Post Reply RWBY is not as great as it could be
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Posted 10/2/16 , edited 10/2/16


So I have a big gripe about a show I like. A show that I feel could be a lot better, but due to a lack of direction and bad writing, is limiting itself. I am talking about RWBY. Season 4 is coming out soon so I figured I would look back at the 3 seasons that have come out and see what they could of done better at.

First off, there really is no consistency other than every season the animation gets better, and since season 4 is animated in Maya rather than Poser Pro really shows. One thing I did like about RWBY is how certain plot elements that came to fruition in season 3 were present in season 1. On the same token, other things have been swept under the table and seemingly forgotten about. Character development in the series is bad to say the least. It reminds me of reading a shounen from an author who has never done one before, and with Rooster Teeth being a small company, really had no place making a cast so large in the first place all to populate its world. Granted some are minor characters, others not so much.

I liked how Cinder Fall was showcased as having the fall maidens power in episode 1, and seeing other various elements happen in season 1 and to come back in 3 really showed how well they planned events would happen. That begs the question, if they planned so far ahead and had 3 years ahead on the script, why in the hell was season 3 so rushed to get to the point? Events in 3 moved along really fast and had no time to properly develop and plan events, aside from Cinder's ascension as the main villain. One of my big gripes is how they killed off Roman Torchwich and Pyrrha Nikos. Going back to what Rooster Teeth said and what I have seen, when RWBY started, they all knew Pyrrha was gonna die. So how in the hell did they fail so horribly at ending her story. Was there even a story to begin with? Nope. Killing Pyrrha off had no affect on the outcome of the story whatsoever and just wasted the potential of what Pyrrha could of brought to future seasons of RWBY. Killing off a character is acceptable when certain variables are met in my opionion: A) Helps progress the story The character is properly developed and in the position to be used as a plot device to further the story C) The character is continually used in the story to further help the story in segments pertaining to that characters backstory. Its troubling that Jen Brown confirmed that Pyrrha is dead and she no longer voices that role which tells me that they will not be narrating backstory for Pyrrha later on in near recent present flashbacks or somehow tidbits of conversation Pyrrha had with people she met and conversed with before she joined the story/things she could of said to different characters in RWBY that weren't put on the screen. Variables A and B are not satisfied, and I am holding off on C until I see a couple more seasons. So to answer a question, yes she was my favorite, and no I don't hold that in contempt. What I do is they killed off an underdeveloped character that had potential to move the story, or create different plot points with the enigmatic character known as Pyrrha.

So to compare Pyrrha to a character I felt was a great character we knew a lot about as the show went on, and we learned even more about his younger life in future seasons. I am talking about Ned Stark.
So Pyrrha was born in... somewhere? Her parents were... People? What she did before she came to beacon? Oh thats easy, that was... You know, activites and stuff. Aside from Captain Obvious facts like her hair is red and she wields a spear, we really don't know anything about her, and we probably never will. I credit that to a rushed narrative. Volume 3 felt like they crammed 2 scripts together to make one. I say that because it shows. I say that because of the various things I've read about Rooster Teeth and how the whole operation changed when Monty Oum died. I say that the original vision he had for RWBY is gone and in the coming seasons, we will see when the story becomes clearly evident that Monty Oum no longer has any creative authority over the writing. Mind you that season 1 and 2 he had authority over were completely worthless in a narrative sense.
Ned Stark was the king of the north. He married Catlyn and had many children. He fought in a war with the other houses to bring down a tyrant known at Aegon Targaryon. He fathered a bastard with a tavern wench and regrets his decision, but not the child. He then went on to serve as the hand of the king for his long time friend Robert Baratheon, and went to the place known as King's Landing. Later, by his own chivalric code and strong sense of justice and doing whats right, his life came to an end. His story didn't though. Throughout the other seasons of game of thrones, and especially the last one that came out, we learned more about Ned Stark in the past and his travels. We might possibly see this incorporated in RWBY at some point with another younger voice actor for Pyrrha, but thats to be seen.
Season 1, we saw an average episode length of 3 minutes. Aside from the Hunter Exam, all we got was the characters bullshitting around. Season 2 wasn't much better. It introduced even more minor characters it incorporated in the world and fleshed out some of them in ways that had no relevance in creating character development for the story. The most talked about and defining moment in season 2 was the food fight. Really? When people really have nothing better to remember about something they watched than a food fight that had nothing to do with pushing the story forward, they you have failed as writers to emotionally attach someone to your story. We saw the end of the second season as the last 4 episodes when the tonal shift made a sudden change to more of a darker tone compared to what we saw before hand.
Season 3 was the best season yet, and it fell short of what I was hoping it would be able to accomplish. We did get the best animation at that point, and the average length did go to around 11 minutes which is great. We did learn a good deal about Pyrrha and how her decision to acquire the fall maidens powers could affect the balance of the world, but later we would not see any fruit bare from such an event. What we did see was the killer dances moves of the cast! Right? I wasn't too thrilled about. It did nothing but waste time and distract viewers from the inevitable gut punch that was the deaths of 3 characters later on.
My favorite thing is how insanely fast power creep was in the series. In season1, they could barely as a big group take out a single grimm. In season 2, with group tactics they could. It was still hard though. In season 3, the characters are running around culling grimm left and right with sheer ease! When were they ever capable of doing that? Apparently now, cause Rooster Teeth says so. The whole Cinder Falls incident shouldn't of happened till season 5, but yeah things change. Especially since the creator died. What I don't get is Pyrrha died, and got disentigrated. Not just her flesh, her clothes, and her armor and weapons which are made of a metal capable of transforming properties, which would take quite a bit of heat to even outright instantly disentigrate metal. Stranger still is that some reason Pyrrha's circlet survived when everything else on her person got completely destroyed. So something special is with that circlet, but the question is if we will see anything from it. Well if its any indication that they competely forgot about Jaune and his semblance, then we may never see anything. After all, JNR joined Ruby on her quest and seemingly forgot about Pyrrha at the end of season 3. Seriously? No grieving from Jaune? Who was the closest to Pyrrha, and we get nothing. Reminded me of how Fuuka Akitsuki was killed and we knew how that story went. Of course to RWBY's credit, Pyrrha was a minor character so her lack of presence won't affect anything.
I am excited for season 4, but don't expect much in aside from an angst teen drama akin to Twilight. Season 4 will most likely be a lot calmer than season 3 was as the characters soul search and find answers to what the hell just happened. I know I am. Maybe they will fucking remember, "Oh yeah, we did give Jaune a semblance right?"
If Rooster Teeth is smart, they would at least if not bring Pyrrha back, bring Jen Brown back so they can create dialogue pertaining to her character before beacon. That is if they have any intention to flesh her out. With the way the decided to make RWBY edgy and kill off 3 characters in the blink of a season, then no they won't. Also don't try too hard to be dark Rooster Teeth, develop it and make it come naturally. So RWBY at this point is a 2.5/5 for me.
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Posted 10/2/16 , edited 10/3/16
It's good to see passion in the youth, even over something that was never good. Rooster Teeth should have stuck with making a lark out of Halo.
Posted 10/2/16 , edited 10/3/16
i didn't like it either
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Posted 10/2/16 , edited 10/2/16

Legendzerox wrote:


These types of things always go well /sarcasm.

Characters constantly grow and change along with the world aka consistency. And "bad development", its worlds better than some other anime out there since they actually respect their characters. The characters don't straight up fit into the usual stereotypes, instead even if they have traits of them there's deeper things behind them (ie Weiss isn't standoffish simply because she's a tsundere, but because of how people treat her, her lifestyle up to coming to Beacon, and her family circumstances). They also don't demean/degrade their characters by doing fanservice every chance they get, again showing respect for their characters and sets them apart from standard anime. So, I completely disagree.




It wasn't rushed, they gave each thing its necessary time and didn't over-focus on things; though they are a small company so some things didn't make the cut but that didn't hurt the story or the pacing.

Roman's death was just like everything with his character was: lined with dark comedy aspect. As for Pyrrha, her story was handled in a way fitting the story. She went out as a hero trying her best to take down the villain even against overwhelming odds, because that's the kind of person she was (a heroic one). Her death shows that even the mightiest of warriors can fall and specifically to Ruby shows the cruelty the world is capable of. I loved, respected, and was heartbroken over Pyrrha's death but there was a reason for her death and trying to say otherwise just shows a narrow vision.

a) Pushed the tone shift and danger level of the world that up to that point had been light-hearted; also showed that the mightiest can fall thus reinforcing the point.
b) She was always at risk of something happening to her (including death), because of how high her skill level was and that she was placed as a hero. Also she isn't one of the main characters so expecting to get a huge full-on exploration was never likely from the start.
c) Just because Jen won't be voicing her going forward, doesn't mean there can't be expansion on her story via meeting people who knew her (parents, schoolmates, friends, etc).

They killed off a developed character who's death would show the stakes of the battle happening. They let her have her heroic moment to show her metal; and she did gloriously regardless of the outcome she earned the title of "hero" for trying.




Pyrrha wasn't a core MC, she was a secondary much like Coco/Velvet/Sun/Neptune/Glynda/etc which means if any story is given for them you should be grateful. All of these things could easily be brought up via other characters talking about her and/or talking to people who knew her; though once again she's a secondary thus not the focus of the story.

Miles, Kerry, and Monty all oversaw the writing of RWBY, this b.s. about it changing away from Monty's vision is just that b.s. and honestly it needs to stop. The fact is and has been stated by Jen herself, Pyrrha's death was going to happen even while Monty was still alive and working on the story; it wasn't something suddenly thrown in. Also the food fight is so remembered because it turned a food fight into an awesome/badass event, which as far as I know isn't something anyone else has done as well. Looking at fan art, reading posts about RWBY, and talking to people about it I can easily say your assertion on it not having "emotional attachments" is nothing more than a pipe dream. Vol 3 alone killed multiple people emotionally because they were so emotionally invested in these characters.




They'd been training since v1 to v3 and been through some particularly difficult battles to learn the hard way. Instead let's have them show no growth at all /sarcasm. The reason Cinder put her plans into motion when she did was because of the Vytal Festival, which wouldn't be around come v5; so no it shouldn't have been put off. Pyrrha's circlet still being around to me is an artistic choice, to further demonstrate the fall. The fandom isn't going to let them forget about Jaune's semblance, but that doesn't mean they should rush to show it either; when its fitting for them they'll show it. No one in RNJR forgot about Pyrrha, there's a small time skip in the v3 finale that takes place between Fall & Winter shift so I'm sure during that time Jaune and the others were in full depression mode. Add to that Jaune even after that time skip still is downtrodden and that Nora & Ren are simply putting on a facade to lower the depression and there's more than enough grief for Pyrrha (and everyone else) going on.

If RT is smart, they'll keep doing what they do and write their story as they see it; especially considering RvB is now at 14 seasons and is tied to the "will go on till people stop wanting it" idea. They are still worlds ahead of most anime, and even further than that when it comes to female characters.
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xCrimsonEX wrote:


Legendzerox wrote:


These types of things always go well /sarcasm.

Characters constantly grow and change along with the world aka consistency. And "bad development", its worlds better than some other anime out there since they actually respect their characters. The characters don't straight up fit into the usual stereotypes, instead even if they have traits of them there's deeper things behind them (ie Weiss isn't standoffish simply because she's a tsundere, but because of how people treat her, her lifestyle up to coming to Beacon, and her family circumstances). They also don't demean/degrade their characters by doing fanservice every chance they get, again showing respect for their characters and sets them apart from standard anime. So, I completely disagree.




It wasn't rushed, they gave each thing its necessary time and didn't over-focus on things; though they are a small company so some things didn't make the cut but that didn't hurt the story or the pacing.

Roman's death was just like everything with his character was: lined with dark comedy aspect. As for Pyrrha, her story was handled in a way fitting the story. She went out as a hero trying her best to take down the villain even against overwhelming odds, because that's the kind of person she was (a heroic one). Her death shows that even the mightiest of warriors can fall and specifically to Ruby shows the cruelty the world is capable of. I loved, respected, and was heartbroken over Pyrrha's death but there was a reason for her death and trying to say otherwise just shows a narrow vision.

a) Pushed the tone shift and danger level of the world that up to that point had been light-hearted; also showed that the mightiest can fall thus reinforcing the point.
b) She was always at risk of something happening to her (including death), because of how high her skill level was and that she was placed as a hero. Also she isn't one of the main characters so expecting to get a huge full-on exploration was never likely from the start.
c) Just because Jen won't be voicing her going forward, doesn't mean there can't be expansion on her story via meeting people who knew her (parents, schoolmates, friends, etc).

They killed off a developed character who's death would show the stakes of the battle happening. They let her have her heroic moment to show her metal; and she did gloriously regardless of the outcome she earned the title of "hero" for trying.




Pyrrha wasn't a core MC, she was a secondary much like Coco/Velvet/Sun/Neptune/Glynda/etc which means if any story is given for them you should be grateful. All of these things could easily be brought up via other characters talking about her and/or talking to people who knew her; though once again she's a secondary thus not the focus of the story.

Miles, Kerry, and Monty all oversaw the writing of RWBY, this b.s. about it changing away from Monty's vision is just that b.s. and honestly it needs to stop. The fact is and has been stated by Jen herself, Pyrrha's death was going to happen even while Monty was still alive and working on the story; it wasn't something suddenly thrown in. Also the food fight is so remembered because it turned a food fight into an awesome/badass event, which as far as I know isn't something anyone else has done as well. Looking at fan art, reading posts about RWBY, and talking to people about it I can easily say your assertion on it not having "emotional attachments" is nothing more than a pipe dream. Vol 3 alone killed multiple people emotionally because they were so emotionally invested in these characters.




They'd been training since v1 to v3 and been through some particularly difficult battles to learn the hard way. Instead let's have them show no growth at all /sarcasm. The reason Cinder put her plans into motion when she did was because of the Vytal Festival, which wouldn't be around come v5; so no it shouldn't have been put off. Pyrrha's circlet still being around to me is an artistic choice, to further demonstrate the fall. The fandom isn't going to let them forget about Jaune's semblance, but that doesn't mean they should rush to show it either; when its fitting for them they'll show it. No one in RNJR forgot about Pyrrha, there's a small time skip in the v3 finale that takes place between Fall & Winter shift so I'm sure during that time Jaune and the others were in full depression mode. Add to that Jaune even after that time skip still is downtrodden and that Nora & Ren are simply putting on a facade to lower the depression and there's more than enough grief for Pyrrha (and everyone else) going on.

If RT is smart, they'll keep doing what they do and write their story as they see it; especially considering RvB is now at 14 seasons and is tied to the "will go on till people stop wanting it" idea. They are still worlds ahead of most anime, and even further than that when it comes to female characters.


You had a lot of detailed things to say which was nice, and some are correct. In that Pyrrha was a heroic figure. You are incorrect in her being developed, among other things. RWBYS story in volume 1 and 2 were quite horribly written and showed that they didn't think would get as big as it did and they didn't really try. Hence the average 3 minutes. Though you are entitled to your opinion as much as I am, but you will see by the end of volume 4.
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Posted 10/3/16 , edited 10/3/16

Legendzerox wrote:

You had a lot of detailed things to say which was nice, and some are correct. In that Pyrrha was a heroic figure. You are incorrect in her being developed, among other things. RWBYS story in volume 1 and 2 were quite horribly written and showed that they didn't think would get as big as it did and they didn't really try. Hence the average 3 minutes. Though you are entitled to your opinion as much as I am, but you will see by the end of volume 4.


Detailed = me actually approaching this in a serious manner.

Again Pyrrha wasn't a main character, she was a secondary. Saying she wasn't developed is like saying Glynda hasn't been developed, both of them are secondaries that if they get any development they're lucky. Pyrrha actually got 2 character showcasing points: 1) when she chose to sacrifice her life and Jaune in order to accept the Amber's aura and 2) when she chose to go after Cinder. Both of these decisions go toward her character and show the burden she carried. RWBY v1&2 were fine, for you they may not have done whatever you wanted but for others (and quite a good amount of these considering the popularity of the series) they were good to great. I love when people try to claim others "didn't really try" just because whatever doesn't match what that particular person wants; they tried and did plenty again I'd point to RWBY's popularity and praise that its gotten.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion and that opinion can be commented/pushed back on when put into a public space, so long as all of this is considered and stressed as your opinion. Also the part about the writing and/or direction changing after Monty died, that is a grey area of opinion/fact and its also been refuted multiple times by Miles & Kerry, so its a moot/invalid point that only serves to cause anger and divisiveness. I don't exactly know what you expect me to see, but I have only high hopes and respect for wherever RWBY goes. I'll still be watching and probably praising it by v10 because I love the characters, the world, and the people working on it.
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Posted 10/3/16 , edited 10/3/16

xCrimsonEX wrote:


Legendzerox wrote:

You had a lot of detailed things to say which was nice, and some are correct. In that Pyrrha was a heroic figure. You are incorrect in her being developed, among other things. RWBYS story in volume 1 and 2 were quite horribly written and showed that they didn't think would get as big as it did and they didn't really try. Hence the average 3 minutes. Though you are entitled to your opinion as much as I am, but you will see by the end of volume 4.


Detailed = me actually approaching this in a serious manner.

Again Pyrrha wasn't a main character, she was a secondary. Saying she wasn't developed is like saying Glynda hasn't been developed, both of them are secondaries that if they get any development they're lucky. Pyrrha actually got 2 character showcasing points: 1) when she chose to sacrifice her life and Jaune in order to accept the Amber's aura and 2) when she chose to go after Cinder. Both of these decisions go toward her character and show the burden she carried. RWBY v1&2 were fine, for you they may not have done whatever you wanted but for others (and quite a good amount of these considering the popularity of the series) they were good to great. I love when people try to claim others "didn't really try" just because whatever doesn't match what that particular person wants; they tried and did plenty again I'd point to RWBY's popularity and praise that its gotten.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion and that opinion can be commented/pushed back on when put into a public space, so long as all of this is considered and stressed as your opinion. Also the part about the writing and/or direction changing after Monty died, that is a grey area of opinion/fact and its also been refuted multiple times by Miles & Kerry, so its a moot/invalid point that only serves to cause anger and divisiveness. I don't exactly know what you expect me to see, but I have only high hopes and respect for wherever RWBY goes. I'll still be watching and probably praising it by v10 because I love the characters, the world, and the people working on it.


And you think I'm not approaching this in a serious manner? I like RWBY as much as anybody else, but I'm not gonna be blinded by fanboyism.
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Posted 10/3/16 , edited 10/3/16
I think it does alright. It has issues, but does fine.
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Posted 10/3/16 , edited 10/3/16
I kind of lost interest in this partway thru the second season, but I was surprised to hear that they killed off Pyrha and what happened to Yang.

Dunno. Might watch this season just to see what happens. I'd be heartbroken though if they killed off Nora or Jaune.
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Posted 10/3/16 , edited 10/3/16

Legendzerox wrote:

And you think I'm not approaching this in a serious manner? I like RWBY as much as anybody else, but I'm not gonna be blinded by fanboyism.


No, I wasn't saying anything about how you were approaching this. What I was saying is that I gave this my full attention to respond, which I don't do for every thread, comment chain, post I see (in other words: I was showing both you and this thread respect).

I'd say from your points, you're "blinded" by your love/respect/whatever else you want to put in there for Pyrrha. The writers could write a golden ultimate script, and you'd likely still hate it because Pyrrha's dead. Which in a way is a good thing and a sign of good writing, because it means you got emotionally invested in that character which is one of the things a writer tries to accomplish.
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Posted 10/3/16 , edited 10/3/16

xCrimsonEX wrote:


Legendzerox wrote:

And you think I'm not approaching this in a serious manner? I like RWBY as much as anybody else, but I'm not gonna be blinded by fanboyism.


No, I wasn't saying anything about how you were approaching this. What I was saying is that I gave this my full attention to respond, which I don't do for every thread, comment chain, post I see (in other words: I was showing both you and this thread respect).

I'd say from your points, you're "blinded" by your love/respect/whatever else you want to put in there for Pyrrha. The writers could write a golden ultimate script, and you'd likely still hate it because Pyrrha's dead. Which in a way is a good thing and a sign of good writing, because it means you got emotionally invested in that character which is one of the things a writer tries to accomplish.


Ok then my b. I know you like the show a lot as you took the time to respond in length. I like the show too. Otherwise I wouldn't of written something so lengthy myself. Its just we have different views. Mind you I am also not a professional reviewer. Its not Pyrrha herself that irked me, its that they took a character with more potential alove than dead and killed her. As I said, she was a sacrifice to change the tone of the show and thats it. Under different circumstances, I would of been ok with her death. Her death was pure shock factor and nothing more.
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Posted 10/3/16

Legendzerox wrote:

Ok then my b. I know you like the show a lot as you took the time to respond in length. I like the show too. Otherwise I wouldn't of written something so lengthy myself. Its just we have different views. Mind you I am also not a professional reviewer. Its not Pyrrha herself that irked me, its that they took a character with more potential alove than dead and killed her. As I said, she was a sacrifice to change the tone of the show and thats it. Under different circumstances, I would of been ok with her death. Her death was pure shock factor and nothing more.


I'm not a professional reviewer either, though I do write as a hobby so I can see why certain things are done and see potential arcs. Pyrrha being alive would take away a bit of the "danger" element and would've possibly led to her having to hand over her hero title to Ruby from the way the story is going vs her dying cementing that no one is completely safe in the world of Remnant and Ruby trying to train herself up to earn the hero title from Pyrrha's legacy/memory. If this were a standard anime I think this would be the point where most would want a spinoff for Pyrrha since then she'd be moved from secondary to primary, though at least
As I've mentioned before her death wasn't just pure shock factor (aka edgy), if it was I'd have my picket sign as well since I utterly hate edgelord b.s.; but I see both her death and Yang's loss of an arm as sending the message of "even the mighty fall" and show the danger the world poses. As it stands now Pyrrha went down as a hero and her legacy will carry on in Ruby.
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Posted 10/21/16
I'll emerge from my lurk to jump in on this, if only because I love RWBY so much. (And I want to make a related posting on the main thread anyway.)

I don't think Legendzerox is off base with their criticisms. RWBY is an often-unpolished and sometimes even amateurish production, but that is part of its charm. It oozes its authorial process from every pore and wears its tumultuous inspirations proudly; and that in-itself is a thing of beauty. Monty and the other show makers visibly pour(ed) their hearts and souls into this show. They were willing to take risks and explore angles that would never fly with the fiscally-conservative mainstream entertainment media (here in the West and even in Japan). In that I'd actually go so far as to compare RWBY to a Gainax or Trigger production. Even if the former is nowhere near as transgressive, they share the same unabashed revelry in their own excesses.

Of course the big difference between Gainax and Rooster Teeth is experience. The Japanese production house is so storied because their creative risk-taking almost always pays off. RWBY, by contrast, is still learning, and its track record is accordingly mixed.

For instance, I'd agree RWBY has way too many characters for its own good. It seems like secondary characters are treated primarily as a showcase for the art department and a chance for voice acting cameos. This is not necessarily a bad thing and many shows pull of giant ensemble casts with aplomb. However unique characterization seems to be an aspect of writing that Miles, Kerry, and Monty have trouble with, even with their main cast. Having such a large stable of characters only accentuates this difficulty. Therefore this is one instance where I think Rooster Teeth's risk-taking has little to redeem it.

On the other hand, one could argue the same shotgun approach has produced excellent dividends in other areas.
Consider the fight scenes. One could argue the bulk of the first three volumes are basically a procession of contrived pretexts to frequently showcase Monty's incredible fight choreography in all its marvelous diversity. And yet even if that was all there was to RWBY it would still be a decent show. (And I would make that argument: in my eyes, all through volumes 1 and 2, right up until the midpoint of volume 3, the fighting was still RWBY's main draw and principle redeeming quality.)

However I think the best argument for the genius of Rooser Teeth's creative spray-and-pray strategy is the plot itself. Up to this point, RWBY is absolutely dense with unresolved plot threads. We've got the moon; the relationships of humans, grim, aura, and dust; Yang and Ruby's moms; Blake and the faunus civil rights struggle; why the hell Jaune is still playing hunter when he clearly lacks the aptitude; Ozpin's deal; the four maidens; and now the silver eyed warriors.
Like Lost or even Harry Potter, it's the slow burn and churn of mysteries and conspiracies in the background that makes a series like this so engrossing in the long term. And let us not forget, all through the first three volumes we had Cinder's conspiracy and the relationship between Jaune and Pyrrha: of late suddenly and simultaneously resolved two years after their introduction, which was undoubtedly the most affecting moment of the series to date.

Of course, in the long term it's probable some of these plot threads will be dropped, or forgotten, or find dumb and unsatisfactory conclusions. After all, many better skilled and more experienced writers than these have failed spectacularly at the same challenge. But we can't fairly judge The Rooster Teeth guys until they've taken their crack at it.
For now, could we possibly agree that RWBY is objectively a mixed bag in terms of quality (of writing and otherwise), BUT it is a VERY INTERESTING mixed bag, for those who can come at it with a tolerant mindset. That in itself should be enough to label it subjectively good.
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Posted 10/21/16
P.S. Let's take a moment to talk Pyrrha specifically.
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Posted 10/21/16 , edited 10/21/16
Ah a very interesting opinion. I rarely see negatively towards RWBY so thanks for this honestly. It gave me more insight. I agree and disagree to an extent. I like RWBY because it kind of has that amateurish appeal and I'm always rooting for it to get better, and each season I'd say it did. It's not the greatest written thing ever but I don't mind that one bit, I don't think it's really trying to be that either. It dips its toes in interesting topics and the plot I think is pretty cool. Plus the fights and animation is great. It's CGI anime done right.

Totally agreed there's too many characters for the writers' own good. With a show that's a short, they have way too many characters that feel like dead weight and can even take away from the essential characters.

On Pyrrah, I didn't mind that she died, so much as how she died. I think it's fine to kill off a character for whatever reason, knock yourself out, but don't make it feel too cheap and unnecessarily. To me Pyrrah died for nothing. She decided to fight an impossible fight when she could have easily gotten away. I understand she wanted to be heroic and fight for her friends, but it just made the situation worse for them. They have now lost a very important warrior and she basically killed herself for no reason, it was a very stupid decision on her part and she should have fought another day. To me it felt out of character for her to make such a rash decision.

I would had have no problem if let's say Cinder tried to go after her and she died trying to save Jaun. Something that involved defense rather than her going on the offensive in an impossible to win fight! That's my biggest gripe of it all.

Anyways, I was very sad that she died and I'm sure it will serve some purpose, I don't mind knowing about her parents or whatever, I think she got enough development for me to care about her and think she was a good character.

And btw, Jaun and Pyrrah's relationship was one of the best things to happen to the series.



BoredTraveler wrote:

I'll emerge from my lurk to jump in on this, if only because I love RWBY so much. (And I want to make a related posting on the main thread anyway.)

I don't think Legendzerox is off base with their criticisms. RWBY is an often-unpolished and sometimes even amateurish production, but that is part of its charm. It oozes its authorial process from every pore and wears its tumultuous inspirations proudly; and that in-itself is a thing of beauty. Monty and the other show makers visibly pour(ed) their hearts and souls into this show. They were willing to take risks and explore angles that would never fly with the fiscally-conservative mainstream entertainment media (here in the West and even in Japan). In that I'd actually go so far as to compare RWBY to a Gainax or Trigger production. Even if the former is nowhere near as transgressive, they share the same unabashed revelry in their own excesses.

Of course the big difference between Gainax and Rooster Teeth is experience. The Japanese production house is so storied because their creative risk-taking almost always pays off. RWBY, by contrast, is still learning, and its track record is accordingly mixed.

For instance, I'd agree RWBY has way too many characters for its own good. It seems like secondary characters are treated primarily as a showcase for the art department and a chance for voice acting cameos. This is not necessarily a bad thing and many shows pull of giant ensemble casts with aplomb. However unique characterization seems to be an aspect of writing that Miles, Kerry, and Monty have trouble with, even with their main cast. Having such a large stable of characters only accentuates this difficulty. Therefore this is one instance where I think Rooster Teeth's risk-taking has little to redeem it.

On the other hand, one could argue the same shotgun approach has produced excellent dividends in other areas.
Consider the fight scenes. One could argue the bulk of the first three volumes are basically a procession of contrived pretexts to frequently showcase Monty's incredible fight choreography in all its marvelous diversity. And yet even if that was all there was to RWBY it would still be a decent show. (And I would make that argument: in my eyes, all through volumes 1 and 2, right up until the midpoint of volume 3, the fighting was still RWBY's main draw and principle redeeming quality.)

However I think the best argument for the genius of Rooser Teeth's creative spray-and-pray strategy is the plot itself. Up to this point, RWBY is absolutely dense with unresolved plot threads. We've got the moon; the relationships of humans, grim, aura, and dust; Yang and Ruby's moms; Blake and the faunus civil rights struggle; why the hell Jaune is still playing hunter when he clearly lacks the aptitude; Ozpin's deal; the four maidens; and now the silver eyed warriors.
Like Lost or even Harry Potter, it's the slow burn and churn of mysteries and conspiracies in the background that makes a series like this so engrossing in the long term. And let us not forget, all through the first three volumes we had Cinder's conspiracy and the relationship between Jaune and Pyrrha: of late suddenly and simultaneously resolved two years after their introduction, which was undoubtedly the most affecting moment of the series to date.

Of course, in the long term it's probable some of these plot threads will be dropped, or forgotten, or find dumb and unsatisfactory conclusions. After all, many better skilled and more experienced writers than these have failed spectacularly at the same challenge. But we can't fairly judge The Rooster Teeth guys until they've taken their crack at it.
For now, could we possibly agree that RWBY is objectively a mixed bag in terms of quality (of writing and otherwise), BUT it is a VERY INTERESTING mixed bag, for those who can come at it with a tolerant mindset. That in itself should be enough to label it subjectively good.


Yes exactly! You pretty much read my mind.
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