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Post Reply Back on the ballots death penalty
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F / many homes differ...
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Posted 10/27/16
https://ballotpedia.org/California_Proposition_62,_Repeal_of_the_Death_Penalty_(2016)

Oh- look it's back looks like Aclu up to there push again.. I am voting no cause I support death for criminals
whom have proven to take lives! i really don't give a shit if a killer twists around a bit as the end of life is near
maybe should not have committed the crime. I am sure some you liberals will come on here next and tell me crying about some innocent person getting death? I am talking about dna and proven mass killers. I voted no and am in full support of use of death penalty.
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19 / M / Winnipeg, MB.
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Posted 10/27/16 , edited 10/27/16
Okay but is it really wise to trust the courts that are letting Clinton walk away unpunished, and the whole Brock Turner thing happen, with peoples' lives?
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Posted 10/27/16 , edited 10/27/16

octorockandroll wrote:

Okay but is it really wise to trust the courts that are letting Clinton walk away unpunished, and the whole Brock Turner thing happen, with peoples' lives?


did I say i support Clinton not she should be in jail for her crimes.
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19 / M / Winnipeg, MB.
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Posted 10/27/16 , edited 10/27/16

MysteryMiss wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:

Okay but is it really wise to trust the courts that are letting Clinton walk away unpunished, and the whole Brock Turner thing happen, with peoples' lives?


did I say i support Clinton not she should be in jail for her crimes.


... What are you talking about?
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Posted 10/27/16 , edited 10/27/16
I don't support the death penalty unless they do The Running Man.
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Posted 10/27/16
I support it

people moan and whine our jails are "full"
but then don't support this
and we have serial killers trying to get out, legit

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Posted 10/27/16 , edited 10/27/16
I keep seeing this and thinking that it's about killing off weak bills.
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25 / M / NYC Metro Area
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Posted 10/27/16 , edited 10/27/16
My state got rid of it a few years ago, now we are stuck keeping 2 guys alive who raped and killed 2 young girls and the mother while tying up their father and beating him almost to death. I understand not wanting to use it in cases of doubt, but if you catch them in the act, what is so wrong about giving them a few appeals and then carrying out the sentence? Why are taxpayers forced to pay to keep those who commit the most heinous acts alive for decades? I don't get it.
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19 / M / Winnipeg, MB.
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Posted 10/27/16 , edited 10/27/16

kevz_210 wrote:

My state got rid of it a few years ago, now we are stuck keeping 2 guys alive who raped and killed 2 young girls and the mother while tying up their father and beating him almost to death. I understand not wanting to use it in cases of doubt, but if you catch them in the act, what is so wrong about giving them a few appeals and then carrying out the sentence? Why are taxpayers forced to pay to keep those who commit the most heinous acts alive for decades? I don't get it.


Are taxpayers really paying that much though? In california capital punishment costs the state a reported $308 million per execution. If I recall correctly that is several times the cost of keeping them alive.
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Posted 10/27/16 , edited 10/27/16
There are people that are nothing more than a drain on this world's resources. Dispose of them if you are 100% sure they did it and are guilty. If you are not 100% sure, give them life.

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25 / M / NYC Metro Area
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Posted 10/27/16 , edited 10/27/16

octorockandroll wrote:


kevz_210 wrote:

My state got rid of it a few years ago, now we are stuck keeping 2 guys alive who raped and killed 2 young girls and the mother while tying up their father and beating him almost to death. I understand not wanting to use it in cases of doubt, but if you catch them in the act, what is so wrong about giving them a few appeals and then carrying out the sentence? Why are taxpayers forced to pay to keep those who commit the most heinous acts alive for decades? I don't get it.


Are taxpayers really paying that much though? In california capital punishment costs the state a reported $308 million per execution. If I recall correctly that is several times the cost of keeping them alive.


Yes, I know that it is more expensive. However, better question why does it cost 300 million per execution? Obviously some lawyers are making a killing when it comes to creating more and more red tape. People get so many appeals now that the only way you are likely to face execution would be to beg the government to carry it out, which actually the reason why the final execution in my state was actually carried out.(CT).
(See the Michael Ross case, a serial killer who killed and raped countless women over the course of a decade and basically waived his appeals and kept nagging the state to execute him until they finally decided to comply)
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Posted 10/27/16
One of the biggest purposes for the death penalty is to protect the prisoners, too, particularly the ones who aren't spending their whole lives behind bars. Some of these psychopaths get into prison, realize they've hit the ceiling and things can't get any worse, so they just start killing other inmates without concern or abuse the others knowing that there's nothing worse that can happen to them. Well, with the death penalty there is.

Also, witness protection is an issue. These people will organize the killing of the witnesses in their cases so that in the future there's a better chance for them to get out via appeals, or just do so out of pure vengeance. I mean, if they're in for life, again, what more could happen to them in their eyes?

And plus, pretty much every death penalty case I've ever heard, having grown up on murder and crime shows, is reserved for the lowest of the low with irrefutable evidence, not circumstantial unclear situations like some would have you believe, and even more stringently applied in a liberal state like CA. These people who get the death penalty are killing multiple people in a brutal fashion, I see no reason to waste taxpayer dollars on sustaining their life (which through their own actions they forfeited according to the law) nor endangering our inmates needlessly.

Plus, if you happen to be religious, many if not most religions (all Abrahamic religions, for example) command the death penalty in their scriptures.

Don't get why this is such an issue to be honest, it's the responsibility of a nation to protect its citizenry, and if it takes the death penalty to do so then so be it. We kill other nation's people in conflict, who have not even committed a grievous crime, why not those who do?



And that's just exactly it. Hearing about stuff like this makes any sane person sick to their core. I hope that man is able to recover even slightly from that incident, but it's gotta be nearly impossible knowing these scumbags are still alive and might even make it back to the streets to claim another victim in the future.
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Posted 10/27/16 , edited 10/27/16
I support it ..With some crimes I feel like the only appropriate punishment is death
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25 / M / NYC Metro Area
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Posted 10/27/16 , edited 10/28/16

cheapshotfail wrote:

One of the biggest purposes for the death penalty is to protect the prisoners, too, particularly the ones who aren't spending their whole lives behind bars. Some of these psychopaths get into prison, realize they've hit the ceiling and things can't get any worse, so they just start killing other inmates without concern or abuse the others knowing that there's nothing worse that can happen to them. Well, with the death penalty there is.

Also, witness protection is an issue. These people will organize the killing of the witnesses in their cases so that in the future there's a better chance for them to get out via appeals, or just do so out of pure vengeance. I mean, if they're in for life, again, what more could happen to them in their eyes?

And plus, pretty much every death penalty case I've ever heard, having grown up on murder and crime shows, is reserved for the lowest of the low with irrefutable evidence, not circumstantial unclear situations like some would have you believe, and even more stringently applied in a liberal state like CA. These people who get the death penalty are killing multiple people in a brutal fashion, I see no reason to waste taxpayer dollars on sustaining their life (which through their own actions they forfeited according to the law) nor endangering our inmates needlessly.

Plus, if you happen to be religious, many if not most religions (all Abrahamic religions, for example) command the death penalty in their scriptures.

Don't get why this is such an issue to be honest, it's the responsibility of a nation to protect its citizenry, and if it takes the death penalty to do so then so be it. We kill other nation's people in conflict, who have not even committed a grievous crime, why not those who do?



And that's just exactly it. Hearing about stuff like this makes any sane person sick to their core. I hope that man is able to recover even slightly from that incident, but it's gotta be nearly impossible knowing these scumbags are still alive and might even make it back to the streets to claim another victim in the future.


In this case they got life with no parole as a plea bargain before the death penalty was repealed and then sentences retroactively reduced, but now with the death penalty gone what will be the plea bargain for the highest sentence: life with no parole? Obviously, by getting rid of the death penalty we have now open the doors to parole to future sickos committing similar acts.
This is part of the reason that having the death penalty on the books, even if it is basically never carried out is still a good thing...
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28 / M / Oklahoma
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Posted 10/27/16 , edited 10/27/16
The problem I have with it is that we've already used it to kill innocent people. There are cases where prosecutors have withheld evidence that could indemnify accused and have made efforts to prevent it from being allowed in court.

Prosecutors are awarded by successful convictions, not justice.

As such, I cannot trust such a system. While there are people I would agree that the death penalty is applicable for, the ability for abuse outside of it is high.

Equally, I have a problem with our court systems and things like witness testimony. Often witness testimony is taken at face value when in reality it's anecdotal and prone to flaws. Evidence that is weak can also be postured to look stronger, such as hair comparison and lie detectors. Hair comparison has been used in death penalty states to convict in-spite of parties involved knowing it's pseudo-science at best.

Last but not least, to maintain our constitution of cruel and unusual punishment we have to buy drugs from expensive suppliers. When including the legal fees, the drug costs, etc. it is actually cheaper within our current judicial framework to not have the death penalty.

These require no appeal to emotion to prove and are backed by factual evidence. In comparison the pro-death penalty stance requires emotion with desire for vindication to be accepted.


kevz_210 wrote:
In this case they got life with no parole as a plea bargain before the death penalty was repealed and then sentences retroactively reduced, but now with the death penalty gone what will be the plea bargain for the highest sentence: life with no parole? Obviously, by getting rid of the death penalty we have now open the doors to parole to future sickos committing similar acts.
This is part of the reason that having the death penalty on the books, even if it is basically never carried out is still a good thing...


False dichotomy.
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