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Post Reply About all of the bull in the media on immigration
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Posted 7/24/16 , edited 9/4/16
The recent wave of Muslim immigration into Europe has been blown out of proportion by the media. Importing young people into a country is good for the economy. These immigrants will keep the European economy growing in the next few decades. I don't know if you ever had any exposure to the working class sectors of the economy of Europe, but let me tell you, strawberries don't pick themselves, they are picked by immigrants. Bars, clubs, pubs, etc don't clean themselves, they are cleaned by immigrants. Construction work, also mostly done by immigrants.


There is a lot of bullshit in the media about immigrants claiming benefits in EU and in UK. I can tell you, lots of my high school friends who were native to this country can get around $600 of benefits per person + heavily subsidized housing + free education and training + free everything for their kids (school meals, books, grants to go to university, etc, etc). For them, it is actually irrational to get a min wage job ($1200 per month after tax) because they will loose out on a LOT of welfare benefits. In comparison, for an immigrant to apply for a 2 year visa here, it costs $1000 + supporting documentation from your employer + bank statements to show you can support yourself for at least two years without state help. These immigrants then pay the same taxes and national insurance as everybody else, but are forbidden to claim a lot of welfare benefits available to the natives. I don't know exactly which benefits, because I have met lots of both legal and illegal immigrants in the UK, but I don't know of any of them using any state services other than the NHS.


Now, as for the USA. Has any of you ever tried to apply for a US visa with work permit? Because it is not easy. I know of a couple highly educated and talented people who got jobs in the USA and failed the visa process. One of them went for a phd in an ivy league university (full scholarship) instead, as a way in. The other one thought forget it, and went for a highly paid job here instead. The way I see it, USA is loosing out. I mean what made USA the best country in the world was because of USA's ability to attract the most amazing people from all around the world to come to the US and give them citizenship. Now, the US immigration process is just a bureaucratic nightmare, especially compared to more enlightened countries like Australia, New Zealand and Canada.


Lastly, the Muslims. I am a fourth generation atheist, so from my point of view, all of you religious people are literally crazy. But I am used it, people kneeling and talking to their imaginary friend, people passing judgement on others based an incoherent book written in the bronze age, people 'donating' money to organizations which are many orders of magnitude more wealthy than themselves, etc, etc. It's OK, everybody's a little crazy sometimes, no big deal. As for the terrorism and rape and "crime wave". Let's look at it from my atheist point of view, OK? There are lots of crazy people in the world, so no doubt a few of them will commit absurd acts of violence. Catholics fiddle kids. Muslims rape women and do suicide bombings. And protestants, like Tony Blair, decided to spend billions to invade and bomb countries half way across the world despite the mass popular demonstrations right here in London, because in his own words, God told him to do it. And on this subject of Tony Blair, he preferred to spend the money on war instead of schools, because he also had the "bright" idea of selling state schools to private sponsors, like fellow Christian Peter Vardy, who then decided to not only adopt creationist texbooks but also adopt daily prayers and weekly prayer assemblies in these state schools. So in summary, crazy doesn't make you a bad person, and being a bad person is certainly not limited to any particular brand of craziness.
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Posted 7/24/16 , edited 7/24/16

goodman528 wrote:

The recent wave of Muslim immigration into Europe has been blown out of proportion by the media. Importing young people into a country is good for the economy. These immigrants will keep the European economy growing in the next few decades. I don't know if you ever had any exposure to the working class sectors of the economy of Europe, but let me tell you, strawberries don't pick themselves, they are picked by immigrants. Bars, clubs, pubs, etc don't clean themselves, they are cleaned by immigrants. Construction work, also mostly done by immigrants.


There is a lot of bullshit in the media about immigrants claiming benefits in EU and in UK. I can tell you, lots of my high school friends who were native to this country can get around $600 of benefits per person + heavily subsidized housing + free education and training + free everything for their kids (school meals, books, grants to go to university, etc, etc). For them, it is actually irrational to get a min wage job ($1200 per month after tax) because they will loose out on a LOT of welfare benefits. In comparison, for an immigrant to apply for a 2 year visa here, it costs $1000 + supporting documentation from your employer + bank statements to show you can support yourself for at least two years without state help. These immigrants then pay the same taxes and national insurance as everybody else, but are forbidden to claim a lot of welfare benefits available to the natives. I don't know exactly which benefits, because I have met lots of both legal and illegal immigrants in the UK, but I don't know of any of them using any state services other than the NHS.


Now, as for the USA. Has any of you ever tried to apply for a US visa with work permit? Because it is not easy. I know of a couple highly educated and talented people who got jobs in the USA and failed the visa process. One of them went for a phd in an ivy league university (full scholarship) instead, as a way in. The other one thought forget it, and went for a highly paid job here instead. The way I see it, USA is loosing out. I mean what made USA the best country in the world was because of USA's ability to attract the most amazing people from all around the world to come to the US and give them citizenship. Now, the US immigration process is just a bureaucratic nightmare, especially compared to more enlightened countries like Australia, New Zealand and Canada.


Lastly, the Muslims. I am a fourth generation atheist, so from my point of view, all of you religious people are literally crazy. But I am used it, people kneeling and talking to their imaginary friend, people passing judgement on others based an incoherent book written in the bronze age, people 'donating' money to organizations which are many orders of magnitude more wealthy than themselves, etc, etc. It's OK, everybody's a little crazy sometimes, no big deal. As for the terrorism and rape and "crime wave". Let's look at it from my atheist point of view, OK? There are lots of crazy people in the world, so no doubt a few of them will commit absurd acts of violence. Catholics fiddle kids. Muslims rape women and do suicide bombings. And protestants, like Tony Blair, decided to spend billions to invade and bomb countries half way across the world despite the mass popular demonstrations right here in London, because in his own words, God told him to do it. And on this subject of Tony Blair, he preferred to spend the money on war instead of schools, because he also had the "bright" idea of selling state schools to private sponsors, like fellow Christian Peter Vardy, who then decided to not only adopt creationist texbooks but also adopt daily prayers and weekly prayer assemblies in these state schools. So in summary, crazy doesn't make you a bad person, and being a bad person is certainly not limited to any particular brand of craziness.



Christians: Creationism and anti-LGBT

Muslim: Prophet is a murderous pedophile

On the other side, some Christians and Muslims are the kindest individuals you might meet. some religious people simply ignore the more archaic parts of their literature I guess. And no this NOT BAITING.. this is just fact(from one born as christian).
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Posted 7/25/16
Muslims are ok until their numbers get too high or if too many that are straight from a culture SO different to the one in their new home has come over all at one time. So it would seem.
I mean it would be the same if 1,000,000 Aussies all wanting to drink booze and eat pork and go to strip clubs and brothels and go to a Christain church all went to teh middle east at once. (not the rape and bombings but the clash of cultures).

As far as the benifits, there are alot of rumors regarding that as far as the Muslims and Indians and the Africans here.
I know the Aboriginies get alot of benifts and aid but i mean they were here first.
Also Muslims have way more kids than most non Musilms/whites so they can really cash in on that here in Australia.


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23 / M / El paso Tx
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Posted 7/25/16
Thanks you for this. i realized not all muslim are bad and thanks for some info on the refugee crises.
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21 / M
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Posted 7/25/16
Will Donald Trump going to stop the terrorist attacks? Who know, he might get assassinated.
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Posted 7/25/16 , edited 9/4/16

KnightOfZero1991 wrote:
Christians: Creationism and anti-LGBT

Muslim: Prophet is a murderous pedophile
they are both mostly the same thing.
Only 1 have progressed further and gained more facts/tech to prove other wise.

While both have that little % that is above whats commonly nice.

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Posted 7/25/16 , edited 9/4/16

KnightOfZero1991 wrote:


goodman528 wrote:

The recent wave of Muslim immigration into Europe has been blown out of proportion by the media. Importing young people into a country is good for the economy. These immigrants will keep the European economy growing in the next few decades. I don't know if you ever had any exposure to the working class sectors of the economy of Europe, but let me tell you, strawberries don't pick themselves, they are picked by immigrants. Bars, clubs, pubs, etc don't clean themselves, they are cleaned by immigrants. Construction work, also mostly done by immigrants.


There is a lot of bullshit in the media about immigrants claiming benefits in EU and in UK. I can tell you, lots of my high school friends who were native to this country can get around $600 of benefits per person + heavily subsidized housing + free education and training + free everything for their kids (school meals, books, grants to go to university, etc, etc). For them, it is actually irrational to get a min wage job ($1200 per month after tax) because they will loose out on a LOT of welfare benefits. In comparison, for an immigrant to apply for a 2 year visa here, it costs $1000 + supporting documentation from your employer + bank statements to show you can support yourself for at least two years without state help. These immigrants then pay the same taxes and national insurance as everybody else, but are forbidden to claim a lot of welfare benefits available to the natives. I don't know exactly which benefits, because I have met lots of both legal and illegal immigrants in the UK, but I don't know of any of them using any state services other than the NHS.


Now, as for the USA. Has any of you ever tried to apply for a US visa with work permit? Because it is not easy. I know of a couple highly educated and talented people who got jobs in the USA and failed the visa process. One of them went for a phd in an ivy league university (full scholarship) instead, as a way in. The other one thought forget it, and went for a highly paid job here instead. The way I see it, USA is loosing out. I mean what made USA the best country in the world was because of USA's ability to attract the most amazing people from all around the world to come to the US and give them citizenship. Now, the US immigration process is just a bureaucratic nightmare, especially compared to more enlightened countries like Australia, New Zealand and Canada.


Lastly, the Muslims. I am a fourth generation atheist, so from my point of view, all of you religious people are literally crazy. But I am used it, people kneeling and talking to their imaginary friend, people passing judgement on others based an incoherent book written in the bronze age, people 'donating' money to organizations which are many orders of magnitude more wealthy than themselves, etc, etc. It's OK, everybody's a little crazy sometimes, no big deal. As for the terrorism and rape and "crime wave". Let's look at it from my atheist point of view, OK? There are lots of crazy people in the world, so no doubt a few of them will commit absurd acts of violence. Catholics fiddle kids. Muslims rape women and do suicide bombings. And protestants, like Tony Blair, decided to spend billions to invade and bomb countries half way across the world despite the mass popular demonstrations right here in London, because in his own words, God told him to do it. And on this subject of Tony Blair, he preferred to spend the money on war instead of schools, because he also had the "bright" idea of selling state schools to private sponsors, like fellow Christian Peter Vardy, who then decided to not only adopt creationist texbooks but also adopt daily prayers and weekly prayer assemblies in these state schools. So in summary, crazy doesn't make you a bad person, and being a bad person is certainly not limited to any particular brand of craziness.



Christians: Creationism and anti-LGBT

Muslim: Prophet is a murderous pedophile

On the other side, some Christians and Muslims are the kindest individuals you might meet. some religious people simply ignore the more archaic parts of their literature I guess. And no this NOT BAITING.. this is just fact(from one born as christian).



Christians done a lot more than creationism. Most recently, there are the catholic church pedophile priests and abortion clinic shootings and bombings. Going back a couple of decades, there was the IRA planting bombs in in England and Northern Ireland. And then, there are the TV interviews of Bush and Blair explaining why they went to war in Afghanistan and Iraq, literally, God told them to do it. Muslims are crazy, but they certainly don't have a monopoly on the violent terrorist warmongering kind of crazy.
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Posted 7/25/16

goodman528 wrote:


KnightOfZero1991 wrote:


goodman528 wrote:

The recent wave of Muslim immigration into Europe has been blown out of proportion by the media. Importing young people into a country is good for the economy. These immigrants will keep the European economy growing in the next few decades. I don't know if you ever had any exposure to the working class sectors of the economy of Europe, but let me tell you, strawberries don't pick themselves, they are picked by immigrants. Bars, clubs, pubs, etc don't clean themselves, they are cleaned by immigrants. Construction work, also mostly done by immigrants.


There is a lot of bullshit in the media about immigrants claiming benefits in EU and in UK. I can tell you, lots of my high school friends who were native to this country can get around $600 of benefits per person + heavily subsidized housing + free education and training + free everything for their kids (school meals, books, grants to go to university, etc, etc). For them, it is actually irrational to get a min wage job ($1200 per month after tax) because they will loose out on a LOT of welfare benefits. In comparison, for an immigrant to apply for a 2 year visa here, it costs $1000 + supporting documentation from your employer + bank statements to show you can support yourself for at least two years without state help. These immigrants then pay the same taxes and national insurance as everybody else, but are forbidden to claim a lot of welfare benefits available to the natives. I don't know exactly which benefits, because I have met lots of both legal and illegal immigrants in the UK, but I don't know of any of them using any state services other than the NHS.


Now, as for the USA. Has any of you ever tried to apply for a US visa with work permit? Because it is not easy. I know of a couple highly educated and talented people who got jobs in the USA and failed the visa process. One of them went for a phd in an ivy league university (full scholarship) instead, as a way in. The other one thought forget it, and went for a highly paid job here instead. The way I see it, USA is loosing out. I mean what made USA the best country in the world was because of USA's ability to attract the most amazing people from all around the world to come to the US and give them citizenship. Now, the US immigration process is just a bureaucratic nightmare, especially compared to more enlightened countries like Australia, New Zealand and Canada.


Lastly, the Muslims. I am a fourth generation atheist, so from my point of view, all of you religious people are literally crazy. But I am used it, people kneeling and talking to their imaginary friend, people passing judgement on others based an incoherent book written in the bronze age, people 'donating' money to organizations which are many orders of magnitude more wealthy than themselves, etc, etc. It's OK, everybody's a little crazy sometimes, no big deal. As for the terrorism and rape and "crime wave". Let's look at it from my atheist point of view, OK? There are lots of crazy people in the world, so no doubt a few of them will commit absurd acts of violence. Catholics fiddle kids. Muslims rape women and do suicide bombings. And protestants, like Tony Blair, decided to spend billions to invade and bomb countries half way across the world despite the mass popular demonstrations right here in London, because in his own words, God told him to do it. And on this subject of Tony Blair, he preferred to spend the money on war instead of schools, because he also had the "bright" idea of selling state schools to private sponsors, like fellow Christian Peter Vardy, who then decided to not only adopt creationist texbooks but also adopt daily prayers and weekly prayer assemblies in these state schools. So in summary, crazy doesn't make you a bad person, and being a bad person is certainly not limited to any particular brand of craziness.



Christians: Creationism and anti-LGBT

Muslim: Prophet is a murderous pedophile

On the other side, some Christians and Muslims are the kindest individuals you might meet. some religious people simply ignore the more archaic parts of their literature I guess. And no this NOT BAITING.. this is just fact(from one born as christian).



Christians done a lot more than creationism. Most recently, there are the catholic church pedophile priests and abortion clinic shootings and bombings. Going back a couple of decades, there was the IRA planting bombs in in England and Northern Ireland. And then, there are the TV interviews of Bush and Blair explaining why they went to war in Afghanistan and Iraq, literally, God told them to do it. Muslims are crazy, but they certainly don't have a monopoly on the violent terrorist warmongering kind of crazy.


The IRA plants bombs because they want all of Ireland to be Irish not because of Christianity.

"God" aka "the party bosses". We all know Bush along with Obama are puppets of their party and their only purpose is to serve as a figurehead.
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Posted 7/25/16

Rujikin wrote:


goodman528 wrote:


KnightOfZero1991 wrote:


goodman528 wrote:

The recent wave of Muslim immigration into Europe has been blown out of proportion by the media. Importing young people into a country is good for the economy. These immigrants will keep the European economy growing in the next few decades. I don't know if you ever had any exposure to the working class sectors of the economy of Europe, but let me tell you, strawberries don't pick themselves, they are picked by immigrants. Bars, clubs, pubs, etc don't clean themselves, they are cleaned by immigrants. Construction work, also mostly done by immigrants.


There is a lot of bullshit in the media about immigrants claiming benefits in EU and in UK. I can tell you, lots of my high school friends who were native to this country can get around $600 of benefits per person + heavily subsidized housing + free education and training + free everything for their kids (school meals, books, grants to go to university, etc, etc). For them, it is actually irrational to get a min wage job ($1200 per month after tax) because they will loose out on a LOT of welfare benefits. In comparison, for an immigrant to apply for a 2 year visa here, it costs $1000 + supporting documentation from your employer + bank statements to show you can support yourself for at least two years without state help. These immigrants then pay the same taxes and national insurance as everybody else, but are forbidden to claim a lot of welfare benefits available to the natives. I don't know exactly which benefits, because I have met lots of both legal and illegal immigrants in the UK, but I don't know of any of them using any state services other than the NHS.


Now, as for the USA. Has any of you ever tried to apply for a US visa with work permit? Because it is not easy. I know of a couple highly educated and talented people who got jobs in the USA and failed the visa process. One of them went for a phd in an ivy league university (full scholarship) instead, as a way in. The other one thought forget it, and went for a highly paid job here instead. The way I see it, USA is loosing out. I mean what made USA the best country in the world was because of USA's ability to attract the most amazing people from all around the world to come to the US and give them citizenship. Now, the US immigration process is just a bureaucratic nightmare, especially compared to more enlightened countries like Australia, New Zealand and Canada.


Lastly, the Muslims. I am a fourth generation atheist, so from my point of view, all of you religious people are literally crazy. But I am used it, people kneeling and talking to their imaginary friend, people passing judgement on others based an incoherent book written in the bronze age, people 'donating' money to organizations which are many orders of magnitude more wealthy than themselves, etc, etc. It's OK, everybody's a little crazy sometimes, no big deal. As for the terrorism and rape and "crime wave". Let's look at it from my atheist point of view, OK? There are lots of crazy people in the world, so no doubt a few of them will commit absurd acts of violence. Catholics fiddle kids. Muslims rape women and do suicide bombings. And protestants, like Tony Blair, decided to spend billions to invade and bomb countries half way across the world despite the mass popular demonstrations right here in London, because in his own words, God told him to do it. And on this subject of Tony Blair, he preferred to spend the money on war instead of schools, because he also had the "bright" idea of selling state schools to private sponsors, like fellow Christian Peter Vardy, who then decided to not only adopt creationist texbooks but also adopt daily prayers and weekly prayer assemblies in these state schools. So in summary, crazy doesn't make you a bad person, and being a bad person is certainly not limited to any particular brand of craziness.



Christians: Creationism and anti-LGBT

Muslim: Prophet is a murderous pedophile

On the other side, some Christians and Muslims are the kindest individuals you might meet. some religious people simply ignore the more archaic parts of their literature I guess. And no this NOT BAITING.. this is just fact(from one born as christian).



Christians done a lot more than creationism. Most recently, there are the catholic church pedophile priests and abortion clinic shootings and bombings. Going back a couple of decades, there was the IRA planting bombs in in England and Northern Ireland. And then, there are the TV interviews of Bush and Blair explaining why they went to war in Afghanistan and Iraq, literally, God told them to do it. Muslims are crazy, but they certainly don't have a monopoly on the violent terrorist warmongering kind of crazy.


The IRA plants bombs because they want all of Ireland to be Irish not because of Christianity.

"God" aka "the party bosses". We all know Bush along with Obama are puppets of their party and their only purpose is to serve as a figurehead.



The IRA planted bombs because they were Catholic.

Blair has said it himself, and people around him has said it about him, and the official reports on the causes of the Iraq war such as the Chilcot report also state it very clearly, he went to war because God told him to.

I have heard a lot of Muslim apologists making exactly the same excuses for the actions of terrorists, about marginalization, integration, sovereignty, etc, etc. It doesn't work for Islam and it also doesn't work for Christianity. The Muslim terrorists committed these violent acts because they were Muslim. The Catholics committed these violent acts because they were Catholic. And Blair went to war because he was a devout Christian who believed he was doing God's work, when he is in fact a delusional war criminal who should be tried for crimes against humanity.

Don't be an apologist for terrorists.
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Posted 7/26/16
The IRA was right, and is right, Sinn Féin should have one united Ireland and the UK and their lackeys should be booted out.

https://youtu.be/A5efOVnyTT8
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onemannation2012 wrote:

Thanks you for this. i realized not all muslim are bad and thanks for some info on the refugee crises.


lmao
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Posted 7/26/16 , edited 8/29/16
Goodman, the problem with your argument is that you're assuming that immigrants are going to continue to perform the same menial jobs, such as picking produce, for the rest of their lives. They don't. Once they get legal status, they look for better paying jobs, and those are typically the jobs that everyone else wants as well. If immigrants were to come to a country and do the same menial jobs that they were originally doing, then, there wouldn't be an issue as they'd fill and continue to fill the jobs these countries need filled. But, they don't, and so, it's a never ending problem of continuing to import more labor because that labor force is continually in flux.

So, no, I don't think immigration, as it currently is, is a good thing. In the US, I would like to see more use of the H2B visas, with it being mandatory that all employees are returned to their countries at the end of their contract and all children born in the US revert to their parent's citizenship and are not eligible for US citizenship or any benefits.

I deal with the US immigration system on a daily basis and it is a highly ineffective and abused system. If the American public were only aware of how people come to the US and head down to Social Security the next day to claim (and receive) benefits from a system to which they never paid into, I think there would be a lot more outrage than there is now.
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Posted 7/26/16

Akage-chan wrote:

Goodman, the problem with your argument is that you're assuming that immigrants are going to continue to perform the same menial jobs, such as picking produce, for the rest of their lives. They don't. Once they get legal status, they look for better paying jobs, and those are typically the jobs that everyone else wants as well. If immigrants were to come to a country and do the same menial jobs that they were originally doing, then, there wouldn't be an issue as they'd fill and continue to fill the jobs these countries need filled. But, they don't, and so, it's a never ending problem of continuing to import more labor because that labor force is continually in flux.

So, no, I don't think immigration, as it currently is, is a good thing. In the US, I would like to see more use of the H2B visas, with it being mandatory that all employees are returned to their countries at the end of their contract and all children born in the US revert to their parent's citizenship and are not eligible for US citizenship or any benefits.

I deal with the US immigration system on a daily basis and it is a highly ineffective and abused system. If the American public were only aware of how people come to the US and head down to Social Security the next day to claim (and receive) benefits from a system to which they never paid into, I think there would be a lot more outrage than there is now.


What if the American Public was told, often, that it was so, but approximately 50% were then told, emphatically, by their chosen leaders, that "it wasn't really happening and even if it was happening it probably wasn't as bad as those evil Republicans are making it out to be anyway what are you racist?"
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Posted 7/26/16

KnightOfZero1991 wrote:

On the other side, some Christians and Muslims are the kindest individuals you might meet. some religious people simply ignore the more archaic parts of their literature I guess. And no this NOT BAITING.. this is just fact(from one born as christian).


no one is born as a Christian babies don't pop out their mommas already waving a flag lolol

or any other religion for that matter

makes for a funny image though
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Posted 7/26/16 , edited 7/26/16

Akage-chan wrote:


So, no, I don't think immigration, as it currently is, is a good thing. In the US, I would like to see more use of the H2B visas, with it being mandatory that all employees are returned to their countries at the end of their contract and all children born in the US revert to their parent's citizenship and are not eligible for US citizenship or any benefits.

.


If you want this, then the only ones who would have a right to live in USA are the native americans. You are from the place you were born in. If someone is born in USA, they are US citizens. You can't deny those rights to those children. Are your ancestors 100% native Americans? if not, it is a little bit hypocritical of you to want to strip children who are born in USA of their rights while you and your family can live in USA perfectly fine.

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