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Post Reply CR: What's the point of User reviews on this site when so many are downvoted into oblivion?
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Posted 9/17/16
I've seen mention of reviews on this site, but I don't know where they are.

Is it a sub-forum or a separate section of the site?

Cheers
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Posted 9/17/16

CasualObserver wrote:

I've seen mention of reviews on this site, but I don't know where they are.

Is it a sub-forum or a separate section of the site?

Cheers


On the same page where you can find the list of videos for a show, there is a tab right next to "Videos" where you can read the reviews. Here's an example.

http://www.crunchyroll.com/grimgar-of-fantasy-and-ash/reviews
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Posted 9/17/16

staphen wrote:


CasualObserver wrote:

I've seen mention of reviews on this site, but I don't know where they are.

Is it a sub-forum or a separate section of the site?

Cheers


On the same page where you can find the list of videos for a show, there is a tab right next to "Videos" where you can read the reviews. Here's an example.

http://www.crunchyroll.com/grimgar-of-fantasy-and-ash/reviews


Ah, thank you Staphen.

I don't usually click shows from there, I use that list to find something specific or that looks promising, then add it to my queue for watching at another time. That explains why I never see any reviews.
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Posted 9/17/16
People read reviews?
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Posted 9/17/16 , edited 9/17/16
There is a solution to this: you and those who agree with you ought to be up-voting all the negative reviews you see regardless of the content.
That's what the kids are doing who vote them down- just voting No for anything less than 5 stars regardless of the content.
They aren't reading anything.

Then you should down-vote any five star reviews- starting with the one listed on top. The way they get there is a few users have some buddies on the site and they agree to vote up each other's reviews. They do the same thing with the comments.
It's not complicated, and was fairly obvious to me when I joined the site. If you see BS on the site, fight back against it.
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Posted 9/17/16 , edited 9/17/16

Hmm..... I haven't been in the User Reviews section for quite sometime now, and what puts me off was one main reason ----- there'd be reviews posted by users after watchin' only a few episodes and not the entirety. Some would even be too eager to post after just watchin' one episode, and no offense intended, but that to me, isn't considered a proper review to cover the whole series.


Your point holds validity and I'll assume that when you've created this thread, that you do finish an anime before makin' your rev-post. Hence, I won't dispute it. But on my end, since I have the habit of checking people's verdict as part of my deciding factor whether to watch a title or not, I opt to go for various sites to make comparisons..... except here.


Sounds unfortunate? Perhaps. And unless CR finds a way to re-do the point system and how to avoid too much clutter in that section, I doubt I'll be checkin' back there anytime soon.
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Posted 9/17/16
You failed to address the two major points of the entire thread.

It's highlighting popular opinion that's fine. What isn't fine is hiding critical opinions which is exactly what this system is doing, thus continuing the narrative that these people are seeking to promote the show. In that case, hard-lined criticism is shoved aside. So, what you are implying is that you advocate censorship. In the end, you don't understand the feature let alone how it can be abused.

Even in the case that I don't know their intentions, there's always the possibility that at least some are simply downvoting it based on the score itself isn't there? Have you considered that as well? Because this is already an issue with Rotten Tomatoes and other reviewing sites. The score is looked at and nothing more. Fans of Suicide Squad petitioned to remove Rotten Tomatoes from existence for the same idea. It isn't a stretch to assume this site suffers a similar case, which it evidently is. The point is that this system can be so easily abused to censor criticism; it's laughable that you do not at least concede that.

Please, feel free throw the word "hypocrisy" around until you feel that you've made a sound argument.
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Posted 9/17/16 , edited 9/17/16

I-Crypt-I wrote:

You failed to address the two major points of the entire thread.

It's highlighting popular opinion that's fine. What isn't fine is hiding critical opinions which is exactly what this system is doing, thus continuing the narrative that these people are seeking to promote the show. In that case, hard-lined criticism is shoved aside. So, what you are implying is that you advocate censorship. In the end, you don't understand the feature let alone how it can be abused.

Even in the case that I don't know their intentions, there's always the possibility that at least some are simply downvoting it based on the score itself isn't there? Have you considered that as well? Because this is already an issue with Rotten Tomatoes and other reviewing sites. The score is looked at and nothing more. Fans of Suicide Squad petitioned to remove Rotten Tomatoes from existence for the same idea. It isn't a stretch to assume this site suffers a similar case, which it evidently is. The point is that this system can be so easily abused to censor criticism; it's laughable that you do not at least concede that.

Please, feel free throw the word "hypocrisy" around until you feel that you've made a sound argument.


This is very true, but unfortunately, this is due to the hardcore fandom of any show. Just look at Berserk 2016 for example. If we were to take a moment, sit down and analyze the entire first season that just recently ended from an objective standpoint, it really wasn't that great of an adaptation to the hit manga in Japan. However, you have over 100 5 star reviews in the review section on this website, with the majority consisting of little to no detail on why it's a 5 star in the first place. Don't believe me? Go take a look at the reviews right now. The amount of vague, fanboyism that's displayed is absolutely mind blowing, and somehow they still get voted up like that was helpful. Here's a recent 5 star review:

"I really get upset on some of the reviews. Berserk is exactly shown the way it is supposed to be. Gory,blood everywhere, in your face slaughter. It is not supposed to be all happy and full of joy. I think the animation is excellent and so happy it is not a copy cat trying to use all the newest CG. The plot or story line is excellent. I would say watch the original then this, and you will understand everything. Well worth the viewing, but it is true that all people have their own taste. I am not a Sailor Moon fan so I do not watch that type."

How is this a review? This is more of a statement befitting a comment section rather than the actual review section. Then, there's this obnoxious example:

"I love the show and I enjoy watching it ............................................................................................................................................................................................................................"

Not kidding, this was copied and pasted, word for word.

It is unfair to the actual legitimate reviews that people take time and effort to putting into only to get down voted heavily, but that's the internet for you. I don't think anyone can change that.

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Posted 9/17/16

I-Crypt-I wrote:

You failed to address the two major points of the entire thread.

It's highlighting popular opinion that's fine. What isn't fine is hiding critical opinions which is exactly what this system is doing, thus continuing the narrative that these people are seeking to promote the show. In that case, hard-lined criticism is shoved aside. So, what you are implying is that you advocate censorship. In the end, you don't understand the feature let alone how it can be abused.

Even in the case that I don't know their intentions, there's always the possibility that at least some are simply downvoting it based on the score itself isn't there? Have you considered that as well? Because this is already an issue with Rotten Tomatoes and other reviewing sites. The score is looked at and nothing more. Fans of Suicide Squad petitioned to remove Rotten Tomatoes from existence for the same idea. It isn't a stretch to assume this site suffers a similar case, which it evidently is. The point is that this system can be so easily abused to censor criticism; it's laughable that you do not at least concede that.

Please, feel free throw the word "hypocrisy" around until you feel that you've made a sound argument.


While you're at it, why don't you kick and scream because they didn't put your favorite review on the damn homepage. So unpopular reviews end up on the last page. If those reviews weren't on the last page, some other reviews would be. What exactly are "they" censoring? Who are "they" anyway? You think Crunchyroll is editing the numbers or paying people to vote against negative reviews? Here's an idea. Why don't you inform us about the "Newest" button so people looking for more recent reviews can find them? Then you can come back and complain again about people censoring negative reviews by posting a bunch of positive ones right after, but only on the popular shows.

Yeah, it's possible that some people might be voting based on the score. What of it? Fact is, you don't actually know whether they did or not. And the score is part of the review so why shouldn't they? Here's another idea. Maybe you should take a tip from "them" and start downvoting the reviews that you don't like. Believe it or not, the system actually works better with more votes.

I'm not even sure I should address your statements about Rotten Tomatoes. By your very own flimsy argument, you assert that Rotten Tomatoes has the same issue and then use it to validate your claim that the system can be abused. Asserting that another site has an issue does not support the notion that this site has an issue, and your claim that the system can be easily abused does not naturally follow. By the way, Rotten Tomatoes is still around, so it looks like you and the fans of Suicide Squad are still in the minority. Here's yet another idea. If the system is really so easy to abuse, why don't you prove it? Go abuse it yourself and see if you can get that information you want to share into the limelight.

There is one valid complaint I think you might have that you haven't brought up. Why doesn't Crunchyroll let you filter reviews by score? As it is, it can be difficult to find negative views on popular shows simply because of the sheer volume of reviews in general, and score is a pretty effective way to identify reviews with differing viewpoints. But rather than a cry about your self-righteous views on censorship, that would be more like a feature request to solve a specific problem. And honestly, I don't see it as much of a problem, because there are other places I can go to get differing viewpoints, like the forums.
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Posted 9/18/16 , edited 9/18/16
So your idea of addressing the issue is spitefully returning the favour and abusing the voting the same way? Great advice you have there Mr. Hypocrisy expert. Calling me self-righteous now? I think you need to look up that word and then "hypocrisy."

As for the Rotten Tomatoes point, you misunderstood it. Fans of Suicide Squad were upset about RT's low aggregate score. They petitioned to remove it entirely. Fans are censoring based on their feelings, and it really comes to no surprise this site suffers the same. What of the positive reviews that are more akin to fandom commenting like the other poster quoted above us? Where's the objectivity in these reviews?

I read reviews because I don't have the time nor will to watch something unappealing. I wish to impart the same courtesy and having that buried is injustice to them as it is to me.


But no, such a thing is absurd to you apparently. I'm not sure you know what points you're making. I don't think I'd care enough anyway at this point.
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Posted 9/18/16 , edited 9/18/16

I-Crypt-I wrote:

So your idea of addressing the issue is spitefully returning the favour and abusing the voting the same way? Great advice you have there Mr. Hypocrisy expert. Calling me self-righteous now? I think you need to look up that word and then "hypocrisy."

As for the Rotten Tomatoes point, you misunderstood it. Fans of Suicide Squad were upset about RT's low aggregate score. They petitioned to remove it entirely. Fans are censoring based on their feelings, and it really comes to no surprise this site suffers the same. What of the positive reviews that are more akin to fandom commenting like the other poster quoted above us? Where's the objectivity in these reviews?

I read reviews because I don't have the time nor will to watch something unappealing. I wish to impart the same courtesy and having that buried is injustice to them as it is to me.


But no, such a thing is absurd to you apparently. I'm not sure you know what points you're making. I don't think I'd care enough anyway at this point.


Soo... Suicide Squad fans weren't able to suppress negative opinion, meaning that Rotten Tomatoes doesn't have the same problem as this site? I obviously still don't understand the point you're trying to make there.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here and look up self-righteous.


having or characterized by a certainty, especially an unfounded one, that one is totally correct or morally superior.


I've been arguing this whole time that popular reviews are being highlighted and unpopular reviews are being suppressed, but you seem to think that negative reviews which are unpopular need to be featured on the top page. You are basing this on the made-up fact that people are arbitrarily voting down opinions with scores lower than 4/5 and that it is inherently wrong to do so. You are essentially arguing from a high horse, and I don't see how that could be anything but self-righteous.

I'm pretty much convinced now that I used hypocrisy correctly too, but let's see...


the practice of claiming to have moral standards or beliefs to which one's own behavior does not conform; pretense.


The double-standard here being that you want to be able to suppress other more popular reviews by featuring your favorite unpopular reviews on the top page instead of the ones that are currently there. Furthermore, you want this based on your own agenda of sharing negative information on the show, but the people who do the voting have the clearly dishonest agenda of sharing their positive opinion on the show.

As for the suggestion to abuse the system, I merely asked you to prove it. If it goes against your self-righteous moral fiber, then feel free to disregard it.

Also, if someone really wants to read your favorite negative reviews so bad, it's not impossible to find them. There is no injustice here. Perhaps you should be thankful that Crunchyroll is allowing people post their unpopular opinions in the first place. But the fact that they do allow it does not mean that they have to feature your favorites.

EDIT: Looks like I failed to respond to one of your questions, so here it is. The poster who quoted above us mentioned Berserk. Why don't we have a look at the top page of reviews for Berserk? It's changed a little bit since yesterday, but I still see a 2-star review on the top page that was posted over a week ago. All the fandom comment reviews that he mentioned are simply not there, likely buried under the helpful ones. Seems to me like the voting system is working pretty well.
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Posted 9/18/16 , edited 9/18/16

staphen wrote:


EDIT: Looks like I failed to respond to one of your questions, so here it is. The poster who quoted above us mentioned Berserk. Why don't we have a look at the top page of reviews for Berserk? It's changed a little bit since yesterday, but I still see a 2-star review on the top page that was posted over a week ago. All the fandom comment reviews that he mentioned are simply not there, likely buried under the helpful ones. Seems to me like the voting system is working pretty well.


Actually, if you read my post, I said "recent" which means newest reviews posted. Most of those helpful ones were posted very early on when Berserk first started airing. I only see one helpful review that was posted just a little over a week ago that is an actual true objective review.
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Posted 9/18/16

Lemontitties wrote:


staphen wrote:


EDIT: Looks like I failed to respond to one of your questions, so here it is. The poster who quoted above us mentioned Berserk. Why don't we have a look at the top page of reviews for Berserk? It's changed a little bit since yesterday, but I still see a 2-star review on the top page that was posted over a week ago. All the fandom comment reviews that he mentioned are simply not there, likely buried under the helpful ones. Seems to me like the voting system is working pretty well.


Actually, if you read my post, I said "recent" which means newest reviews posted. Most of those helpful ones were posted very early on when Berserk first started airing. I only see one helpful review that was posted just a little over a week ago that is an actual true objective review.


I did read your post, and I wasn't responding to you. I cleverly decided not to respond directly to you because I don't disagree with what you said.
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Posted 9/18/16

staphen wrote:


I did read your post, and I wasn't responding to you. I cleverly decided not to respond directly to you because I don't disagree with what you said.


Gotcha, my apologies.
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Posted 9/18/16
Thats simply how the internet is. If people even slightly dislike an opinion than that opinion gets buried. The internet is all about polarizing everything in black and white despite it not being like that in real life. There isn't much you or CR could actually do about it.
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