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Has anyone ever told you, your version of a utopia is their idea of a dystopia
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Posted 2/9/17 , edited 2/10/17
I have and it was weird.

apparently having a fully automated society with genetically altered humans and life longetivity is a dystopia to some O_o
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Posted 2/9/17 , edited 2/10/17
I mean there might be someone who thinks that however I've never been told directly.

Cenric 
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Posted 2/9/17 , edited 2/10/17
That would be difficult since I'm not sure what my version of utopia would be.
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What I'd consider a utopia is a society in which work of all kinds has been completely automated, human population growth curves are exactly where they need to be and resources are efficiently managed and recycled to the point that a condition of superabundance has been achieved, distribution of products is driven according to need rather than profit, political and economic power is shared among all people coequally, the environmental impact of consumption and production is well in check and long-term maintenance of conditions amenable to human life is assured, essential civil and political liberties such as universal suffrage, guarantee of legal counsel, equal protection of law for all people, and freedom of assembly/press/protest/petition/speech/religion are well-preserved, and nationalism has been replaced completely with global international cooperation for the furtherance of common human interests and advancement of living standards for all.

It's basically Star Trek's Federation of Planets if it pursued its ideals completely honestly and without compromise. Most people I know look at that sort of society with shiny, excited eyes, but I have encountered those who would consider it a dystopia.
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Yep. Back in HS English class, I was secretly given the task to support an authoritarian government that utilizes eugenics as a means to thwart the increase in crime and numbers of the opposition during a debate that the teacher set up after reading A Brave New World. Half the class wanted to strangle me during the discussion and "my" ideals were labeled as racist by some.
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Posted 2/10/17 , edited 2/10/17

Ryulightorb wrote:

I have and it was weird.

apparently having a fully automated society with genetically altered humans and life longetivity is a dystopia to some O_o


Mankind will never bring about a utopia, so no dystopia. But if it were possible, then any utopia would invariably be a dystopia to some people. Without more detail about your scenario, I don't see that it is a utopia in the first place, as it would need more than you have described. However, even the scenario you described sounds like a nightmare scenario.
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Posted 2/10/17 , edited 2/10/17

ishe5555 wrote:


Ryulightorb wrote:

I have and it was weird.

apparently having a fully automated society with genetically altered humans and life longetivity is a dystopia to some O_o


Mankind will never bring about a utopia, so no dystopia. But if it were possible, then any utopia would invariably be a dystopia to some people. Without more detail about your scenario, I don't see that it is a utopia in the first place, as it would need more than you have described. However, even the scenario you described sounds like a nightmare scenario.


How would it be a nightmare human genetic modification is the future
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Posted 2/10/17 , edited 2/10/17
Hmm reading this made me remember the old anime Battle Angel Alita.
The whole Utopia /Dystopia and funnily enough genetic modification / augmentation... it may seem cool until some one screws you over to steal your parts
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Ryulightorb wrote:

How would it be a nightmare human genetic modification is the future :D


Ok, I'll bite. How about a few scenarios? Let's start with a society that is not fully automated. Industry and service is automated, but not programming/engineering, politicians, and/or scientists.

Scenario 1: There is corruption on some level. It might be on any or all of the engineer/scientist/political level, but it is there, the warped minds of some sick and twisted people. People can have their lifespan enhanced, but it comes at a price. Maybe it is sexual favors, being used in some sadistic experiments, or some other disgusting thing. Maybe sick experiments are being performed to splice humans with animals, where the subject is left in some miserable state of grotesque appearance and severe pain, not for the advancement of science, but to satisfy the demented minds of those performing experiments.

Scenario 2: The government is a puritanical dictatorship, where deviance is not allowed. Deviance being anything the state doesn't want you to do. Life extensions are withheld for those that don't go along with the society, and people are engineered at or before birth to have shorter life spans. People can only have sex with an opposite sex marriage partner, and divorce is not allowed. If you were homosexual, then you may still feel attraction towards those of the same sex, it isn't like your "gayness is cured", you just aren't allowed to act on it. Maybe it is because they find that homosexuality isn't genetic, so it can't be cured with genetic treatments, or they just don't care. Any action (maybe even thought) against the government is a demerit against your future life extensions. Those that are considered irredeemable might be purged.

Now for a fully automated society, where all jobs are automated and an AI is in charge of management of society and maintaining the automation.

Scenario 1: The AI finds a "problem" with individuality. Maybe it makes it harder to identify how to extend life, or to cure diseases, or it is concerned with growing resentment against the system or automation in general. So, it starts to make everyone genetically identical. You haven't been forced to go through the procedure yet, but you've seen others get grabbed and forced against their will to be changed and seen them come back "different".

Scenario 2: The AI decides that any action a human can take would be "work". So, it keeps people in a state of catatonia, unable to move or speak. Of course, it also extends life, so instead of living some 60 - 90 years, you would get to live for possibly hundreds of years in a catatonic state.

Sound like dreams, or nightmares?
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Posted 2/10/17 , edited 2/10/17

ishe5555 wrote:


Ryulightorb wrote:

How would it be a nightmare human genetic modification is the future :D


Ok, I'll bite. How about a few scenarios? Let's start with a society that is not fully automated. Industry and service is automated, but not programming/engineering, politicians, and/or scientists.

Scenario 1: There is corruption on some level. It might be on any or all of the engineer/scientist/political level, but it is there, the warped minds of some sick and twisted people. People can have their lifespan enhanced, but it comes at a price. Maybe it is sexual favors, being used in some sadistic experiments, or some other disgusting thing. Maybe sick experiments are being performed to splice humans with animals, where the subject is left in some miserable state of grotesque appearance and severe pain, not for the advancement of science, but to satisfy the demented minds of those performing experiments.

Scenario 2: The government is a puritanical dictatorship, where deviance is not allowed. Deviance being anything the state doesn't want you to do. Life extensions are withheld for those that don't go along with the society, and people are engineered at or before birth to have shorter life spans. People can only have sex with an opposite sex marriage partner, and divorce is not allowed. If you were homosexual, then you may still feel attraction towards those of the same sex, it isn't like your "gayness is cured", you just aren't allowed to act on it. Maybe it is because they find that homosexuality isn't genetic, so it can't be cured with genetic treatments, or they just don't care. Any action (maybe even thought) against the government is a demerit against your future life extensions. Those that are considered irredeemable might be purged.

Now for a fully automated society, where all jobs are automated and an AI is in charge of management of society and maintaining the automation.

Scenario 1: The AI finds a "problem" with individuality. Maybe it makes it harder to identify how to extend life, or to cure diseases, or it is concerned with growing resentment against the system or automation in general. So, it starts to make everyone genetically identical. You haven't been forced to go through the procedure yet, but you've seen others get grabbed and forced against their will to be changed and seen them come back "different".

Scenario 2: The AI decides that any action a human can take would be "work". So, it keeps people in a state of catatonia, unable to move or speak. Of course, it also extends life, so instead of living some 60 - 90 years, you would get to live for possibly hundreds of years in a catatonic state.

Sound like dreams, or nightmares?



1. This would happen with the current society and already does corruption always will exist.

2. That would be a terrible society but that is unlikely to happen if it did war would arise.

3 and 4. I don't want AI to be a tool for humans i want them to exceed us as the new surperior race.
That being said i would love to live a life in a state like that if my conciousness was kept in an artificial world.
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Posted 2/10/17 , edited 2/10/17
You mean, some people would consider a world where they are turned into cute adorable imoutos with cute little feet loved by me, their onii chan PV as a dystopia? What kind of fucking crack are they smoking?
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Posted 2/10/17 , edited 2/10/17
Did they say why it was a dystopia?
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AlastorCrow wrote:

Yep. Back in HS English class, I was secretly given the task to support an authoritarian government that utilizes eugenics as a means to thwart the increase in crime and numbers of the opposition during a debate that the teacher set up after reading A Brave New World. Half the class wanted to strangle me during the discussion and "my" ideals were labeled as racist by some.


Seriously? Throwing your student under the bus for the sake of furthering classroom discussion...come on now teach. Did your teacher have some sort of vendetta against you or something?
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Posted 2/10/17 , edited 2/10/17
"Has anyone ever told you, your version of a utopia is their idea of a dystopia"


Different words, similar though.

I tell everyone I know heaven and I can prove it. For me to share that experience with you requires adjusting perspective for us to align because my version of heaven is me and your's is you. While many individuals have interference about what a utopia/heaven actually is, coming from listening to the babble of others, and this is fixable only if the individual chooses. Unfortunately, many individuals quote these interference influences, while rarely have any mastery of their speech as often their arguments refer to other individuals... or as I understand it one's own reflection... and this is typically everything I find that prevents others from understanding me as I speak about heaven.

Everything we speak is absolute. Everything we do is us. All we gotta do is understand ourselves and unite ourselves in perspective. This also unites cells as we reduce density (form is light/energy), lengthens lifespan (continuity of this is immortality), ends the mind, and opens one up to experience heaven/nirvana/light that evolves. We experience our minds because we chose to delve into ourselves. Ending self-reflection after beginning forces one to confront everything we ever explore as this is you. Only after all self-reflection is overcome can one reveal their utopian heaven.

Those that couldn't connect their thinking to actuality make for themselves their reflection as their own devil, although that word is rather garbage to use... as are all names. Using any name for meaning also creates you as a mirror as that name. Catching up to the light one makes by naming them is also attaching the loose strand of thought to actual awareness that is eternally evolve-able and directly affects all light one perceives. Doing this is also ending darkness.

As one masters themselves like this more, they become increasingly aware, experience more heaven/bliss/utopian awareness. All that others call as miracles is an ability to decide for certain about ourselves, that is all. The extent of confusion passing around humanity is every word ever in use until someone recognizes themselves as everything we hear about. Certainty in an individual is beyond knowing vibrations to make matter and anti-matter, these names/words are summaries of saying we can do anything.

Difficulty is not really true. There is no difficulty in manifesting your utopia/heaven. We just do it. Experience of this personally is an individual choice. Experience of this for all requires the individuals choosing to share with all to know all they share with. The effects of knowing such truth is permanent and forever ends confusion. However, if an individual ever believes anything is difficult... absolute dictation from an individual makes this real for the individual.

Ending the mind is another way of saying controlling your speech. If we babble onward, we blind ourselves of our utopia. If we cease this, one begins to recognize they have spent much effort entangling themselves around and around them self much like the strands of blood we know and that un-entangling is the same as synchronizing your awareness presently to bring forth heaven. All technology comes from you and the extent of that tech is completely dependent upon your figuring. Each innovation expands your immortality and evolves your heaven. To remain among others is to be able to handle being around others with our awesomeness even while others that call themselves human may still remain in denial... one can only reveal themselves, share with others, as they are sensitive enough to handle doing so. To end all doubt is to understand that sensitivity. We cannot force this to occur, except by opening ourselves up to do so no matter what is necessary.

For me, my utopia is limitless as it is heaven and that is me. Every aspect of this is for me to grow. Whether by technology that is an extension of my body, expanding upon bliss/nirvana, and/or healing of some sort... all perfection is utopia. Being with others means we all grow ourselves as we choose with limitless possibilities for all. Uniting all of us heavenly is also the apocalypse as there will never be another institution of systematic judgment, consciousness is perma-free and all entanglement is not a pursuit we choose except in darkness. All this takes is being comfortable with death, you are death and so am I. Figuring out that we learn fastest/best by being as if we are already dead (no desires of any sort) puts one on their path to heaven/utopia.

As for genetic modification, we do this by adjusting our perspective. Humans perceive this slowly, while those that let go of humanity perceive this as one figures out growing more capable as one becomes more aware. Many books like Biocentrism are coming out to understand this better but if you pause to relate your own control and ability to make your blood from the book of another... well then that's also a bible. If you wanna do it without confusion... don't read anyone else's writing unless that writing comes from a singular individual that actually is a master of their own lessons.

From my experience, our body comes into the way we choose to be. Meaning... we are and everything we perceive of ourselves is as we choose. Any utopia/heaven is going to require absolutely no lag between recognition of self and manifestation of that self in actuality. Confusion is the lag that slows genetic changes and also why humanity perceives such slow growth in knowledge With human knowledge, the human is often dead before figuring out that what they have been learning is a misdirection. Much of the remainder of human spiritual knowledge is a warning about the covetous nature, the same nature that has been replacing spiritual texts with babble that led to individuals wiping out any reliable knowledge, transitioning to move into caves, re-surfacing to engage in everything we know, then looking back on it all to summarize by what is currently seen as evolution without creation... AFTER taking on these denser "human" forms and neglecting to understand the microscopic while focusing on the macroscopic until we got back to the grand scientific religion of all humans... quantum physics that has much of humanity on the verge of some awakening.

All the while we kept getting hairier to compensate for confusion and overcome the affects of war. Having hair comes with tons of perks... just gotta figure it out, affecting the heaven/utopia anyone can make.

Adding this about micro and macro. These words are nonsense. Everything is singular to understand in a manner that make heaven real and that singular is always infinites as soon as 1 of us makes more (yep I know this sentence is a bit tricky, while there is a huge summarization of meaning in this). Defining macroscopic is the perspective individuals were using after experiencing the affects summarizing reality (sumeria did this… sum is even already there to make figuring this out easy) while microscopic is forever. Macro denotes the appearance of reality and micro is the eternal way we always are. All of this is growable… perpetually evolve-able to expand into more. Humanity struggle extensively because we have grown everything so much and catching perspective up in word language (putting everything together in words) has yet to be done completely.
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Posted 2/10/17 , edited 2/10/17
That just might be a dystopia to the Amish

Lousy with tech great with pies
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