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Affirmative Action for the SAT
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38 / M / Shanghai China
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Posted 12/14/16 , edited 12/14/16
glad I went to school when I did at least back in the 97 I could get a Pepsi from a vending machine for 25 cents and not have to worry about a shitty government tell me what I can and can not eat or drink.
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22 / M / Prison
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Posted 12/14/16 , edited 12/14/16

gsm642 wrote:

glad I went to school when I did at least back in the 97 I could get a Pepsi from a vending machine for 25 cents and not have to worry about a shitty government tell me what I can and can not eat or drink.


I think the only schools I've seen with those left these days would be the Governor schools.
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38 / M / Shanghai China
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Posted 12/14/16 , edited 12/14/16
I never would have graduated today if I went because of the amount of Pepsi I still drank and drank in high school. They would have had me expelled what the government fails to understand is that some people are immune to getting overweight and they shouldn't punish everyone.
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The White House
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Posted 12/14/16 , edited 12/15/16



Amyas_Leigh wrote:


ninjitsuko wrote:

The delusion is real


Yes, your delusion is real.
You didn't read the fact that the article was showing a study - nothing that illustrates or correlates to the actual aspect of Affirmative Action.
Maybe if you stop using Pepe like a troll, you'd be taken more seriously.





Ignoring facts make you delusional. I don't see your facts.

Also stop cyber-bullying pepe, hes just a frog that wants to stop feeling bad.

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22 / M / Prison
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Posted 12/14/16 , edited 12/15/16

gsm642 wrote:

I never would have graduated today if I went because of the amount of Pepsi I still drank and drank in high school. They would have had me expelled what the government fails to understand is that some people are immune to getting overweight and they shouldn't punish everyone.


Might be because of building healthier habits before the freshman 15 takes a toll. Believe me, a lot of people will get fat eating like their teenage years.
Posted 12/14/16 , edited 12/15/16
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28 / F / SC
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Posted 12/14/16 , edited 12/15/16

Dark_Alma wrote:

It isn't like the SAT and ACT are hard anyway. I still outscored 95% of the country.


boy i feel dumb

it's amazing i even got into university. and even graduated with a BA. since i thought the SAT and ACT were hard and scored extremely low

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25 / M / Abyss
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Posted 12/14/16 , edited 12/15/16

Sogno- wrote:


Dark_Alma wrote:

It isn't like the SAT and ACT are hard anyway. I still outscored 95% of the country.


boy i feel dumb

it's amazing i even got into university. and even graduated with a BA. since i thought the SAT and ACT were hard and scored extremely low



Haha, everything through high school was a breeze for me. Then I learned being naturally smart and having no knowledge how to study isn't exactly good in University. I bombed my first 2 years before I learned how to study! I started at a 1.2 GPA. I have worked it back to a 3.2 ... God is it hard though!

To be honest, I think it is the Asperger's that made me like this. I am naturally inclined to the sciences and mathematics, and with a lot of hard work I became a god at reading. I still cant write for the life of me (getting better). It has been theorized that Einstein and Kelvin were Asperger's too. It would be interesting to see a full study on it.

Edit: For reference, I had a 4.2/4.0 (due to dual credit classes giving a 30 pt curve on final grades) by graduation in High School. Top 10% yada yada. Then I went to university and bombed down to 1.2. It was a shock. I changed majors, went to Geosciences and am SLOWLY pulling my grade up.
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32 / M / Duckburg
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Posted 12/14/16 , edited 12/15/16
The funny thing is, I think that the universities taking the shit for being racist against Asians might be the easier path to go down. What I mean here is, Asians are probably the least populous minority in the United States, yet from what I have read they make up the vast majority of applicants to prestigious universities. They also for the most part have better grades than other races. So if Universities admitted people purely based on achievement, which is the right thing to do from a fairness point of view, then the majority of students in prestigious Universities would be Asian, even though their population is the least among the minorities. They would essentially become the academic 1%, except with a race attached.

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23 / M
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Posted 12/14/16 , edited 12/15/16

ninjitsuko

DarthRutsula wrote:

Universities should just offer the same educations everywhere and discourage the whole thought that one school is better than the other. Fix standardized testing (somehow) and provide classes that are practical in the real world, like do you REALLY need to know calculus? Is a class like art appreciation really necessary in most cases?

Imo an education should entail a little bit of everything and then you choose what you want. If anatomy interested you, good for you, be a doctor, but I'd be damned if you can't read a simple income statement, or know how to make a powerpoint (something that a lot of people don't seem to understand).


I agree with the majority of this statement.
Standardized testing is a plague on the public school system right now. The federal government has outlined standardized tests that students must take and their scores reflect onto the teacher as well as the school overall. If the school doesn't meet the criteria for a "passing school" - then they become a "failing school". Now you would think that with all of the initiatives that the government has claimed to be undertaking to help "failing schools" that they'd pay for the vast majority of the upgrades to the teacher roster, better materials and equipment for the school, and so forth - but, they rarely even pay half of these costs and leave it up to the state's board of education to ration out their budget to make up for the shortfall of the school (despite the standardized test is a federal requirement).

As someone who has a Master's Degree in Mathematics, I really wish that more people would take Calculus or Trigonometry. I understand that these courses aren't easy for everyone, but they do offer a different perspective on how to correlate data/information. Some schools actually do have "life courses" like the ones you've mentioned (in high school, especially). As time progresses, more schools are focused on their students passing the standardized exams - which shows the decaying amount of "life courses" because the school's focus is more so to satisfy the federal government's requirement of a "passing" school. I can say that I found the joy of cooking and the ability to sew/hem my own clothes because of some of these courses in middle school (Home Economics). The same course taught me how to double-check my pay stub for any inconsistencies, how to balance a checkbook/bank account and change my own oil/tires on a vehicle. I was 13 years old and probably knew more about the "real world" than most people graduating from college do these days (because these kinds of courses are dwindling away).


PeripheralVisionary wrote:

Equality isn't equal scores, but equal opportunity.

Interestingly enough, 67% of people reject Affirmative Action in colleges.



That's usually because by the time someone reaches the age to go to college, they know that their peers are going to be equal in some way or another. Affirmative action in college just causes conflicts like these. The university of Texas had a run where they had stopped using the Affirmative Action laws (this was supported by the Supreme Court temporarily while they come to a conclusion), it did impact the enrollment of African-Americans in that particular college. The Supreme Court ruled in favor of keeping the Affirmative Action laws applied to colleges as the test run concluded that we still need these kinds of laws to ensure that there's a "proportional minority representation on large, public college campuses". This test was done twelve or so years ago, as far as I recall. The statements during the Supreme Court's case implied that they feel that it shouldn't be necessary in 25 years (from that point) - but they voted to keep it going for the time being. Nobody has actually challenged it since.

I reject that we should need it - and most college students should know well enough whether or not they can handle being in college (or drop out when they realize this themselves). Unfortunately, these kinds of decisions aren't left up to fellow college students in a lot of colleges. That means that it's some old fogey who simply has the antiquated idea that races have different intelligence levels. Some of the posts on this forum indicate that there are users who agree with this and they're only in their late 20's to early 30's (around my age). I don't know how we're really going to get around to handling all of this fairly when there's a division even in the age gap that should accept their peers as equals in some way or another... lol.


I think that it is worth pointing out that higher education isn't for everyone, which sucks given that our society really REALLY encourages us to get a higher education. And not that i'm hinting at any specific ethnicity here (aside from asians) but i'm willing to bet some groups will skew the higher education spectrum, several asian cultures stress that academic success.

But also, i remember hearing on npr not too long ago, that rather than high school students going straight to college/university they should take a year to "grow up" and that those who took that year break actually performed better.

But considering the way current society is, i'm afraid that those extra four years of college will be pretty much mandatory just to be able to earn a decent living unless we cross into the required income laws that have been proposed but denied in several places around the world. Much like our tax system I would like to see our education system get revamped.

And as far as you saying people should delve a little bit into calculus, I disagree. As someone who has taken some calculus I can tell you that it has provided nothing to my simple life. Maybe it helps in a scientific field, but business-wise i haven't had as much use for it as any of the accounting/tax classes i've had. Did you know that the US and the rest of the world uses different accounting standards? Maybe i'm biased towards education reform since I've felt that it has failed many of us.

I remember how i took the ACT this one time and was only able to "answer" 7 questions when I actually answered them all. Curse my own way of taking a test, circle the answers in the book then go back and fill in the answers on the answer sheet. This forces me to go back and kind of double check my work and make sure i didn't skip any which I have had happen before because I couldn't circle my answers, I misaligned them all.
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Posted 12/15/16 , edited 12/15/16
They get better grades because they work harder to get them. I do not think it is a matter of intelligence or latent ability.

Parents push them from a young age to recognize the importance of academic achievement and hard work, and to take advantage of the opportunity they've been given by being here in the US. While other kids are off after school playing video games, they're at an afterschool program or a tutoring program, already preparing for the next standardized test. While other parents okay most of their kids' requests to go places and do things, Asian parents want you to take care of all your things and get your priorities in order first and, even then, you're not allowed to go out too much because you could be doing things that help you even when you don't have school. Like some kind of training or reading. They're pushed to go the extra mile, like take harder classes, get involved with school council stuff, etc. Basically to try to excel at all that they do. Total freedom only comes at adulthood.

It's no wonder that they often achieve more and get higher grades and scores. They deserve them. I've always considered affirmative action to be BS for the sake of diversity. People ought to be considered based on their abilities, their merits, and not the color of their skin, their gender, or other superficial trait.

The darker side is that Asian kids who DON'T have such good parents will have less of a chance to get into a good school with a lower score like, say, 1700.

I got 2100 on my SAT, 97th percentile. Would I have gotten that without being pushed to study? Probably not. Why should someone else's 1850, 85th percentile, have the same value when they clearly put in less work and have less stuff on their resume than me? They're less qualified to take the spot. I'm so glad I'm done with my undergrad and got to avoid this during my senior HS year.
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20 / M / Temple of Yaoiism
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Posted 12/15/16 , edited 12/15/16
Penalizing Asians while giving blacks a boost to their SAT score is the same as paying someone with an Engineering degree the same as someone with a gender studies degree who works at Starbucks.

You shouldn't penalize people for being competent and working hard while rewarding others for being incompetent and making dumb decisions, it's completely against the meritocracy we live in.

Either way, I'm glad I didn't take the SAT, standardized tests are stupid anyways.
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Posted 12/15/16 , edited 12/15/16
Well I'm not familiar with USA SAT. In the UK there's SAT at ages 7 and 11. When you get to around 16 you 're doing GCSE tests in various subjects, these are level 2 qualifications (there are equivalents for those that did not take the traditional route), two years later you do A level tests in various subjects or choose non academical qualifications at the same level (level 3) in a school or college setting. With these results you apply through UCAS for a place in university. The UCAS application form does include a section questionnaire about you background or ethnicity but this has nothing to do with how many points you have to get a university place. That is all dependent on your test results in your chosen subjects or career study route.
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Posted 12/15/16 , edited 12/16/16
I could only really find one other source corroborating this with a quick google search, not sure if it's true, tbh.
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Posted 12/23/17 , edited 12/23/17
Year-end cleanup. Closing threads with no new posts since 12/31/2016.
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