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Post Reply Bill banning child marriage fails in Pakistan after it’s deemed ‘un-Islamic’
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13 / F / California
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Posted 1/16/16


What the fuck?
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18 / F / Everywhere
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Posted 1/16/16
I can't seem to find a facepalm emoji. This will have to do.
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27 / M / NY
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Posted 1/16/16

FruitPunchSamurai987 wrote:

I can't seem to find a facepalm emoji. This will have to do.




This might help.
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28 / M / USA! USA! USA!
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Posted 1/16/16
Someone actually reported this thread.


Like wow, some people really don't like it when their narrative gets challenged.
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Posted 1/16/16

runec wrote:

Culture ≠ Religion


anti-freeze wrote:
Still it is kind of a sad day for the world. I mean yeah here in the united states of amercia you can get married at 16 with parental consent. .


12 in Massachusetts! ( For girls only of course ). Hell, in Georgia if you're pregnant you don't even need the parental consent part ( an alarming number of states have a "knocked up" clause ). Many states don't even actually have a minimum. You just require judicial and/or parental approval.

Sooo, yeah. Glass houses, etc.
this has got to be the most grossest thing I have ever read today.
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28 / M / USA! USA! USA!
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Posted 1/16/16

runec wrote:

Culture ≠ Religion


anti-freeze wrote:
Still it is kind of a sad day for the world. I mean yeah here in the united states of amercia you can get married at 16 with parental consent. .


12 in Massachusetts! ( For girls only of course ). Hell, in Georgia if you're pregnant you don't even need the parental consent part ( an alarming number of states have a "knocked up" clause ). Many states don't even actually have a minimum. You just require judicial and/or parental approval.

Sooo, yeah. Glass houses, etc.




By "alarming number"...........you mean four, right?


And half of those still require parents or a judge to consent to the marriage even if there is a pregnancy.


Every state has a minimum age for marriage, and only what, four or five have it under 16?


Hell, two states have it over 18 without parental consent.


Cultural relativism simply doesn't work, and especially not in this matter.


There are fundamental differences.
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Posted 1/17/16 , edited 1/17/16

maxgale wrote:
By "alarming number"...........you mean four, right?


That doesn't alarm you? I find it rather alarming.



maxgale wrote:
Every state has a minimum age for marriage, and only what, four or five have it under 16?


Nope, check again. 6 states can waive the minimum. In North Carolina a parent alone can even wave the minimum without judicial consent if a pregnancy is involved.



maxgale wrote:And half of those still require parents or a judge to consent to the marriage even if there is a pregnancy.


Yes, I actually identified the state in question. You are making an argument against nothing.



maxgale wrote:
Every state has a minimum age for marriage, and only what, four or five have it under 16?


Try 8. 13 if you include the ones that have a special clause allowing it to be lowered. 19 if you include the ones where it can be waived.




maxgale wrote:
Hell, two states have it over 18 without parental consent.


And one of those two states has it at 15 with consent.




maxgale wrote:
Cultural relativism simply doesn't work, and especially not in this matter.
.


You might have a point if I had been arguing cultural relativism in any way shape or form. I was, in fact, doing quite the opposite. My initial comment was that culture does not equal religion. So being a dipshit and trotting this out with a "pedophile prophet" comment as the op did is idiotic.

Child marriage is no more an Islamic religious imperative than female genital mutilation is a Christian religious imperative.

Its cultural.



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Posted 1/16/16
Why was this reported? lol
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21 / Australia
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Posted 1/17/16
So the definition of a child is that black and white as to make two years a massive difference?
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23 / M / Kaguya's Panties
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Posted 1/17/16
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27 / M / ihlok
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Posted 1/17/16 , edited 1/17/16

ayesharocks wrote:


D4nc3Style wrote:


Pakistani lawmakers had to withdraw a bill aimed at curbing the practice of child marriage after a prominent religious body declared the legislation un-Islamic.
.
.
Clerics on the council object to minimum age requirements, arguing instead that an individual can marry once reaching puberty, which can be as early as the age of 9.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/01/15/bill-banning-child-marriage-fails-in-pakistan-after-its-deemed-un-islamic/?tid=sm_fb


Clerics on the council object to minimum age requirements, arguing instead that an individual can marry once reaching puberty, which can be as early as the age of 9.


I'm guessing they just wanna follow in the footsteps of their pedophile "prophet".


http://www.breakthrough.tv/earlymarriage/the-law-pcma/ oh yeah sorry actually PCMA replaced it and now prohibits girls under 18

The link you gave is an Indian law not Pakistan's. I think that law is irrelevant as far as Pakistan is concerned.


I read this just now. Another sad example where medieval thinking persisted over humane behavior.
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Posted 1/17/16 , edited 1/17/16

anti-freeze wrote:

such is what happens when you live in a theocracy. Perfectly reasonable laws get overturned because the religion does not approve of them. It is always funny to read these kinds of articles and then watch people react. I mean are people really that surprised? We all know that most countries in that part of the world are theocracies. Yet we get all butt-hurt when they do something stupid like this.

Even better is how so few people can see how Christians do the same thing to Americans all the time. Yet because they are Christian no one seems to care. I mean it is never okay, and yet it happens all the time here. The only difference is that the church has no pull in how laws are actually made or handled here. We have enough smart people figure out how to keep the religion far outisde.

Still it is kind of a sad day for the world. I mean yeah here in the united states of amercia you can get married at 16 with parental consent. However, that is not something we think about. I guess the only thing that makes this article a step back for humanity is how the clergy wants the legal age of consent for marriage to be 9. Even back in the old days people thought that was wrong.



Your statement contradicts itself.

"Christians [here] do the same thing all the time. Yet because they are Christian, no on seems to care. [...]It happens all the time here."

Then directly after that, "The only difference is that the church has no pull in how laws are actually made or handled here. We have enough smart people figure out how to keep the religion far outisde."

So make up your mind, does it happen all the time here, or are we smart enough to NOT let it happen all the time? :P

---------------------------------

Religion and Law went well together hundreds of years ago. When fear of man wasn't enough to keep you on the straight and narrow, fear of the Almighty would step in and temper your decisions.

However, with the rise of secularism, keeping religions in power has a more detrimental effect, because we're advanced enough as a society to not need to have an ultimate being direct our morality, but rather decide taht for ourselves.

Ergo, in secular societies, huge attention is given to the separation of church and state. While religion was once a great tool for keeping mankind in line, it doesn't have that effect in this day and age. In fact, it can even bring the opposite affect, that you'd go against your morality because of religion, even though you're smart enough to know better.

This is really true of any religion. Religions, unlike governmental bodies, are quite static. You cannot redefine what part of the bible means, you cannot adjust the Koran to account for today's differences, etc. Law, on the other hand, is very fluid, can and does often change to meet society's standards. It's adaptable.

Anywho, I'm rambling again.
Posted 1/17/16
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Posted 1/17/16 , edited 1/17/16

runec wrote:

Culture ≠ Religion


anti-freeze wrote:
Still it is kind of a sad day for the world. I mean yeah here in the united states of amercia you can get married at 16 with parental consent. .


12 in Massachusetts! ( For girls only of course ). Hell, in Georgia if you're pregnant you don't even need the parental consent part ( an alarming number of states have a "knocked up" clause ). Many states don't even actually have a minimum. You just require judicial and/or parental approval.

Sooo, yeah. Glass houses, etc.


I'd heard about some places in the USA like this. Some places in the Caribbean have this too. It can take parental consent to get married from ages 12-18. It is difficult to find a lot of those type of marriages these days. You'd hear of some grandparents ,great aunts/uncles and great grandparents who had been married young. A great aunt of mine was married at 14. There was one place that attempted to update marriage laws and one religious group (not representing everyone in that religion) loudly objected on a cultural basis.

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Posted 1/17/16 , edited 1/17/16
Religion is a scary and dangerous disgusting abomination and blight upon the world. I can't wait till we as a species are evolved enough to free ourselves from the indoctrination of all religion.


Sorry if you found this offensive.



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Posted 1/17/16 , edited 1/17/16
Emotional topic, right?

The first and second time someone proposed marriage to me, I was a minor and below the age of consent. (And not pregnant. And not "doing it" with the two different guys who asked.) The fact that their proposals were illegal had no bearing on my decision to tell them to get away from me before I disemboweled them from the bottom side. That's just the kind of thing I might do. Proposal? Counter-proposal. See?

But, um, is anyone asking the women / girls / females / whatever you consider them, what THEY think about getting married? What if they want to? What if their parents want them to? What if "that's how things are done" in that culture so the consequences aren't the same as they would be if the same thing happened in a different culture?

I don't think it's especially wise to marry so young, since being especially young or old when you give birth for the first time increases the liklihood of killing you AND the baby. Still, there's just no way most of us here have a valid opinion on this one.

The people we are referring to right now are basically faceless stereotypical representations of the real girls, and not real people with thousands of years of culture and history behind them, and ideas and thoughts about the world, and needs and wants that they seek to meet. These "girls" are basically our dolls. How are we doing them any good right now by pretending we know what's best for them?

And then, I started laughing and went and watched some anime.
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27 / M / NY
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Posted 1/17/16


I bet you see utopia in that image.

I see bleak, colorless, sterile environment.

I get the joke, but you're not selling me on an artistic level. lol

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