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Post Reply Why, Instead Of Attempting To Argue Your Beliefs, Do You Remain Content in Ignoring Posts On The Assumption That You're
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Posted 5/27/16 , edited 5/27/16

Jan- wrote:Well i wouldn't go as far as saying muslims being evil.


And....ANOTHER thread turns Muslim!

Let's keep a running count, just to be sure.
(And we're not going to ban Muslim-steered threads, it's just more of a guideline we're planning to put in place...)
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Posted 5/27/16

Ejanss wrote:


Jan- wrote:Well i wouldn't go as far as saying muslims being evil.


And....ANOTHER thread turns Muslim!

Let's keep a running count, just to be sure.
(And we're not going to ban Muslim-steered threads, it's just more of a guideline we're planning to put in place...)


and another person jumps the gun and accuses anyone that doesn't speak positively of muslims as being a muslim-phobe. So how's that bigotry working out for you?
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Posted 5/27/16 , edited 5/27/16

Rujikin wrote:


Ejanss wrote:


Jan- wrote:Well i wouldn't go as far as saying muslims being evil.


And....ANOTHER thread turns Muslim!

Let's keep a running count, just to be sure.
(And we're not going to ban Muslim-steered threads, it's just more of a guideline we're planning to put in place...)


and another person jumps the gun and accuses anyone that doesn't speak positively of muslims as being a muslim-phobe. So how's that bigotry working out for you?


I take it you were being ironic about the thread-hijack joke. It's hard to tell, from a Cool Spot with a flamethrower.
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Posted 5/27/16

PrinceJudar wrote:



So just to check I'm understanding you properly, you are saying not to just memorize, but to understand it on a level that you can implement it yourself? Paraphrasing versus copy + paste, essentially?



I would agree with you that one does not entirely understand what he reads until he can explain it in his own words. That does not mean to neglect evidence and study, however. They add evidence to one's own argument.


You are close, but I would say close enough for the purpose of understanding. What we have learned we must take for our own use, but we must never repeat it. Only from this knowledge must we create our own words.

To neglect the studies one has layed out for us is what you still can't grasp, again I cannot change your answer, because you see the world as it is in reality, logic that cannot be changed. We learn how our mistakes shape our world, how perusing the quest for logic will ultimately be the final answer. You cannot control what we have done, so how can we control what we will begin to do? Only through logic?

I do not contest that evidence and study provides a valid argument, but there is soo much more we can answer with our own words. For now you seem to get the idea.
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Posted 5/27/16

Humms wrote:

You are close, but I would say close enough for the purpose of understanding. What we have learned we must take for our own use, but we must never repeat it. Only from this knowledge must we create our own words.

To neglect the studies one has layed out for us is what you still can't grasp, again I cannot change your answer, because you see the world as it is in reality, logic that cannot be changed. We learn how our mistakes shape our world, how perusing the quest for logic will ultimately be the final answer. You cannot control what we have done, so how can we control what we will begin to do? Only through logic?

I do not contest that evidence and study provides a valid argument, but there is soo much more we can answer with our own words. For now you seem to get the idea.

There is a creativity existent in the rational world as well. It is not what a mind thinks, but how it thinks--no? Is that not why we have the compliment of a beautiful mind? In science we search for truth while knowing that universal truth is beyond the grasp of humankind. Humans are not purely logical minds and we cannot forgo that aspect of ourselves. Logic, however, is a tool for retaining fundamentals in an argument, both consistent and sound. In an argument it is reason that triumphs, because it is more probable to be closer to truth. Certainly there are other means of stumbling upon such by other facets, but they more accidental. By no means does the irrational convey certainty rather than probability that may or may not be fulfilled in actuality.

I do not see the world as such. This may not be objective reality--for example--this could be just a Brain in a Vat. I should also mention that while you may uphold the individual, rightly so, that we should not overlook the value we all gain by merely being a part of humanity. Nearly all items you use had once been the idea of another. Language as well. There is little we can rightfully say that is entirely of our own making.

I agree there is much that need be said on our own, to convey our understanding and to contribute. I also agree that I do not understand what you mean when you say an answer should be found outside of reason and dismissive of data.

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Posted 5/27/16

WeeabooWarrior wrote:

Don't Assume anything in science is valid.

Not to long ago, we had a chemist literally break the laws of chemistry!

https://www.newscientist.com/round-up/impossible-chemistry/

The APA claims that Homosexuality isn't a mental illness (I don't think it is, although I do think mental illness can arise, at higher rates due to the habit of homosexuality), but this doesn't change the fact that nearly 2/3's of the entire field of Psychology could be dismissed as it can't be reproduced.

http://www.nature.com/news/over-half-of-psychology-studies-fail-reproducibility-test-1.18248

Arguing overwhelming evidence in quantity is just a red hearing if the central point can't be changed.



Ah, I see. So this means psychology really is nothing more than theories? Okay.
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Posted 5/27/16

PrinceJudar wrote:


Humms wrote:

You are close, but I would say close enough for the purpose of understanding. What we have learned we must take for our own use, but we must never repeat it. Only from this knowledge must we create our own words.

To neglect the studies one has layed out for us is what you still can't grasp, again I cannot change your answer, because you see the world as it is in reality, logic that cannot be changed. We learn how our mistakes shape our world, how perusing the quest for logic will ultimately be the final answer. You cannot control what we have done, so how can we control what we will begin to do? Only through logic?

I do not contest that evidence and study provides a valid argument, but there is soo much more we can answer with our own words. For now you seem to get the idea.

There is a creativity existent in the rational world as well. It is not what a mind thinks, but how it thinks--no? Is that not why we have the compliment of a beautiful mind? In science we search for truth while knowing that universal truth is beyond the grasp of humankind. Humans are not purely logical minds and we cannot forgo that aspect of ourselves. Logic, however, is a tool for retaining fundamentals in an argument, both consistent and sound. In an argument it is reason that triumphs, because it is more probable to be closer to truth. Certainly there are other means of stumbling upon such by other facets, but they more accidental. By no means does the irrational convey certainty rather than probability that may or may not be fulfilled in actuality.

I do not see the world as such. This may not be objective reality--for example--this could be just a Brain in a Vat. I should also mention that while you may uphold the individual, rightly so, that we should not overlook the value we all gain by merely being a part of humanity. Nearly all items you use had once been the idea of another. Language as well. There is little we can rightfully say that is entirely of our own making.

I agree there is much that need be said on our own, to convey our understanding and to contribute. I also agree that I do not understand what you mean when you say an answer should be found outside of reason and dismissive of data.



Of course, that is what being human is all about. There are people who love to discuss about many things, both logical and creative, reality and fictional, whatever tRuth people want to find; let them find it through any method they choose . The beauty about being human is that what we love to do makes us happy, and I do not step on people's necks for doing so as long as their words are true to themselves. Logic in our world is very important, and so is the creative mind.

Humanity would ultimately agree on how to communicate with eachother, regardless who created our first words, we accept them as a means of reaching out to others, to take from our mind what we are really feeling and thinking.. no matter what we could possibly do to the way we communicate there will alwas be a constant for it, we would ultimately agree on the way our thoughts reach out to people, just like I am typing this message . Of course any idea we have is ultimately not our own, but it is how we create that idea. No dream is ever the same, we envision our own truth from the knowledge we connect with. We move boulders with our ideas just like we move people. It isn't what we create, it is how we create it, an idea can be used by many, but it is how we go about creating it, what we can express to others, how we capture our own moment.

I didn't expect you to understand, I wanted you to try. Something that many people will never do If we are always given the answer we will never learn to find the truth ourselves.





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Posted 5/27/16


Just weird they come form unsafe, un free shit holes to our so much nicer and safer and "free" nations yet bring their problems with them and want to change their new home to be like their old one.
Rather than enjoy and embrace their new home and freedom they want to make it shit like the place that they supposedly ran from?


Well thing is people aren't necessarily too smart about these kinds of things. Another thing to note is most new guys jsut left their old homeland.Culture isn't something that goes away overnight.
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Posted 5/27/16 , edited 5/27/16

PeripheralVisionary wrote:

Ah, I see. So this means psychology really is nothing more than theories? Okay.


Think of it this way, what studies are popularized in social media? What studies make for gorgeous and bold headlines?

Psychology has it the worst. By far.

However, other fields are not perfect either:

http://www.nature.com/news/1-500-scientists-lift-the-lid-on-reproducibility-1.19970




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Posted 5/27/16

PrinceJudar wrote:


PeripheralVisionary wrote:

Ah, I see. So this means psychology really is nothing more than theories? Okay.


Think of it this way, what studies are popularized in social media? What studies make for gorgeous and bold headlines?

Psychology has it the worst. By far.

However, other fields are not perfect either:

http://www.nature.com/news/1-500-scientists-lift-the-lid-on-reproducibility-1.19970






Makes sense, considering shows like Dr.Phil, Celebrity Rehab, are quite popular.
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Posted 5/27/16


well..i thought this was forum and i just answered someones post.Most of time i see monologue after monologue.Somebody says one thing but no one really responds to what one posts. Just shard my two cents about the subject the original poster posted which happened to be muslim related issue.
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Posted 5/27/16

PeripheralVisionary
TL;DR: The problem is merely this. People are refusing change in the face of OVERWHELMING evidence, that they don't go out of their way to view, nor read them when presented with them. They are, however, fine with debating certain other people....who have the strange relation of appearing to be novices. The problem I feel is that they are refusing to challenge their view.


Possible reasons:

1) They didn't read your post

2) They didn't understand your post

3) They didn't read the source you linked
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Posted 5/27/16
Mostly it isn't about attempting to convince the peeps one is debating with.


There are some people who are so entrenched in their ignorance and self-righteousness on this forum that they attempt to ban others simply for posting scientifically verified truths, and the direct claims of others. Coincidentally, there happens to be one half of the political spectrum that literally believes disagreement is harassment. That facts can oppress. These same individuals who attempt to ban others will explicitly use this language of "harassment" and "oppression" when they are unable to argue against fact and logic.


There's no convincing people like that.


Rather, it is about convincing people who are undecided or who are willing to change their positions when relevant facts or arguments are presented.


Posted 5/27/16

PrinceJudar wrote:


WeeabooWarrior wrote:

I was actually thinking about "love", how it's sweet and sour at the same time.

You know us Feeler types aren't interested in Quantum displacement! The idea that an atom could be in two places at once which would make inter-galactic communication possible is irrelevant if I can't see my loved ones in person! >:(


To be fair, there is a theory that quantum physics explains irrational human behavior. So it actually would apply to touchy-feely things like love.



Love can be explained with quantum probabilistic models, as other human behavior seems to be interpreted much like a Schrodinger's Cat.

All just theory, but it suits better than classical probability models.



How do they define love? How exactly do they use the models or what do they use it for? It sounds like highly sophisticated game theory.
Posted 5/27/16

PeripheralVisionary wrote:


WeeabooWarrior wrote:

Don't Assume anything in science is valid.

Not to long ago, we had a chemist literally break the laws of chemistry!

https://www.newscientist.com/round-up/impossible-chemistry/

The APA claims that Homosexuality isn't a mental illness (I don't think it is, although I do think mental illness can arise, at higher rates due to the habit of homosexuality), but this doesn't change the fact that nearly 2/3's of the entire field of Psychology could be dismissed as it can't be reproduced.

http://www.nature.com/news/over-half-of-psychology-studies-fail-reproducibility-test-1.18248

Arguing overwhelming evidence in quantity is just a red hearing if the central point can't be changed.



Ah, I see. So this means psychology really is nothing more than theories? Okay.


I'm saying, due to the fact that most Psychological research can't be reproduced, we should be highly skeptical of any bold claim made within the field. IF we applied the same scrutiny to let's say, Theoretical Physics, most of the field would be tossed out, without question.
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