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Do you have a Nihilist view on life?
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28 / F / Michigan, USA
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Posted 2/19/08
~ Remember peoples, this is extended discussion That means 3+ sentences, not one liners.

Some food for thought (besides the opening post)...

What do you think of nihilism?
Why do you think someone would be a nihilist?
Why are/aren't you a nihilist?
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Posted 2/19/08

Do0mAid wrote:

~ Remember peoples, this is extended discussion That means 3+ sentences, not one liners.

Some food for thought (besides the opening post)...

What do you think of nihilism?
Why do you think someone would be a nihilist?
Why are/aren't you a nihilist?



I think nihilism is only for people who are too arrogant to accept anything is higher than themselves

I think somone would be a nihilist if they are ignorant athiest

I'm not a nihilist because I'm a Christian
Posted 2/19/08

Regulus133 wrote:
No objective meaning? Agreed.

Yep, I agree.



No purpose? No objective, absolute purpose. We can make our own.

Yes, basically, but I think the society you're in also has a sort of "group purpose" that's decided as a group or imposed on people.



No essential value? I'm more with Nietzsche on this one. We make our own through exercising our freedom. He actually criticized Western religion as nihilistic because it more or less asserts that what really matters is the afterlife, not the current life.

Yea, I agree with that.



No reasonable proof of the existence of a higher ruler or Creator? Agreed. But that doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

True, but one could declare a creator god as at least being empirically irrelevant based on lack of evidence.



No true morality? Agreed.

I wouldn't say that there's a one single "true" morality, but you seem to imply that all systems of morals are equal and I disagree. I believe that morals are social survival adaptations, and that some systems are vasty superior to others. For example, headhunters and cannibals can't form large prosperous civilizations.



Objective secular ethics are impossible? Agreed.

Well, again no one "true" single objective ideal, but secular ethics/morals can be measured by survival efficiency, or perhaps also by quality of life of the average person under each system. Survival efficiency is pretty objective with quality of life and such being more subjective. After all, people could have lives that suck based on our standards but be brainwashed into thinking their lives are great.



So yes, I'm nihilistic in the sense that I do not believe in absolutes in and of themselves, but I am nevertheless down-to-earth and affirming of life.

Hmm, well, is it nilistic to declare your purpose as to have as little trouble/stress/suffering/badstuff/etc. as possible for the rest of your life while not harming and even aiding in the survivability of others? That's sort of the Buddhist view, except that Buddhism adds the additional idea of nirvana (which some people think is nihilistic because they think that nirvana means non-existence, which it doesn't.)
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Posted 2/19/08
Nihilist... Nope, I don't believe that there's a purpose to life, nor do I believe there is not. Maybe there's another term for it. Nihilism is an interesting theory nonetheless. It just doesn't seem right, it's more like a religion imo.. Maybe not a religion, more like a faith.
Posted 2/19/08

zombiexmylove wrote:


n_n303 wrote:

yes, i dont believe in shit like god, fate, soul mates, or destiny.
and why do i have a feeling this is a duplicate..or atleast should go into the E.D section?


I searched up nihilism and nihilist, and no topics like this have come up.

It's more of a yes or no question.



Yeah, she's right. I personally am not one, but at the same time I have some qualities, not all of them though. Nihilism is such bull though, why not care about life and think they're is some meaning?
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Posted 2/19/08
I can probably be classified as a nihilist. Since I believe that all existence is born to survive, nothing more. Each person is like a speck of dust in comparison to the earth and the earth is insignificant in the the universe.

True knowledge can never be achieved, we can theorize what happens or happened but we can never confirm.

The only thing worse than theories that can never be achieved would be people blaming everything on a higher deity to explain the unexplainable. If there is a god, then he would be like a little girl playing with dolls. There would be no other reason to create existence, besides watching them live for insignificant reasons.
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Posted 2/19/08

coreyb49127 wrote:


Hugegnome wrote:

I can probably be classified as a nihilist. Since I believe that all existence is born to survive, nothing more. Each person is like a speck of dust in comparison to the earth and the earth is insignificant in the the universe.

True knowledge can never be achieved, we can theorize what happens or happened but we can never confirm.

The only thing worse than theories that can never be achieved would be people blaming everything on a higher deity to explain the unexplainable. If there is a god, then he would be like a little girl playing with dolls. There would be no other reason to create existence, besides watching them live for insignificant reasons.


thats not a nihilist.........

nihilists believe that nothing is real that this very exsitence is fake. throughout history every known (semi-famous whichever you prefer to use) have actually commited suicide becaue the view is so depressing

cr fails again you guys realize ANYONE can post on wikipedia right?

here

http://www.iep.utm.edu/n/nihilism.htm


Philosophy.
a. an extreme form of skepticism: the denial of all real existence or the possibility of an objective basis for truth

1 a: a viewpoint that traditional values and beliefs are unfounded and that existence is senseless and useless b: a doctrine that denies any objective ground of truth and especially of moral truths

Nihilists doesn't involve the belief that "nothing is real that this very existence is fake," it has more to do with life being pointless. There is no higher meaning to life than just living and dying. That's why they committed suicide, because they know that life is insignificant.

Just because it includes the words "denial of truth" doesn't mean they believe that this existence is false. It just means that there are no higher meaning to things and that things people believe are true are merely their own beliefs.
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Posted 2/19/08

shibole wrote:



No purpose? No objective, absolute purpose. We can make our own.

Yes, basically, but I think the society you're in also has a sort of "group purpose" that's decided as a group or imposed on people.


Of course, but the question is whether it is objective and absolute.





No reasonable proof of the existence of a higher ruler or Creator? Agreed. But that doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

True, but one could declare a creator god as at least being empirically irrelevant based on lack of evidence.


I agree. The only concern I really have with God is the way people use it as a concept to influence others.





No true morality? Agreed.

I wouldn't say that there's a one single "true" morality, but you seem to imply that all systems of morals are equal and I disagree. I believe that morals are social survival adaptations, and that some systems are vasty superior to others. For example, headhunters and cannibals can't form large prosperous civilizations.


This is my position as well; I do not mean to imply that all systems are equal in the context of their purpose. See the last comments in my original post. I offer the same response to the following bit on "objective secular ethics."





So yes, I'm nihilistic in the sense that I do not believe in absolutes in and of themselves, but I am nevertheless down-to-earth and affirming of life.

Hmm, well, is it nilistic to declare your purpose as to have as little trouble/stress/suffering/badstuff/etc. as possible for the rest of your life while not harming and even aiding in the survivability of others? That's sort of the Buddhist view, except that Buddhism adds the additional idea of nirvana (which some people think is nihilistic because they think that nirvana means non-existence, which it doesn't.)


Since nihilistic claims regard objectivity and absolutes, I'm sure you can affirm that purpose and remain nihilistic. However, I'm not quite sure where Buddhism fits when it comes to nirvana (can we even speak of that?). Not that Nietzsche himself defines nihilism, but it's rather clear that he would criticize it for its denial of attachments (including freedom) in life.
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Posted 2/19/08

krnsoldierofGod wrote:

I think nihilism is only for people who are too arrogant to accept anything is higher than themselves

I think somone would be a nihilist if they are ignorant athiest

I'm not a nihilist because I'm a Christian


You're positing, then, that:
1.) it is arrogant to not accept anything higher than oneself
2.) nihilists are only atheists
3.) possibly (I'm not sure) all atheists are ignorant.

Claim #1: Not true. If one doesn't see any reason to believe in God, it is not about arrogance or humility. It is just about not having a reason to believe.

Claim #2: Not true. Nietzsche, for example, claimed that Christianity is a religion of nihilism in that it denies our current life for the sake of the afterlife by (1) affirming self-regulation rather than self-affirmation and (2) setting the unknown world beyond this one up to be more important. If this doesn't bother you, that's fine - it just means you don't really have a problem with that form of nihilism, in which case it would be inappropriate for you to use the word insultingly.

Claim #3: There are many knowledgeable atheists, just as there are many knowledgeable theists. If you mean to say that atheists are ignorant only in that they do not believe in God, I would need you to present me with proof - indubitable evidence, not just claims - that God does actually exist. That means you would need to prove both the existence of the supernatural as well as a being that matches your beliefs exactly. Best of luck in this endeavor.
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Posted 2/19/08

Regulus133 wrote:


krnsoldierofGod wrote:

I think nihilism is only for people who are too arrogant to accept anything is higher than themselves

I think somone would be a nihilist if they are ignorant athiest

I'm not a nihilist because I'm a Christian


You're positing, then, that:
1.) it is arrogant to not accept anything higher than oneself
2.) nihilists are only atheists
3.) possibly (I'm not sure) all atheists are ignorant.

Claim #1: Not true. If one doesn't see any reason to believe in God, it is not about arrogance or humility. It is just about not having a reason to believe.

Claim #2: Not true. Nietzsche, for example, claimed that Christianity is a religion of nihilism in that it denies our current life for the sake of the afterlife by (1) affirming self-regulation rather than self-affirmation and (2) setting the unknown world beyond this one up to be more important. If this doesn't bother you, that's fine - it just means you don't really have a problem with that form of nihilism, in which case it would be inappropriate for you to use the word insultingly.

Claim #3: There are many knowledgeable atheists, just as there are many knowledgeable theists. If you mean to say that atheists are ignorant only in that they do not believe in God, I would need you to present me with proof - indubitable evidence, not just claims - that God does actually exist. That means you would need to prove both the existence of the supernatural as well as a being that matches your beliefs exactly. Best of luck in this endeavor.



rebuttal #1 having not a reason to believe could be an excuse

rebuttal #2 there IS a purpose to live and there ARE true morals in the Christian religion, the form of Chrisitanity your referring to must be one of those wacko ones like mormons or jehovas witness where they changed the Bible

rebuttal #3 All who don't know the truth of Jesus Christ is ignorant (in my opinion)
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Posted 2/19/08
yeah i dont believe in gods. if there is a god, i would most likely kill him.
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Posted 2/19/08
how can you live life without any of that...i have a hard time any of you are actually nihilists...unless i misunderstood the topic
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Posted 2/19/08

krnsoldierofGod wrote:

rebuttal #1 having not a reason to believe could be an excuse

rebuttal #2 there IS a purpose to live and there ARE true morals in the Christian religion, the form of Chrisitanity your referring to must be one of those wacko ones like mormons or jehovas witness where they changed the Bible

rebuttal #3 All who don't know the truth of Jesus Christ is ignorant (in my opinion)


#1: Could be, but is not necessarily. And I can almost guarantee you that most of atheism is not just about fear of God or arrogance. May it suffice to say that there are at least exceptions to what you perceive to be the rule.

#2: No, I'm not referring to anything crazy. It's simple. There are rules in the Bible, and breaking them constitutes sin. Sin without forgiveness from God leads to Hell, which is either a place of eternal suffering or simply the end of life, depending on your interpretation. Thus Christians often deny themselves certain activities in which they may wish to engage - a denial of life for the sake of another life. You can go into whether morality is just fear of punishment or genuine belief in what is supposedly right and wrong, but it doesn't change the fact that Biblical Christianity denies a lot of possibilities in life with promise of a reward.

#3: You're entitled to your opinion, but the only ones who will take you seriously are your own "kind." If you do not back it up with proof or compelling evidence, your opinion is as meaningful as a statement of your preference in color or soup. If you want to change people or get them to want to change themselves, calling them ignorant won't help; if you aren't interested in that, why bother insulting them?
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Posted 2/19/08

DarkLFluffles wrote:

how can you live life without any of that...i have a hard time any of you are actually nihilists...unless i misunderstood the topic


It is difficult for people who really feel they need some kind of absolute backing to their existence. I was raised to believe I had one, but it crumbled before the power of reason. I'm not over the negative feelings regarding it, but I do feel that everyone should truly experience it before deciding upon his path in life.

In place of objectivity, we have subjectivity; in place of God, we have ourselves.
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Posted 2/19/08

Regulus133 wrote:


krnsoldierofGod wrote:

rebuttal #1 having not a reason to believe could be an excuse

rebuttal #2 there IS a purpose to live and there ARE true morals in the Christian religion, the form of Chrisitanity your referring to must be one of those wacko ones like mormons or jehovas witness where they changed the Bible

rebuttal #3 All who don't know the truth of Jesus Christ is ignorant (in my opinion)


#1: Could be, but is not necessarily. And I can almost guarantee you that most of atheism is not just about fear of God or arrogance. May it suffice to say that there are at least exceptions to what you perceive to be the rule.

#2: No, I'm not referring to anything crazy. It's simple. There are rules in the Bible, and breaking them constitutes sin. Sin without forgiveness from God leads to Hell, which is either a place of eternal suffering or simply the end of life, depending on your interpretation. Thus Christians often deny themselves certain activities in which they may wish to engage - a denial of life for the sake of another life. You can go into whether morality is just fear of punishment or genuine belief in what is supposedly right and wrong, but it doesn't change the fact that Biblical Christianity denies a lot of possibilities in life with promise of a reward.

#3: You're entitled to your opinion, but the only ones who will take you seriously are your own "kind." If you do not back it up with proof or compelling evidence, your opinion is as meaningful as a statement of your preference in color or soup. If you want to change people or get them to want to change themselves, calling them ignorant won't help; if you aren't interested in that, why bother insulting them?


#1 then why do YOU not believe in Christianity?

#2 Just because your a Christian doesn't mean that there are not certain "rules" that you have to follow in order for you to stay as a Christian. The Bible says we weren't created to be perfect. For being moral, they are God's rules so they are moral/immoral if you like it or not ( in the Christian religion)

#3 you should see back what I said (I think somone would be a nihilist IF they are ignorant athiest)

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