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Religion vs Science
Posted 7/8/07
This thread is too intelligent for me.

*sulks in corner*
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29 / M / Home of SeaBiscuit
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Posted 7/8/07

SeraphAlford wrote:


happyxix wrote:

I'm directing this to SeraphAlford cause I don't wanna quote that long thing.

97% that Jesus came back to life? Its either he did or he didn't. Its like like 97% of Jesus came back to life like he is missing like a hand or a ear or something. I can pull random percentage outta no where too. Like 10% of monkeys knows Icelandic.

The point is no other major physicists or chemist agrees with that random statement. No math can even PROOVE that something is alive or dead. Unless that 97% is saying "outta 100 books 97 says jesus has been reborned and 3 said that he haven't"

The integral from bread to wine of 0 dx = jesus? I think not.


This is what we call ignorance.

It’s a mathematically proven fact, rather you like it or not.


No its a religious fanatic's idea. Show the proof and the variables. I'm mainly interesting how they will work together.

1 + 1 = window

Thats proven to be correct too. But does it make it right? No
Its not as much ignorance as believing something that is not proven and AGREED by majority of the science community.

And azrael910 basically said what I want to say except 10000x better =]
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30 / M / North Carolina
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Posted 7/8/07

First off there are many aspects of science that are completely theory and not at all fact. Yet, because we attach the word science, it must be true. Take for example the scientific explanation for the Big Bang. Personal I find it utterly absurd to think that a clash of matter and matter destroying antimatter could produce matter, as the science theorizes. Antimatter is a theoretical substance that in my opinion does not exist. But, it’s still science; moreover, look at evolution. Evolution is in fact a real thing. However, evolution as the source of life is a theory. A scientific theory, but one none the less. Thus the science of evolution being the creation of life revolves around beliefs and speculations that CANNOT be proven.

This being said I do believe that there is absolutely no proof for religion. It requires a slight deal of blind faith, no matter how you look at it. The problem is people these days frown upon such things as blind faith. Now me, I converted to Christianity when I felt I had experienced things that could only be explained through religion and not science.

Next, The book I mentioned was written by Paul Davie. You should read it. It’s not at all what you have in mind. You should also read The Theory of Everything.

As far as the moral thing goes that’s a stupid and ignorant statement in my opinion. Utter crap according to you, but other people may disagree. This is what I was talking about with my atheist statement. Some atheists are highly understanding and intellectual, but others simply lash out and attack things they disagree with. It’s the equivalent of America trying to tear down communism. Just because your personal morals clash with those preached in various faiths does not mean the latter set are crap.

See, in order to be anything other than an ignorant moron you NEED to know that your morals may not be right. Who’s to say what’s right and wrong except a deity? In order for someone to set law there must be someone higher than the ones that are being subjected to the law. This goes for right and wrong as well. If there is no God then frankly there is no difference between right and wrong because nothing has any real meaning. This is, of course, my opinion.


Care to explain that "time" where you experienced something that cannot be proven by your knowledge of science? I bet someone could explain it for you.
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31 / M / manila
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Posted 7/8/07
>.> just how many people are going to compare religion and science?

~just bumped in..
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Posted 7/8/07
bruv! i won this discussion on msn the other day!!
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37 / F / Fort Meade, MD
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Posted 7/8/07

Senta wrote:

This thread is too intelligent for me.

*sulks in corner*


LOL
I would never seek to compare the two since they both give the world things it needs...
However, each of those things are completely separate.
Again... religion - gives the world a basis of how to act, hell even the constitution is based loosly on the bible. - It's a good way to live.. basically be a good person.

Does science really give us codes to live by?
NO.
Does anywhere in science explain what you should do with your life?
NO..
So therefore, the two can not and SHOULD not be compared.
They both give different things to the world.
They are both needed in the world.

Religion gives someone something to believe in, something to strive for
So does science.
In that way, science and religion go together, but that's pretty much the only way.
Trying to compare beliefs and facts is rediculous!

I don't have any fancy links to back up any of my claims, but this is just my opinion, based on what i've seen in life, i've seen what a prison missionary does. I've seen what people who live in literal anarchy is like.

Now, philosophers can completely prove using reason as a way that lack of God's existance. But for some people to believe in God's will is enough for them.
You don't need to try to get someone to believe your side of the argument just because you think you're right!
WHO KNOWS WHO"S RIGHT!
no one will no for sure, until we die.


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32 / M / call boy
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Posted 7/8/07
religion and science are both the same..
both being believed in.. both being worshiped..
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28 / 横浜市
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Posted 7/8/07
@Azrael - I'll pick and choose as I go, there is a bit much to quote so try and stay with me. Your overall contention that religion being an outdated tool to deal with an impossibly complex universe is one that I share, but I feel compelled to question some points you made that I are slightly contradictory.

You mentioned that scientific theory was unbiased, but I feel that this is not exactly true. Scientific method assumes that there is an logical and scientific explanation to explain a phenomenon. A moot point, but still valid.

After a second look over your material, everything else is pretty airtight, and really my only object is contradictory in nature. Like I said I agree with your contention, and it's very well argued.

It was me who quoted Einstein, and I didn't really expect to be tripped up over that (so kudos to you).
Posted 7/8/07

johnnski wrote:

religion and science are both the same..
both being believed in.. both being worshiped..


science is not worshipped. That word implies unquestioning belief, which is exactly the opposite of what science is.
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Posted 7/8/07

Trivium wrote:


johnnski wrote:

religion and science are both the same..
both being believed in.. both being worshiped..


science is not worshipped. That word implies unquestioning belief, which is exactly the opposite of what science is.


Game, set and match to Trivium (at least on this point). Science strives to constantly revalute theories based upon new or conflicting evidence. Religon constitues not asking any questions and having 'faith'.
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37 / F / Fort Meade, MD
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Posted 7/8/07
Main Entry: 1wor·ship
Pronunciation: 'w&r-sh&p also 'wor-
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English worshipe worthiness, respect, reverence paid to a divine being, from Old English weorthscipe worthiness, respect, from weorth worthy, worth + -scipe -ship
1 chiefly British : a person of importance -- used as a title for various officials (as magistrates and some mayors)
2 : reverence offered a divine being or supernatural power; also : an act of expressing such reverence
3 : a form of religious practice with its creed and ritual
4 : extravagant respect or admiration for or devotion to an object of esteem <worship of the dollar>



now what were you saying about the word worship?
Posted 7/8/07
Science ftw
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32 / M / Iloilo City, PH
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Posted 7/8/07
for the record religion didn't create this happy haven, we all know as the internet...

i'm all for science...
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35 / M / 中国
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Posted 7/8/07

Dusterbayala wrote:
LOL
I would never seek to compare the two since they both give the world things it needs...
However, each of those things are completely separate.
Again... religion - gives the world a basis of how to act, hell even the constitution is based loosly on the bible. - It's a good way to live.. basically be a good person.

Does science really give us codes to live by?
NO.
Does anywhere in science explain what you should do with your life?
NO..
So therefore, the two can not and SHOULD not be compared.
They both give different things to the world.
They are both needed in the world.


I addressed this in my original post:


But how can one have moral grounding without religion? The bottom line is we all rely on each other to survive. Strength in numbers. Virtually every religion involves a moral code that allow for proper communal living. By having a proper code of ethics we can not only function as a society, but also thrive and progress. Religion isn't necessary for that. One shouldn't require the threat of hellfire and damnation held over them to keep them peaceable with others.


Furthermore, the need for something doesn't necessarily make it so. If I'm dying of thirst in the desert, I need water to survive. But that doesn't necessarily mean water will manifest itself just because I am in need of it. The fact of the matter is that there is no water and I will die.

Also, science is more concerned with the how, not the why if you will. That is the realm of philosophy. I think you can learn a lot about the why of things by observing the world around you.

You can look at the behavior of animal groups to see the benefits of communal living. They don't seem to go to sunday school and they've figured it out for the most part. Why is that we need religion to demonstrate to us it's easier to get through life if we all just get along? If anything, religion has introduced conflict rather than peacefull living.


orangemaen wrote:

You mentioned that scientific theory was unbiased, but I feel that this is not exactly true. Scientific method assumes that there is an logical and scientific explanation to explain a phenomenon. A moot point, but still valid.



I think science makes this assumption since there has never been any real hard credible evidence for the supernatural aspects of religion. If there were, then it would be entered into falsfiability (sp?) as a possibility. Being as that it's never been demonstrated - not once ever in the history of all organized religion - I think it's fair to dismiss it. If it is ever demonstrated, then it will be time to reevaluate.
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26 / F / I live in england...
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Posted 7/8/07
i dont really care........sigh life is so damn boring.............
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