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Post Reply Some Inauguration Day protesters arrested will be charged with felony rioting [original misleading title removed by mod]
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Posted 1/23/17 , edited 1/23/17
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Posted 1/23/17 , edited 2/6/17

official-shinsengumi wrote:


Kira0309 wrote:

good, shut them up already. Freaking democrats are crazy.



ya know- its usually republicans that act kinda weird

i don't think it was democrats going around calling Obama the antichrist lol






Ya but they didn't run around for months in the street saying "not my president" and rioting to the point of destroying other peoples homes, businesses and lives.
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Posted 1/23/17 , edited 1/23/17

Kira0309 wrote:


official-shinsengumi wrote:


Kira0309 wrote:

good, shut them up already. Freaking democrats are crazy.



ya know- its usually republicans that act kinda weird

i don't think it was democrats going around calling Obama the antichrist lol






Ya but they didn't run around for months in the street saying "not my president" and rioting to the point of destroying other peoples homes, businesses and lives.


Yes they did lol
Posted 1/23/17 , edited 2/6/17
Good. Being butthurt doesn't give anyone the right to set strangers' cars on fire, loot businesses, and assault random people on the street.
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Posted 1/23/17 , edited 1/23/17

octorockandroll wrote:
Seriously people. When this happened I was an 11 year old in another country, and even I knew about this. How on earth could it fly over the heads of actual Americans?


In case you hadn't noticed, the collective American consciousness is about 23 days, after which they seem to move on to whatever has caught their interest then. The threats and nastiness are nothing new, when you have a rule that allows anyone to say any thing about any one you're going to find radical nuts yelling anything about everything. The American media and its population is the living proof of the infinite monkey theorem.
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Posted 1/23/17 , edited 1/24/17
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Posted 1/23/17 , edited 1/23/17
Yeah, gonna have to say with my final opinion, both sides have people that take it too far, the images with them burning an Obama (doll?) and the "Hang in there Obama" were flat out evil imo. Those were / are imo threats.
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Posted 1/23/17 , edited 2/6/17
It's no longer a normal peaceful protest if you become violent unreasonably. It's more like a riot. And you should be arrested if you go around causing damage just to chimp out. I don't feel sorry for any of them. More of them should have been arrested.

Like what the hell, you're destroying your fellow working-class person's property just because you're angry. With a mindset like that, you should be punished.

Peaceful protests? Sure. Breaking windows and burning cars? No, you deserve to be arrested.
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Posted 1/23/17 , edited 1/24/17

ninjitsuko wrote:


Rujikin wrote:

So anyone that is mad "Trump" is arresting protesters can thanks Malik Obama's brother for allowing that stupid law to pass.


You should read the link that you posted. I'll quote the summary:


"[T]here is no Federal law that expressly prohibits unlawful entry to the White House and its grounds or the Vice President's residence and its grounds. The Secret Service must therefore rely upon a provision in the District of Columbia Code, which addresses only minor misdemeanor infractions, when someone attempts to or successfully trespasses upon the grounds of the White House or Vice President's residence."


If you read further into their summary, you'll also see this little gem:


Some say those existing provisions made protests illegal at political events where the Secret Service is protecting a candidate for office. Our understanding is that this is incorrect. The law applies to "cordoned off" areas or where a restriction is posted and where the general public has been cleared from. Additionally, it is unlikely the courts would uphold a restriction on access based on a political viewpoint.


Try to at least read what you're linking to when it contradicts your actual post. It kind of causes a great disconnect on the thread and pretty much invites the entire thread to derail from whatever intention you may have had for it to begin with.

To clarify:

Your analysis that you've posted of this bill is incorrect (which shouldn't be surprising due to your initial source being "The Daily Mail"). In order for this bill to apply to the protesters that you've mentioned, they would have to have been protesting in an area that was section off and all of the public had been removed from said area prior to the protesting or unlawful entry. Now if they had done this on the lawn of the White House, that would fall into the category of the law.


My source was CBS, I even linked it. Did you even bother reading that? Daily mail's writing can be iffy at times but boy do they make a good summary.

Yeah heres the thoughts from an organization of lawyers: https://www.aclu.org/blog/how-big-deal-hr-347-criminalizing-protest-bill

It's important to note — contrary to some reports — that H.R. 347 doesn't create any new crimes, or directly apply to the Occupy protests. The bill slightly rewrites a short trespass law, originally passed in 1971 and amended a couple of times since, that covers areas subject to heightened Secret Service security measures.

These restricted areas include locations where individuals under Secret Service protection are temporarily located, and certain large special events like a presidential inauguration. They can also include large public events like the Super Bowl and the presidential nominating conventions (troublingly, the Department of Homeland Security has significant discretion in designating what qualifies as one of these special events).

The original statute, unchanged by H.R. 347,made certain conduct with respect to these restricted areas a crime, including simple trespass, actions in or near the restricted area that would "disrupt the orderly conduct of Government," and blocking the entrance or exit to the restricted area.

H.R. 347 did make one noteworthy change, which may make it easier for the Secret Service to overuse or misuse the statute to arrest lawful protesters.

Without getting too much into the weeds, most crimes require the government to prove a certain state of mind. Under the original language of the law, you had to act "willfully and knowingly" when committing the crime. In short, you had to know your conduct was illegal. Under H.R. 347, you will simply need to act "knowingly," which here would mean that you know you're in a restricted area, but not necessarily that you're committing a crime.

Any time the government lowers the intent requirement, it makes it easier for a prosecutor to prove her case, and it gives law enforcement more discretion when enforcing the law. To be sure, this is of concern to the ACLU. We will monitor the implementation of H.R. 347 for any abuse or misuse.

Also, while H.R. 347, on its own, is only of incremental importance, it could be misused as part of a larger move by the Secret Service and others to suppress lawful protest by relegating it to particular locations at a public event. These "free speech zones" are frequently used to target certain viewpoints or to keep protesters away from the cameras. Although H.R. 347 doesn't directly address free speech zones, it is part of the set of laws that make this conduct possible, and should be seen in this context.

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Posted 2/6/17

octorockandroll wrote:


shugotenshi-atm wrote:

It is interesting how Jonny has just said both Liberals and conservatives are "severely biased in there[sic] beliefs" given how religious voters are mostly conservative and not Liberal.

Listen, it is true many Liberals are misinformed. But the same is true of Conservatives. Or did we forget Pizzagate, Death Panels, and a certain former president's birth certificates, all phony rumors based on lies.

The fact is most people are misinformed, regardless of their political affiliation. You would do well to not generalize.



official-shinsengumi wrote:


Heres 30 years of right wing terrorism

We're uninformed? Oh sure. Everyone is misinformed about something I guess.

Did you know that Obamacare and the affordable care act are the same thing?

These people don't lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N6m7pWEMPlA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sx2scvIFGjE





Honestly guys, reasoning with people like this is kind of a lost cause. We've all seen people like him both on and off the forums who view every issue as an "us vs. Them" fight between whatever end of the political spectrum they're on and those who aren't. I mean, dude watches Stefan Molyneux unironically. Do you really think he's going to listen to reason?


Stop projecting. You are the lost cause. Not once did you argue with anything Stefan said, and considering that he uses video footage to show what he's talking about, it's kinda hard to argue with it. That's just one thing that shows YOU won't listen to reason. Also, a huge point of how you don't listen to reason, as well as the others on here that were saying the same thing is the thing I keep repeating over and over again, which is if you want to know truth, get direct experience with it by going to the Bronx and telling them you are a Trump supporter, then go to the midwest and tell them you are a democrat. In the former, you'll get beat to an inch of your life, in the later the worst that'll happen to you is being called a crybaby. The proof is in the pudding.
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Posted 2/6/17

Shishiosa wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:
Seriously people. When this happened I was an 11 year old in another country, and even I knew about this. How on earth could it fly over the heads of actual Americans?


In case you hadn't noticed, the collective American consciousness is about 23 days, after which they seem to move on to whatever has caught their interest then. The threats and nastiness are nothing new, when you have a rule that allows anyone to say any thing about any one you're going to find radical nuts yelling anything about everything. The American media and its population is the living proof of the infinite monkey theorem.


No, just liberal media. Oh, and we believe in free speech so that way our government doesn't have too much power, comrade. Under Stalin's rule, ya know, the kinda guy who didn't like free speech, more people (his own people) died under him than Hitler. You're in no position to be criticizing my country. "What did you say about Putin?! To the gulag in Siberia with you!"
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Posted 2/6/17

ninjitsuko wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:

Honestly guys, reasoning with people like this is kind of a lost cause. We've all seen people like him both on and off the forums who view every issue as an "us vs. Them" fight between whatever end of the political spectrum they're on and those who aren't. I mean, dude watches Stefan Molyneux unironically. Do you really think he's going to listen to reason?


Pretty much my stance on it too. I had originally thought about showing statistics that go against his statement as well as showing phrases through the Qur'an that shows peace and tranquility in the religion (in contrast to where both the Qur'an and the "Holy Bible" both have passages of "kill the naysayers").... but it appears that reason won't reach someone who is fixated on their views. So I'm just going to sit over here and shrug.



Yes, the qur'ran has passages that speak about peace and tranquility, but literally on every page of that sucker you can find passages about killing infidels., and Christ never said anything about killing your enemies, but allah and muhammed did. And I never said the bible doesn't have disgusting passages as well, but when well over 65% of muslims out of 4 billion think sharia law is a good thing, it's bait alarming to say the least. Now compare the number of Christians and Jews committing terrorist acts to the number of muslims doing the same. It's pretty clear to see what the truth is. If you don't believe me, go to afghanistan or pakistan and tell them you are a gay jew. I bet they'll treat you with "peace and tranquility". The proof is in the pudding. You only loved that YOU are to one who can't be reasoned with. You're just another misinformed leftist.
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Posted 2/6/17

official-shinsengumi wrote:



you really think he's going to listen to reason?


not really, but theres always a chance



Read my new posts. It's you that is misinformed. Stop projecting.
Posted 2/6/17 , edited 2/6/17

johnnymcool wrote:
Yes, the qur'ran has passages that speak about peace and tranquility, but literally on every page of that sucker you can find passages about killing infidels., and Christ never said anything about killing your enemies, but allah and muhammed did. And I never said the bible doesn't have disgusting passages as well, but when well over 65% of muslims out of 4 billion think sharia law is a good thing, it's bait alarming to say the least. Now compare the number of Christians and Jews committing terrorist acts to the number of muslims doing the same. It's pretty clear to see what the truth is. If you don't believe me, go to afghanistan or pakistan and tell them you are a gay jew. I bet they'll treat you with "peace and tranquility". The proof is in the pudding. You only loved that YOU are to one who can't be reasoned with. You're just another misinformed leftist.




No, I think you're the one misinformed here, unfortunately. The Qur'an may state a number of things - but most of the violence indicates to fight against those who are punishing innocent women and children. In fact, Muhammad stated specifically not to attack those who are not attacking those who are innocent around you or yourself. Muhammad and his followers came against a land (according to the Qur'an) that was filled with those who tried to convert them. Muhammad, in turn, stated that they should be compassionate and be understanding that their god may be a false one and that "Allah" shall not punish them for something they simply do not understand. It goes on and on.

My whole point is that all religions have had their fair share of terrorist-like scenarios through the years. Using Sharia Law as an indication of "how bad the religion is" is pretty much a moot/pointless attempt. It would be like trying to say that Democracy is horrible but 6 out of 10 Americans think it's a great thing - you accept what you're used to because it makes the most sense in your mind.

Christians and Catholics, not terrorists? Maybe you should go through a history lesson. Everything from the Holy Roman Empires to the IRA exists in the name of both of these religions. Yet, you're the one calling me a "misinformed leftist" when I'm not even a registered Democrat or view things in a liberal mindset (other than many social issues). Like I said, you're just one that simply will not accept anything beyond his own perspective. That's okay. You be you. But I'm done trying to rationalize with you when you simply go on a rampage moments after realizing you're unbanned, reviving a dead thread that had your last mentions/quotes, and banging on a dead horse (the thread was dead, Jim). Carry on and be you, yo.

Edit: Added some to the first paragraph to clarify my stance
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Posted 2/6/17 , edited 2/6/17

johnnymcool wrote:


official-shinsengumi wrote:



you really think he's going to listen to reason?


not really, but theres always a chance



Read my new posts. It's you that is misinformed. Stop projecting.


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