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Post Reply Political correctness..
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Posted 10/18/15

VZ68 wrote:




Too late, already done.



I've seen that movie (via bootleg) and to be honest I didn't find it that racist except for the fact that it sugar-coated slavery (and the really racist cartoon that was hidden on the extras of the bootleg). Heck, Birth of a Nation is much more racist, and that was on Netflix not too long ago.

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Posted 10/18/15

LadyPsychic wrote:
I mean, what's the point of that word when you can just say "stupid" instead?


I'm not going to leap into this argument, but I will say this - I've used the "r-word" a number of times, and it has more to do with how the word flows and feels. Stupid feels kind of awkward in my mouth, to be honest. However, I have used some other words with even greater frequency - idiotic, moronic, and so on. Most of the time I've used the r-word, too, I've used it to refer to myself in certain areas.

So, that words has some merits just based on how it sounds - it may not have anything to do with the meaning, in some of the same way that non-anglophones often say "cellar door" is among the most beautiful phrase in English.

Whether people should use that word is another matter. I lean more towards it being alright, but it should never be used in malice or used to shame people who are different. I feel the same about many words... I realize that some people can't handle it, and that is horrible, but I don't like to infringe on anybody's speech.

Well, sorry, I ended up actually putting forth my views.
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Posted 10/18/15 , edited 10/18/15
It's worse to be deliberately politically incorrect to prove a point.
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Posted 10/18/15

VZ68 wrote:


sarteck wrote:


mrya21 wrote:
There are plenty of native americans that find chief wahoo racist. It's not as big a controversy as say, the red skins, but it's not the best situation. I mean, chief wahoo really is a gross caricature from another era. It kind of reminds me of the "little black sambo" images, which of course are straight racist. I don't think the original designers of the logo/mascot gave any thought whatsoever to what native americans thought at all and whether or not they were bad people trying to be racist it's not really relevant today because it is an exaggerated caricature of a specific group of people who were horribly treated. Even without getting rid of the Indians name and mascot there are surely less derogatory looking logo they could come up with (also the name chief wahoo doesn't sound much better)


Well, like I said, I ain't got no horses in that race. Last time I knew anything about baseball was the early nineties, and the only thing I "knew" about it was Levi, hahaha, so I don't know what Wahoo's all about.

But from what you're telling me there, sounds a pretty thin line to walk. We gunna ban old Disney cartoons next, y'know? I know, i know, probably apples and oranges, but it seems a similar thing to me.

(Also, "Wahoo" might be a little less original than "Noc-a-Homa," but seems about the same to me in terms of sound, hahaha.)



Too late, already done.

Speedy Gonzales was also banned for awhile, until the Latins got together and said Speedy was great and an Icon.


You just triggered my Post Traumatic Slave Syndrome(Sarcasm). Seriously though fuck Pre Segregation Disney. Anything Pre-Lion King/Mulan/Aladdin/etc is shit and really shouldnt be shown to kids.
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Posted 10/18/15

Schmooples wrote:


LadyPsychic wrote:
I mean, what's the point of that word when you can just say "stupid" instead?


I'm not going to leap into this argument, but I will say this - I've used the "r-word" a number of times, and it has more to do with how the word flows and feels. Stupid feels kind of awkward in my mouth, to be honest. However, I have used some other words with even greater frequency - idiotic, moronic, and so on. Most of the time I've used the r-word, too, I've used it to refer to myself in certain areas.

So, that words has some merits just based on how it sounds - it may not have anything to do with the meaning, in some of the same way that non-anglophones often say "cellar door" is among the most beautiful phrase in English.

Whether people should use that word is another matter. I lean more towards it being alright, but it should never be used in malice or used to shame people who are different. I feel the same about many words... I realize that some people can't handle it, and that is horrible, but I don't like to infringe on anybody's speech.

Well, sorry, I ended up actually putting forth my views.


To be fair, "idiot" originally meant "ignorant, as in layman." I'd find it surprising that (if anyone actually cared), people working as "laymen" wouldn't be offended by the usage. "Moron" originally referred to someone as having the mentality of an 8-12 year old. Again, "Politically correct" [extremists] would argue this word is "ageist" or whatever bullshit "ist" or "ism" they can give it.

Nearly any similar word that we use for a similar meaning actually has similar roots. If we're going to get offended at "what it -could- mean" rather than "what we know it was intended as from the person who just said it," we're just going to have a huge clusterfuck of Political Correctness.

That's why thinking when I say such a thing is "retarded" is somehow me trying to put down mentally disabled people, I just laugh and shrug it off.
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Posted 10/18/15

dragontackle wrote:


You just triggered my Post Traumatic Slave Syndrome(Sarcasm). Seriously though fuck Pre Segregation Disney. Anything Pre-Lion King/Mulan/Aladdin/etc is shit and really shouldnt be shown to kids.


So when is this? I need a timeline because I have no idea what you are talking about.
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Posted 10/18/15

dragontackle wrote:
You just triggered my Post Traumatic Slave Syndrome(Sarcasm). Seriously though fuck Pre Segregation Disney. Anything Pre-Lion King/Mulan/Aladdin/etc is shit and really shouldnt be shown to kids.


I loved old Disney stuff... Winnie the Pooh gave me nightmares (that fucking acid trip dream Pooh had...) But shit like Robin Hood almost made me furry.

If Disney's learned one thing over the years, it's how to sexualize animals. (And no, I'm not a furry. I hope.)
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Posted 10/18/15

Sir_jamesalot wrote:

It's worse to be deliberately politically incorrect to prove a point.


Worse than what? Being politically correct?
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Posted 10/18/15

sarteck wrote:

To be fair, "idiot" originally meant "ignorant, as in layman." I'd find it surprising that (if anyone actually cared), people working as "laymen" wouldn't be offended by the usage. "Moron" originally referred to someone as having the mentality of an 8-12 year old. Again, "Politically correct" [extremists] would argue this word is "ageist" or whatever bullshit "ist" or "ism" they can give it.

Nearly any similar word that we use for a similar meaning actually has similar roots. If we're going to get offended at "what it -could- mean" rather than "what we know it was intended as from the person who just said it," we're just going to have a huge clusterfuck of Political Correctness.

That's why thinking when I say such a thing is "retarded" is somehow me trying to put down mentally disabled people, I just laugh and shrug it off.


There is a fairly big difference between finding fault with what a word means now and what it used to mean, but you are right - and derogatory words are derogatory because, in some fashion or another, they were designed to be critical of someone or something. Pointing that out is like pointing out that "beautiful" and "pretty" both serve to highlight aesthetically pleasing qualities. Still, there is a line to be drawn somewhere. I would consider it more appropriate to call someone an idiot than a retard. But again, I'm not interested in enforcing my views on anyone or whining about it when people say something I consider a bit rude - minus a few things that incite violence or damage to people.
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Posted 10/18/15 , edited 10/18/15

VZ68So when is this? I need a timeline because I have no idea what you are talking about.

Lets say anything Disney put out that came before Dumbo.So anything before 1941(and this doesnt even include Anti-Japanese propaganda)


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Posted 10/18/15

dragontackle wrote:

You just triggered my Post Traumatic Slave Syndrome(Sarcasm). Seriously though fuck Pre Segregation Disney. Anything Pre-Lion King/Mulan/Aladdin/etc is shit and really shouldnt be shown to kids.


Dude, Song of the South was pretty awesome, though it is clearly dated and shows some of the faults of the time. Still, it had a number of fine points and some nice music.

I loved it as a kid. I didn't grow up to be violent, racist, or a criminal of any sort - why shouldn't it be shown to kids?
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Posted 10/18/15 , edited 10/18/15

sarteck wrote:


LadyPsychic wrote:

Well, I suppose we shall have to agree to disagree then. I refuse to use the r-word. I mean, what's the point of that word when you can just say "stupid" instead? As far as people never insulting each other being a "false utopian ideal", maybe you are correct but not even trying isn't going to help either. Personally, I think that if people were properly punished every time they insulted someone they would eventually stop. Of course, there are some flaws with that idea such as violating 1st amendment rights (though I personally don't think insults should be covered by the 1st amendment) and defining exactly what is an insult (because someone with an agenda could claim that a perfectly harmless word is an insult and things could spin out of control). Trying to get the entire population into becoming good non-bigoted folks may be ultimately futile, but what if we could at least do so to the "Ones Who Matter"? (aka people with power) If we could somehow take away power from bigoted politicians (and keep bigots from becoming politicians in the first place) then that would not only make the country (and perhaps the world in general) a better place, but it would send a message to the average joe bigots that if they want to have power themselves then they better see the error of their ways and let go of their bigoted ideals (including insults). Of course, barring a major revolution, this is only a pipe-dream, but it's still something to gradually work towards.



Yes, Freedom of Speech is an important thing.

"Bigoted" means something other than what you think it means. It means exactly what you are trying to accomplish, actually--intolerance.

Saying "retard" is not "intolerance." Trying to get the word banned by "Ones with Power," that's "intolerance."

People seem to love the word "bigot" nowadays without knowing what it actually means. They usually define it as "someone whos' ideals I don't agree with." It's sad.


Well, I define "bigot" as a person who is mean/unfair/oppressive to those who are different race-wise, gender-wise, sexual orientation-wise, mental-wise, physical-wise, and petty difference-wise (aka tattoos, men with long hair, etc). Maybe it's not the proper definition but I don't have a better word to use (can you think of any?). You may also note that I didn't put religion-wise on the list. It's because most religions are inherently "bigoted" (or whatever you like to call it) so they don't count. It's not that I'm against religion per-say (I used to be religious myself), but I believe that all religions should be purified (have the bigoted parts either removed or labeled as "written by bigoted men, not God"). That way, people can't hide behind their religion any more.

As for "intolerance" it depends on the situation. If I were to throw someone in jail for saying the r-word (or even the n-word) that would be intolerance. However, what I have in mind is more like "Jimmy, that was a mean thing to say! Next time you say it you'll get a spanking and I'll post what you did on the internet so everyone can see what a naughty boy you are! Now apologize and be good!" Basically, it's correcting a bad behavior. Also, you seem to be misunderstanding something. Under my ideal system, if an average joe were to say the r-word (or anything else bigoted) at worst he or she would get dirty looks and possibly be ostracized as punishment . Under the same system, if a politician were to say the same things he or she would immediately be kicked out of their position and be banned from politics for at least a decade.

As for whether the r-word itself is intolerance it depends on how it's used. If it's used medical-wise, then it's okay (though I think they should use the terms "Down-Syndrome" and "slower mental growth" instead, but that's just me). If it's used as an insult, it's intolerance. If it's used as a substitute for "very foolish or stupid", then... to tell you the truth I don't know. Every time I hear that word, I cringe (even if used in it's "very foolish or stupid" meaning), but I suppose that not a good reason to ban it. Still, it's use should be discouraged at least. If I had kids, I'd tell them to not use the r-word and use the word stupid instead and to tell everyone who said the r-word the same thing. Perhaps, the only thing I can do is lead by example.

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Posted 10/18/15 , edited 10/18/15

Schmooples wrote:


dragontackle wrote:

You just triggered my Post Traumatic Slave Syndrome(Sarcasm). Seriously though fuck Pre Segregation Disney. Anything Pre-Lion King/Mulan/Aladdin/etc is shit and really shouldnt be shown to kids.


Dude, Song of the South was pretty awesome, though it is clearly dated and shows some of the faults of the time. Still, it had a number of fine points and some nice music.

I loved it as a kid. I didn't grow up to be violent, racist, or a criminal of any sort - why shouldn't it be shown to kids?


I agree. While Song of the South may have sugar-coated slavery, it wasn't as bad as some people made it out to be. Heck, even my half-black cousin saw it and he liked it. Now, Birth of a Nation..... ugh. That's probably the most racist thing I've ever seen. But even that, I wouldn't ban (I'm against banning the media/fictional works/historical pieces)

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Posted 10/18/15

LadyPsychic wrote:


Schmooples wrote:


dragontackle wrote:

You just triggered my Post Traumatic Slave Syndrome(Sarcasm). Seriously though fuck Pre Segregation Disney. Anything Pre-Lion King/Mulan/Aladdin/etc is shit and really shouldnt be shown to kids.


Dude, Song of the South was pretty awesome, though it is clearly dated and shows some of the faults of the time. Still, it had a number of fine points and some nice music.

I loved it as a kid. I didn't grow up to be violent, racist, or a criminal of any sort - why shouldn't it be shown to kids?


I agree. While Song of the South may have sugar-coated slavery, it wasn't as bad as some people made it out to be. Heck, even my half-black cousin saw it and he liked it. Now, Birth of a Nation..... ugh. That's probably the most racist thing I've ever seen. But even that, I wouldn't ban (I'm against censoring the media/fictional works/historical pieces)



Can't say I've seen Birth of a Nation... No idea what it is about, but it sounds really Imperialistic.
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Posted 10/18/15

LadyPsychic wrote:

It glorifies the KKK and makes them out to be heroes.


Yeah, I just googled it. Damn. Wouldn't have guessed from the name. But geeze... I'm sort of surprised that flew even back then.
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