Post Reply Puberty and aging speculation
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Posted 2/28/17
So here is my newest idea about aging. We've all reached puberty at one point and as Wikipedia(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puberty) points out, it started from the hormonal signals in the brain to the gonads.

Now, what Wikipedia didn't say is, what is the gene expression that is controlling the first appearance of these hormonal signals from the brain. The clock that is changing the gene expression to make us reach puberty at age 14 can have a lot to do with aging and the physical body blue print.

Why do I care about the body blue print, because to reverse aging is to reset your physical body size. So to reset the body to that of a child, maybe a vast amount of our body tissue will undergo apoptosis like the separation between our fingers. And leaves only the healthy tissue intact.

We sort out the body size blue print, and it would send signals to reset the rest of the body, maybe in the form of miRNA and to direct the body and cells back to its youthful state. Inducing apoptosis to the unneeded tissues. I wouldn't call them ungrowth hormones.

This is just speculation on my part, and I am still unsure as to which part of the body holding the gene expression that would govern the rest of the body and aging.
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Posted 3/1/17 , edited 3/1/17
Your speculation is a bit of an oversimplified one. There's multiple mutations and various expressions involved in the development process, just look at complicated background of developmental disorders. The etiology can considerably differ despite similar symptomology. It's the same reason drugs may work for one individual and not as much for another (European descent is considerably over-represented in pharmaceutical testing). While there is promising research being done in gene editing it is much more complicated than reaches the public eye. Jumping genes, proteins, mutations, a large array of variation that will have to be sorted out. At this time your speculation reads more like that of science fiction, but that does not entail it so in its entirety. To reverse age one would first have to be able to replicate the development process--you've made the assumption development is bidirectional when it is much more likely one directional. Mutations: cause-and-effect. It is not a matter, then, of 'undoing' rather than replicating development stages in a reverse pattern which is not the same manner it occurred forward (at that point inducing development of many other things would be possible). That being said, 'halting' development would be more simple than making that transition in reverse.

All more science fiction-y at this point though. Not my field of expertise, so much like yourself, it's way over my head.



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Posted 3/1/17
And here I was thinking we aged beyond sexual maturity because of some messed up flaw in our DNA replication process . As for actually achieving your pipe dream of biological immortality it'd be easier to simply engineer immortal humans from zygotes grown in a lab or in utero. Adult DNA is markedly inflexible , with little in the way of wiggle room for genetic manipulation on the scale you're talking about. Your method would likely induce some pretty serious cancers and genetic abnormalities
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Posted 3/1/17
Hmm, I am referring to SALK institute's idea of reverse aging (http://www.salk.edu/news-release/turning-back-time-salk-scientists-reverse-signs-aging/). They suggested that it could be done in clinical trial in 10 years. This is really exciting news.

To answer prince's question, most of our human genome are still the same. We all come from stem cells, we all age, and I would speculate that we all possess the ability to revert our cells back to stem cells because we possess Yamanaka factors.

Now the above research only promise life extension by 30% and I am not sure if it is repeatable. It is quite a simple method consider all you need to do is to turn on the same four Yamanaka factors on all cells and watch them rewind to a younger stage. Now I can't promise that there wouldn't be any side effect, I just know from result that the reprogrammed mice live longer and looks younger.

So from this research we know that aging is a side effect of changing epigenetic marks of gene expression, but not mutation. If anyone is interested in this research I can provide a more detailed paper I found on Google
Posted 3/1/17
Look up the free radical theory if you want to learn more about aging.
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Posted 3/1/17
So my idea is like a snapshot, since I am 30 years old right now I would capture all the epigenetic marks of my current gene expression on all cells. When I grow old like I reach 80 years old, I would try to hack my epigenetic marks to match the snapshot back when I was 30 years old there by making the cells produce younger and healthier looking proteins for the cell exactly like when I was 30 years old.

This is assuming I don't get fatter or thinner over the time, too many factors here. I am also unsure if I need a different hack for every single cell in comparison to just turning four Yamanaka factors on and watch the cells rewind.
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Posted 3/1/17

I think you need some fresh air
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Posted 3/1/17

Apholo wrote:

Look up the free radical theory if you want to learn more about aging.


Yes I know the DNA damage theory similar to this one. But I've also read somewhere that when cell revert back to its stem cell state, all DNA damage, mitochondrial damage, and telomere length are repaired and restored to its initial state, sounds promising heh
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Posted 3/1/17

llunga wrote:


I think you need some fresh air


Fred is taking a shower brb
qwueri 
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Posted 3/1/17
I don't think regressing someone's body to that of a prepubescent state would work as you're thinking. There's already a genetic disorder where individuals don't undergo puberty, and there's no record of an anti-aging effect. Just disabilities including infertility, impaired of sense of smell, and failure of some parts of the body (kidney, bones, mouth, teeth, etc) to develop normally.
https://ghr.nlm.nih.gov/condition/kallmann-syndrome#definition

To reverse aging you'd first need to identify the cause(s) for degradation of cells and dna in an aging individual. Stopping or regressing puberty probably isn't the answer.
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Posted 3/1/17

qwueri wrote:

I don't think regressing someone's body to that of a prepubescent state would work as you're thinking. There's already a genetic disorder where individuals don't undergo puberty, and there's no record of an anti-aging effect. Just disabilities including infertility, impaired of sense of smell, and failure of some parts of the body (kidney, bones, mouth, teeth, etc) to develop normally.
https://ghr.nlm.nih.gov/condition/kallmann-syndrome#definition

To reverse aging you'd first need to identify the cause(s) for degradation of cells and dna in an aging individual. Stopping or regressing puberty probably isn't the answer.


Right, the cause of aging is the drift of epigenetic marks (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3014766/). Each time this mark drifts, it causes a shorter gene expression. By reverting to stem cell you essentially reset the marks and causes the Yamanaka genes to express.

What SALK did to test on the lab rats is they enabled the Yamanaka genes by changing the epigenetic marks for all the cells, so the epigenetic drift which causes aging was set back to a previous state, and they stopped it before all the histone unwinds and become a stem cell completely, so the skin cell is still a skin cell and a liver cell is still a liver cell but in a younger state. I've done a slightly more advanced search on Google on their project and found this page (https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/12/161215143541.htm)

Well, you are probably right on the prepubescent part, I mean I am only speculating on how it would work, but many changes in hormones that would change the epigenome occur during puberty. I would bet on a safe age of probably 80 to 30 years old, but this is speculation on my part. It hasn't been done.
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Posted 3/1/17
We don't age nor do we experience puberty. All is an illusion... hear that before? I have and I have said it believing it. When you shift yourself from human beliefs, you recognize truth. Illusion is rather an inept word, more appropriately... all we experience is because we chose to.

Aging is someone that is stuck on a chosen expression of death. Puberty is someone self-possessing after experiencing entanglement with other individuals. In terms of will, saggy skin that goes with old age is someone that gave into human knowledge and thought it was all there is. Puberty comes about from those that choose to mate after human experiences. Death sets us free and death is the path chosen to be human. Present control is recognition of immortality and all else.... only by remaining present and undoing all the possessive stuff humanity tends to give into.

Being told meaning comes with all these problems in someone dictating to you, you. All those that experience dictionaries also now fully integrate into human babble. Comes with perks, although if you choose to awake to know immortality... nothing... from that moment you are no longer and all you experience is awareness that is permanent, indescribable because you could describe it forever, and all the shit anyone ever spoke about in regards to heaven (yep that's you free of dictated meaning).. To do that, one must sacrifice all their meaning... then anyone is going to recognize they don't have to age and that puberty only occurs after many other burdens piled upon an individual for that to happen.

Stuff about words... further into a tree of awareness (let's say that for now) the more difficult it is to perceive clearly. For example, as an individual you make possible the connecting tree of knowledge that is from you. Blood derives from you and all words about blood further on derive as well, while all still is about you. Going into the behavior of cells teaches an individual to program their cells... literally. We program our blood, only difference between deniers and truthsayers is deniers die, truthsayers are immortal (not saying to pursue death here... saying gotta let go while believing in yourself and you experience healing.... of blood and more). Understand yourself more deeply, like applying that each blood cell is another you, helps bring focus to all the bullshit. Blood means you are constantly recreating yourself while your whole being is all that you are and you are that which is always beyond form. Transcending blood is fully completing your current form, uniting cells, instead of leaving something left to learn.

Human society is set to fail because all the individuals that had an understanding of blood that applies to present state of reality, kept that knowledge secret as family knowledge. Many stories one might hear over the course of a declining country is discussion about politicians hearing about blood significance from their own citizens re-learning everything, then attempting to cover it up. Societies, often manipulated by those that knew these so called secrets, work together to figure everything out again while all the words are corrupted until you make them yours... ez to manipulate the masses that derive meaning from others... also blinds them from feeling themselves... makes them more susceptible to giving into someone working to convince them of something... and always comes with similarities of babel falling. Just like you see happening with America. Once media begins to tear apart their leader, all it takes is for the each individual to finish figuring out everything they were told not to question. That happens in every way possible because it becomes much of the creativity societies think they are thriving on... figuring out something someone else already figured out then got covered up. Well.. benefit is at one point that awesome lesson is retaught in a way that can no longer result in denial.

If you want to overcome aging, stop speaking like those that age. If you want to overcome puberty... well understand everything you've experienced that you call puberty and catch it up to a present understanding about yourself instead of accepting someone else's definition. You are the offspring of the first dude that creates everything (god is a poor word to express this) while being completely independent and able to make everything in your own way... or you can be a dying human that may figure all this out before they die while already set to dying, or figure it out sooner and keep believing in that no matter the babble to undo all definition of the word death.
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Posted 3/1/17 , edited 3/1/17

fredreload wrote:

Hmm, I am referring to SALK institute's idea of reverse aging (http://www.salk.edu/news-release/turning-back-time-salk-scientists-reverse-signs-aging/). They suggested that it could be done in clinical trial in 10 years. This is really exciting news.

To answer prince's question, most of our human genome are still the same. We all come from stem cells, we all age, and I would speculate that we all possess the ability to revert our cells back to stem cells because we possess Yamanaka factors.

Now the above research only promise life extension by 30% and I am not sure if it is repeatable. It is quite a simple method consider all you need to do is to turn on the same four Yamanaka factors on all cells and watch them rewind to a younger stage. Now I can't promise that there wouldn't be any side effect, I just know from result that the reprogrammed mice live longer and looks younger.

So from this research we know that aging is a side effect of changing epigenetic marks of gene expression, but not mutation. If anyone is interested in this research I can provide a more detailed paper I found on Google


You're misreading that study quite a good deal--but with the manner it was reported--bound to occur. What they are managing is not 'reverse aging' as the headline seems to insinuate, but rather attempting to normalize the development in mice with a premature aging disease--this entails therapy where they controlled epigenetic factors in order to manipulate the development process and the advancement of the disease during the mice's development. In normal mice it does not 'reverse aging'--it only helped repair tissue which is why they hint towards it being a step towards cell regenerative treatments. As far as I understand they're regulating gene expression--not changing it. However, even that much is very difficult and complicated to replicate in humans compared to mice.

Essentially they realize that the advancement of aging can be protected against--somewhat--by regulating gene expression in mice. Don't get me wrong, it's interesting, but nothing you seem to think it.

You're taking an inch and running a mile. Designing the bike and proclaiming the hoverboard is next--basically.

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Posted 3/1/17

PrinceJudar wrote:


fredreload wrote:

Hmm, I am referring to SALK institute's idea of reverse aging (http://www.salk.edu/news-release/turning-back-time-salk-scientists-reverse-signs-aging/). They suggested that it could be done in clinical trial in 10 years. This is really exciting news.

To answer prince's question, most of our human genome are still the same. We all come from stem cells, we all age, and I would speculate that we all possess the ability to revert our cells back to stem cells because we possess Yamanaka factors.

Now the above research only promise life extension by 30% and I am not sure if it is repeatable. It is quite a simple method consider all you need to do is to turn on the same four Yamanaka factors on all cells and watch them rewind to a younger stage. Now I can't promise that there wouldn't be any side effect, I just know from result that the reprogrammed mice live longer and looks younger.

So from this research we know that aging is a side effect of changing epigenetic marks of gene expression, but not mutation. If anyone is interested in this research I can provide a more detailed paper I found on Google


You're misreading that study quite a good deal--but with the manner it was reported--bound to occur. What they are managing is not 'reverse aging' as the headline seems to insinuate, but rather attempting to normalize the development in mice with a premature aging disease--this entails therapy where they controlled epigenetic factors in order to manipulate the development process and the advancement of the disease during the mice's development. In normal mice it does not 'reverse aging'--it only helped repair tissue which is why they hint towards it being a step towards cell regenerative treatments. As far as I understand they're regulating gene expression--not changing it. However, even that much is very difficult and complicated to replicate in humans compared to mice.

Essentially they realize that the advancement of aging can be protected against--somewhat--by regulating gene expression in mice. Don't get me wrong, it's interesting, but nothing you seem to think it.

You're taking an inch and running a mile. Designing the bike and proclaiming the hoverboard is next--basically.



It is good that you are interested, this is the idea I am trying to provoke. This is by far the most promising research I can find on Google aside from increasing telomere length or DNA damage. Don't get me wrong, those ideas still set as the foundation of which this research is builds on.

So to answer some of your questions. This research might not be true reverse aging, it is something they are working toward. Now the mice has a premature aging mutation, but it is because they can get the result faster, 18 weeks versus 24 weeks. If this research is to be conducted on normal mice, it might be 3 years versus 5 years, which is a big difference. Now it might not be true reverse aging, but it certainly makes a considerable life extension despite the regenerative ability.

Changing the epigenetic marks is changing the gene expression, where they turn on the Yamanaka factors on all cells that are not normally turned on when cells specialized. They suggested a human clinical trial is on its way in 10 years, which is considerably fast.

Right I could be jumping the gun here . Currently regulating gene expression is a good source for helping cancer research. I am trying to promote the idea that we are getting closer to solving aging and cancer. A few years ago I was also looking into DNA damage and telomere length. Then the epigenome shows up, which I completely skipped out. While not completely understanding the mechanics, research suggests that by reverting cells to the most basic form, a stem cell, all these factors are repaired. Therefore, presenting this research here could save you a lot of research time.
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Posted 3/2/17 , edited 3/2/17
So here is another speculation part. You create a different miRNA for every single cell. Each miRNA should be able to target its own cell due to the fact that the human shape fetus can be generated from a blastula using the same method, it is all signaling miRNA. So you 3D print the miRNA and put it in a solution, then inject it into the blood stream and wait for miRNA to change every single cell in the body.


P.S You would probably need a way to figure out every single cell's epigenetic marks
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