are saying Pokemon and Digimon can't be compared so then what is it to be compared with? Neopets, Cubix, Medabots, Monster Rancher, Dragon Drive, Yugio(oh), Bakugan.

If something was a kids show but meant for a slightly older audience then maybe I should compare ur to Dragon Drive.

You've got it completely wrong; the dark elements are a key reason as to why Digimon is able to distinguish itself from other contemporary shows. You see, as an anime Digimon treats its audiences with respect, showing dangerous situations and complex character dynamics because this is the sort of high quality storytelling that audiences deserve to see. Children don't want to be talked down to or coddled, they want to see epic stories where the stakes are high and the consequences really matter. Since its first season Digimon achieved this level of quality, trusting its target audience of children with dark themes that people of that age are more than ready to handle.
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Posted 12/28/15
Am I the only one seeing Digimon having more similar themes to the SMT franchise
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Posted 12/29/15
All I can say is hmmm.
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Posted 12/29/15

abdallahm96 wrote:
Am I the only one seeing Digimon having more similar themes to the SMT franchise






SMT was the original "gotta catch 'em all" series, after all.
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