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Posted 10/3/16

octorockandroll wrote:


redokami wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:


Cero_of_Clouds wrote:

So, people wanna teach kids about gender identity, but not sex ed. or how to defend themselves? yay


Uh, I'm pretty sure the people who want to ban sex ed from schools are the ones who /don't/ want to have gender identity be discussed in classes.


ya know, bring back sex ed, and make every kid starting in 8th grade take pee pregnancy tests and drug tests inorder to go to school, shit we need to do it for other things,


What are you even talking about?


im talking about how we need to get the next generations more responsible, don't get preg when you are in highschool, don't do drugs in highschool, -which is can also be connected to gang activity - if we do mandatory drug tests at school, likeat jobs, then it can act as a deterant - I cant spell that-


its a step
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Posted 10/3/16

redokami wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:


redokami wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:


Cero_of_Clouds wrote:

So, people wanna teach kids about gender identity, but not sex ed. or how to defend themselves? yay


Uh, I'm pretty sure the people who want to ban sex ed from schools are the ones who /don't/ want to have gender identity be discussed in classes.


ya know, bring back sex ed, and make every kid starting in 8th grade take pee pregnancy tests and drug tests inorder to go to school, shit we need to do it for other things,


What are you even talking about?


im talking about how we need to get the next generations more responsible, don't get preg when you are in highschool, don't do drugs in highschool, -which is can also be connected to gang activity - if we do mandatory drug tests at school, likeat jobs, then it can act as a deterant - I cant spell that-


its a step


Well I think pregnancy and drug abuse should be discouraged as much as possible by schools I think forcing tests on people is really invasive and stepping very far over a school's authority. If the kids are doing drugs/high or getting pregnant on school territory then yeah, by all means, kick them out. But unless they're doing something criminal I don't believe a school has the right to punish students for what they do outside of the school.

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Posted 10/3/16
It's sort of a step in the wrong direction. I don't think it would act as a deterrent, anyway. Drug tests are both somewhat expensive, and the accuracy is somewhat variable.
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Posted 10/3/16

octorockandroll wrote:


redokami wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:


redokami wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:


Cero_of_Clouds wrote:

So, people wanna teach kids about gender identity, but not sex ed. or how to defend themselves? yay


Uh, I'm pretty sure the people who want to ban sex ed from schools are the ones who /don't/ want to have gender identity be discussed in classes.


ya know, bring back sex ed, and make every kid starting in 8th grade take pee pregnancy tests and drug tests inorder to go to school, shit we need to do it for other things,


What are you even talking about?


im talking about how we need to get the next generations more responsible, don't get preg when you are in highschool, don't do drugs in highschool, -which is can also be connected to gang activity - if we do mandatory drug tests at school, likeat jobs, then it can act as a deterant - I cant spell that-


its a step


Well I think pregnancy and drug abuse should be discouraged as much as possible by schools I think forcing tests on people is really invasive and stepping very far over a school's authority. If the kids are doing drugs/high or getting pregnant on school territory then yeah, by all means, kick them out. But unless they're doing something criminal I don't believe a school has the right to punish students for what they do outside of the school.



then by that logic my mother shouldn't have to do a preg test every time she gets her pain medicine for her foot that doctors fucked up and cut the nerves in

she doesn't even have a damn uterus

even if she did who cares if she had sex she is 46 years old and has one kid, me
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Posted 10/3/16

redokami wrote:

then by that logic my mother shouldn't have to do a preg test every time she gets her pain medicine for her foot that doctors fucked up and cut the nerves in

she doesn't even have a damn uterus

even if she did who cares if she had sex she is 46 years old and has one kid, me


That sounds more like "if you are pregnant, these drugs could kill your baby so we need to do a quick test before prescribing anything"...

But anyways, I agree with octorock here. What you are suggesting is not only invasive, it is also costly and ineffective.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/04/27/schools-drug-tests-costly-ineffective-and-more-common-than-you-think/
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Posted 10/3/16 , edited 10/3/16

sundin13 wrote:


redokami wrote:

then by that logic my mother shouldn't have to do a preg test every time she gets her pain medicine for her foot that doctors fucked up and cut the nerves in

she doesn't even have a damn uterus

even if she did who cares if she had sex she is 46 years old and has one kid, me


That sounds more like "if you are pregnant, these drugs could kill your baby so we need to do a quick test before prescribing anything"...

But anyways, I agree with octorock here. What you are suggesting is not only invasive, it is also costly and ineffective.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/04/27/schools-drug-tests-costly-ineffective-and-more-common-than-you-think/


it actually isn't



also if you want to talk about costly , stop doing preg tests on a woman who doesn't have a uterus lmao

oh and don't deny medicine because of a tiny amount of alchohol from a few COUGH DROPS



even when told she doesn't drink
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Posted 10/3/16

redokami wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:


redokami wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:


redokami wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:


Cero_of_Clouds wrote:

So, people wanna teach kids about gender identity, but not sex ed. or how to defend themselves? yay


Uh, I'm pretty sure the people who want to ban sex ed from schools are the ones who /don't/ want to have gender identity be discussed in classes.


ya know, bring back sex ed, and make every kid starting in 8th grade take pee pregnancy tests and drug tests inorder to go to school, shit we need to do it for other things,


What are you even talking about?


im talking about how we need to get the next generations more responsible, don't get preg when you are in highschool, don't do drugs in highschool, -which is can also be connected to gang activity - if we do mandatory drug tests at school, likeat jobs, then it can act as a deterant - I cant spell that-


its a step


Well I think pregnancy and drug abuse should be discouraged as much as possible by schools I think forcing tests on people is really invasive and stepping very far over a school's authority. If the kids are doing drugs/high or getting pregnant on school territory then yeah, by all means, kick them out. But unless they're doing something criminal I don't believe a school has the right to punish students for what they do outside of the school.



then by that logic my mother shouldn't have to do a preg test every time she gets her pain medicine for her foot that doctors fucked up and cut the nerves in

she doesn't even have a damn uterus

even if she did who cares if she had sex she is 46 years old and has one kid, me


Well for one thing no I definitely do not think your mom should get a pregnancy test if she doesnt have her uterus, but that is still a different situation.

A school is only responsible for a child during the 8-ish hours a day monday through friday that the child spends at the school. A doctor is, on the other hand, responsible for taking care of their patients' health whenever they bring up an issue to them. Unlike a child at a school, a patient is not exempt from their doctor's responsibility just because they have left the premises where the responsible person is.

Imagine for a minite that your mom did have a uterus (because if she doesnt it really is bullshit that she has to get a pregnancy test) then if it turned out she was pregnant and the doctor gave her her meds without testing her they could be responsible for damages caused to the baby. So they must test her to make sure they aren't poisoning a fetus by giving her her medication. But there isn't going to be any health related issues with a pregnant girl showing up to class (at least not for the first little while)
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Posted 10/3/16

sundin13

That sounds more like "if you are pregnant, these drugs could kill your baby so we need to do a quick test before prescribing anything"...

But anyways, I agree with octorock here. What you are suggesting is not only invasive, it is also costly and ineffective.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/04/27/schools-drug-tests-costly-ineffective-and-more-common-than-you-think/


I don't think the invasive part is the main issue here. Technically, students have very limited or no 4th Amendment rights since a lot of it is signed off when applying. This is why teachers can go through backpacks, lockers and whatever with only "reasonable suspicion." Also, realistically speaking, most teens don't keep those things secret and pregnancy is a fairly obvious thing. The costly and ineffectiveness is the important parts here. It's really not a bad idea in theory, but it's been proven to suck so whatever.
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Posted 10/3/16

octorockandroll wrote:


redokami wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:


redokami wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:


redokami wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:


Cero_of_Clouds wrote:

So, people wanna teach kids about gender identity, but not sex ed. or how to defend themselves? yay


Uh, I'm pretty sure the people who want to ban sex ed from schools are the ones who /don't/ want to have gender identity be discussed in classes.


ya know, bring back sex ed, and make every kid starting in 8th grade take pee pregnancy tests and drug tests inorder to go to school, shit we need to do it for other things,


What are you even talking about?


im talking about how we need to get the next generations more responsible, don't get preg when you are in highschool, don't do drugs in highschool, -which is can also be connected to gang activity - if we do mandatory drug tests at school, likeat jobs, then it can act as a deterant - I cant spell that-


its a step


Well I think pregnancy and drug abuse should be discouraged as much as possible by schools I think forcing tests on people is really invasive and stepping very far over a school's authority. If the kids are doing drugs/high or getting pregnant on school territory then yeah, by all means, kick them out. But unless they're doing something criminal I don't believe a school has the right to punish students for what they do outside of the school.



then by that logic my mother shouldn't have to do a preg test every time she gets her pain medicine for her foot that doctors fucked up and cut the nerves in

she doesn't even have a damn uterus

even if she did who cares if she had sex she is 46 years old and has one kid, me


Well for one thing no I definitely do not think your mom should get a pregnancy test if she doesnt have her uterus, but that is still a different situation.

A school is only responsible for a child during the 8-ish hours a day monday through friday that the child spends at the school. A doctor is, on the other hand, responsible for taking care of their patients' health whenever they bring up an issue to them. Unlike a child at a school, a patient is not exempt from their doctor's responsibility just because they have left the premises where the responsible person is.

Imagine for a minite that your mom did have a uterus (because if she doesnt it really is bullshit that she has to get a pregnancy test) then if it turned out she was pregnant and the doctor gave her her meds without testing her they could be responsible for damages caused to the baby. So they must test her to make sure they aren't poisoning a fetus by giving her her medication. But there isn't going to be any health related issues with a pregnant girl showing up to class (at least not for the first little while)

I can kind of under stand that

also she doesn't have it because she got cancer from my dad giving her a disease after he cheated


what im getting at is, when whoever brought up sex ed it made me think of how the youth today is detorating -I cant spell tonight, im tired sorry-
morals are being lost

the family structure is being lost


and the school system is teaching bullshit

more than ever do we have drug abuse alcohol abuse sex running rampant, at a young age

I just wish morals were restored, ya know? sex ed was gotten rid of because people didn't take it serious


meaning they didn't take the consuequences of sex serious , andyou know what happens with that
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Posted 10/3/16 , edited 10/3/16

octorockandroll wrote:

Imagine for a minite that your mom did have a uterus (because if she doesnt it really is bullshit that she has to get a pregnancy test) then if it turned out she was pregnant and the doctor gave her her meds without testing her they could be responsible for damages caused to the baby. So they must test her to make sure they aren't poisoning a fetus by giving her her medication. But there isn't going to be any health related issues with a pregnant girl showing up to class (at least not for the first little while)


Even still, how do the doctors know that she doesn't have a uterus? Is it something that she is telling them (people are known to lie or stretch the truth)? How sure are they? There have been plenty of cases of "infertile" people getting pregnant, so what are the odds here in theory?

But essentially, this boils down to doctors following protocol (which makes sense for most people) even for an edge case. Not really anything to get in a tiff about. It is an entirely different question than school drug tests/pregnancy tests.

Further, what do you do if someone is found to be pregnant? Expel them? How exactly will that help that individual not go down the wrong path in life?

PS: Yes, I know I'm quoting you octorock and not redo...I'm not trying to argue with you, I just wanted to add a bit to your points


Cero_of_Clouds wrote:


sundin13

That sounds more like "if you are pregnant, these drugs could kill your baby so we need to do a quick test before prescribing anything"...

But anyways, I agree with octorock here. What you are suggesting is not only invasive, it is also costly and ineffective.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/04/27/schools-drug-tests-costly-ineffective-and-more-common-than-you-think/


I don't think the invasive part is the main issue here. Technically, students have very limited or no 4th Amendment rights since a lot of it is signed off when applying. This is why teachers can go through backpacks, lockers and whatever with only "reasonable suspicion." Also, realistically speaking, most teens don't keep those things secret and pregnancy is a fairly obvious thing. The costly and ineffectiveness is the important parts here. It's really not a bad idea in theory, but it's been proven to suck so whatever.


I'm not saying it is illegal. I'm talking about what that would do psychologically. I know I would feel like I'm living under a totalitarian regime if I was pulled aside once a month to pee in a cup so the school could make sure I'm not doing anything immoral.

And yeah, pregnancy tends to show itself, so why exactly are the tests necessary? Thats a good point.
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Honestly aside from e-cigarettes theres not a lot of drug abuse in school these days (considering...)

In fact a lot of the timelines I was able to find showed its kinda on a decrease

https://d14rmgtrwzf5a.cloudfront.net/sites/default/files/daily-cig-use-grade-2015.jpg

https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/drugfacts/high-school-youth-trends
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Posted 10/3/16

sundin13 wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:

Imagine for a minite that your mom did have a uterus (because if she doesnt it really is bullshit that she has to get a pregnancy test) then if it turned out she was pregnant and the doctor gave her her meds without testing her they could be responsible for damages caused to the baby. So they must test her to make sure they aren't poisoning a fetus by giving her her medication. But there isn't going to be any health related issues with a pregnant girl showing up to class (at least not for the first little while)


Even still, how do the doctors know that she doesn't have a uterus? Is it something that she is telling them (people are known to lie or stretch the truth)? How sure are they? There have been plenty of cases of "infertile" people getting pregnant, so what are the odds here in theory?

But essentially, this boils down to doctors following protocol (which makes sense for most people) even for an edge case. Not really anything to get in a tiff about. It is an entirely different question than school drug tests/pregnancy tests.

Further, what do you do if someone is found to be pregnant? Expel them? How exactly will that help that individual not go down the wrong path in life?

PS: Yes, I know I'm quoting you octorock and not redo...I'm not trying to argue with you, I just wanted to add a bit to your points


Cero_of_Clouds wrote:


sundin13

That sounds more like "if you are pregnant, these drugs could kill your baby so we need to do a quick test before prescribing anything"...

But anyways, I agree with octorock here. What you are suggesting is not only invasive, it is also costly and ineffective.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/04/27/schools-drug-tests-costly-ineffective-and-more-common-than-you-think/


I don't think the invasive part is the main issue here. Technically, students have very limited or no 4th Amendment rights since a lot of it is signed off when applying. This is why teachers can go through backpacks, lockers and whatever with only "reasonable suspicion." Also, realistically speaking, most teens don't keep those things secret and pregnancy is a fairly obvious thing. The costly and ineffectiveness is the important parts here. It's really not a bad idea in theory, but it's been proven to suck so whatever.


I'm not saying it is illegal. I'm talking about what that would do psychologically. I know I would feel like I'm living under a totalitarian regime if I was pulled aside once a month to pee in a cup so the school could make sure I'm not doing anything immoral.

And yeah, pregnancy tends to show itself, so why exactly are the tests necessary? Thats a good point.


as I said to octo it had to be taken out because of cancer
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Posted 10/3/16 , edited 10/3/16
Figured this may be handy down the line.


octorockandroll wrote:to anyone making those hilariously outdated helicopter jokes is comparing an abstract and unquanitfiable state of being to a physical one. That comparison makes no sense.
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Posted 10/3/16

sundin13

I'm not saying it is illegal. I'm talking about what that would do psychologically. I know I would feel like I'm living under a totalitarian regime if I was pulled aside once a month to pee in a cup so the school could make sure I'm not doing anything immoral.

And yeah, pregnancy tends to show itself, so why exactly are the tests necessary? Thats a good point.


Ah, I see. Jeez, I don't think there would ever even be a school that would do that due to the amount of money it would take. Aside from that, unless I'm signing that waiver (like for sports), I think I'm with you on that. I don't find it necessary to piss in a cup for drugs at random or monthly. I mean, it would be good to get the kid help, but the negatives probably outweigh that positive.
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