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Concepts/Ideas vs. Human life
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Posted 11/12/15
Is there one thing which is more valuable, more precious, and more important than the lives of human beings? I'm sure a lot of people have different ideas of this, but I'm sure most will say "no".

However, I can name one concept that is of greater value than all human life put together. And that is personal freedom. The freedom to do anything under the sun without violating the freedom of others. Making sure every adult human has such freedom is more important than people living.

My views are shaped by this fundamental value. Wonder why I feel this way about suicide? It's because I have an agenda. You see, I hate the fact that people feel empathy towards suicide victims. Why? Because the backlash against the suicide rate of LGBT teens is killing our religious freedom. You see, since a large number of liberal LGBT people oppose the religious freedom views that are being brought up by religious people, I want more of their kids to commit suicide. You see, if they kill themselves as kids, less people will oppose religious freedom legislature.
In other words... I'd rather see the suicide rate among young lgbt people go sky high than see one christian baker forced to serve a gay wedding.
But.... It's not out of any form of admiration or reverence for christians. In fact, I'll admit I'm even more bigoted towards them.
It's just that the lives of thousands of kids is still less important than the freedom of one group of people that I don't even like .
Hell, if it wasn't for my value system, I'd support ancient style executions of christians. I'm not even "lion" about it... get it? Lion? Cause they killed them with lions.
And this is for one reason and one reason alone... Fundamentalist Christians oppose marijuana, and therefore, I have hatred on the level of Nero towards them. For no other reason than I wanna smoke weed legally.

And this is because life is cheap. When a freedom dies out, it may die permanently. We will always make new people. However, I fear that if America loses it's battle against the PC left, religious freedom for christians might die. I'd rather see all of them die than their freedom die. Yea, I wanna see more LGBT kids commit suicide? Not out of homophobia but to help religious people protect their freedom. And the only reason I don't wanna burn religious people at the stake and light a joint with their burning crucified bodies is because that would require killing people, which violates my principles, and because they side with me on the religious freedom issue.

You see. In the end, I don't care about anyone. When it all boils down to it, humans are just means to an end. All that matters are concepts. Concepts can die much faster than human beings can. Human beings might die but we can reproduce. Out values, and our freedoms can't.
And religious freedom is a precious, fragile, dying entity that needs to be protected.

Now? Why do I choose freedom over things like progress, pragmatism, equality, justice, or other concepts? There's plenty of great concepts out there. So why did I choose this one? Well, because freedom makes us feel like we're "us". Our lives may not be that important, however, freedom gives us the ability to create ourselves. Freedom is what helps us determine who we are, to create ourselves, to control who we are and where we stand in a world where there's billions of different ideas to choose from.
The reason why I consider freedom to outweigh human life is because human life only has value because of freedom.
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23 / M / Germany
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Posted 11/12/15
Long story short: OP is trolling. Abandon thread at all cost.
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28 / M / UK, Liverpool
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Posted 11/12/15
I think human life is respective to the condition.

Now if you want to test drugs you have to go through so much red tape which is a "good thing".

If you throw the same condition during a war period, you'll properly just need a captive.

Very much like the old saying "It's nice to be nice", but being nice isn't always the best option. Imagine One person gets caught as a captive and for there freedom 1 trillion pound/dollar has to be given up, how likely to you think it is?", I mean the western culture like to say they don't negotiate with terrorists but the fact is, is that it'd be too expensive.

So my opinion is: "it depends on the situation".
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Posted 11/12/15
Actually just look at the best psychologists.

They progressed research into the mind of animals (which include humans), but they were cruel... no psychologist now would be able to do it, or willing to do it (well most).
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Posted 11/12/15 , edited 11/12/15

instinct46 wrote:

I think human life is respective to the condition.

Now if you want to test drugs you have to go through so much red tape which is a "good thing".

If you throw the same condition during a war period, you'll properly just need a captive.

Very much like the old saying "It's nice to be nice", but being nice isn't always the best option. Imagine One person gets caught as a captive and for there freedom 1 trillion pound/dollar has to be given up, how likely to you think it is?", I mean the western culture like to say they don't negotiate with terrorists but the fact is, is that it'd be too expensive.

So my opinion is: "it depends on the situation".


Okay, that's a good point. However, I'd argue that for he governemnt to pay 1 trillion dollars for the release of one captive, would violate the freedom of every single person in the country, due the the gross economic effects it would have on people and on taxation. Would taking so much money and hurting the economy in such away violate the freedom of every other tax-paying person?
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Posted 11/12/15 , edited 11/12/15
Considering I don't value human life at all, I'd say a lot of things are more valuable/precious/important as you put it.
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28 / M / UK, Liverpool
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Posted 11/12/15

silversongwriter wrote:


instinct46 wrote:

I think human life is respective to the condition.

Now if you want to test drugs you have to go through so much red tape which is a "good thing".

If you throw the same condition during a war period, you'll properly just need a captive.

Very much like the old saying "It's nice to be nice", but being nice isn't always the best option. Imagine One person gets caught as a captive and for there freedom 1 trillion pound/dollar has to be given up, how likely to you think it is?", I mean the western culture like to say they don't negotiate with terrorists but the fact is, is that it'd be too expensive.

So my opinion is: "it depends on the situation".


Okay, that's a good point. However, I'd argue that for he governemnt to pay 1 trillion dollars for the release of one captive, would violate the freedom of every single person in the country, due the the gross economic effects it would have on people and on taxation. Would taking so much money and hurting the economy in such away violate the freedom of every other tax-paying person?



My point is it's only viable for a small amount... say we will return 3 people for a million dollars. Imagine if that happened every day, it would be lovely to say ya we'll pay... but given enough bodies the country would come to a stand still. I believe you and I have proved the point...

We live in an economical world, were the strongest are based around money. (Strength / Image) * (Humans * Total Humans) ...

so if it gets to lets say 5 million it's like GO US!!! WOOOOO!!!... but * 5 million by 500, and then you have an issue, were most people would want to say they save them, but at the back of there minds they think no I want better health care. (Sorry I scrapped my grammer and what not in that reply)
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Posted 11/12/15 , edited 11/12/15
Human life is valuable, but the value is not infinite, even though we dislike assigning a finite value to things that are difficult or impossible to measure. But, that the value of a life is finite is consistent with what we know about other things that exist, that things have a beginning and end, situations in which they are useful or useless, that existence is essentially limited.

Although I think it's unwise to trade 5 trillion for one prisoner, that is not due to my believing that human life is less valuable than ideas. It is due to the fact that one prisoner is unlikely to contribute enough to pay back that 5 trillion upon returning and living out his life. An unwise investment, in other words. I find it easier to think of things in terms of net loss and gain rather than focus on emotional appeal. That's not to say emotions aren't important, but those, too, have limited value and we ought not to pretend that we are all-important.
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28 / M / UK, Liverpool
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Posted 11/12/15

Morbidhanson wrote:

Human life is valuable, but the value is not infinite, even though we dislike assigning a finite value to things that are difficult or impossible to measure. But, that the value of a life is finite is consistent with what we know about other things that exist, that things have a beginning and end, situations in which they are useful or useless, that existence is essentially limited.

Although I think it's unwise to trade 5 trillion for one prisoner, that is not due to my believing that human life is less valuable than ideas. It is due to the fact that one prisoner is unlikely to contribute enough to pay back that 5 trillion upon returning and living out his life. An unwise investment, in other words. I find it easier to think of things in terms of net loss and gain rather than focus on emotional appeal. That's not to say emotions aren't important, but those, too, have limited value and we ought not to pretend that we are all-important.


Hear Hear
Posted 11/12/15
As long as the net gain of happiness is bigger, then the act is good. If the net gain due to freedom is greater than saving one person, let the person die.
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28 / M / UK, Liverpool
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Posted 11/12/15

haikinka wrote:

As long as the net gain of happiness is bigger, then the act is good. If the net gain due to freedom is greater than saving one person, let the person die.



That in of it's self is relative to your country. The happiness of one person gaining an iPad is unlikely to out weigh that of the people who helped to develop it.
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Posted 11/12/15
https://youtu.be/iPXKfGxeHIY

Is this another Smoke Weed thread?

I'm going to become a school bus driver and smoke weed everyday.

Posted 11/12/15
Best troll I've seen in years! Bravo!
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21 / F / Reliving The Future
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Posted 11/12/15

dotsforlife wrote:

Considering I don't value human life at all, I'd say a lot of things are more valuable/precious/important as you put it.


That's really unsettling, are you sure you don't value human life at all?
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41 / M / USA
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Posted 11/12/15

ChaoticRuins wrote:


dotsforlife wrote:

Considering I don't value human life at all, I'd say a lot of things are more valuable/precious/important as you put it.


That's really unsettling, are you sure you don't value human life at all?


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