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Post Reply Why You Shouldn't Hate Other Anime
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Posted 2/15/16
So you saying having standards is pointless?

There are many reason to dislike those shows, its your job to provide counter points as to why it is good. Nothing is free from criticism and if you don't like this then I suggest never going on anything with forums or a comment section (ex youtube, crunchyroll)

I have all of bryhindrle in the darkness and yes it is a terrible show. Bad ending, poor characterization, lack of a plot, poor animation the amount of still frames and panning stills used made me think Arms was going to go broke, although after watching that I wish they did.

I have watched all of Attack on Titan and yes it is only slightly above average with its ADHD plot line whats in the basement, titans, whats in the basement,forget the basement now its this rock, now titans,
Posted 2/15/16
Attack on Titan, while I did like it, felt a bit too self righteous by casting Eren as the protaganist. I'm not sure how the shows want to go about developing his character. Is he an anti hero? Is he a protaganist? What is he? He's a very angry person, and that shows in his action. So angry in fact that he comes off as morally questionable that appeal to teen with morals that are less than typical of shonen heroes. Just as Naruto and Ichigo cater to the power fantasy of those wanting to emphasize friendship and traditional mores, you have someone that clashes with these heroes, by embodying traits of anger and vengeance, traits associated with the anti hero, without the usually grittiness or some mood of condemnation, and while this may be refreshing to me, it's also a bit disturbing. I think it's fine to be angry, but here's a guy who hurts his friends with his anger, and somehow this comes off as being very self righteous.
xxJing 
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Posted 2/15/16

PeripheralVisionary wrote:

Attack on Titan, while I did like it, felt a bit too self righteous by casting Eren as the protaganist. I'm not sure how the shows want to go about developing his character. Is he an anti hero? Is he a protaganist? What is he? He's a very angry person, and that shows in his action. So angry in fact that he comes off as morally questionable that appeal to teen with morals that are less than typical of shonen heroes. Just as Naruto and Ichigo cater to the power fantasy of those wanting to emphasize friendship and traditional mores, you have someone that clashes with these heroes, by embodying traits of anger and vengeance, traits associated with the anti hero, without the usually grittiness or some mood of condemnation, and while this may be refreshing to me, it's also a bit disturbing. I think it's fine to be angry, but here's a guy who hurts his friends with his anger, and somehow this comes off as being very self righteous.


He is the protagonist, and he is filled with anger because he saw his mother get eaten in front of his eyes. It's closer to a seinen manga than it is a shonen manga.

He never hurt his friends, not intentionally, he wants to help them.

I don't know what you mean by self-righteous. While Eren is the protagonist, his role in the story is no bigger than Armin's, Levi's, Mikasa's, or really any of the other major characters. What Eren is, is a kid who has the will but not the talent, and that angers him. It takes him much more effort to accomplish what Mikasa can. He then gets a special power. It doesn't give him ultimate power, but rather it puts his usefulness to the community on par with that of like Levi for example. He still is weak with it when he is on his own, he can't solve every single problem. However when he has the support of Levi, Armin, Mikasa, Jean, etc... he can finally be useful. Before he was a pawn, this upgraded him to a knight.

The parts of the manga beyond the anime go further with the importance of working as a team.

I actually have respect for the author of AoT. He could have made Eren a complete powerhouse Kirito, Naruto, super savior. Instead he made him the representative of a type of kid that exists in droves, especially in Japan. A kid who wants to be special but can't excel at anything, who wants to have friends and be relied upon by those friends, but is just too clumsy. The dreams of those kids are usually that they can be good at something, at any one thing. Have some sort of talent, be gifted at something just so they can fit in. That something is represented by the titan power. It doesn't make Eren the best at everything, but it makes him irreplaceable, and that's what is important.

Also another reason why he is angry, is because Mikasa inadvertently patronizes him and it pisses him off. While to Mikasa, Eren is her beloved childhood friend / foster brother, to Eren, Mikasa is the older sibling that can do everything and you cannot compare to. He loves her like family, but he wants something that he can be good at of his own. Yet she just follows him around solving his problems for him. It makes him feel even more useless.
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Posted 2/15/16
You aren't the only one allowed to have honest opinions.
Posted 2/15/16
i still think SAO , Narushit and Gintamturd suck
Posted 2/15/16 , edited 2/15/16

xxJing wrote:


PeripheralVisionary wrote:

Attack on Titan, while I did like it, felt a bit too self righteous by casting Eren as the protaganist. I'm not sure how the shows want to go about developing his character. Is he an anti hero? Is he a protaganist? What is he? He's a very angry person, and that shows in his action. So angry in fact that he comes off as morally questionable that appeal to teen with morals that are less than typical of shonen heroes. Just as Naruto and Ichigo cater to the power fantasy of those wanting to emphasize friendship and traditional mores, you have someone that clashes with these heroes, by embodying traits of anger and vengeance, traits associated with the anti hero, without the usually grittiness or some mood of condemnation, and while this may be refreshing to me, it's also a bit disturbing. I think it's fine to be angry, but here's a guy who hurts his friends with his anger, and somehow this comes off as being very self righteous.


He is the protagonist, and he is filled with anger because he saw his mother get eaten in front of his eyes. It's closer to a seinen manga than it is a shonen manga.

He never hurt his friends, not intentionally, he wants to help them.

I don't know what you mean by self-righteous. While Eren is the protagonist, his role in the story is no bigger than Armin's, Levi's, Mikasa's, or really any of the other major characters. What Eren is, is a kid who has the will but not the talent, and that angers him. It takes him much more effort to accomplish what Mikasa can. He then gets a special power. It doesn't give him ultimate power, but rather it puts his usefulness to the community on par with that of like Levi for example. He still is weak with it when he is on his own, he can't solve every single problem. However when he has the support of Levi, Armin, Mikasa, Jean, etc... he can finally be useful. Before he was a pawn, this upgraded him to a knight.

The parts of the manga beyond the anime go further with the importance of working as a team.

I actually have respect for the author of AoT. He could have made Eren a complete powerhouse Kirito, Naruto, super savior. Instead he made him the representative of a type of kid that exists in droves, especially in Japan. A kid who wants to be special but can't excel at anything, who wants to have friends and be relied upon by those friends, but is just too clumsy. The dreams of those kids are usually that they can be good at something, at any one thing. Have some sort of talent, be gifted at something just so they can fit in. That something is represented by the titan power. It doesn't make Eren the best at everything, but it makes him irreplaceable, and that's what is important.

Also another reason why he is angry, is because Mikasa inadvertently patronizes him and it pisses him off. While to Mikasa, Eren is her beloved childhood friend / foster brother, to Eren, Mikasa is the older sibling that can do everything and you cannot compare to. He loves her like family, but he wants something that he can be good at of his own. Yet she just follows him around solving his problems for him. It makes him feel even more useless.

I understand why he's angry, but watching a 10 year old kill 2 men and goading Mikasa to do in the third before seeing his mother gets eaten makes me ridiculously uncomfortable. By presenting a situation so morally in favor of Eren is so offputting, compared to the moral complexities featured in the very same show, and it feels very angry to watch. If you're not caught up in wanting to see the 3 men get killed, you're just watching a kid, morally dogmatic in his opinion, ruthlessly kill 2 men for a transgression they're clearly guilty of. That was a character defining moment. Sure, would I have been angry too? Yes, but this was just a cathartic mass of unpleasantness I rather not watch. It felt juvenile in its attempts to define evil and the appropriate punishments, and it utterly lacked in the mercy one would expect from a shounen. It's more akin to "I Saw The Devil" Than Naruto, that's for sure. It's more akin to a self righteous torture porn, not that "ISTD" was, because it clearly knew it would be horrific, whereas AoT does not recognize this, instead turning it into a moral situation that, I don't know, glorifies violence? It's not like Mikasa wasn't justified in her actions, but Eren?
xxJing 
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Posted 2/15/16

PeripheralVisionary wrote:


xxJing wrote:


PeripheralVisionary wrote:

Attack on Titan, while I did like it, felt a bit too self righteous by casting Eren as the protaganist. I'm not sure how the shows want to go about developing his character. Is he an anti hero? Is he a protaganist? What is he? He's a very angry person, and that shows in his action. So angry in fact that he comes off as morally questionable that appeal to teen with morals that are less than typical of shonen heroes. Just as Naruto and Ichigo cater to the power fantasy of those wanting to emphasize friendship and traditional mores, you have someone that clashes with these heroes, by embodying traits of anger and vengeance, traits associated with the anti hero, without the usually grittiness or some mood of condemnation, and while this may be refreshing to me, it's also a bit disturbing. I think it's fine to be angry, but here's a guy who hurts his friends with his anger, and somehow this comes off as being very self righteous.


He is the protagonist, and he is filled with anger because he saw his mother get eaten in front of his eyes. It's closer to a seinen manga than it is a shonen manga.

He never hurt his friends, not intentionally, he wants to help them.

I don't know what you mean by self-righteous. While Eren is the protagonist, his role in the story is no bigger than Armin's, Levi's, Mikasa's, or really any of the other major characters. What Eren is, is a kid who has the will but not the talent, and that angers him. It takes him much more effort to accomplish what Mikasa can. He then gets a special power. It doesn't give him ultimate power, but rather it puts his usefulness to the community on par with that of like Levi for example. He still is weak with it when he is on his own, he can't solve every single problem. However when he has the support of Levi, Armin, Mikasa, Jean, etc... he can finally be useful. Before he was a pawn, this upgraded him to a knight.

The parts of the manga beyond the anime go further with the importance of working as a team.

I actually have respect for the author of AoT. He could have made Eren a complete powerhouse Kirito, Naruto, super savior. Instead he made him the representative of a type of kid that exists in droves, especially in Japan. A kid who wants to be special but can't excel at anything, who wants to have friends and be relied upon by those friends, but is just too clumsy. The dreams of those kids are usually that they can be good at something, at any one thing. Have some sort of talent, be gifted at something just so they can fit in. That something is represented by the titan power. It doesn't make Eren the best at everything, but it makes him irreplaceable, and that's what is important.

Also another reason why he is angry, is because Mikasa inadvertently patronizes him and it pisses him off. While to Mikasa, Eren is her beloved childhood friend / foster brother, to Eren, Mikasa is the older sibling that can do everything and you cannot compare to. He loves her like family, but he wants something that he can be good at of his own. Yet she just follows him around solving his problems for him. It makes him feel even more useless.

I understand why he's angry, but watching a 10 year old kill 2 men and goading Mikasa to do in the third before seeing his mother gets eaten makes me ridiculously uncomfortable. By presenting a situation so morally in favor of Eren is so offputting, compared to the moral complexities featured in the very same show, and it feels very angry to watch. If you're not caught up in wanting to see the 3 men get killed, you're just watching a kid, morally dogmatic in his opinion, ruthlessly kill 2 men for a transgression they're clearly guilty of. That was a character defining moment. Sure, would I have been angry too? Yes, but this was just a cathartic mass of unpleasantness I rather not watch. It felt juvenile in its attempts to define evil and the appropriate punishments, and it utterly lacked in the mercy one would expect from a shounen. It's more akin to "I Saw The Devil" Than Naruto, that's for sure. It's more akin to a self righteous torture porn, not that "ISTD" was, because it clearly knew it would be horrific, whereas AoT does not recognize this, instead turning it into a moral situation that, I don't know, glorifies violence? It's not like Mikasa wasn't justified in her actions, but Eren?


Ah. That part didn't bother me. I had thought of stabbing my dad multiple times when I was around that age. He was a violent alcoholic. I could actually relate a bit to that scene though.

I never did though. He died of cancer. I celebrated.

Maybe it's because of that, but I think of it this way. You are either somewhat morally tainted and alive, or you are a saint, but a dead, beaten, bitch. I don't value the purity of my soul at all, so that scene just seemed like common sense to me.
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Posted 2/15/16
^ . . . sure. Okay.

But yeah. Quality issues. More people need to recognize when they exist. That would be nice.
Posted 2/15/16 , edited 2/16/16

xxJing wrote:

Ah. That part didn't bother me. I had thought of stabbing my dad multiple times when I was around that age. He was a violent alcoholic. I could actually relate a bit to that scene though.

I never did though. He died of cancer. I celebrated.

Maybe it's because of that, but I think of it this way. You are either somewhat morally tainted and alive, or you are a saint, but a dead, beaten, bitch. I don't value the purity of my soul at all, so that scene just seemed like common sense to me.

I lean toward atheism for the most part. While I welcome dark subject matters in kids show, but watching someone deal out "justice" like candy just feels like an angry male empowerment fantasy. You see it in SAO too, where Kirito tortures Sughou for his crimes against Asuna, and while I could see why he's angry, it too felt sanctimonious by presenting a morally infallible character do a morally right act, and seeing as that act is UNNECESSARY torture, left me grossed out. Now I can handle gore, but putting such a situation in a kid show just felt wrong. I don't know why, but torture for the sake of causing pain doesn't feel at all like something that should be in a tween's show.
xxJing 
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Posted 2/15/16 , edited 2/16/16

PeripheralVisionary wrote:
I lean toward atheism for the most part. While I welcome dark subject matters in kids show, but watching someone deal out "justice" like candy just feels like an angry male empowerment fantasy. You see it in SAO too, where Kirito tortures Sughou for his crimes against Asuna, and while I could see why he's angry, it too felt sanctimonious by presenting a morally infallible character do a morally right act, and seeing as that act is UNNECESSARY torture, left me grossed out. Now I can handle gore, but putting such a situation in a kid show just felt wrong. I don't know why, but torture for the sake of causing pain doesn't feel at all like something that should be in a tween's show.


Eren didn't torture. He killed 3 guys who were going to sell a little girl into slavery or prostitution or whatever. Being a 10 year old kid, I doubt he had the ability to simply disable them. It was kill or be killed.

SAO wasn't meant for tweens the second it introduced the threat of rape and NTR through brainwashing as its primary antagonist.

If you want boy scout ethics, go watch Superman.

Posted 2/15/16 , edited 2/16/16

xxJing wrote:

Eren didn't torture. He killed 3 guys who were going to sell a little girl into slavery or prostitution or whatever. Being a 10 year old kid, I doubt he had the ability to simply disable them. It was kill or be killed.

SAO wasn't meant for tweens the second it introduced the threat of rape and NTR through brainwashing as its primary antagonist.

If you want boy scout ethics, go watch Superman.



But here's the thing I'm not too sure of. Couldn't he have alerted authorities or whatever? Seeing him dole out punishment like it was that easy just felt like a morally holier than thou power fantasy that says "Hey angry teens, you're completely justified". It shirks me greatly. This type of pandering doesn't get us to think like Berserk or Gantz, but instead masturbates to our own preconceptions of whats right and wrong without really assessing why such actions are morally reprehensible in a first place. Awarding the prize of thought behind it is juvenile, Surely anyone could take any action, dole out a bit of a reason, and then "justify" it. Instead of taking our emotions and running away with it, while excusing a protagonist , it should I don't know.....examine what's right and what's wrong? I'm not sure how it should be addressed. It just felt unpleasant, juvenile, and downright masturbatory.

And SAO is meant for Tweens. The minimum age requirement is 13, yet we both know that shows can aim lower or higher than what their age rating has said, no matter how duplicitous it may feel. In essence, it is more of a guideline advising parents to give them a general idea than a law we should follow verbatim.
xxJing 
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Posted 2/15/16 , edited 2/16/16

PeripheralVisionary wrote:

But here's the thing I'm not too sure of. Couldn't he have alerted authorities or whatever? Seeing him dole out punishment like it was that easy just felt like a morally holier than thou power fantasy that says "Hey angry teens, you're completely justified". It shirks me greatly. This type of pandering doesn't get us to think like Berserk or Gantz, but instead masturbates to our own preconceptions of whats right and wrong without really assessing why such actions are morally reprehensible in a first place. Awarding the prize of thought behind it is juvenile, Surely anyone could take any action, dole out a bit of a reason, and then "justify" it. Instead of taking our emotions and running away with it, while excusing a protagonist , it should I don't know.....examine what's right and what's wrong? I'm not sure how it should be addressed. It just felt unpleasant, juvenile, and downright masturbatory.

And SAO is meant for Tweens. The minimum age requirement is 13, yet we both know that shows can aim lower or higher than what their age rating has said, no matter how duplicitous it may feel. In essence, it is more of a guideline advising parents to give them a general idea than a law we should follow verbatim.


---

Alerting the authorities in that situation may have been the moral thing to do. It would have however had a much lower success rate considering their society, the fact that Mikasa was just kidnapped when Eren and his father arrived since her parents corpses were sprawled on the floor, and also the fact that Mikasa and her parents lived quite far away from town which is why they needed Eren's dad to visit them in the first place.

Also, it's a sad state of affairs when you think that having your mother devoured right in front of your eyes, your friends decapitated, and the general idea of rapists and slave traders is less offensive than the idea of a kid using extreme means to defend someone.

You can be a murderer or a rapist or whatever ya want when you grow up kid, but as long as you are a minor we need you to set a good example, no matter the consequences. Stories of child abuse keep the nation afraid and stable, we don't need no up and coming vigilantes giving people hope.
Posted 2/15/16 , edited 2/16/16

xxJing wrote:

---

Alerting the authorities in that situation may have been the moral thing to do. It would have however had a much lower success rate considering their society, the fact that Mikasa was just kidnapped when Eren and his father arrived since her parents corpses were sprawled on the floor, and also the fact that Mikasa and her parents lived quite far away from town which is why they needed Eren's dad to visit them in the first place.

Also, it's a sad state of affairs when you think that having your mother devoured right in front of your eyes, your friends decapitated, and the general idea of rapists and slave traders is less offensive than the idea of a kid using extreme means to defend someone.

You can be a murderer or a rapist or whatever ya want when you grow up kid, but as long as you are a minor we need you to set a good example, no matter the consequences. Stories of child abuse keep the nation afraid and stable, we don't need no up and coming vigilantes giving people hope.


So a ten year old taking on 3 grown men has a higher success rate than the police? Please don't talk down to me, I'm only trying to communicate feelings that I am certain I have yet cannot express. In other words, I only have a vague idea why this might perturb me. That is all.
xxJing 
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Posted 2/15/16 , edited 2/16/16

PeripheralVisionary wrote:

So a ten year old taking on 3 grown men has a higher success rate than the police? Please don't talk down to me, I'm only trying to communicate feelings that I am certain I have yet cannot express. In other words, I only have a vague idea why this might perturb me. That is all.


In that situation yes. He got the jump on them. It very distinctly depicted that they were stronger than him. It doesn't take much skill to stab somebody with a knife though when they are completely off guard. The last guy quickly detained Eren, Mikasa then picked up a knife and stabbed him while he was off guard by focusing on Eren.

If a 10 year old walked toward you with a knife you would probably be completely unsuspecting also, given that you haven't experienced something like that before.

On the other hand, if they went to the police considering how far it would be, the guys would have gotten away, sold Mikasa, and vanished into the wind. The police of that world would also probably dismiss the case as pointless since she was an orphan now anyway.

The small chance that Eren found her was really her only path to salvation.
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Posted 2/15/16
Tsk tsk people talking about "xx anime sucks" just remember these wise words before you post:

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