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Post Reply All news media is fake news, some are just more fake than others.
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Posted 2/17/17 , edited 2/28/17
Fake news... and the victims of it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjrqQK5xrMY

what you opinion on my stances that all news media is fake news, not just mainstream but all. The all push agenda's most do to bias of their own. Also what did you think of the video I think this Youtuber has a good understanding of reality of the media.

Looks like I have to go into this a little deeper. Down the hole I go.


Their is no other sides to facts.. you have the facts, then you have a agenda.. If your adjusting the facts to push a agenda then it is fake news.

what is news, it is the reporting of what happen, the facts, allowing the viewer to come up with his own ideals. Basically if you have to manipulate the information or add insight to the information. You have just left the plain of News and entered into agenda pushing aka Fake news. Their is news what happen the facts. Then their is fake news speculations, false claims, no backing to story, agenda pushing.

qwueri 
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Posted 2/17/17 , edited 2/21/17
Sounds suspiciously like gaslighting.

Trying to claim that all news is inherently fake takes a remarkable lack of faith in other human beings to tell the truth and accurately relay events. Doubly so when news is reporting events on camera.

*Edit: The presence of opinion or bias does not make something fake. Fact is not inherent with or without opinions of those relaying the information. What is inherent with fact is the ability to verify that something actually happened.
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Posted 2/17/17 , edited 2/21/17
Bias does not make something fake. Bias exists in interpretation, not facts. Two news outlets can report on the same facts completely different things. That does not make them both "fake news", it means that they interpreted facts differently. That isn't an inherently bad thing for the media to be doing either.
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Posted 2/17/17 , edited 2/21/17
2 viable sources make a story with facts-real news
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Posted 2/17/17 , edited 2/21/17
The Amazing Atheist is really not someone who is in any position to criticize the news for having biases, mate.


qwueri wrote:
The presence of opinion or bias does not make something fake. Fact is not inherent with or without opinions of those relaying the information. What is inherent with fact is the ability to verify that something actually happened.


+1
Ejanss 
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Posted 2/17/17 , edited 2/21/17

qwueri wrote:

Sounds suspiciously like gaslighting.

Trying to claim that all news is inherently fake takes a remarkable lack of faith in other human beings to tell the truth and accurately relay events. Doubly so when news is reporting events on camera.


It also borders dangerously on Richard Pryor's famous "Who you gonna believe, me, or your lyin' eyes?"

And even more dangerously on disgruntled DC Comics fans claiming that the movie critic industry were "biased", "outdated", "against them", or "promoting a Disney agenda" for saying such meanie things about BvS and Suicide Squad.
I'm sorry, after last summer I CAN'T watch another Trump-supporter "Fake news!" cry and not see some disgruntled Harley Quinn fanboy railing about why Zack Snyder didn't get a Best Director nomination.
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Posted 2/17/17 , edited 2/21/17

Ejanss wrote:


qwueri wrote:

Sounds suspiciously like gaslighting.

Trying to claim that all news is inherently fake takes a remarkable lack of faith in other human beings to tell the truth and accurately relay events. Doubly so when news is reporting events on camera.


It also borders dangerously on Richard Pryor's famous "Who you gonna believe, me, or your lyin' eyes?"

And even more dangerously on disgruntled DC Comics fans claiming that the movie critic industry were "biased", "outdated", "against them", or "promoting a Disney agenda" for saying such meanie things about BvS and Suicide Squad.
I'm sorry, after last summer I CAN'T watch another "Fake news!" cry and not see some disgruntled Harley Quinn fanboy railing about why Zack Snyder didn't get a Best Director nomination.


THIS

It's frightening how many people falsely play the victim for stupid reasons these days, I see it almost everywhere in some capacity.

And I am a Harley Quinn fanboy and I hope Snyder and hacks like him don't touch her or her associated properties with a 7foot pole ever again.
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Posted 2/17/17 , edited 2/19/17
I don't feel like expounding on this today; maybe I will in a few days. It's usually my mode to explain things so that people understand, though, so I will try to come back to this.

DarkPhoenix3450 is right - and anyone who thinks "facts" can exist independent of interpretation and bias is wrong (e.g., qwueri). This is one of the lessons of philosophy, 20th-century philosophy in particular. Further than that, both the concept of a fact and that of fake news are misused and misunderstood. (While I understand why the idea of fake news is problematic, my reasoning about the term fact is less-developed, so I may not have anything that great to say about the latter. I'm also hesitant to say much about it, because I know philosophers have done so in detail and I haven't studied that particular subject.)

As for the content of the video DarkPhoenix3450 posted, though - I didn't watch it. It was long, and I find PewDiePie - and especially everything Harry Potter and J.K. Rowling - boring.
Ejanss 
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Posted 2/17/17 , edited 2/21/17

octorockandroll wrote:


Ejanss wrote:
And even more dangerously on disgruntled DC Comics fans claiming that the movie critic industry were "biased", "outdated", "against them", or "promoting a Disney agenda" for saying such meanie things about BvS and Suicide Squad.
I'm sorry, after last summer I CAN'T watch another "Fake news!" cry and not see some disgruntled Harley Quinn fanboy railing about why Zack Snyder didn't get a Best Director nomination.


THIS

It's frightening how many people falsely play the victim for stupid reasons these days, I see it almost everywhere in some capacity.

And I am a Harley Quinn fanboy and I hope Snyder and hacks like him don't touch her or her associated properties with a 7foot pole ever again.


Anyone hang around movie fan-rumor blog sites after August, and see the Disgruntled Corporals desperately trying to crunch cherrypicked box-office-vs.-expense and overseas-gross numbers to "prove" that Suicide Squad had actually made a profit after all, so there?
Three solid months of it, all the way up to home video. Trump hasn't been that long on obsessively digging up "alternative data" to vindicate his imaginary Inauguration numbers, so there, but just wait...
qwueri 
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Posted 2/17/17

auroraloose wrote:

I don't feel like expounding on this today; maybe I will in a few days. It's usually my mode to explain things so that people understand, though, so I will try to come back to this.

DarkPhoenix3450 is right - and anyone who thinks "facts" can exist independent of interpretation and bias is wrong (e.g., qwueri). This is one of the lessons of philosophy, 20th-century philosophy in particular. Further than that, both the concept of a fact and that of fake news are misused and misunderstood. (While I understand why the idea of fake news is problematic, my reasoning about the term fact is less-developed, so I may not have anything that great to say about the latter. I'm also hesitant to say much about it, because I know philosophers have done so in detail and I haven't studied that particular subject.)

As for the content of the video DarkPhoenix3450 posted, though - I didn't watch it. It was long, and I find PewDiePie - and especially everything Harry Potter and J.K. Rowling - boring.


Sorry to pick in your post since you're not interested in responding right away, but...

I'm not trying to assert that facts can be presented independently from interpretation or bias. However factual information and opinion are two different measurements of information being presented. I.e. Trump holding a news conference and saying certain things are factual. The coverage of those facts, what's fact checked and what's not, and of course punditry is influenced by bias in reporting. Calling that reporting 'fake news' because of a particular bias or another is effectively conflating all coverage with 'fake news' during the election which turned out to have never occurred.
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Posted 2/17/17 , edited 2/17/17

auroraloose wrote:

I don't feel like expounding on this today; maybe I will in a few days. It's usually my mode to explain things so that people understand, though, so I will try to come back to this.

DarkPhoenix3450 is right - and anyone who thinks "facts" can exist independent of interpretation and bias is wrong (e.g., qwueri). This is one of the lessons of philosophy, 20th-century philosophy in particular. Further than that, both the concept of a fact and that of fake news are misused and misunderstood. (While I understand why the idea of fake news is problematic, my reasoning about the term fact is less-developed, so I may not have anything that great to say about the latter. I'm also hesitant to say much about it, because I know philosophers have done so in detail and I haven't studied that particular subject.)

As for the content of the video DarkPhoenix3450 posted, though - I didn't watch it. It was long, and I find PewDiePie - and especially everything Harry Potter and J.K. Rowling - boring.


I am not sure what you mean. Seems like something David Hume (?) would've advocated, that our internal sense of logic will tell us only what we want to hear, which makes sense, given that people are often somewhat to deeply inhibited by their bias, but I am not sure that reality cannot exist independent of what we view it as, if that is what you are saying. Or perhaps you are saying that reality might not match up to most known or any known interpretation? I believe you advocated the notion that facts are never "proven", but laws and theories just happen to be consistent explanations.

So something along the lines of "Those typed sentences in textbooks denoting what is or isn't is not are not without subjection to some sort of bias in interpretation, and especially bias in overall coverage, and are not proven once and for all?" I am a bit confused

Of course, I am not entirely sure why we would debate the merit of a real reality that we might not even see. I just do not know of your interpretation of the philosophical approach to the nature of an objective reality itself, hence why I am asking. I do not think there is a definite answer other than what we choose to believe in, but that is me.

I am sure you studied more than me.
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Posted 2/17/17
The best one is that there is a alien invasion coming in September that was detected in 2014 and that's when first contact is supposed to happen. not sure if its really important as other fake news but as fake news go if its true its very interesting and not surprising really all the ancient texts did warn us one day they would return and with the amount of noise our tv broadcast and radio signs make its amazing it hasn't happened yet. I did a quick search supposedly if you are in the right location with the right gear meaning scientists right now mainly you can detect the energy field coming from the force field that the fleet is generating which is how it was originally detected in 2014.
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Posted 2/17/17 , edited 2/28/17
even the Associated Press can't be trusted at times. they apparently got trolled with a fake report not too long ago.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-immigration-nationalguard-idUSKBN15W1OT?il=0
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Posted 2/17/17

namealreadytaken wrote:

even the Associated Press can't be trusted at times. they apparently got trolled with a fake report not too long ago.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-immigration-nationalguard-idUSKBN15W1OT?il=0


Wouldn't those be State decisions anyway and not White House decisions?
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Posted 2/17/17 , edited 2/17/17

namealreadytaken wrote:

even the Associated Press can't be trusted at times. they apparently got trolled with a fake report not too long ago.
http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-trump-immigration-nationalguard-idUSKBN15W1OT?il=0


This is one of the reasons I think "fake news" is a complicated issue. I don't think we should really be too upset over the brand of fake news that comes out of honest mistakes (assuming at least that the proper steps are taken to redress the issue). These things will happen, especially in an age where a) a lot of things sounds unbelievable; and b) there are so many sources of news that can trip you up.

It is the willfully dishonest type of "fake news" that I think holds the brunt of the blame, like the people who originally made up that "troll report", or other people who make things up to push an agenda or just to troll people.

I think this is where the slogan "fake news" differs on the left and right. The left seems to be more worried about the "fake news" that some random guy (or, ya know, the president) makes up that goes viral on facebook. The right seems to be more worried about mistakes in news coverage. While they are both a problem, I personally place more blame with the malicious than the careless.
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