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Russia says diplomatic relations with US have been destroyed over expulsions
qwueri 
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Posted 12/30/16 , edited 12/30/16

Rujikin wrote:

Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake. -Napoleon Bonaparte

It would be best for Trump to sit back and let Obama and the Dems make complete asses out of themselves then when everyone is sick of it make a snarky reply about how incompetent Obama is and how he would handle diplomacy much better than that.


Until January 20th all Trump can do is sit back and make snarky comments. Putin seems to be banking on Trump assuming a strong pro-Russian stance and repealing sanctions. And maybe he will. But it'll come at a dear cost domestically, especially should any of the details behind why the US intelligence community is so sure of Russian involvement comes to the public. And should Putin gamble wrong on what Trump will do, he'll have lost considerable leeway on relations with the US and possibly any UN member.

*It's probably about the safest bet Putin can make at this point. No matter what he does it plays into the western aggression narrative. But a tit-for-tat escalation is not something the Russian economy can afford. He's managed to spit in the eye of the US through the election regardless of the amount of activity his government played, doubled by strengthened ties with Iran, Syria, and Turkey. Russia taking active retaliation would make it harder for any chance he has at ties with the Trump administration and could lead to worse sanctions and diplomatic backlash from the US and allies. Putin may be alot of things, but I doubt stupid is one of them.
Posted 12/30/16

Rujikin wrote:
The Russian president has rejected a suggestion of the foreign ministry to expel 35 American diplomats in response to a similar move by the US. He said Obama’s act was designed to provoke a reaction, but Russia would not take the bait.


Read what I quoted from the Prime Minister (not the Russian president, Putin). He won't take the suggestion, but the Prime Minister doesn't hold similar power in their government as, say, the United Kingdom/England. I don't think Obama's act was designed to provoke a reaction as much as it is to prevent any further actions. Just because he's not doing it doesn't mean that Putin doesn't want to - he's just biding his time waiting for Trump to take office.
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Posted 12/30/16

qwueri wrote:


Rujikin wrote:

Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake. -Napoleon Bonaparte

It would be best for Trump to sit back and let Obama and the Dems make complete asses out of themselves then when everyone is sick of it make a snarky reply about how incompetent Obama is and how he would handle diplomacy much better than that.


Until January 20th all Trump can do is sit back and make snarky comments. Putin seems to be banking on Trump assuming a strong pro-Russian stance and repealing sanctions. And maybe he will. But it'll come at a dear cost domestically, especially should any of the details behind why the US intelligence community is so sure of Russian involvement comes to the public. And should Putin gamble wrong on what Trump will do, he'll have lost considerable leeway on relations with the US and possibly any UN member.


Haha quite true, but they are bigly snarky comments.

I'd say Trumps policy is whatever benefits America and if Putin is smart, he is, he would offer something in return to make it beneficial to America.

Well the CIA has basically clammed up and refused to put forth the evidence even to congress: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/12/15/lawmakers-fume-over-agency-refusal-to-brief-house-panel-on-russia-hacking-claims.html

Without solid proof it just sounds like political maneuvering.



Amid concerns about reports that conflict with details previously provided to the committee, Chairman Devin Nunes, R-Calif., originally had requested a closed, classified briefing for members from the FBI, CIA, Office of the Director of National Intelligence and National Security Agency.

But Fox News was told the CIA Director John Brennan declined to provide a briefer, citing its focus on the full review requested by President Obama. The other agencies did not respond to the committee’s request, which is unusual given the panel is the most-senior committee with jurisdiction.

Nunes had to cancel the briefing in response.

"It is unacceptable that the Intelligence Community directors would not fulfill the House Intelligence Committee’s request to be briefed tomorrow on the cyber-attacks that occurred during the presidential campaign," Nunes said in a statement. "The Committee is deeply concerned that intransigence in sharing intelligence with Congress can enable the manipulation of intelligence for political purposes."
qwueri 
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Posted 12/30/16

Rujikin wrote:

Haha quite true, but they are bigly snarky comments.

I'd say Trumps policy is whatever benefits America and if Putin is smart, he is, he would offer something in return to make it beneficial to America.

Well the CIA has basically clammed up and refused to put forth the evidence even to congress: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2016/12/15/lawmakers-fume-over-agency-refusal-to-brief-house-panel-on-russia-hacking-claims.html

Without solid proof it just sounds like political maneuvering.



Amid concerns about reports that conflict with details previously provided to the committee, Chairman Devin Nunes, R-Calif., originally had requested a closed, classified briefing for members from the FBI, CIA, Office of the Director of National Intelligence and National Security Agency.

But Fox News was told the CIA Director John Brennan declined to provide a briefer, citing its focus on the full review requested by President Obama. The other agencies did not respond to the committee’s request, which is unusual given the panel is the most-senior committee with jurisdiction.

Nunes had to cancel the briefing in response.

"It is unacceptable that the Intelligence Community directors would not fulfill the House Intelligence Committee’s request to be briefed tomorrow on the cyber-attacks that occurred during the presidential campaign," Nunes said in a statement. "The Committee is deeply concerned that intransigence in sharing intelligence with Congress can enable the manipulation of intelligence for political purposes."


The CIA being too busy working on a full report to do a private briefing for the House Intelligence Committee is not the same as refusing to put forth evidence. I doubt you would have found that briefing any more convincing than the CIA's current statements, considering it was planned to be "a closed, classified briefing".
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Posted 12/30/16 , edited 12/30/16
Why do I find this scary that the right wing is so desperate to smear Obama they will even praise Putin. Because last time 9/11 was the result of this stuff. Bill Clinton declared Bin Laden a threat to the USA went after him 3 times almost got him was off by hours. Every time he did the GOP and there media empire snuggled up the Bin Laden and against the president. "wag the dog Mister Clinton" became a war cry on the Right. For those that don't know "wag the dog" is a political comedy about a president making up a war in a sound stage to win an election and things going horribly right. This lead to Clinton having to stop direct counter-terrorism activities under threat of Congressional investigation and persecution. Clinton left Bush Jr a massive report on Bin laden. Clinton's people tried to warn Bush Jr he ignored all of it as "Clinton stuff". The Right wing put there political goals Over the safety of the country. It's why after 9/11 there was such a media blitz and such about "bush kept us safe" .They never wanted people to find out. Yes they knew something was up yes the could of stopped it but they drunk there own political kool aid and dismissed such concerns.

And here we are again Putin by far someone that does not have the US interests at heart. Who has actively defied international law and snatched land. Who has puppet states set up in countries all around Russia. has personally ordered assassins and war crime be committed. Yet the right wing to smear Obama even on the way out is dismissing the threat for the sake of political points. Only this time it's not some rag tag band of shit heads pooping in the desert mountains, but a leader of one of USA greatest foes. While Putin not going to start world war 3 or nuke the world at 1st. He's still going to try to take the rest of Ukraine which he's been playing a shadow war in. He's going to keep Syria destabilized.

So yea keep dismissing this stuff because of political power games worked out so well last time.

P. S. Also to preempt the predictable response No Clinton was never offered Bin laden that entire story is based of one discredited diplomat who failed at his job of Soften Sudan ties with the USA and then got punished because of it. At the time and to be honest still is Sudan is a state sponsor of terrorist actives and as such has faced sanctions for all these years. Even if it was all true what Erwa claims. The offer was made at the time there wasn't enough evidence against the guy it would be 2 years before he had a inditment, and that was when clinton made the 3 attempts on him geting so close he missed him by a couple hours.
Posted 12/30/16
Lol, thanks for the laughs!
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Posted 12/30/16

Starting to get what people mean by getting old enough to see the same mistakes made.
Posted 12/30/16
Posted 12/30/16


I never quite understood why people made a meme with this. The meme incorrectly describes Trump's expression.
Which, I guess, makes it even funnier.

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Posted 12/30/16


However, it must be understood that the act of declaring 35 people personae non grata is much more damaging than just telling the people to leave the country.

Assuming these people are involved in active intelligence operations, there are three interrelated areas of significant damage:

Publicly exposing the person as a known intelligence operative;
Disrupting active intelligence-gathering operations without the time required to transition operations to another operative; and
Permanently ruining that person's career in operations.

Combined, these create a domino effect that can seriously impact intelligence-gathering activities inside and outside the U.S. for many years to come.

Obama's action severely damages Russian intelligence operations, assuming they were indeed Russian spies.
given that's the case, it seems a fitting response to the alleged hacking - assuming Russia was indeed behind wikileaks.
runec 
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Posted 12/30/16 , edited 12/30/16

neotag wrote:
Why do I find this scary that the right wing is so desperate to smear Obama they will even praise Putin.


"Great move on delay (by V. Putin) - I always knew he was very smart!"

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/814919370711461890

We have an incoming president who has positioned himself against his own government and related agencies. In favour of knobslobbering a hostile foreign leader in a childishly embarrassing fashion. Yet the people praising him for it were the same people screaming at Obama for "bowing to our enemies" and acting "weak" when Obama was engaging in, you know, diplomacy after his inauguration.

Diplomacy = Bowing to our enemies

Responding to an attack by a foreign power = Handjob from the president elect.

>.>


Edit: Oh god he's so proud of that tweet he pinned it.


Posted 12/30/16

runec wrote:


neotag wrote:
Why do I find this scary that the right wing is so desperate to smear Obama they will even praise Putin.


"Great move on delay (by V. Putin) - I always knew he was very smart!"

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/814919370711461890

We have an incoming president who has positioned himself against his own government and related agencies. In favour of knobslobbering a hostile foreign leader in a childishly embarrassing fashion. Yet the people praising him for it were the same people screaming at Obama for "bowing to our enemies" and acting "weak" when Obama was engaging in, you know, diplomacy after his inauguration.

Diplomacy = Bowing to our enemies

Responding to an attack by a foreign power = Handjob from the president elect.

>.>


Edit: Oh god he's so proud of that tweet he pinned it.




But I thought he was going to start a war? Maybe this is his version of Hillary's 'reset' button.
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Posted 12/30/16

namealreadytaken wrote:



However, it must be understood that the act of declaring 35 people personae non grata is much more damaging than just telling the people to leave the country.

Assuming these people are involved in active intelligence operations, there are three interrelated areas of significant damage:

Publicly exposing the person as a known intelligence operative;
Disrupting active intelligence-gathering operations without the time required to transition operations to another operative; and
Permanently ruining that person's career in operations.

Combined, these create a domino effect that can seriously impact intelligence-gathering activities inside and outside the U.S. for many years to come.

Obama's action severely damages Russian intelligence operations, assuming they were indeed Russian spies.
given that's the case, it seems a fitting response to the alleged hacking - assuming Russia was indeed behind wikileaks.


All diplomats are spies as well. They feed back to their country what a country thinks about their policies and finds out where they are willing to negotiate. They also report back rumors and heresay. Isn't this like common knowledge...?

The podesta emails were from a script kiddy that guessed the password from the top 1000 commonly used passwords. Supposedly he manually typed them in didn't even know how to make a script.
runec 
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Posted 12/30/16

Rujikin wrote:
The podesta emails were from a script kiddy that guessed the password from the top 1000 commonly used passwords. Supposedly he manually typed them in didn't even know how to make a script.


Podesta emails were from a spearphishing attack that snagged one of his staff that was screening his emails. Which you would know. If you ever bothered to read or research a topic before you offered your opinion on it.

But that seems to be asking too much of you. -.-

Posted 12/30/16

runec wrote:

Podesta emails were from a spearphishing attack that snagged one of his staff that was screening his emails. Which you would know. If you ever bothered to read or research a topic before you offered your opinion on it.

But that seems to be asking too much of you. -.-



*MEOW* The claws are out now!
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