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Post Reply Florida teacher's 'privilege' form outrages parents
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Posted 4/10/16
This just goes to show that we need to replace K-12 teachers with robots.
Posted 4/10/16
A teacher has no need to know any of this. This is simply busywork gone wrong.
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Posted 4/10/16 , edited 4/11/16

lambofgenesis wrote:


Bakaneer wrote:

Talk about going totally overboard with this. Kids don't even know themselves at that age, much less understand these adult themes and other sexual stuff. I get that the message about inequality and raising awareness to all of those crazy things that go on in society, but this is just not the right the way to approach it.


I mean, I'm not in 7th or 8th grade and I don't know what cisgendered is. It's a fucking tumblr troll term and this teacher obviously is like 18 and immature and a huge internet tumblr activist. Glad she learned what happens when you bring your online trolling to your irl job.


First of all it's basically impossible to get a teaching job at 18. And cisgendered is just the opposite of transgendered. The context of the question is enough to get that. Also havn't you heard the tumbler phrase "straight cisgendered male"? Again it's not hard to guest if you hear it in a sentence. Sorry you put it literally no effort. Also yes she's a troll, because there's no way she actually maybe believes this. But yes spanish class isn't the right one for this.
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Posted 4/10/16 , edited 4/10/16

104 wrote:


lambofgenesis wrote:


Bakaneer wrote:

Talk about going totally overboard with this. Kids don't even know themselves at that age, much less understand these adult themes and other sexual stuff. I get that the message about inequality and raising awareness to all of those crazy things that go on in society, but this is just not the right the way to approach it.


I mean, I'm not in 7th or 8th grade and I don't know what cisgendered is. It's a fucking tumblr troll term and this teacher obviously is like 18 and immature and a huge internet tumblr activist. Glad she learned what happens when you bring your online trolling to your irl job.


First of all it's basically impossible to get a teaching job at 18. And cisgendered is just the opposite of transgendered. The context of the question is enough to get that. Also havn't you heard the tumbler phrase "straight cisgendered male"? Again it's not hard to guest if you hear it in a sentence. Sorry you put it literally no effort. Also yes she's a troll, because there's no way she actually maybe believes this. But yes spanish class isn't the right one for this.


I don't frequent tumblr, but I guess you do. You also seem to advocate 7th and 8th graders being exposed to vague sexual terminology that isn't even official (so sex slang ) and have them use their (maybe still child-like minds) to contextually figure out terms they didn't even know existed. Yet another reason to hate tumblrs. Nevermind, cisgendered is actually a sociology term. But the point still stands -- 8th graders really?

Also for substitute teacher or aide positions/internships, you can get teacher positions at 18 (freshman summer of college )

and ofc it's trolling. I can believe and argue about alien-gendered humans whose souls are reotillian/sirian/andromedan all I want. That doesn't mean it's not troll. I can then ask 8th graders if they associate with it sexually. Is it trolling?
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Posted 4/10/16 , edited 4/11/16
Are you transgendered, agendered, or cisgendered. It's pretty straight forward if you know what the first word is. A good chunk of the words you know you learned from context. Please don't insult 12 yearolds. One means people who identify as the opposite of their assigned gender. The second just by the spelling means people who don't have one. What else is cisgendered suppose to mean then?

I'd assumed that kind of talk was why you don't spend much time there.

"(so sex slang )" This is arguing in bad faith. It's like criticizing someone for support Martin Luther King Jr., because he was a criminal. You're using connotations of the word that clearly don't apply here. Also THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!! I've know about sex since I was 8. I knew words a person would actually think of upon hearing "sex slang", when I was still younger than than this kids. And surprisingly, this did not set my poor baby brain on fire, or turn me into a sex addict.
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Posted 4/10/16 , edited 4/10/16

Jean104 wrote:

Ait's are transgendered, agendered, or cicredibility likeince etty straight forward if you know what the first word is. A good chunk of the words you know you learned from context. Please don't insult 12 yearolds. One means people who identify as the opposite of their assigned gender. The second just by the spelling means people who don't have one. What else is cisgendered suppose to mean then?

I'd assumed that kind of talk was why you don't spend much time there.

"(so sex slang )" This is arguing in bad faith. It's like criticizing someone for support Martin Luther King Jr., because he was a criminal. You're using connotations of the word that clearly don't apply here. Also THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!! I've know about sex since I was 8. I knew words a person would actually think of upon hearing "sex slang", when I was still younger than than this kids. And surprisingly, this did not set my poor baby brain on fire, or turn me into a sex addict.


I believe her form actually asked are you cisgendered, genderqueer, or x ( forgot x), so no it isn't an easy context, and it's not whether they can figure it out, it's about how they shouldn't be corrupted especially since they only begin to teach you about sex in those grades.

And cool that you were exposed to lewd things at 8, I guess. I'm glad most of the world's education systems aren't promoting that as can be seen from this outcome. But I guess you feel bad about that...?

And it's sex slang in the same way they don't teach 12 year olds what a sex change is. It's something for high school.

And no I don't currently do tumblr due to the trolling. I don't like being trolled, but do love trolling. Tumblr isn't fun trolling anyway as it involves using vague terminology to somehow increase your credibility, and walls of text. Reading and writing pseudo-esoteric pages just to troll is too much work. magisoka is good at it though as we've all seen that kind of trolling isn't my thing
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Posted 4/10/16
The manner of the subjects' presentation was hamfisted and inappropriate, that's certainly true. Spanish language classes are not the proper context for such discussions, and the teacher certainly shouldn't have revealed that there were students in the class with ADHD even if they weren't specifically named in the process and returning the form was voluntary. That was entirely unnecessary and unprofessional.

With all of that in mind, twelve years is plenty old enough to begin to be taught about concepts like gender identification and sexual orientation, and there is no doubt in my mind whatsoever that schools have a critical role to play in providing children with education about these topics. But if schools are going to teach about these things as I think they should I will have certain professional standards I will expect to be upheld. The subjects should be integrated into relevant coursework, and students' personal information should be respected and solicited only inasmuch as is necessary and allowable.
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Posted 4/10/16
I feel like what a lot of people are missing here, is that there is a big difference between teaching people about gender identity in a context of sexual education and in a context of "privilege". I don't think the issue most people have with this is that the teacher was discussing sexual identity (although as you stated, its not a conversation for spanish class), the problem is that they are trying to teach it in the context of privilege which is extremely ideological in nature.
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Posted 4/10/16

BlueOni wrote:

The manner of the subagreepresentation was hamfisted and inappropriatshould at certainly true. Spanish language classes are not the proper context for such discussions, and the teacher certainly shouldn't have revealed that there were students in the class with ADHD even if they weren't specifically named in the process and returning the form was voluntary. That was entirely unnecessary and unprofessional.

With all of that in mind, twelve years is plenty old enough to begin to be taught about concepts like gender identification and sexual orientation, and there is no doubt in my mind whatsoever that schools have a critical role to play in providing children with education about these topics. But if schools are going to teach about these things as I think they should I will have certain professional standards I will expect to be upheld. The subjects should be integrated into relevant coursework, and students' personal information should be respected and solicited only inasmuch as is necessary and allowable.


Teaching about Homosexuality is iffy @12 since they're literally just learning about sex, with some kids not even having sexual thoughts or urges yet.

Transgender and sex changes arguably don't need to be taught at all since sex change operations aren't medically advisable during teen years.So it's not like they'll have Trans peers. But i agree, for tolerance purposes and awareness, it should be taught sometime in high school.
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Posted 4/10/16 , edited 4/11/16

lambofgenesis wrote:


Jean104 wrote:

Ait's are transgendered, agendered, or cicredibility likeince etty straight forward if you know what the first word is. A good chunk of the words you know you learned from context. Please don't insult 12 yearolds. One means people who identify as the opposite of their assigned gender. The second just by the spelling means people who don't have one. What else is cisgendered suppose to mean then?

I'd assumed that kind of talk was why you don't spend much time there.

"(so sex slang )" This is arguing in bad faith. It's like criticizing someone for support Martin Luther King Jr., because he was a criminal. You're using connotations of the word that clearly don't apply here. Also THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!! I've know about sex since I was 8. I knew words a person would actually think of upon hearing "sex slang", when I was still younger than than this kids. And surprisingly, this did not set my poor baby brain on fire, or turn me into a sex addict.


I believe her form actually asked are you cisgendered, genderqueer, or x ( forgot x), so no it isn't an easy context, and it's not whether they can figure it out, it's about how they shouldn't be corrupted especially since they only begin to teach you about sex in those grades.

And cool that you were exposed to lewd things at 8, I guess. I'm glad most of the world's education systems aren't promoting that as can be seen from this outcome. But I guess you feel bad about that...?

And it's sex slang in the same way they don't teach 12 year olds what a sex change is. It's something for high school.

And no I don't currently do tumblr due to the trolling. I don't like being trolled, but do love trolling. Tumblr isn't fun trolling anyway as it involves using vague terminology to somehow increase your credibility, and walls of text. Reading and writing pseudo-esoteric pages just to troll is too much work. magisoka is good at it though as we've all seen that kind of trolling isn't my thing


Nice, but seriously, what's even suppose happen when you explain sex stuff to kids? I mean death seems like way more of a touchy subject. How long should we wait to tell them about that? Also yep anyone who disagrees with you is trolling. There's definitely no way they actually disagree. As for the context either normal isn't on the list or it's "cisgendered".








At the post above this one: You can get pretty far without even mentioning sex. "So, you know how guys like girls and girls like guys and sometimes they even get married and start a family? Well some guys feel that way towards other guys. [...]" And then you talk about homophobia and how gay people are fighting for their rights. Or for that matter if the kid already knows about sex, just add that gay people found workarounds and were anatomy allows straight people sometime do it that way too.
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Posted 4/10/16 , edited 4/10/16

lambofgenesis wrote:

Teaching about Homosexuality is iffy @12 since they're literally just learning about sex, with some kids not even having sexual thoughts or urges yet.


Not teaching them about homosexuality puts them at risk of falling prey to misinformation just the same as not teaching them about sex at all. Same-sex partnerships are a significant part of human sexuality that they will undoubtedly one day encounter if they haven't already, so I'm not sure I see why the subject should be excluded from the lessons.


Transgender and sex changes arguably don't need to be taught at all since sex change operations aren't medically advisable during teen years.So it's not like they'll have Trans peers. But i agree, for tolerance purposes and awareness, it should be taught sometime in high school.


Well, the tricky part is that they do have transgender peers even before then. Professional standards call for sex reassignment surgery to be performed at the age of majority after having undergone a long series of interventions beforehand, true. But social and psychological interventions can begin at the primary level (about 6-11), and pharmacological interventions can begin just before or right at the start of the secondary level (about 11-12). It's to the benefit of everyone involved, including transgender students, their peers, and even the faculty and staff charged with their education and care that good information is available as these things are happening.

Mind you, that information would be set to a level the students could reasonably understand and at a time when they were actually confronting something. In primary school introduction to gender identity and transgender people as a concept should suffice. The details about pharmacological, psychological, and surgical interventions would be better reserved for the last year of primary school or at some point early in secondary education, because that's when concerns like puberty become more concrete and immediately relevant to their lives.


sundin13 wrote:

I feel like what a lot of people are missing here, is that there is a big difference between teaching people about gender identity in a context of sexual education and in a context of "privilege". I don't think the issue most people have with this is that the teacher was discussing sexual identity (although as you stated, its not a conversation for spanish class), the problem is that they are trying to teach it in the context of privilege which is extremely ideological in nature.


That didn't escape me, and I certainly agree, but I narrowed my focus to one parent's commentary about whether some subjects (presumably sexual orientation and gender identity) are more properly taught in schools at all or not.
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Posted 4/10/16

sundin13 wrote:


megahobbit wrote:


sundin13 wrote:

Hooray for the indoctrination of children into warped ideologies!


wut. I mean sure some of this is pretty cavalier (as someone with ADD I think that pretending its a meaningful disability is stupid). But for the most part this seems to be parents getting freaked out over nothing.

Also if these kids are twelve im pretty sure its safe for them to know about trans and the whole LGBT spectrum. I think its best to raise your kids as accepting early.


Its not about knowing about LGBT people, it is about how the idea of "privilege" in this context is extremely ideological, and even if you agree with the ideology, it isn't something that should be taught in schools (at least as anything concrete). I don't care what teachers believe, but keep your ideologies out of schools.


I would disagree. I personally think teaching the concept of privilege has always been done in schools. I was certainly taught about it growing up in regards to race and racism (full disclosure I was in a private catholic school not a public one) I think LGBT is the next step. It has been taught in schools.

Though the fact the teacher put ADHD down as a meaningful thing is still dumb.
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Posted 4/10/16

lambofgenesis wrote:

Transgender and sex changes arguably don't need to be taught at all since sex change operations aren't medically advisable during teen years.So it's not like they'll have Trans peers. But i agree, for tolerance purposes and awareness, it should be taught sometime in high school.


This logic honestly baffles me on so many levels. The idea of something simply being taught to a kid and they will instantly imitate it is like PMRC levels of dumb.

Secondly most people who are trans generally start realizing this during puberty which is 5,6,7,8 grade.
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Posted 4/10/16 , edited 4/12/16

megahobbit wrote:
I would disagree. I personally think teaching the concept of privilege has always been done in schools. I was certainly taught about it growing up in regards to race and racism (full disclosure I was in a private catholic school not a public one) I think LGBT is the next step. It has been taught in schools.

Though the fact the teacher put ADHD down as a meaningful thing is still dumb.


The concept of privilege is kinda bullshit as it puts much more stock on how you were born than on who you are as a person and extrapolates out using all manner of assumptions to imply life experiences. I have always been a follower of the "judge a person by the content of their character, not how they were born" school of thought, and things like this just seem regressive in nature. Yes, have discussions about race, but have those discussion in a way which speak towards individualism, not collectivization. Also, telling people that they are oppressed just serves to give people a victim complex and see oppression where it doesn't exist.
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Posted 4/10/16 , edited 4/10/16

megahobbit wrote:


lambofgenesis wrote:

Transgender and sex changes arguably don't need to be taught at all since sex change operations aren't medically advisable during teen years.So it's not like they'll have Trans peers. But i agree, for tolerance purposes and awareness, it should be taught sometime in high school.


This logic honestly baffles me on so many levels. The idea of something simply being taught to a kid and they will instantly imitate it is like PMRC levels of dumb.

Secondly most people who are trans generally start realizing this during puberty which is 5,6,7,8 grade.


Your reading comprehension baffles me... or not... I guess catholic schools still teach us to read what we want into everything. Ineither explicitly stated nor implied dangers of imitation. I was referring to them having to interact with trans peers in school, which again is unlikely since it's not a recommended surgery at school ages.

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