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Post Reply Philosophically, why is killing/murder wrong?
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Posted 1/3/16

qualeshia3 wrote:

Let me know if a thread like this one exist or not.
Thanks a bunches.


Explain your opinions in great detail.


Bonus Questions:

1) Why do murderers exist? What is the point?

2) What goes through the mind of a murderer?


Enjoy!!!


Well if we are to take into question the act of killing. Not the title bestowed upon those who commit this act, then this immediately becomes a slippery slope of when it's okay to kill.

It's a matter of justification that equates to backing up the point of the act. Nobody kills for absolutely no reason. Whether we agree on the point of why the act was committed or not is usually determined by social values and ect. In other words, a matter of perspective.

A soldier is seen as a soldier for his acts, he brings honor to his/her country by defeating(killing their countries enemies).

A murderer, usually something like a domestic dispute gone wrong. Gets called just that, a murderer for killing a wife, neighbor and so on.

Truthfully, there is no difference in these acts other than the fact they can be sanctioned pending the situation. Self defense/War time.

What goes through the mind of a murderer? That goes back to my fist point, the justification for killing another. Which, widely varies.
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Posted 1/3/16

PrinceJudar wrote:


HolyDrumstick wrote:Or, more simply stated: Murderers are people.


This sums it up perfectly.






Some people tend to see them as monsters more than people. As for me, I'm not really sure.
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Posted 1/3/16

HolyDrumstick wrote:


VaughanDS wrote:

My personal view:
Murder is neither "right" nor "wrong" as morality is subjective.
This is due to the fact that our morals derive from social norms so the current view on right or wrong is purely defined by what the majority see as normal and not normal. To kill someone will seem like a horrific action to you, however this is only because that mentality has been instilled within you since birth.
Not to sound like a nutjob but society is a construct that inhibits personal growth to instil a hive mind mentality of conformity. If you really want to kill someone you should be able to do it, however you can't because from birth you have been conditioned to believe it is wrong, this may benefit society as a whole but doesn't it seem to say something about our "free will"?


I understand what you are saying. People are probably going to think I'm a psycho for what I'm about to say.

I personally have been freed of the bad feelings towards killing people... at least from the conceptual point, because I haven't actually killed anyone to know if I would feel guilty.

If being honest with myself, I can't see other people in pain, so I could never torture. It deeply disturbs and upsets me. But the idea of ending someone does not bother me at all. If there were no laws, I could see removing several people simply because they are problematic in my life. However, I also never want to go to prison, and do not feel any burning desire or need to kill, so I will never kill anyone.

It may seem strange, but I blame my solitary lifestyle and the fact that the Marine Corps conditions Marines to be somewhat okay with the concept of killing. It's enabled me to look at it in another way. However, I'm still very sane, and do not feel compelled to kill, so I choose to obey the law for my own safety and happiness. Basically the same reason I follow most laws.

I don't know how normal this is, but I feel like if people were really honest with themselves, many would see that they feel the same way.


Thing is that's it with laws, no one really wants to follow them, but we just do it. Our lives are laid out in front of us and any deviations from the predetermined path = scorn, ridicule and in the worst cases imprisonment from the rest of society who blindly follow.

I guess I'm just misanthropic but human nature disgusts me if following a collective norm is all we are able to do.
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Posted 1/3/16

VaughanDS wrote:


Thing is that's it with laws, no one really wants to follow them, but we just do it. Our lives are laid out in front of us and any deviations from the predetermined path = scorn, ridicule and in the worst cases imprisonment from the rest of society who blindly follow.

I guess I'm just misanthropic but human nature disgusts me if following a collective norm is all we are able to do.


But see, that's just an unhealthy way of looking at things. Yes, I choose to follow the law for my own safety and happiness, but I also respect the law for making the world a much less dangerous and chaotic place. It's much easier to choose to follow laws when you understand that most of them are GOOD for humanity.
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Posted 1/3/16
It depends on the type of murder. Some murders are driven by anger or scorn. Other are driven by greed. Examples of this would be robbery or killing to collect a loved one's life insurance policy. Finally you have those who just have a desire to kill. It could be a mental imbalance, the fact the individual has sociopathic or psychopathic tendencies, motive, or a pure addiction.

Killing/Murder is a trait of the human race. People kill other people every day. Laws are in place to attempt to prohibit these actions. In a lawless society, which still exist in some places in the world. Killing runs rampant.

Determining if killing and murder is wrong depends on the individual and what they believe in. This could be religious beliefs, personal beliefs, adhering to laws in place or lack thereof, or a situation that places you in a kill or be killed situation to survive. I believe there are multiple variables to this.

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Posted 1/3/16

Hrafna wrote:


qualeshia3 wrote:

Ever wondered why killers feels killing is necessary?

Sorry, I was just fucking around. It's ridiculous to compare urination to murder.

To answer you seriously this time around:

Most murders are murders of passion, occurring due to extreme psychological stress. It is the mental breakdown that the killer went through as a result of accepting the inevitability of is own social demise that left him appearing as if incapable of empathy.


It's okay.
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Posted 1/3/16

HolyDrumstick wrote:


VaughanDS wrote:


Thing is that's it with laws, no one really wants to follow them, but we just do it. Our lives are laid out in front of us and any deviations from the predetermined path = scorn, ridicule and in the worst cases imprisonment from the rest of society who blindly follow.

I guess I'm just misanthropic but human nature disgusts me if following a collective norm is all we are able to do.


But see, that's just an unhealthy way of looking at things. Yes, I choose to follow the law for my own safety and happiness, but I also respect the law for making the world a much less dangerous and chaotic place. It's much easier to choose to follow laws when you understand that most of them are GOOD for humanity.


Why should any one person truly care about the good of humanity? All humans do is worry about their selfish existence while destroying the earth and procreating. The most ironic part is that the end result is just death, so really there is no meaning to one's existence in the first place.

Q. How will the inevitable destruction of humanity affect me in my lifetime?
A. It won't.

Let me show this from another perspective. Why is it that we believe that doing things for others is a good thing? Because in return we get a rush of endorphins from being "kind to others". So then is it really us helping others, or have humans been using the excuse of altruistic behaviour to feel good about ourselves..? If I am right then really what is the point of trying to help a civilisation like that to continue to exist, really if that is the case murder should be allowed to we can show the true nature of humanity and let it eradicate itself like we will end up doing anyway.

Our lives are worthless in the grand scheme of things, and pretending otherwise is just ignorance, in my opinion anyway.
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Posted 1/3/16 , edited 1/3/16

VaughanDS wrote:

Our lives are worthless in the grand scheme of things, and pretending otherwise is just ignorance, in my opinion anyway.


No doubt, but based on this logic, is there truly anything you can care about or devote yourself to that is MORE important than the future of mankind? I personally say no.

The idea that mankind is a lost cause, and can just die off is very similar to feeling the same about a baby, simply because it hasn't learned anything, yet. I don't do what is good for mankind because of the current state of mankind, I do what is good for mankind for what I hope it will be, one day.

Of course, you're welcome to do whatever you want. I'm simply stating my perspective.
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Posted 1/3/16 , edited 1/3/16

HolyDrumstick wrote:


VaughanDS wrote:




No doubt, but based on this logic, is there truly anything you can care about or devote yourself to that is MORE important than the future of mankind? I personally say no.

The idea that mankind is a lost cause, and can just die off is very similar to feeling the same about a baby, simply because it hasn't learned anything, yet. I don't do what is good for mankind because of the current state of mankind, I do what is good for mankind for what I hope it will be, one day.

Of course, you're welcome to do whatever you want. I'm simply stating my perspective.


I guess the main difference between in our viewpoints show that you feel no animosity towards the human race yet I pretty much hate it. I personally see mankind as a growing tumour, I think our existence is just getting worse and worse. From there our views split so really I don't think either of us can have a mutual agreement but I understand where you are coming from.

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Posted 1/3/16
I believe that murder (i.e. killing with malace) is wrong because it's the intentional removal of another person's ability to make choices. Basically, for the same reason I feel slavery is wrong. I value choice over human life though.
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Posted 1/3/16 , edited 1/3/16

VaughanDS wrote:
I guess the main difference between in our viewpoints show that you feel no animosity towards the human race yet I pretty much hate it. I personally see mankind as a growing tumour, I think our existence is just getting worse and worse. From there our views split so really I don't think either of us can have a mutual agreement but I understand where you are coming from.


I definitely understand where you are coming from. To me, humanity is simply in its "Terrible Twos," so to speak.
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Posted 1/3/16

mscall92 wrote:

I believe that murder (i.e. killing with malace) is wrong because it's the intentional removal of another person's ability to make choices. Basically, for the same reason I feel slavery is wrong. I value choice over human life though.


Choices?
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Posted 1/3/16

VaughanDS: society is a construct that inhibits personal growth to instil a hive mind mentality of conformity. If you really want to kill someone you should be able to do it, however you can't because from birth you have been conditioned to believe it is wrong, this
may benefit society as a whole but doesn't it seem to say something about our "free will"?


On the contrary, people have much greater potential for personal growth because of society. What could you achieve or become, as a person, before society existed? The idea of personal growth probably didn't even exist before society.

As for free will, I don't think some primitive human trying to survive day by day on their own would have much leeway to do the things they'd want, the challenges of survival would dominate their life's choices.


HolyDrumstick: I understand what you are saying. People are probably going to think I'm a psycho for what I'm about to say.


Being able to kill is a natural thing, humans have done it forever. I think most people would be able to given the right motivation, even if they won't admit it.


VaughanDS: Thing is that's it with laws, no one really wants to follow them, but we just do it. Our lives are laid out in front of us and any deviations from the predetermined path = scorn, ridicule and in the worst cases imprisonment from the rest of society who blindly follow.

I guess I'm just misanthropic but human nature disgusts me if following a collective norm is all we are able to do.


If you don't like how things are, you can always try to change it. It's not like the law or societal norms are set in stone. They change because of people.

Also, is it really disgusting that people can agree on a way of living that allows for the human condition to improve? Do you look at what goes on in lawless areas or places ruled by warlords and think that is something to aspire to? I look upon that with disgust, personally; I know it's not the best humans can do.
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Posted 1/3/16


I believe that society has allowed human progression in the way that it wants. Truly, the thought of an anarchic life sounds harsh but that is because if the current humans reach it, we will not be able to have true free will because we have been conditioned by society to accept the way things are and mindlessly follow it, so our lives would still be subconsciously made into right and wrong.

The act of changing a whole societies norms has been greatly under appreciated here, the most influence comes from the media as a whole and it is laughable to think a single human could hope to change it.
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Remember this, "Right and wrong/good and bad are childish terms. They are opinion more than anything" Objectively speaking there is no right or wrong there is only beneficial and detrimental. Killing is only wrong because it was made illegal for morality's sake. Take away those laws and morals and you ask yourself will killing this person or group benefit me or will it lead to more problems. You decide. I'm not saying the world will let you get away with it but you might, anything is possible.
To answer your other questions, murder is a desire we act upon that can stem from any number of things. The point of it /goal is to feel good/better.
Also (my opinion) i think murder is a human(maybe legal) term associated with "bad" killing instead of "good" killing(self defence/protection). Ask around to see if there is a difference between killing and murdering. Does one animal kill another, or does it murder it?
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