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Post Reply Russia says diplomatic relations with US have been destroyed over expulsions
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Posted 12/30/16
Russia, they got McDonalds there?
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Posted 12/30/16

neotag wrote:

It's scary how much of the right wing has warmed up to Russia, even before Trump. For years "Putin is a stronger leader" on fox news and such things were told. If MSNBC or someone with a (D) said half this stuff they been charged and strung up by the rightwing as tratiors by now. Yet because Trump has a (R) and not a (D) so it's ignored. Because Trump has an (R) McConnell is trying to bury any probe. Fuck Sake Trumps latest excuse/statement summeried to " Move on Computers have complicated lives". LOL WAT? Didn't know we broke the full ai barrier.


To be fair, despite me not liking or trusting the guys at all, Paul Ryan, Mitch McConnell, John McCain and Linday Graham in a bit of a backhanded compliment said Obama "finally" did the right thing today and made the right choice. It looks like Trump may not have the full support of the Republican Party he thought he would.
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Posted 12/30/16

neugenx wrote:


neotag wrote:

It's scary how much of the right wing has warmed up to Russia, even before Trump. For years "Putin is a stronger leader" on fox news and such things were told. If MSNBC or someone with a (D) said half this stuff they been charged and strung up by the rightwing as tratiors by now. Yet because Trump has a (R) and not a (D) so it's ignored. Because Trump has an (R) McConnell is trying to bury any probe. Fuck Sake Trumps latest excuse/statement summeried to " Move on Computers have complicated lives". LOL WAT? Didn't know we broke the full ai barrier.


To be fair, despite me not liking or trusting the guys at all, Paul Ryan, Mitch McConnell, John McCain and Linday Graham in a bit of a backhanded compliment said Obama "finally" did the right thing today and made the right choice. It looks like Trump may not have the full support of the Republican Party he thought he would.


The problem with that is Ryan, McConnell and such were there 2 years ago when obama incressed ongoing sactions, imposed new ones, and did similer stuff in responce to crimea . So yea backhanded is right.

qwueri 
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Posted 12/30/16
Wasn't it a week or two ago Russia was snickering at what Obama could possibly do to retaliate for the hackings? Surprise surprise, he hit them where it hurts most, the wallet.

Given the political climate, I won't be surprised if Trump quiets down about the whole thing. At least if he doesn't want to turn into a lame duck within his first year or two in office.
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Posted 12/30/16 , edited 12/30/16
I feel that Obama is being incredibly childish. "My team didn't win so I'm going to get you back". Get back at the hackers, fine. But the people in the embassy had nothing to do with it. I'm doubtful that a secretary for the Russian Ambassador had anything to do with it, but hey, 72 hours for you and your family to leave the US.

And where, or where, is this glorious proof that the Obama Administration says exists? I have yet to see CNN, FoxNews or the BBC present anything other than "sources say". No, that's absolute garbage. If blatant proof exists, I was to see it to make my own decision as to whether or not it points to, and only to, the Russian government. As is, this lack of transparency which I've gotten so accustomed to during the Obama Administration, only proves my point in that Obama's feelings are hurt and this is how he chooses to retaliate.
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Posted 12/30/16
Unless this country changes its spending habits due to the federal reserves unlimited money printing giving false security what you suggest wouldn't work unless they were some real pricey slaves
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Posted 12/30/16

Xxanthar wrote:


runec wrote:


FLjerry2011 wrote:
I grew up in the 60's with Nuke drills when they had ICBM's on Cuban soil. Since then I dont trust them at all.


I think this is what truly baffles me about this entire scenario. How did half the country that went through the Cold War suddenly do a 180 on Russia? Let alone start slobbering up to Putin of all people. An alarming chunk of America doesn't appear to have any problem whatsoever with the president elect snuggling up to America's biggest historical geopolitical adversary.

I really don't understand it.


Maybe because that's actually not the case? Putin said something nice about trump and Trump returned the compliment. Trump didn't smack his head on the floor bowing and apologizing to our enemies. That was Obama.


I forgot about the political foes killed / nice goverment and you trust them ! / I have enoiugh issues with our country to start with let alone that renegade goverment.interfering DONT you care about your persinal infro / finacial data being hacked ??


The Putin Critics Who Have Been Assassinated "skyNEWS"

Boris Nemtsov

Boris Nemtsov is the latest in a long line of opposition figures who have died under suspicious circumstances in recent years.

09:31, UK, Tuesday 03 March 2015
L-R Boris Nemtsov, Alexander Litvinenko, Anna Politkovskaya
Image Caption: A number of Kremlin opponents have lost their lives in recent years

The murder of opposition politician Boris Nemtsov close to the Kremlin makes him the latest vocal critic of Russian President Vladimir Putin to die violently or in suspicious circumstances.

The former deputy prime minister was gunned down in central Moscow while walking home from a restaurant with his girlfriend on Friday.
Opposition leader Boris Nemtsov presents "The Life of a Galley Slave"
Image Caption: Mr Nemtsov was shot dead while walking with his girlfriend in Moscow

Mr Putin has pledged a full investigation into his death and said he will take personal charge of it.

Some activists have accused Mr Putin of being responsible, while his supporters have suggested Mr Nemtsov's murder may have been a provocation aimed at tarnishing the president's image.

No suspects have been arrested following the murder, considered the one of the most shocking in a long list of suspected political assassinations during Mr Putin's rule.

The Kremlin has denied any involvement in the deaths of these high-profile activists, politicians, journalists and lawyers

Alexander Litvinenko - 2006

Former Russian spy Alexander Litvinenko died in November 2006, almost three weeks after drinking tea poisoned with radioactive polonium-210.

It is understood he ingested the tea during a meeting with two fellow former Russian spies, Andrei Lugovoi and Dmitri Kovtun, at the Millennium Hotel in London's Grosvenor Square. Both deny any involvement in his death and remain in Russia.

Before fleeing Russia and being given British nationality, Litvinenko had accused Mr Putin of corruption. He also blamed Mr Putin for a number of apartment block bombings which helped start the Second Chechen War in 1999, thhe popularity of which helped bring him to power.

Anna Politkovskaya - 2006

The 48-year-old journalist, a prominent critic of Mr Vladimir Putin, was gunned down at her Moscow apartment block on 7 October 2006, the president's birthday. She was shot twice in the chest, once in the shoulder, and once, at point blank range, in the head

Five men were found guilty of the killing, including the gunman Rustam Makhmudov, although it is not yet known who ordered the killing.

Ms Politkovskaya specialised in uncovering state corruption and rights abuses. She won international acclaim for her reports in the Putin-critical newspaper Novaya Gazeta, about Russian abuses in Chechnya, and for her book Putin's Russia.

Sergei Magnitsky- 2009

Lawyer Sergei Magnitsky died in police custody in November 2009 after allegedly being denied medical treatment and brutally beaten.

He had been instructed by British-American businessman William Browder to investigate a multi-million tax fraud against the Russian state which Mr Browder's businesses had become unwittingly involved in. But when Magnitsky found evidence suggesting that police officials were behind the fraud, he was arrested and charged with having carried it out himself.

In July 2012 he was convicted - three years after his death - of tax evasion. Mr Browder successfully lobbied the US government to impose sanctions on those linked to Magnitsky's death.

Natalia Estemirova - 2009

Natalia Estemirova had two bullet wounds to the head

The prominent human rights activist was found dead hours after being kidnapped on 15 July, 2009, in the Chechen capital, Grozny.

The 51-year-old had collected evidence of human rights abuses in Chechnya since the start of the second war there in 1999.

She also worked with the investigative journalist Anna Politkovskaya, who was murdered in 2006.

Stanislav Markelov and Anastasia Baburova - 2009

Leading human rights lawyer Stanislav Markelov was gunned down in broad daylight on 19 January, 2009.

Stanislav Markelov and Anastasia Baburova were both shot dead

Journalist Anastasia Baburova, 25, was shot dead after she tried to come to his assistance.

Mr Markelov had just held a press conference to protest at the early release of an army colonel who was jailed for the killing of a young Chechen girl. He had also represented the murdered journalist Anna Politkovskaya.

Paul Klebnikov - 2004

Mr Klebnikov was the editor of Forbes Russia

Another investigative journalist, Paul Klebnikov, an American of Russian descent, was killed outside his office in a drive-by shooting in Moscow in 2004. He was the editor of Forbes Russia.

Mr Klebnikov had written about corruption in Russia and Forbes had published a list of Russia's richest people.

Sergei Yushenkov - 2003

The co-chairman of the Liberal Russia movement was murdered outside his home in Moscow, on 17 April 2003.

According to the Moscow Times, he was gunned down just hours after the Justice Ministry officially registered his Liberal Russia movement as a party.

Boris Berezovsky - 2013

A coroner recorded an open verdict into Boris Berezovsky's death

Once one of the most powerful men in Russia, the self-made tycoon was leader of the so-called "oligarchs" who wielded power during the presidency of Boris Yeltsin in the 1990s.

But after falling out with Mr Putin - who is said to have been handpicked by Berezovsky as Yeltsin's successor - he fled and settled in Britain, where he became an outspoken critic of the new president.

He was found dead at his Berkshire home in March 2013 in an apparent suicide, although an inquest into his death recorded an open verdict.

http://news.sky.com/story/the-putin-critics-who-have-been-assassinated-10369350


How quickly we forget Russian " War CRIMES this wiil make you pause


Soviet war crimes

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_war_crimes

Afghanistan (1979–1989)

The army of the Soviet Union killed large numbers of Afghans to suppress their resistance. Up to 2 million Afghans lost their lives during the Soviet occupation

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_war_crimes#Afghanistan_.281979.E2.80.931989.29

Posted 12/30/16
I had read the official report on WhiteHouse.gov and waited for this thread to be made - with a biased source illustrating the "repercussions" or circumstance. As a friend of mine said, "Just wait until Breitbart or a liberal source interprets the data in a subjective way, then there's going to be a thread on Crunchyroll about it." Needless to say, I wasn't disappointed.

Perhaps it would be ideal to read the Official Report rather than having it interpreted by a media source. Albeit, I know there are plenty of "Anti-Obama" types here - but, I'm sure you can all agree that it's better to hear (read) it from the horse's mouth versus that of a third-party source that decides to paint a frame around it that aligns with your political views.

----

As for the 180° spin that conservatives (extreme or otherwise) have taken in response to Russia as a country altogether. Not to say that the United States Government is flawless and innocent when it comes to similar war crimes that have been listed in this thread so far, just that even the Russians would have a hissy fit if we obviously attempted to kill Putin or undermine the integrity of Russia altogether. While I will say that there weren't any attempts of assassination, there were obvious attempts to undermine the authority and integrity of the United States as a whole (basically "Haha, you're idiots for even believing us" - yes, this is subjective/anecdotal and my personal perspective on it).

I see that the vast majority of those who are focusing on the evidence fail to realize that the CIA isn't required to show its investigative information to the general population. While I agree it would be awesome, I also realize that there are some things that the CIA just isn't going to reveal to us. We live in an age where people expect to have all of the information - the government is still living in the age where the citizens are viewed as idiots where the more information they have, the more dangerous they are to themselves and the country as a whole. I wish we could have all the information required to create our own perspective/understanding of the data being laid out in front of us - to determine what we believe is truthful and honest or just lies and nonsense. Alas, there isn't a government in the world that follows the ideology of supplying all information to the public.

Posted 12/30/16


Can we get a list of Clinton's 'friends' that have suddenly committed 'suicide' by shooting themselves multiple times with different caliber weapons?
Posted 12/30/16
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Posted 12/30/16 , edited 12/30/16

mxdan wrote:

If this is true my guess is this is at the request of the CIA or some intelligence agency. I highly doubt that Obama would be stirring the pot like this right before he is out of office for no reason other that blind Russian hatred. My guess is than something is happening right now that is making the CIA uncomfortable.


Actually it's apparently common practice for a president to do all the things that they couldn't get away with right before leaving.

Like pardoning criminals and making a few of those policies that they normally would get torn apart for making.

I can't say stuff isn't also going on behind the scenes but I'm just saying it's not that unbelievable that this isn't also personal.

I mean after all that's happened Obama probably doesn't have much left to lose.
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Posted 12/30/16
Wow Putin is making Obama look like an idiot and an asshole. Who kicks diplomats and their families out during the holiday season or when airlines are booked full with new years travellers?

Putin: Russia will not expel anyone in response to US sanctions


The Russian president has rejected a suggestion of the foreign ministry to expel 35 American diplomats in response to a similar move by the US. He said Obama’s act was designed to provoke a reaction, but Russia would not take the bait.

“We reserve the right to retaliate, but we will not sink to the level of this irresponsible ‘kitchen’ diplomacy. We will take further moves on restoring Russian-American relations based on the policies that the administration of President-elect Donald Trump adopts,” Russian President Vladimir Putin said in a statement published by the Kremlin website.

Putin said that, unlike the Obama administration, Russia will not target foreign diplomats and their families days before New Year’s celebrations.

“We will not forbid families and children from spending the New Year’s holidays at the places they are used to. Moreover, I invite the children of all American diplomats with accreditation in Russia to New Year’s and Christmas festivities in the Kremlin,” the Russian president said.

Putin said he regretted that US President Barack Obama is ending his term “in such a way,” but that he extended his New Year’s congratulations to the outgoing US president and his family nevertheless.

“I congratulate President-elect Donald Trump and the entire American people!” he concluded.

The Kremlin said it will send a government plane to the US to evacuate the expelled diplomats and their family members. Earlier, there were reports that the diplomats were having problems buying tickets on such short notice, with airlines already booked by New Year’s travelers.

Earlier, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov suggested that Russia respond to the expulsion of 35 Russian diplomats from the US by expelling 35 American diplomats from Russia. Similarly, the eviction of a Russian diplomatic staff from two vacation houses in the US would be mirrored by a similar eviction of Americans in Russia.

President Obama targeted Russian diplomats as a part of wider sanctions against Russian, which he justified by the alleged interference by the Russian government in the November presidential election in the US. Moscow denies the allegations.

The US claimed that the vacation houses had been used for espionage. Russia insists that they were used by the diplomatic staff to spend holidays with their families.


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Posted 12/30/16

qwueri wrote:

Wasn't it a week or two ago Russia was snickering at what Obama could possibly do to retaliate for the hackings? Surprise surprise, he hit them where it hurts most, the wallet.

Given the political climate, I won't be surprised if Trump quiets down about the whole thing. At least if he doesn't want to turn into a lame duck within his first year or two in office.


Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake. -Napoleon Bonaparte

It would be best for Trump to sit back and let Obama and the Dems make complete asses out of themselves then when everyone is sick of it make a snarky reply about how incompetent Obama is and how he would handle diplomacy much better than that.
Posted 12/30/16

Rujikin wrote:

Wow Putin is making Obama look like an idiot and an asshole. Who kicks diplomats and their families out during the holiday season or when airlines are booked full with new years travelers?



Putin: Russia will not expel anyone in response to US sanctions

Earlier, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov suggested that Russia responds to the expulsion of 35 Russian diplomats from the US by expelling 35 American diplomats from Russia. Similarly, the eviction of a Russian diplomatic staff from two vacation houses in the US would be mirrored by a similar eviction of Americans in Russia.



Translation: "Oh yeah?! Two can play that game! We'll do the same to your diplomats that are here in Russia!"

I don't really see this as Russia getting the "one-up" on these sanctions; just trying to pretend that they're taking the higher road when their hands were caught in the cookie jar. Putin knows that his intelligence agency did do some dirty deeds during the election (and far before it, it's one of the notorious things about the USA/Russia relationship - and why Obama was heavily criticized by Republicans during his term for being "soft" on the Russians). I do find it humorous to see that the Prime Minister of Russia is seeking to retaliate with the same ideology that Obama's sanctions took by mirroring them.

Russia is just as parallel to the United States as it's always been. They're continuously seeking to take things in a democratic spin on what is considered the norm in their society. Putin and Obama aren't much different in how they'll become aggressive and then take a faux-diplomatic approach to things after everything blows up. Really, nothing new to see here when it comes to the generic expectation of relations between the USA and Russia. The only difference is that Trump supporters are actively invested into this because the accusation is that Russia influenced their win (which is neither here or there, as we do not have enough evidence in the public domain to support either side of that particular theory).
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Posted 12/30/16

ninjitsuko wrote:


Rujikin wrote:

Wow Putin is making Obama look like an idiot and an asshole. Who kicks diplomats and their families out during the holiday season or when airlines are booked full with new years travelers?



Putin: Russia will not expel anyone in response to US sanctions

Earlier, Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov suggested that Russia responds to the expulsion of 35 Russian diplomats from the US by expelling 35 American diplomats from Russia. Similarly, the eviction of a Russian diplomatic staff from two vacation houses in the US would be mirrored by a similar eviction of Americans in Russia.



Translation: "Oh yeah?! Two can play that game! We'll do the same to your diplomats that are here in Russia!"

I don't really see this as Russia getting the "one-up" on these sanctions; just trying to pretend that they're taking the higher road when their hands were caught in the cookie jar. Putin knows that his intelligence agency did do some dirty deeds during the election (and far before it, it's one of the notorious things about the USA/Russia relationship - and why Obama was heavily criticized by Republicans during his term for being "soft" on the Russians). I do find it humorous to see that the Prime Minister of Russia is seeking to retaliate with the same ideology that Obama's sanctions took by mirroring them.

Russia is just as parallel to the United States as it's always been. They're continuously seeking to take things in a democratic spin on what is considered the norm in their society. Putin and Obama aren't much different in how they'll become aggressive and then take a faux-diplomatic approach to things after everything blows up. Really, nothing new to see here when it comes to the generic expectation of relations between the USA and Russia. The only difference is that Trump supporters are actively invested into this because the accusation is that Russia influenced their win (which is neither here or there, as we do not have enough evidence in the public domain to support either side of that particular theory).


The Russian president has rejected a suggestion of the foreign ministry to expel 35 American diplomats in response to a similar move by the US. He said Obama’s act was designed to provoke a reaction, but Russia would not take the bait.
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