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Post Reply Serious Question about Insensitivity.
Posted 11/13/16

Bryaugh wrote:

Aren't you being a little too sensitive about people being upset with insensitivity?

But seriously, there are certain groups of people who have a history of both cultural and institutional oppression and hatred directed at them, and that lingers and must be aknowledged. Seriously think about the history of the group or person you are “being insensitive towards”. I'm not sure what specifically you are referring to. But IMO those particular situations where a minority has been oppressed by the government, religion, and economically need to have that history in mind and adjust the sensitivity.

Lastly, if someone you think is being too sensitive or accusing you of being insensitive and their situation doesn't have that dark history then I guess you're free to be a regular indiscriminate asshole. And you are free to ignore their bitching.


History is not an excuse to throw your hands up and demand special treatment. If we go back far enough in history we all had to deal with living in caves during a mini-ice age. We had big ass cave lions trying to eat us and we probably only bathed once a year.

Everyone's gone through a shitty life. We get it. Many people did many bad things to many other people... we've fixed most of our problems over the past 100 years, no we haven't fixed everything yet. Shit takes time. Some people need to stop bitching about the past. Stop getting offended at every little thing. Work on improving your current situation in life without depending on others for so much, and learn to do for yourself.
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Posted 11/13/16

HolyDrumstick wrote:


sundin13 wrote:

Generally I find it best to not act like a dick whenever possible. "Respect" isn't something that should be criticized as "PC", its just fundamental to being a good person...


True, you absolutely should be respectful when possible.

However, there's also a moment when we need to separate respecting a person and the fact that they have an opinion and calling stupidity out for what it is. I don't mean tossing out insults either, I mean making a decent argument.

I cannot fathom how, in any reasonable reality, presenting arguments can be considered bad simply because they're "insensitive." Insults sure.... but... legitimate arguments and opinions? Nah.


I think that one can disagree with someone in a respectful way, even if you think that their point is stupid. I also think that the disrespectful tone a lot of users took in that one thread was extremely harmful to actually getting any point across. I think the users who did make tactful comments and actually tried to engage with the OP contributed much more to the rude, insensitive comments even if they essentially said the same thing. Like much in these forums, it is less about what you say and more about how you say it.
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Posted 11/13/16

Dogempire wrote:

I'd personally prefer not to get too involved in this topic, but if you're a minority or a woman there's a good chance someone is going to say something racist, sexist, or homophobic to you at least once in your lifetime.

There's no avoiding it, so you have to build up enough self-confidence so if it does happen to you, you can blow them off as idiots instead of crying about it for months or even years.


I'm Male and I read sexist stuff against whites (mainly the internet) all the time and no one thinks twice about doing it. It's just considered normal and us guys don't worry about it or don't care. If we actually took it to heart every time then we would get noting accomplished and spend our entire day replying to the sexism against us.

Instead we either ignore it or troll them quickly and move on. If these crybaby women were men they would commit sucide from all the micro aggressions done against them.
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Posted 11/13/16 , edited 11/13/16
I guess there is a balance. We should be free to express ourselves, to be bold and challenge the rules. But we should also have the wisdom to moderate ourselves when appropriate. We should understand that we will be offended sometimes, and that's OK. Sometimes you have to let it go. Other times you have to take a stand. Conflict is perfectly normal and healthy, as long as we grow from it. Something like that.

I think we find this balance more naturally when dealing with people 1 on 1. When we sit behind a computer, or engage group to group, it's easy to forget to empathize.
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Posted 11/13/16
I always thought if you talk with someone face to face you can see their resolve, maybe understand a little bit about how they function.

Over a connection I tell it like it is, and hopefully people can keep up with me

I treat everyone the same way I would expect them to treat me, but when I get on the internet I like to express myself. Whether it be personal, or for fun. If you call that Insensitive I will kindly show you the virtual door.



I took 5 minutes just to find a picture of a door, I was nice enough to look for some nice doors just to get my point across. Is that something an insensitive person would do? I'm sure they would just put some cheap IKEA door......... You should be thankful
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Posted 11/13/16 , edited 11/13/16
Depends how far they take it IMO

If they say something as insensitive as "Oh you have OCD? Everybody has their own issues, suck it up and just do what you gotta do", I'm gunna feel like smashing their faces in
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Posted 11/13/16 , edited 11/13/16

HolyDrumstick wrote:

I keep seeing things being branded as insensitive. As if being insensitive is a universally bad quality. Or that if you are being insensitive, it is a result of your own lack of empathy and not a result of the stupidity of the opinion/stance you are being insensitive about.


Lemme guess: Like, MODERATORS calling posters "insensitive" for not going along with the Rainbow Mafia, and locking/deleting any threads that disagree?

Yes, we must take steps to help foster good conversation, by shaming and punishing the Bad conversations and reminding them that the Good People run the world, by creating cornfields to wish them into.
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Posted 11/13/16

HolyDrumstick wrote:


Bryaugh wrote:
Lastly, if someone you think is being too sensitive or accusing you of being insensitive and their situation doesn't have that dark history then I guess you're free to be a regular indiscriminate asshole. And you are free to ignore their bitching.


So, we should change how we treat people based on the history of their demographic.

I'm confused.

It's that just a prettier form of bigotry?


It would be closer to another definition of discrimination, discerning the differences between things. But there is really no use in using a word that will be confusing with different definitions and interpretations.

Knowing the differences in people, and adjusting your behavior and communication for those specific differences in a way that is not ignorant of that particular history which really does impact their lives would be an appropriate way to treat people differently in my opinion.

The context, content, and intent are all important in determining what is too insensitive. It's complex and requires some serious contemplation to empathize.

If after all that someone is by your judgement to still be too insensitive then atleast you have some serious thoughts and an argument to back yourself up with.
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Posted 11/13/16

Bryaugh wrote:


HolyDrumstick wrote:


Bryaugh wrote:
Lastly, if someone you think is being too sensitive or accusing you of being insensitive and their situation doesn't have that dark history then I guess you're free to be a regular indiscriminate asshole. And you are free to ignore their bitching.


So, we should change how we treat people based on the history of their demographic.

I'm confused.

It's that just a prettier form of bigotry?


It would be closer to another definition of discrimination, discerning the differences between things. But there is really no use in using a word that will be confusing with different definitions and interpretations.

Knowing the differences in people, and adjusting your behavior and communication for those specific differences in a way that is not ignorant of that particular history which really does impact their lives would be an appropriate way to treat people differently in my opinion.

The context, content, and intent are all important in determining what is too insensitive. It's complex and requires some serious contemplation to empathize.

If after all that someone is by your judgement to still be too insensitive then atleast you have some serious thoughts and an argument to back yourself up with.


I think the word "tact" describes quite well what you are trying to say.

Of course this only applies if someone is actually trying to have a discussion and not just mock someone.
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Posted 11/13/16 , edited 11/13/16

HolyDrumstick wrote:

I keep seeing things being branded as insensitive. As if being insensitive is a universally bad quality. Or that if you are being insensitive, it is a result of your own lack of empathy and not a result of the stupidity of the opinion/stance you are being insensitive about.

Now, I want other opinions on this, because I personally may just be a callous person.


Here are my thoughts, take them as you will.

I feel like the General Discussion forums here are prone to deliberately being (let us say) "insensitive" towards other people's thoughts or feelings. Heck, even I'm like this at times because of how preposterous some of the comments on this forum seem (to me). I attempt to rationalize and understand as much as I can about a person's point of view until they either become outright dismissive or just ignoring the clear facts that I've laid out (not an opinion-fueled statement). I chose the route that resulted in me banning the person from appearing on the forums; mostly out of the idea that I felt that this individual spent more time trolling and trying to get a reaction than to have a genuine conversation.

Your comments, that I've seen so far, are a different brand of "insensitive". You're quick to dismiss someone's opinions just because they don't align with your own (yes, before you even start typing - I know you're thinking that it's a rather common theme in these parts); however, the main aspect that causes people to feel/believe that you're being insensitive is that you don't necessarily care about being insensitive. You're doing so because you feel that you should because it aligns with your perception of the person's attitude or response on the thread. Not that there is anything directly wrong with how you are - it's who you are and that's fine. Though, that's not the question, is it?


HolyDrumstick wrote:
However, I don't see universal sensitivity as a positive thing. I think there are times when, perhaps, we need a little insensitivity. In addition, if someone IS a bit insensitive when maybe they shouldn't be, I don't think it's a big deal.... and definitely not something to get upset about.

We're not babysitting newborns, we're interacting as adults.


People will come up with every excuse in the book as to why they should or should not be sensitive. I don't mean this personally to you; it's a natural thing in humanity. Some will blame the fact that we've had an "Obama ran government for eight years" (here's looking at you, Xxanthar) and others will claim that the war that SJWs have rampaged has spiraled out of control (which means that people are too sensitive). Whatever the case, we somehow mixed up the idea of empathy with sensitivity. We've confused privilege with bias. There's a whole slew of confusing aspects of how people interact nowadays (personally). I agree with the sentiment that you shouldn't really go out of your way to be a dick. However....

The most important thing is that we all believe our opinions matter. That we must correct someone on a forum like Crunchyroll or a social media outlet like Facebook because we're right and they're wrong. Our facts are better than whoever we're debating against's facts.

Nobody cares what I'm typing here. I accept that. Basically, I'm just typing to myself. You may read what I type but that doesn't necessarily that you're going to take what I say with an ounce of seriousness or as something to gain additional understanding from. It's not my job to educate you on what I believe. You don't necessary give a damn about what I feel or what I believe, either. However, we've all been conditioned in the modern day (especially due to the Internet as a whole) that our opinions have value. They don't. We share our opinions in hopes of having a conversation to better enlighten ourselves or those whom we speak to on this forum. It's just that it doesn't mean that we have to jump down someone's throat just because they don't share the same opinion that you do or I do and so on.

Do you think that all of the political discussions and threads on Crunchyroll actually changed someone's mind as to who to vote for? Who not to vote for? Most of the threads I've seen - everyone in the thread had a clear, decisive stance as to who they were voting for and why they were voting for that particular person. Instead, we argued and ranted. We debated, we rationalized, we justified...

Though, if you take what I've said here and applied it to the "Safe Place" thread that was locked.. you would walk away with the core perspective of:

If you don't agree with something or somebody, you do not have to comment on the thread.

That was the "insensitive" bit. The thread did not ask for comments as to why a "safe place" doesn't make sense (to you). It did not ask you or anyone else to post comments that rambled on about the OP being "insensitive of my insensitivity" or anything of the sort. Those who participated in what was perceived as negatively didn't have to participate at all. Yes, this is where the opinion/option that the OP should have created a group and not a thread; came from however, the same rule applies. You don't have to jump into someone's thread, channel, Slack/Discord, or comment thread just because you disagree with what they said. Your opinions (as well everyone else's here, including myself) are not that important. They aren't going to change the OP's mind just because she asked for a safe place that you disagreed with.

"We're not babysitting newborns, we're interacting as adults."

I would disagree with this. As an adult, I know when not to engage in something. If I see two guys pointing guns at one another I do not believe that I'm going to walk in the middle of them and say "Guys, I think this one over here is more right than that one over there. You're both idiots but I think that my opinion is more important than the opinions you two have stated and are arguing about because I'm an individual who has information that I perceive as factual that debunks whatever you're both fighting about."

No, if two people were shooting at one another I would find the nearest and fastest way to get away from that environment and say absolutely nothing to either of them. It's their business, their lives, and their opinions. This is an exaggerated "example" as to what happened in the Safe Place thread.
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Posted 11/13/16 , edited 11/13/16

Xxanthar wrote:


Bryaugh wrote:

Aren't you being a little too sensitive about people being upset with insensitivity?

But seriously, there are certain groups of people who have a history of both cultural and institutional oppression and hatred directed at them, and that lingers and must be aknowledged. Seriously think about the history of the group or person you are “being insensitive towards”. I'm not sure what specifically you are referring to. But IMO those particular situations where a minority has been oppressed by the government, religion, and economically need to have that history in mind and adjust the sensitivity.

Lastly, if someone you think is being too sensitive or accusing you of being insensitive and their situation doesn't have that dark history then I guess you're free to be a regular indiscriminate asshole. And you are free to ignore their bitching.


History is not an excuse to throw your hands up and demand special treatment. If we go back far enough in history we all had to deal with living in caves during a mini-ice age. We had big ass cave lions trying to eat us and we probably only bathed once a year.

Everyone's gone through a shitty life. We get it. Many people did many bad things to many other people... we've fixed most of our problems over the past 100 years, no we haven't fixed everything yet. Shit takes time. Some people need to stop bitching about the past. Stop getting offended at every little thing. Work on improving your current situation in life without depending on others for so much, and learn to do for yourself.


No people shouldn't be bitching about every little thing, but recent history still has a real and major impact today for many people. They are compelled to fight for their rights and cultural acceptance, because it won't just happen on it's own. It actually takes a real and conserted effort to make a cultural change, even after legislation is enacted.
Posted 11/13/16

Bryaugh wrote:


No people shouldn't be bitching about every little thing, but recent history still has a real and major impact today for many people. They are compelled to fight for their rights and cultural acceptance, because it won't just happen on it's own. It actually takes a real and conserted effort to make a cultural change, even after legislation is enacted.



Fight for your rights. If they are legit, I'd probably lend you a hand. Just don't tread on other people's rights as you do it.

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Posted 11/13/16

ninjitsuko wrote:


HolyDrumstick wrote:

I keep seeing things being branded as insensitive. As if being insensitive is a universally bad quality. Or that if you are being insensitive, it is a result of your own lack of empathy and not a result of the stupidity of the opinion/stance you are being insensitive about.

Now, I want other opinions on this, because I personally may just be a callous person.


Here are my thoughts, take them as you will.

I feel like the General Discussion forums here are prone to deliberately being (let us say) "insensitive" towards other people's thoughts or feelings. Heck, even I'm like this at times because of how preposterous some of the comments on this forum seem (to me). I attempt to rationalize and understand as much as I can about a person's point of view until they either become outright dismissive or just ignoring the clear facts that I've laid out (not an opinion-fueled statement). I chose the route that resulted in me banning the person from appearing on the forums; mostly out of the idea that I felt that this individual spent more time trolling and trying to get a reaction than to have a genuine conversation.

Your comments, that I've seen so far, are a different brand of "insensitive". You're quick to dismiss someone's opinions just because they don't align with your own (yes, before you even start typing - I know you're thinking that it's a rather common theme in these parts); however, the main aspect that causes people to feel/believe that you're being insensitive is that you don't necessarily care about being insensitive. You're doing so because you feel that you should because it aligns with your perception of the person's attitude or response on the thread. Not that there is anything directly wrong with how you are - it's who you are and that's fine. Though, that's not the question, is it?


HolyDrumstick wrote:
However, I don't see universal sensitivity as a positive thing. I think there are times when, perhaps, we need a little insensitivity. In addition, if someone IS a bit insensitive when maybe they shouldn't be, I don't think it's a big deal.... and definitely not something to get upset about.

We're not babysitting newborns, we're interacting as adults.


People will come up with every excuse in the book as to why they should or should not be sensitive. I don't mean this personally to you; it's a natural thing in humanity. Some will blame the fact that we've had an "Obama ran government for eight years" (here's looking at you, Xxanthar) and others will claim that the war that SJWs have rampaged has spiraled out of control (which means that people are too sensitive). Whatever the case, we somehow mixed up the idea of empathy with sensitivity. We've confused privilege with bias. There's a whole slew of confusing aspects of how people interact nowadays (personally). I agree with the sentiment that you shouldn't really go out of your way to be a dick. However....

The most important thing is that we all believe our opinions matter. That we must correct someone on a forum like Crunchyroll or a social media outlet like Facebook because we're right and they're wrong. Our facts are better than whoever we're debating against's facts.

Nobody cares what I'm typing here. I accept that. Basically, I'm just typing to myself. You may read what I type but that doesn't necessarily that you're going to take what I say with an ounce of seriousness or as something to gain additional understanding from. It's not my job to educate you on what I believe. You don't necessary give a damn about what I feel or what I believe, either. However, we've all been conditioned in the modern day (especially due to the Internet as a whole) that our opinions have value. They don't. We share our opinions in hopes of having a conversation to better enlighten ourselves or those whom we speak to on this forum. It's just that it doesn't mean that we have to jump down someone's throat just because they don't share the same opinion that you do or I do and so on.

Do you think that all of the political discussions and threads on Crunchyroll actually changed someone's mind as to who to vote for? Who not to vote for? Most of the threads I've seen - everyone in the thread had a clear, decisive stance as to who they were voting for and why they were voting for that particular person. Instead, we argued and ranted. We debated, we rationalized, we justified...

Though, if you take what I've said here and applied it to the "Safe Place" thread that was locked.. you would walk away with the core perspective of:

If you don't agree with something or something, you do not have to comment on the thread.

That was the "insensitive" bit. The thread did not ask for comments as to why a "safe place" doesn't make sense (to you). It did not ask you or anyone else to post comments that rambled on about the OP being "insensitive of my insensitivity" or anything of the sort. Those who participated in what was perceived as negatively didn't have to participate at all. Yes, this is where the opinion/option that the OP should have created a group and not a thread; however, the same rule applies. You don't have to jump into someone's thread, channel, Slack/Discord, or comment thread just because you disagree with what they said. Your opinions (as well everyone else's here, including myself) are not that important. They aren't going to change the OP's mind just because she asked for a safe place that you disagreed with.

"We're not babysitting newborns, we're interacting as adults."

I would disagree with this. As an adult, I know when not to engage in something. If I see two guys pointing guns at one another I do not believe that I'm going to walk in the middle of them and say "Guys, I think this one over here is more right than that one over there. You're both idiots but I think that my opinion is more important than the opinions you two have stated and are arguing about because I'm an individual who has information that I perceive as factual that debunks whatever you're both fighting about."

No, if two people were shooting at one another I would find the nearest and fastest way to get away from that environment and say absolutely nothing to either of them. It's their business, their lives, and their opinions. This is an exaggerated "example" as to what happened in the Safe Place thread.


Well, that's an interesting take on me, who I am, and how I handle things that I don't agree with.

However, it's all bullshit. There are plenty of times that I've come to understandings with people in these very forums, after having a legitimate discussion. So, to be perfectly honest, I find your evaluation of why I am the way I am.... well, let's just say you aren't getting it.

I disagree when people have stupid arguments, going as far as to defend positions I don't entirely agree with, simply because the opposing argument is so terribly bad. Feel free to go look at my discussion on the holocaust (one of these threads on the front page) to see exactly what I'm talking about.

Why am I insensitive? Well, I'll tell you, I'm not always insensitive. When I AM insensitive, it's because walking on eggshells to a sensitive person does nothing to make them less sensitive. In fact, it reinforces their idea that they shouldn't be criticized or deal with opposing opinions. You're welcome to go check that yourself, too.

There's a big difference in your debate scenario and what we're actually dealing with.

Most people realize that. I imagine you know that, but are just trying to cool the waters or smooth things out. People who don't realize that are currently being sheltered from criticism by our society, so.... it's kind of hard to get any criticism to their ears. Case and point: this whole situation on CR -- you saying all this here, now, dismissing everything I said by saying I was unable to adjust my opinion in the first place.

I was going to say more.... but I'm just not.
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Posted 11/13/16

Bryaugh wrote:

No people shouldn't be bitching about every little thing, but recent history still has a real and major impact today for many people. They are compelled to fight for their rights and cultural acceptance, because it won't just happen on it's own. It actually takes a real and conserted effort to make a cultural change, even after legislation is enacted.


Rights and cultural acceptance are often two very different things. There is no one who is oppressed in the US. Everyone is equal.

Guess what, there's always going to be people who don't like you for whatever excuse they can find. Just like certain people don't like me because I'm a straight white dude. I call them out on it, but I certainly don't want big brother sheltering me from such nonsense.

The problem is not equality, but rather people aren't receiving the special treatment they feel they are entitled to because they fall into a special group that a small amount of people are bigoted against.
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Posted 11/13/16
Speaking as someone who had to learn tact and wasn't so much born with it intrinsically...

Tact is necessary to disarm people of their more innate suits of armor--so to speak. Generalizations, as an example, spark the theory of mind humans have. People do not necessarily take generalizations against themselves. On the contrary, they apply theory of mind and wonder as to what image other people may see of them--and often then take personal offense to such because it is a misrepresentation of their individual person (all within a split second).

Humans also often have ideas they grow attached to in a personal manner--where an attack against that idea is against their person.

You also have tribal natures etc. etc. The list never ends.

Tact is the effort put forth to maneuver oneself around the defense systems humans have in order to have a conversation of--hopefully--vague reason. When dealing with humans utilizing tact is a basic necessity to healthy exchange. If one decides to put no effort in--to be completely and utterly 'insensitive'--then what other response would one expect other than a mirrored one? An effortless return?

One needn't be cautious of every little possible intricacy, but humans call for a balanced use of tact. If a person is demanding too much, then they are better left to their own devices I find.

Don't want a conversation? Then one shouldn't bother trying at all, of course.

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