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Posted 6/23/16

KnightOfZero1991 wrote:

As far as D.Va is concerned, the team is still exploring what to do with the hero. Right now they are looking at her damage output and survivability.

“There’s a couple of directions we could take her and it’s still unclear which direction we’ll go,” said Kaplan. “Obviously her damage has come into question from a lot of people. You have to be really close to do effective damage with D. Va and we might look at that. We might also look at her survivability.

Well next time Im at my friend's I'll post my stats. Pretty sure I have 13 average kills, 5000 average damage and 4 average deaths with her. Typically all gold and/or silver medals, and I get play of the game with her quite often. So im thinking that the complainers just really suck. D. VA is the most offensive of the tank heroes.


“We probably won’t do a bunch of buffs to her damage and her survivability; we’ll probably pick one direction or the other, but right now, we’ve been exploring both.”

-That's the current blizzard consensus with D. Va.

Of course they're not going to do both, she doesn't really need either.


Her unique mobility style is fun, but I don't think blizzard wants to place reliance on health-packs like you are stating. The general consensus on most of the forums I read battle.net and otherwise is that her head-shot radius is several times larger than that of a regular hero, and that there are no risks to missing entirely when aiming for the head. This leads to her health dropping rapidly, despite a large health pool
I listed the health pack option as a way to increase survivability if you are desperately needing it. You can naturally use the healthpacks if needed.

If you can't use her and refuse to use the healthpacks for whatever reason, that is also your own fault and not the character's.


An honorable mention on the forums is that while her gun damage is great at a very close range, her damage drops off rather quickly once you get a few feet from the enemy.

...Then use your boosters and do damage..

Or quit relying solely on your final damage count and use D.Va as you're supposed to: constantly put pressure on her targets. I rack up a ton of damage every game from alternating to targets that I can kill easily to targets that I can soften up. In other words, you are literally just playing as a support tank. In other other words, your goal is not strictly to kill, but to protect your team and soften enemies, and going for the kill only when you know you are going to win.


That said, I still usually get gold kills, objective time, and usually silver damage when I play her.. but I'm skeptical about when competitive comes out.

TL:DR- her playstyle is perfectly fine, but she does need a bit of scaling if she is to be used in top tier groups.

If you regularly get gold medals, I dont understand how you say she is underwhelming..

She's definitely not OP, but she shouldn't be. My favorite part of the game is that, despite the few inevitable terrible balancing decisions, the game is mostly balanced.

I could make a list of things like: Junkrat's grenades should damage himself, Hanzo's attacks need to have a slightly smaller attackbox, S76's bionic field doesn't need to heal faster than mercy, etc., etc.

But I have not played a character that I thought was underpowered. They have their strengths and weaknesses, and the only way to combat their weaknesses is to learn and deal with them.

Anyway, I don't think she needs a buff, but I guess we'll find out if she isn't buffed by the time competitive is out.
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Posted 6/23/16

KnightOfZero1991 wrote:

I think that's the difference between mid- and high level healers, Los(line of sighting) the high dps, allowing you to heal without getting hurt. Both the healer and dps are responsible for this, although with certain tanks, i.e Reinhardt, it is much more heavily weighted for them.


Mercy can't do anything without teammates. If I get caught out of place and all my allies decide to run behind a corner, I can't Guardian Angel over and I just die. It just also does not make sense when you're fighting 1v1 against someone who can't kill you with one hit, Mercy arrives to heal/boost you, and you run away. Stay and fight....
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Posted 6/23/16

KnightOfZero1991 wrote:


subieguy06 wrote:


Morbidhanson wrote:

I'm starting to really hate those people who don't stay and fight when I'm healing them as Mercy. If you're McCree and there's an S76 attacking you and I'm healing you with no other people around, WHY ARE YOU RUNNING AWAY?! STAY AND FIGHT BEFORE HE KILLS ME.


i really hate that, its like, your getting heals and have a higher chance of winning! now fight and protect me while I'm protecting you lol


I think that's the difference between mid- and high level healers, Los(line of sighting) the high dps, allowing you to heal without getting hurt. Both the healer and dps are responsible for this, although with certain tanks, i.e Reinhardt, it is much more heavily weighted for them.


You are absolutely correct like no tomorrow, when done right I've seen teams run through objectives with the right heal and dps, and I've gone through whole matches as mercy maybe dying once or twice. I love healing or whatever the team needs but i feel once people stop playing this like cod and work as a team they'll get more W, instead of 38 eliminations and get the L lol
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Posted 6/23/16 , edited 6/23/16

XxDarkSasuxX wrote:


KnightOfZero1991 wrote:

As far as D.Va is concerned, the team is still exploring what to do with the hero. Right now they are looking at her damage output and survivability.

“There’s a couple of directions we could take her and it’s still unclear which direction we’ll go,” said Kaplan. “Obviously her damage has come into question from a lot of people. You have to be really close to do effective damage with D. Va and we might look at that. We might also look at her survivability.

Well next time Im at my friend's I'll post my stats. Pretty sure I have 13 average kills, 5000 average damage and 4 average deaths with her. Typically all gold and/or silver medals, and I get play of the game with her quite often. So im thinking that the complainers just really suck. D. VA is the most offensive of the tank heroes.


“We probably won’t do a bunch of buffs to her damage and her survivability; we’ll probably pick one direction or the other, but right now, we’ve been exploring both.”

-That's the current blizzard consensus with D. Va.

Of course they're not going to do both, she doesn't really need either.


Her unique mobility style is fun, but I don't think blizzard wants to place reliance on health-packs like you are stating. The general consensus on most of the forums I read battle.net and otherwise is that her head-shot radius is several times larger than that of a regular hero, and that there are no risks to missing entirely when aiming for the head. This leads to her health dropping rapidly, despite a large health pool
I listed the health pack option as a way to increase survivability if you are desperately needing it. You can naturally use the healthpacks if needed.

If you can't use her and refuse to use the healthpacks for whatever reason, that is also your own fault and not the character's.


An honorable mention on the forums is that while her gun damage is great at a very close range, her damage drops off rather quickly once you get a few feet from the enemy.

...Then use your boosters and do damage..

Or quit relying solely on your final damage count and use D.Va as you're supposed to: constantly put pressure on her targets. I rack up a ton of damage every game from alternating to targets that I can kill easily to targets that I can soften up. In other words, you are literally just playing as a support tank. In other other words, your goal is not strictly to kill, but to protect your team and soften enemies, and going for the kill only when you know you are going to win.


That said, I still usually get gold kills, objective time, and usually silver damage when I play her.. but I'm skeptical about when competitive comes out.

TL:DR- her playstyle is perfectly fine, but she does need a bit of scaling if she is to be used in top tier groups.

If you regularly get gold medals, I dont understand how you say she is underwhelming..

She's definitely not OP, but she shouldn't be. My favorite part of the game is that, despite the few inevitable terrible balancing decisions, the game is mostly balanced.

I could make a list of things like: Junkrat's grenades should damage himself, Hanzo's attacks need to have a slightly smaller attackbox, S76's bionic field doesn't need to heal faster than mercy, etc., etc.

But I have not played a character that I thought was underpowered. They have their strengths and weaknesses, and the only way to combat their weaknesses is to learn and deal with them.

Anyway, I don't think she needs a buff, but I guess we'll find out if she isn't buffed by the time competitive is out.


The problem with D.Va is that Winston pretty much does everything she can do except better. I see almost no reason to pick D.Va unless there are very rare situations in which Winston's shield is not enough (say, enemy team has 3 Bastions). I get that she's not supposed to do big damage, but her shots are cotton candy if you're 15 feet away or more from her. Sure, Boosters are nice for scoring the final hit, and she can run to the enemy without firing and just melee them, but using the boosters uses up the cooldown and exposes you to enemy fire for 5 seconds, and you're a huge target with no regenerating shields. Defense matrix is nice but it's inefficient to waste two skills and time to hunt for health after a bad engagement.

I'd just reduce the rate her damage decreases with falloff and add 2 more pellets fired per shot, reduce both the duration and cooldown of her defense matrix so she has an incentive to use it more, and slightly increase her booster cooldown (maybe just 1 or 2 seconds) so she has a bit more of a reason to stick next to her team to use the matrix. I'd also give her a small mobility skill outside her mech, something simple similar to McCree's combat roll. She can still ambush people and soften up targets, but she will do a little more damage to them. Right now, she's pretty useless if the enemy team has a Lucio (almost every serious team will include one, he's by far the best support). I like her, but I do think she needs a buff. Damage dealt at the end of the game doesn't really mean anything if the targets are pretty much topping off as soon as you damage them, and she obviously will get kill participation since she can just deal 1 damage to any enemy that someone else finishes off. Her scores seem high on paper but she's not effective at her roles in practice.

Junkrat's grenades DO damage him. Only the land mine doesn't, and that makes sense since he's expected to use it for mobility. S76's biotic field doesn't last very long and has a long cooldown, but it's not mobile like Mercy and people need to stay in the area to use it.

I'd probably make the D.Va changes I just mentioned, and probably give Pharah some damage on her Concussive Blast (not much, maybe just 50). Right now, it's basically Lucio's right click except it does no damage and also knocks her back and has a giant cooldown. I'd probably also lengthen Zenyatta's orb duration out of sight to 6 seconds. 3 is way too short.
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Posted 6/23/16 , edited 6/23/16

Morbidhanson wrote:

The problem with D.Va is that Winston pretty much does everything she can do except better. I see almost no reason to pick D.Va unless there are very rare situations in which Winston's shield is not enough (say, enemy team has 3 Bastions). I get that she's not supposed to do big damage, but her shots are cotton candy if you're 15 feet away or more from her. Sure, Boosters are nice for scoring the final hit, and she can run to the enemy without firing and just melee them, but using the boosters uses up the cooldown and exposes you to enemy fire for 5 seconds, and you're a huge target with no regenerating shields. Defense matrix is nice but it's inefficient to waste two skills and time to hunt for health after a bad engagement.

No.. Winston is a completely different playstyle. He can tank better than D. VA because as previously stated, D.VA is not meant, made, or designed to play as a main tank role.


. . . Right now, she's pretty useless if the enemy team has a Lucio (almost every serious team will include one, he's by far the best support).

1. It is nice when you get a good Lucio.

2. I turn Lucio into silly putty on D.VA. Easily.

Lucio stands literally no chance in most scenarios: the only time you would have difficulty in a fight with him is if you were fighting 2v1 and he had another tank or assault character with him. Which ultimately boils back down to picking and choosing your battles a little more wisely.


Her scores seem high on paper but she's not effective at her roles in practice.

Just because she has a shield by her name does not not mean you have to play her as a conventional tank role. If you play her expecting to play like Winston, than you are obviously going to have a hard time.


Junkrat's grenades DO damage him.

Didnt notice that.. pretty sure I've been in his face and he took like no damage..

Well then it needs to do an equal amount if damage to him. I know his grenades do at least 150 damage since he one shots tracer, so if they only do a little back to him then I think it should do the same amount to him.


S76's biotic field doesn't last very long and has a long cooldown, but it's not mobile like Mercy and people need to stay in the area to use it.
That is literally no excuse to be unable to fight him 1 on 1. He is literally impossible to kill while in that bionic field. Even the subtext from tool tips show the original intent blizzard had for him: it is supposed to be a way for him to run away and heal before returning back to the action. His healing is way more powerful than that obviously, since he drops it down and becomes god for 10 seconds.


I'd probably make the D.Va changes I just mentioned, and probably give Pharah some damage on her Concussive Blast (not much, maybe just 50).

Let's not make Pharah more OP than she is. Right now, the only thing keeping her from being overused is the skill and experience you need to make her rockets hit their marks.


I'd probably also lengthen Zenyatta's orb duration out of sight to 6 seconds. 3 is way too short.

And that's taking away the risk of being in combat as a trade off for using that ability.
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Posted 6/23/16


Well, as promised.

This is about an average game for me, but you can see my averages. Anyway, I couldn't really care less about opinions, but she is far from underpowered. She gets the job done.

Which is, of course, my own opinion formed from actually knowing how to use her, but still an opinion nonetheless.
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Posted 6/23/16
I'll always somewhat love D.Va for giving me this great moment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JCQE0B_qTK0
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Posted 6/23/16
Just want to leave this hear, cosplayer is amazing as tracer and that voice , i enjoyed her in this

https://youtu.be/_iqTP97wg0o

forward to 3:29 for tracer
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Posted 6/24/16 , edited 6/24/16



Close range weapon? Check. Winston does more damage consistently at better range and can hit many people at once. He is best up close and doesn't slow down when he's firing. He doesn't do damage at medium and long range, but that's negligible since D.Va will basically be doing like 6 damage per shot at a range where Tesla Cannon's prevents it from locking an enemy. You're better off not attacking the enemy at those distances with D.Va since all you'll do is alert them to your presence. And Tesla Cannon goes through shields, and you don't even have to aim well. Way better than D.Va's cannons unless you're close enough to breathe down the neck of your target.

Shield? Yup. Winston's is usually all you need and it lasts longer than D.Va's matrix. The only time Matrix shines is if there's A LOT of incoming projectiles. And Winston can actually attack while shielding. D.Va needs to be near her team for it to be useful.

Mobility skill? Check. Leap is not quite as good as D.Va's boosters because its cooldown is one second longer, but it gets the job done and it's still excellent.

Ult? Both are meant to displace. Competent people simply never get caught in D.Va's blast. They run and get displaced. Winston just knocks everyone away while damaging and distracting them for several seconds, so he keeps them away for longer than D.Va. Better than Self-Destruct. At it improves his survival by healing him and doubling his HP, making him pretty much unkillable, and extra mobile, and he can jump away when Primal Rage is ending. D.Va just gets to be a squishy human.

And although her mech and Winston and Reinhardt have the same HP on paper, D.Va usually loses her mech faster than Winston or Reinhardt dying. Why? Because her headshot zone is huge and it's smack dab in the middle of her Mech's torso so it's easier to headshot her. Same as how it's easier to headshot Junkrat due to his hunched stance and how it's easier to bodyshot Zenyatta because he has wide legs.

There's basically no reason to use D.Va over Winston unless you're going to be making good use of her Matrix and/or her better longevity per spawn since she pops out of her mech when it's destroyed. She does less damage in general except maybe in human form even if she's a little more mobile and Winston is a better distraction. I like D.Va, but she's a bit underpowered. Winston simply outperforms her in most things she should be doing, relegating her to niche use. I can only think of a slight damage boost and improvements to the matrix to make her a more outstanding pick.



Lucio as a support mitigates the damage D.Va can do to the team. The amped aura healing makes it way too hard for you to kill anyone and even "softening up" people doesn't do anything since they'll heal in a few seconds as long as he's with his team. And even if you happen to catch Lucio alone, he can just right click you away and run away with an amped healing aura. If you boost after him, he just right clicks again and you're at a range where you do no damage to him again. That's more than enough time for him to escape. A smart Lucio won't fight you at a distance where you can do anything to him. He'll run toward his team since he's not designed to fight at close range, or spam left click at you from a distance.

High level competitive teams will often run TWO Lucio and their auras stack. Good luck doing anything with D.Va when people move away from you so fast you can't even get two max-damage shots in and constantly heal.


Junkrat does 120 with a direct hit and 80 with close splash. He does 40 damage to himself, and his frag launcher is hard to aim at long distances. It's more for area denial rather than killing when he's some distance away. If he does full damage to himself, he'd be unplayable since the only time you can reliably kill people with his launcher is at closer ranges and he has no way to self-heal and has no shields.



Mercy heals 50/second. Biotic Field is 40/second. It's possible to kill him when he's in the biotic field, but you simply back off unless you're confident you can headshot him or burst him down. The field only lasts 5 seconds. Even if he is at full health when he starts it, that means he has 400 potential max HP for that 5 seconds. And when does that happen? Not often. People usually place the field when they're damaged and expecting to remain in that area to hold off enemies. Not a broken game changer for him. It's more useful if multiple teammates can benefit from the field. To be honest, it's perfectly okay as it is.

It's best when he puts it at a corner where his team can duck in and out while benefiting from the heal.


Pharah is not overpowered. It's pretty inefficient to use her at level ground with her enemies since the rockets must hit her enemies directly to do damage in that situation, absent a wall behind the enemy. No matter how good your aim is at ground level, the enemy has time to dodge. And they will, while returning fire. This is the reason she has a skill to launch her in the air. While in the air, she becomes a much greater threat since she doesn't need to be as accurate to hit you and gains a dominating range of fire. However, in the air, she is a very vulnerable target. S76, Hanzo, Widowmaker, and pretty much anyone without a shotgun-style weapon will shoot her down quickly. It's a tradeoff that makes sense.

However, Concussive Blast is strictly inferior to Lucio's right click, which he can spam to knock people off ledges and keep people away from him. It does 25 damage. So why shouldn't Concussive Blast do a little damage since it has a far longer cooldown? 25, 50, whatever. As long as it does some damage. No greater than 50 since it would be too good then, but no less than 25 since that's what Lucio's does. Back when she was first introduced, Concussive Blast did 200 to shields. Now it just doesn't do anything.

It's the same situation we used to have with McCree vs Zenyatta. McCree was doing full damage per shot before they nerfed fan fire, while Zenyatta was doing less damage per charged shot. The principles in the game should be applied consistently across all the characters. THEN, we adjust values for balance. It makes more sense that way. Every other knockback or CC skill does some damage. Concussive Blast should, too.



Have you even played Zenyatta much? I played him 7 hours in beta and over 9 hours after release. He lacks mobility, has the lowest health in the game tied with Tracer, and his style is to duck in and out of safety behind the front lines to help his team or throw some potshots at the enemy. He's my most played character.

The earliest Zenyatta had orbs that stuck to their targets until he reassigned them or died. This was too good since they also stacked and he could literally hide forever and still be useful. Every team ran dual Zenyatta. The orb nerf made his orbs not stack and added the line of sight mechanic. But 3 seconds? Without a mobility skill, you can't even turn the corner while navigating a corridor fast enough to maintain line of sight on most of your allies with mobility skills unless they wait for you. You duck out of a corner, assign the orb to an ally, duck back in because Widowmaker is trying to shoot you. You duck out to shoot and, well, there's an obstacle like a phone booth between you and your ally. Orb drops, your ally receives no healing anymore, and you can't get out to put the orb back on because you need to regain line of sight. You effectively can't do your job even if you're constantly peering out between Widowmaker shots and Hanzo arrows. This is why you never see him now when pros are playing.

And Orb of Harmony isn't even that good compared to every other healing skill in the game. It only heals a hair over half of Mercy's rate and affects only one guy, too. All other heals are either AOE or significantly higher single-target. Harmony is arguably the worst heal in the game right now because of situations like what I just described. With 6 seconds, you can duck out that second time to look at your ally and keep the orb going. It's more forgiving, not game-breaking. 6 seconds on Discord also allows him to keep track of an enemy's location for slightly longer. It's not for combat effectiveness, it's for positioning.

To play Zenyatta, you need to, as the most fragile character in the game (who lacks any mobility skill whatsoever) , expose yourself to danger. If you mess up, you don't get a speed aura, you don't get to fly to an ally, you just die unless you waste your ult. Which, also, probably needs a slight change because it requires you to be in the thick of things and announces to the entire enemy team where you are because you become a giant ball of light. You take your normal role and suddenly reverse it and charge in. But you can't even stay in the fray for the entire duration because you're going to want to start retreating during the last two seconds or else you'll die to focused fire. And when you die, you get to enjoy the longest walk from spawn in the game. Zarya has no mobility either, but she's a tank so she won't be dying nearly as much as you. And Symmetra doesn't need to maintain line of sight so she's more hidden than you and won't be dying as much, plus she has a teleporter.
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Posted 6/24/16
Read the first two paragraphs and stopped. You can generalize their weapons and shields, comparing and contrasting all you want, but they are not similar and do not play the same.

As already stated, if you attempt to play her like Winston, of course you are going to have a bad time.

I've already stated how I play as D.VA and it works for me. If you can't do well with her, then check your own skill, it's not the character.
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Posted 6/24/16 , edited 6/24/16
But it is the character. I guarantee you that you can pick Winston and play 20 games and pick D.Va and play 20 games, and the Winston games will be better on average as long as you're playing both seriously and the enemy doesn't have 4 turrets every game. If you're doing organized play and not quick play, you're just not going to want to pick D.Va. They have pretty much the same toolkit and do mostly the same jobs, so It's enough to be worth a comparison.

If a character requires significantly more skill to be good when compared to another character that has a very similar, if not outright overlapping, playstyle, it points to balance issues. There needs to be a reason to pick her over Winston other than "holy crap the enemy has 4 turrets and only one guy on my team talks to me."

This feels like pre-McCree and Widow nerf when people were trying to argue that those two were perfectly balanced and people should just get better to counter them.
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Posted 6/24/16 , edited 6/24/16

Morbidhanson wrote:

But it is the character.

No, it's the individual.


I guarantee you that you can pick Winston and play 20 games and pick D.Va and play 20 games, and the Winston games will be better on average as long as you're playing both seriously and the enemy doesn't have 4 turrets every game. If you're doing organized play and not quick play, you're just not going to want to pick D.Va. They have pretty much the same toolkit and do the same jobs, so It's enough to be worth a comparison.

Tired of repeating myself. Their roles are different. Winston is designed to distract, D.VA's mobility makes her much more capable than that, although she can play a distraction role albeit just not by herself.

D.VA's capability relies just as much on her team as Mercy does. You might as well say that one might as well use Lucio or Zenyatta because they perform a relatively similar function but they are much more combat reliable support characters.

You might as well make your case that Reaper should be used instead of Tracer because they both have high DPS, but Tracer will get one-shot relatively often.

Or that you might as well play torbjorn instead of bastion because if you die as bastion the team is short a player for 8 seconds+the time it takes to make it back to the fight, but if your turret gets shot, you can easily rebuild one in a different location.

Or that you might as well play as Widowmaker than Hanzo for the fact that it's just easier to hit your mark with a high velocity bullet than a low velocity arrow.

Yes, the characters can perform similar functions, but sometimes they may perform other functions better.

For example,

- Tracer has the ability to confuse and disorient enemies,

- Bastion has ridiculously high DPS if you can manage to set him into turret mode,

- And Hanzo has a much better survival rate on the front lines than widowmaker. And that's severely simplifying their actual roles.


And, no offense, but your D.Va record isn't even that good. That's for low level quick plays. I'm talking about competitive play where teammates actually talk to one another.

Never claimed it was. As a matter of fact, Im pretty sure that I said I was an average D.VA player, and it's just that I don't find her to be underpowered at all.


If a character requires significantly more skill to be good when compared to another character that has a very similar, if not outright overlapping, playstyle, it points to balance issues.

For the final time, their playstyle is different. If you decide to keep posting about D.VA and I reply, and you continue to assert that, I'll just snip and link to this post. For this is literally the third time that you've made that assertion.

You can make your case that they have a shield and a mobility ability, but you are also ignoring the fact that Winstons shield lasts like 2 seconds under enemy fire, doesn't move with him, and it's effectiveness is easily nullified by an enemy who simply walks inside; and his leap not only has a preset distance, but has a slightly longer cooldown and can only move in the direction that he is facing upon the skill's activation.

There is much more to a moveset than just having that moveset. An adaptable moveset such as D.VA's allows you to have a more "customizable" playstyle than a static one such as Winston's which will do the exact same thing every single time you press the skill key.

Player skill, not character incompetence.


This feels like pre-McCree and Widow nerf when people were trying to argue that those two were perfectly balanced and people should just get better to counter them.

Not really. An argument for an OP character can be easily found in stats and performance tests. Saying a character is UP takes a lot more than just "I tried using such and such as a tank character but just couldn't pull it off."

There is a difference in arguing for a character that systematically out-performs every other character despite the roles of their opposition than there is with a character where there are many people who have learned to him well with the exception of those few who can't grasp the concept that you need to learn and play to the character's individual strengths and weaknesses rather than their general class.

And the only people who advocated that McCree wasn't OP were the people who abused his obviously overlooked skill set.
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Posted 6/24/16 , edited 6/24/16
Well, I tried. You do you.

When you examine each one of their respective skills and what roles those characters play with those skills, you'll find that Winston is simply better than D.Va unless you can take advantage of her shield due to particularly heavy fire. Winston's shield has 400 HP. That's like the immortal Soldier 76 in his biotic field you mentioned earlier. And it lasts 6 seconds. Most enemies without energy beam weaponry will stop firing in your face once you cast Defense Matrix, and they'll try to hit you from the sides or from behind, where Matrix won't protect you or your team. Like I said, it's better than Winston's shield if there's particularly heavy fire from turrets or a lot of enemies camping at a choke. But that's not enough to make her a reliable pick. She's still relegated to niche use because her other abilities are strictly inferior. There's no meaningful difference between what these two heroes are capable of aside what has already been mentioned. And we're assuming you have a Reinhardt already. Times will be rare, indeed, that you'll need Matrix on top of Reinhardt's shield. Winstons is usually enough, and he can actually contribute by doing some damage to turrets.

Who can pick off supports better? Winston. Whose displacement ult is more effective? Winston. Who has better survivability? Arguably Winston in most cases. Who is a bigger distraction? Winston due to his superior damage and better ult. D.Va's shield is the only thing that sets her apart in a meaningful way.

You can also find characters are UP judging by their stats and performance tests. Zenyatta, Bastion, and Torbjorn are all pretty bad when it comes to higher level play. Bastion and Torb are one-trick ponies. Once you learn to coordinate against and counter turrets, these two are harmless. And you'll probably only have a chance to see them on defense if the enemy knows what they're doing. Zenyatta just needs a change to his orb mechanics to make him viable again, now that WM can't bodyshot him.

Before the WM nerf, I DID think Hanzo was a strictly inferior sniper. Now, it's more even since he actually does a bit more damage and WM's ult isn't so broken anymore.

In D.Va v. Winston comparisons, Winston isn't broken. So it must be the case that D.Va is a bit underpowered if Winston is fine and he's usually better. How do we fix this problem? By making D.Va either stronger or changing her skills so that she performs the shield role better than Winston and often enough to consider picking her.
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Posted 6/24/16 , edited 6/24/16
I tried, too. -shrug-

Well, I don't think she needs a buff, but if the majority of people need blizzard to walk their characters through the game, I really can't say I care.

You play as Winston, and I'll continue to use D.VA where she's needed.

As a side note (in regards to your torbjorn and bastion comment), they are harmless. By themselves. That is where the team play comes in handy. Same with D.VA and the other characters I mentioned. So you pretty much just confirmed one of my earlier points.
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Posted 6/24/16 , edited 6/24/16
Torb and Bastion contribute nothing to group fights by remaining stationary and they can literally be countered by one Pharah from behind while Reinhardt is preoccupied shielding the front. They're some of the least group-friendly heroes because they don't contribute unless the enemy walks into them. Which isn't happening in competitive play, and the danger of being stationary is compounded by the prevalence of huge AOE ults and the popularity of Tracer and Widowmaker. You're better off picking Junkrat for area denial since you can move around and you can help trap Tracer by setting things up behind the team. Soldier 76 if you want someone that contributes directly to team fights and comes back to the battle faster. AND he heals you guys.

Let Torb move his turrets and rework the scrap mechanic and I might consider him better than Bastion. I don't know how Bastion would be made viable for pro play, though. His mechanics are just very linear and you can only really get around them by relocating frequently while being escorted by a teammate. His mobility is what makes him better than Torb.
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