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Post Reply Why do some smart people fail to figure their way out of religion?
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Posted 1/10/16

KarenAraragi wrote:
Fear. No about god himself but letting go of something important to you.
Just stopping suddenly in believing something isn't easy.
Yes people don't just wake up and want to stop believing. There is always a reason behind it, not an agenda type reason, but a causal one. This is why I think no atheist is completely agnostic. We live our lives experiencing things and learning and eventually some of us just 'figure it out.' We rationalize into atheists because of information, does that mean atheism more correctly reflects reality? No, but there is just so much about religion that can be countered with simple observations, deduction and not allowing it to exploit fears and assumptions with the claims it makes.

Are there legitimately people who can claim to be agnostics? Sure, I'm not saying there aren't. Those people simply place more value in the quality and accuracy of knowledge. They are not satisfied with deduction and rationalization without hard evidence for something as important as the existence or non-existence of God. The atheist is happy with, "I don't see any evidence contrary to this deduction so I'm not going to believe."
OutSiN 
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Posted 1/10/16
There are smart people on both sides. The problem is that a lot of times, for the sake of the argument, biased people tend to focus on the idiots of the other side and/or the dumb things smart people have said exclusively.

When you say "Why do some smart people fail to figure their way out of religion?" you start from the biased preconception that one of the sides (which, of course, happens to be the side you're part of) is by default smarted and, when faced with exception, instead of rethinking the initial preconception, you double down and write it off as an exception.
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Posted 1/10/16
I think it's because the more people know about scientific theories for how the universe and life were created, the more it seems like chance occurrences happening repeatedly. They want a more solid explanation of this. Something to keep in mind also is that smart people are rarely churchgoers and almost never take the bible or whatever book they follow literally. There is some stuff that makes sense, but a lot of it is just stories.
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Posted 1/10/16

PeripheralVisionary wrote:

I think most people are smarter than people give them credit for. For every cuckoo out there, there's like 5 or 20 people with the capacity to rationalize. Some people are afraid to tread on their parent's belief?


What does it mean to be smart? People use that word with many different meanings.
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Posted 1/10/16

JustineKo2 wrote:

I think I am smart, but I know there are a lot of people smarter than me (smart as in intelligent).
Yet some of those smarter people still buy into this concept of religion, or practice a religion.
I'm not saying religious people are dumb so perhaps it is just fear of the unknown and unseeable that makes people think, 'OK, I'll believe, just in case."
But that's dumb. There's lots of evidence that shows religion grew out of people's ignorance and the attitude of what's the harm in believing in God? Well what's the harm in not believing?


I think it gives people a reason to live. Something to motivate those who have no incentive to do anything in their life.

Don't get me wrong I am an atheist. But we atheist cannot be blind to the positive affects of religion. Otherwise we are no better than those who tell us "your going to hell" and ect.
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Posted 1/10/16
Religion for most people is a belief in a higher power. Something to help them through their daily struggles. Maybe even something to blame. Their is no point in arguing the point of religion because people a fighting over it or pushing their views its a part of human nature if it isn't that its skin colour, money, social status and origin. for the most part it works keeping people in line excluding fanatics and psychos.
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Posted 1/10/16 , edited 1/10/16

OutSiN wrote:When you say "Why do some smart people fail to figure their way out of religion?" you start from the biased preconception that one of the sides (which, of course, happens to be the side you're part of) is by default smarted and, when faced with exception, instead of rethinking the initial preconception, you double down and write it off as an exception.
But I think, and hoped, the question could be looked at differently than that. It focuses on the concept that atheists become atheists because they use information to tell them a popular opinion is not correct just because its popular or because it seems like the more beneficial route. It's thought above social pressure to conform. I think that is a type of intelligence that can make you an atheist but is not because you are an atheist.
Some assumptions can be made that my question doesn't address:
Some atheists are dumb people, and are atheists for other reasons.
Some religious people are in fact dumb and don't have the capacity to reason their way out of their religion.
Some atheists are smart and are atheists for other reasons.
Some smart people are neither religious nor would label themselves atheists.
Some dumb people are neither religious nor would label themselves atheists.


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Posted 1/10/16 , edited 1/10/16
It’s mostly that generations of humans have been condition to follow a faith based system that its now consider a norm. Anyone who does not follow that norm is considered abnormal and peer pressured into joining what their faith based system that they follow.

Also consider talking a social psychology class and learn about what groups really are.

http://www.sparknotes.com/psychology/psych101/socialpsychology/section8.rhtml
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Posted 1/10/16
Smart= intelligent. i.e.: scientists.

The more one studies the make up of the universe, macro or micro, the more they start finding some underlying order in the chaos. That makes intelligent people to start going back to their religious background. I doubt one religion has all the answers they are looking for.
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Posted 1/10/16 , edited 1/10/16

OutSiN wrote: It focuses on the concept that atheists become atheists because they use information to tell them a popular opinion is not correct just because its popular. It's thought above social pressure to conform.


You're making it seem as if you're under the assumption that religious people are religious because "it's the popular thing to do", or because they want to be accepted. And if you're not under that assumption then you probably should have phrased this better.

Think about it like this. You're currently surrounded by 4 walls, even if you can't see 1 of the walls you still know that there are 4 walls. Simply because you can't see it doesn't mean it "does not exist", you know it is still there. Now, you know those walls are there to begin with because you've seen them, you've touched them, and possibly done other strange things to your walls idk. And that's how you know it exists. Most Atheists or Anti-theists start off with "Well you can't prove God exists" which is true, but you also can't prove he doesn't exist.

Humans are creatures that are limited by perception. If something happens that we don't understand, or we have a sensation we are unfamiliar with, a person could easily draw the conclusion that it was God's doing (especially if they grew up being taught about God by their parents). Giving them a perceived physical evidence of God. Ya know, like having conversations with burning bushes and what not.

Honestly, I'm a little annoyed that you tried to associate intelligence with religious beliefs (whether you intended to or not, you did). It's like trying to associate the color of your eyes with what your favorite sport is, there's no reason or purpose for the correlation. People simply like what they like and believe what they believe. Philosophers have talked about why we think the way we think for millenia (not sure if that's a word?).

They're human. That's the only right answer.
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Posted 1/10/16

Trewill91 wrote:

why do so many smart people fail to realize that the universe is way, WAY too complex and predictable to be the result of a cosmic coincidence?


Kinda just took the words right out of my mouth.
Believing in a religion has nothing to do with your intelligence. I think practicing a religion without enough background, study and factual reasoning as to why you're practicing that religion is kind of dumb. I believe everyone should learn about different religions to find what is true for them. I myself am on a religious journey because i was raised christian but find too many faults in their teachings. But it comes down to there are too many things that happen in the world and universe that can't be explained with science. If you believe science explains every single thing then you are close-minded. Sometimes things happen (magic, extra terrestrial shit, luck, chance, spiritually, whatever you wanna call it) that can't be explained. Ive been a victim or beneficiary of unexplained phenomenon and many others in the world have too. So yes i believe in a higher power and I am not stupid for doing so.
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Posted 1/10/16
I'm a science major, and I've always been very science-oriented. For a long time, I wondered if I might be an atheist, or agnostic at the least.

It was only recently that I became religious, mainly in a spiritual sense. A faith is just that - believing in something that hasn't been proven by our methods. Science proves facts, faith and religion is there for everything else.

That being said, I have nothing against non-religious folk. Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs.
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Posted 1/10/16

Trewill91 wrote:

why do so many smart people fail to realize that the universe is way, WAY too complex and predictable to be the result of a cosmic coincidence?


"Complex" and "Predictable" really aren't two words that go together. Open up a big bag of skittles and a bag of M&M's and drop the two into a pile on the floor. There is no pattern, they simply fall where they fall.
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Posted 1/10/16

JustineKo2 wrote:
Yes people don't just wake up and want to stop believing. There is always a reason behind it, not an agenda type reason, but a causal one. This is why I think no atheist is completely agnostic. We live our lives experiencing things and learning and eventually some of us just 'figure it out.' We rationalize into atheists because of information, does that mean atheism more correctly reflects reality? No, but there is just so much about religion that can be countered with simple observations, deduction and not allowing it to exploit fears and assumptions with the claims it makes.

Are there legitimately people who can claim to be agnostics? Sure, I'm not saying there aren't. Those people simply place more value in the quality and accuracy of knowledge. They are not satisfied with deduction and rationalization without hard evidence for something as important as the existence or non-existence of God. The atheist is happy with, "I don't see any evidence contrary to this deduction so I'm not going to believe."


I claim to be an apathetic agnostic. Conjectures are amusing though and so is the folly that one side somehow has the better answer.

The question of God's existence--it cannot be settled intellectually. The choice to believe versus not can be simplified into three components:

1. Where it can be believed as a result of inquiry.
2. Forced, choose one or the other.
3. It is a largely significant choice with fleeting opportunity.

Humanity varies between two matters when it comes to intellectualism, to seek truth and to avoid error. The balance itself is not settled by reason but by character.

Have you not ever considered the prospect that the position of finding truth is to risk being wrong?

The question is not a matter of intellectualism or evidence, but simply on the strength of whether to simply believe or not.

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Posted 1/10/16 , edited 1/10/16
Only a sith deals in absolutes.
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