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Post Reply Decline in good anime
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37 / M / SW Ontario, Canada
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Posted 10/3/16
Eh, some seasons are winners and some are not. I do, however, find something to like or even love pretty much every season though. Maybe that's because my tastes tend to run towards what is currently "in" or maybe it's because I'm willing to at least try almost anything and haven't locked myself into a "X is the only REAL anime" mindset.
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Posted 10/3/16
Sure the Golden Age is dead but we still have WAN PAAAAANNNCHH *guitar riff*
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Posted 10/3/16

MysticGon wrote:

Sure the Golden Age is dead but we still have WAN PAAAAANNNCHH *guitar riff*


Ikr? And the gloriousness of Reigen-sama
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Posted 10/3/16
I don't think it's decliend as much as it's expanded thus allowing for more crap.

See back in the old days not much anime was made each season. yeah a few new shows would come out but not like what we have today and that makes all the difference for two reasons. First less anime able to be made means they had to put more work into making sure it was good enough to sell or else an anime studio would go under. But now the big companies churn out one or two a season and they've also worked out a formula for easy money with minimum effort.

This means every season will have junk series that are JUST good enough to be worth watching to some and thus making money.

But works of passion and ones made with effort do still come out.



That all being said the fall season is mostly crap. It's seriously been a while where I could find so few anime I actually wanted to watch. Most of the stuff I'm watching this season only because there is nothing better to pick from. So yeah this season is really dry.
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Posted 10/3/16
I haven't been too thrilled with the fall choices either. Oh, how I long for another season of HunterxHunter or Shiro Bako!
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Posted 10/3/16

Metazoxan wrote:

I don't think it's decliend as much as it's expanded thus allowing for more crap.

See back in the old days not much anime was made each season. yeah a few new shows would come out but not like what we have today and that makes all the difference for two reasons. First less anime able to be made means they had to put more work into making sure it was good enough to sell or else an anime studio would go under. But now the big companies churn out one or two a season and they've also worked out a formula for easy money with minimum effort.

This means every season will have junk series that are JUST good enough to be worth watching to some and thus making money.

But works of passion and ones made with effort do still come out.



That all being said the fall season is mostly crap. It's seriously been a while where I could find so few anime I actually wanted to watch. Most of the stuff I'm watching this season only because there is nothing better to pick from. So yeah this season is really dry.



I have to agree with you very much. Back in the day there were also more studio originals, compared to now where half the shows that get released every season are adapting a manga or light novel that is made according to a template of what will sell well over original works that bring something new to the table. These shows are also more like advertisements that only present a single season in order to promote the source material. If the publishers of these books waited for the series to be completed before getting an adaptation, then chances are we would actually get proper conclusions for these series.
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15 / M / California
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Posted 10/3/16
Y'all are just to critical. You go into anime with the mindset of looking for things that are wrong with it. Maybe it's easier for me since I'm a kid, but I just ignore those things and enjoy it. Except there are some shows that are just really, really bad and you just don't watch those, but those are the minority not the majority.
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Posted 10/3/16
If we ever get another anime as good as Death Note, then I'll faint and never wake up from happiness
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Posted 10/3/16 , edited 10/3/16
I think the reason why you're so upset with the current anime is probably because some of them not all lack originality. Majority of the fans don't want something original and true. They prefer mainstream and cliché. Cliches are more popular than anything with originality that is just how it is nowadays. Get use to it or stop watching anime for good.
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37 / M / UK
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Posted 10/4/16

Helix91 wrote:


thatguy9099 wrote:

I'm sorry I just have to rant a little bit but what happen to anime.. When I was growing up You get great shows like yuyu hakusho, outlaw star, dragonball z, rurouni kenshi an so on. but nowadays nothing but these Girly anime shows are coming out or freaking magical girl.. yaoi type anime seems to be popular. I just dont get it. i dont even watch half the line up when shows come out anymore. unless an anime is hit like naruto or have ecchi scenes (tits an ass) showing they dont make it anymore. Are japanese viewers so freaking creepy they cant rate a good show when they see it anymore??? I know I'm not gonna like every show that comes out but to me it seems like 70% of shows that come out anymore are terrible. 20% are decent an that last 10% are good.. Just my opinion on matter though. like to hear everyone elses thoughts as well.


I agree that magical girl shows (really Madoka Magica ripoffs) and male idol/reverse harem shows are two genres that have risen a lot in recent years, and that's a bummer if you don't like them.

Seriously though, there are too many male idol shows right now, I'll give you that.


But like any industry, when something sells well, people try to copy its success. Madoka's number 2 in sales I think , second only to Bakemonogatari. Heck even Fate jumped on the bandwagon with its magical girl spinoff (fourth season now?) Incorporating that into an industry that makes 40-50 episodes per week, and has a tendency to flog each and every idea to death, you're bound to get a lot of overlap.

Sparking the whole male idol/reverse harem was probably Free's fault. Unless it's the KyoAni effect, both series sold 20k+ per volume, which makes it highly profitable. That seems to have created a deluge of similar products, and I'm too lazy to look it up, but some seem to be selling well, suggesting that market hasn't been mined to death yet.

A few years ago it was Gundam/mecha, and I wouldn't be surprised if Rezero sparked an influx on nasty timeloop stories.

I'm waiting for the evitable mashup of every popular idea - the magical shinigami girl who fights in a gundam and has to save the school from closure by singing and playing a guitar whilst running a marathon.



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Posted 10/4/16
There has been a shortage of good anime recently, but it sounds like your problem is you simply haven't looked hard enough otherwise you'd not be putting DBZ on that list. That said I can do without all the male fan service anime that seems to have skyrocketed in popularity in recent years.
Kintor 
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Posted 10/4/16 , edited 10/4/16

Nogara-san wrote:

Go watch Mob Psycho 100 or Space Patrol Luluco.


I agree that some shows need a course in screenwriting, but fanservice in both genders is what sells the most.

I get what you're saying but I disagree with the notion that fan service is the most profitable kind of anime possible. It's a fact that the anime industry today is nothing like it was 15 or even 10 years ago. Where once a anime could be reasonably expected to run for 25 or even 50 episodes a new anime today is lucky to surpass a mere 12 episodes. To top it all off most modern anime is also operating at a much lower budget, hence the predominance of uninspired fan service shows. This means we are getting less anime as a whole per series and typically at a lower quality than before. The business model for most anime is broken; these fan service shows aren't pioneering new heights of profitably for the industry they're just scavengers fighting over the ruins of a once great industry.
Is-9 
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Posted 10/4/16
One thing you need to keep in mind (aside from the obvious 'music was better in the 70ies' issue and what looks like a skewered perspective - magical girl shows have been around since the 60ies!) is that a lot of the anime you mention were made for a mainstream audience and aired on daytime TV. In the early 2000s (yes, that long ago - all the shows you mention are more than 15 years old) there was a shift in anime funding that led to a huge increase in anime targeted mostly at fans, airing late at night. (ANN's Answerman had a good column on the shift recently).

These days, a lot of anime is made for pretty specific audiences - abusive vampire dudes, girls who are also WWII-era warships and magical girl spinoffs of deathgame VNs are not for everyone. Once in a while a huge hit that appeals to a broad audience comes along (Code Geass, Attack on Titan, etc), but a lot the art of navigating the current anime landscape is in noticing which shows are for you and which are not. You're not supposed to watch half of a given season, you're supposed to pick out the things that are for you.

There ARE trends, and sometimes a trend you don't care for becomes dominant, which can be annoying (I didn't personally care much for the 'four cute girls doing cute things in a club' explosion that happened after K-On! became a monster hit), but you sound like your problem is with current anime as a whole, not with the dominant trends, which in my opinion is LN battle harems (in decline), idols (at zenith) and bishonen shows (on the rise).

The truth is that you might simply be growing out of anime. That happens to the majority of fans at some point, once you start realizing that the new hot shows might as well be reruns of things you've already seen. Most anime is made with a fan turnabout of 2-3 years in mind, meaning that you start seeing the same tropes pop up again and again if you hang around for a while. At that point, you either start moving on from anime or you start being more picky, which usually means turning away from the most tropey genres and being more selective in your choices. Find out what you really want to watch, seek it out, and then stop caring about what else is out there. I watch 5 new anime a season at the most and feel confident that I'm not missing out on anything that I would actually like.

Sturgeon's law and all that.
Kintor 
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Posted 10/4/16

Is-9 wrote:

One thing you need to keep in mind (aside from the obvious 'music was better in the 70ies' issue and what looks like a skewered perspective - magical girl shows have been around since the 60ies!) is that a lot of the anime you mention were made for a mainstream audience and aired on daytime TV. In the early 2000s (yes, that long ago - all the shows you mention are more than 15 years old) there was a shift in anime funding that led to a huge increase in anime targeted mostly at fans, airing late at night. (ANN's Answerman had a good column on the shift recently).

These days, a lot of anime is made for pretty specific audiences - abusive vampire dudes, girls who are also WWII-era warships and magical girl spinoffs of deathgame VNs are not for everyone. Once in a while a huge hit that appeals to a broad audience comes along (Code Geass, Attack on Titan, etc), but a lot the art of navigating the current anime landscape is in noticing which shows are for you and which are not. You're not supposed to watch half of a given season, you're supposed to pick out the things that are for you.

There ARE trends, and sometimes a trend you don't care for becomes dominant, which can be annoying (I didn't personally care much for the 'four cute girls doing cute things in a club' explosion that happened after K-On! became a monster hit), but you sound like your problem is with current anime as a whole, not with the dominant trends, which in my opinion is LN battle harems (in decline), idols (at zenith) and bishonen shows (on the rise).

The truth is that you might simply be growing out of anime. That happens to the majority of fans at some point, once you start realizing that the new hot shows might as well be reruns of things you've already seen. Most anime is made with a fan turnabout of 2-3 years in mind, meaning that you start seeing the same tropes pop up again and again if you hang around for a while. At that point, you either start moving on from anime or you start being more picky, which usually means turning away from the most tropey genres and being more selective in your choices. Find out what you really want to watch, seek it out, and then stop caring about what else is out there. I watch 5 new anime a season at the most and feel confident that I'm not missing out on anything that I would actually like.

Sturgeon's law and all that.

I think it's a mistake on your part to assume anime is merely cyclic; there's nothing natural about the prevalence of fan service shows and there's certainly no reason to believe that with time the damage down to the anime industry will spontaneously repair itself. The business model and creative atmosphere which made shows like Code Geass possible is under threat. That in all probability something with ambition of Code Geass simply wouldn't get made today because the industry can no longer support such demanding ventures. This is where the problem with fan service anime becomes more complicated, these low budget shows might be doing well enough to ensure their own survival (like a self-replicating virus if you will) but they aren’t causing the anime industry as a whole to grow and support high budget content.
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Posted 10/4/16

KongouGaro777 wrote:

I have to agree with you very much. Back in the day there were also more studio originals, compared to now where half the shows that get released every season are adapting a manga or light novel that is made according to a template of what will sell well over original works that bring something new to the table. These shows are also more like advertisements that only present a single season in order to promote the source material. If the publishers of these books waited for the series to be completed before getting an adaptation, then chances are we would actually get proper conclusions for these series.


The problem is that the rental market collapsed, and with so many additional channels and streams now, TV advertising revenue is dropping sharply, and most shows are in graveyard slots. So for an original project to even break even it requires a crazy amount of overpriced bluray sales or merchandising. Hence the production committee to split the risk. For manga and light novel adaptions, you're right about it being advertising, but the publisher doesn't usually see and additional sales after the initial first cour. So unless the anime sales fund itself, it doesn't get a second season.

Studios still back original works though. The problem is that the quality of writing simply hasn't been high enough. This year Mari Okada created Kiznaiver and Mayoiga/Lost Village, neither of which were highly rated. I liked Kiznaiver, but felt it probably needed to be a 2-cour and the writing in places was a bit lackluster. Mayoiga had very original characters, and most people hated them

I'm sure Digibro would like us to believe that the creators of Cowboy Bebop & Baccano are locked away in rooms somewhere, until they start producing moe anime with panty shots But the reality is different.

On the flip side, there's a massive over-supply of anime, because a handful of shows literally print money, eg Bakemonogatari and Madoka and everyone else is trying to get a piece of that pie..

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