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Post Reply Mechs are Now Real
zaldar 
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38 / M / Charlotte NC
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Posted 3/20/17
http://money.cnn.com/2017/03/20/technology/jeff-bezos-giant-robot/index.html?iid=ob_homepage_tech_pool. This amazes me and is so very very cool...what do the rest of you think? I want to buy one....
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19 / M / Miami/Hawaii
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Posted 3/20/17 , edited 3/20/17
get in the robot, Jefu.

Interesting, I don't know how much funding will go towards the ones to come. It would be neat to see progression behind the concept, it will take a ton of investments from CEO's, companies, enterprises, etc but seeing that Jeff Bezos both "donned" it and enjoyed himself, it is likely that more is to come since his financial platform is massive.
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19 / M / Winnipeg, MB.
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Posted 3/20/17 , edited 3/25/17
I'm holding off on buying a car just so that I can use that money to get my own mech whenever they become available.

So yeah... you could say I'm a bit excited to see this.
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Posted 3/20/17
I remember reading about it few years ago on what Japanese thoughts are on making Gundam, They're very very expensive and it'll take forever to make one! Our Tech not up there yet, plus need lot of money to make one. Maybe within 100 year?
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Posted 3/20/17
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Posted 3/20/17


Interesting...

I would love to watch it on national TV! Probably be on Pay-perview

Probably look weird since we're used to seeing it in Anime! XD

Don't be surprise if Government are interested in this to use them for War!
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Posted 3/20/17

JanusCascade wrote:



Interesting...

I would love to watch it on national TV! Probably be on Pay-perview

Probably look weird since we're used to seeing it in Anime! XD

Don't be surprise if Government are interested in this to use them for War!


The Japan one is for military use only. Not for war yet
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Posted 3/20/17 , edited 3/26/17

JanusCascade wrote:

Don't be surprise if Government are interested in this to use them for War!


I really doubt any military would be dumb enough to actually use mecha for war. Not as a combat platform, anyway. They don't check any of the boxes for an ideal ground combat platform, whatsoever.

1) An ideal ground combat platform is reliable. It should work consistently, fail rarely, and be easy to fix when it breaks. A weapon does you no good while it's in the repair shop; just ask the nazis about their over-engineered Koenigs Tigers and jet fighters. Mecha fail this requirement in the most epic of forms; they have entirely too many parts that can fail, and much more simple engineering solutions exist (IE, wheels and tracks) Funny enough, the engineering difficulties present in walking locomotion are so vast that neither of the "mecha" the OP mentioned even walk. They're not mecha at all; just the world's least optimal tank design!

2) An ideal ground combat platform requires minimal logistical support. It should be fuel, ammunition, and supply efficient. Every person packing and driving trucks of supplies is one less person fighting (or running the factories, for that matter). Legs are orders of magnitude less efficient at transferring engine power into motive force than are wheels or tracks. That means that much more fuel to transport (and that many more spare parts to keep in stock)

3) An ideal ground combat platform detects the enemy before the enemy detects it. Information is probably the single most valuable commodity in combat; with information superiority you can maneuver into the best position from which to engage, or, if the situation is unfavorable, you can choose to depart and avoid engagement before the enemy ever has a chance to do anything about it. Tanks are relatively short and easily hidden by terrain and vegetation. Standing mecha are not. They would also have a larger radar signature (pound for pound) due to the number of different shapes (arms, legs, whatever) flailing about, and the less volume-efficient shape. Lastly, their inefficient motive method (walking) requires more energy than wheels/ tracks, and therefore increases their thermal signature, as well.

4) An ideal ground combat platform can put effective fires (or other forms of attack) onto the enemy before the enemy can put effective fires on it. A tank is, again, low and squat, and therefore presents a relatively small surface area to hit compared to its size and volume, meaning it is comparatively difficult to hit. A standing mecha is tall and presents a relatively large surface area compared to its size and volume. This makes it comparatively easy to hit with weaponry. A mecha also is not a stable weapons platform; it has a jarring, jerky motion cycle, and an awful lot of joints between weapon and ground, meaning it is more difficult to keep a weapon accurately aimed (and recoil becomes more of an issue than on a tank). Tanks are solid, steady weapons platforms in comparison.

5) An ideal ground combat platform can survive the most likely attacks that will be directed against it. Ideally, this means not being hit in the first place (see above), but when it is hit, it should be able to resist damage. A tank is a small, volume-efficient space. This means that, for a tank of the same weight class, there is relatively little surface area, which means the same weight in armor provides much thicker armor. A mecha has a comparatively enormous amount of surface area requiring armoring, meaning that the mecha would need proportionally massive amounts of armor to come even close to the same level of protection.

No, the only roles mecha realistically have in warfare are as equipment carriers for light infantry operating in rugged terrain where more traditional transports cannot easily operate. Even then, the systems would not be particularly large, and would be used only to carry supplies. More like robotic mules than like walking tanks.

There is utility in power-assisted armor suits for infantry, though. But here we're talking power armor, not mecha, and even then, the only reason they would be preferable to a traditional tank-like shape is because when you're producing a man-sized armored platform, which you want to put a man into, it basically *has* to be man-shaped.
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Posted 3/20/17
Will Amazon use this to deliver my packages?
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19 / M / Palm Coast, Florida
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Posted 3/20/17
Looks like the AMP suit.
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Posted 3/20/17
it's no big deal honestly
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Posted 3/20/17

outontheop wrote:


JanusCascade wrote:

Don't be surprise if Government are interested in this to use them for War!


I really doubt any military would be dumb enough to actually use mecha for war. Not as a combat platform, anyway. They don't check any of the boxes for an ideal ground combat platform, whatsoever.



I don't really disagree with any of your analysis of the unsuitability of bipedal or even quadrupedal mechs for warfare. The only caveat is that your reasoning presumes the current paradigm for warfare is more or less permanent and the only valid template for war.

Suppose for a moment that the growing availability and presence of WMDs and a growing human population renders conventional methods of war too costly in terms of civilian lives that would be impractical to conduct anything resembling a battle without committing war crimes. Under such a circumstance, single combat to handle disputes might be a valid solution. Rules of engagement could make mecha the standard equipment for these practical and more humane engagements (although there is no reason a tank, plane, ship or even infantry could not also suffice).

We might even consider removing ourselves even further from conventional warfare by considering that even when reducing war to a sport could still result in collateral damage and injuries to the participants: VR combat provides the ultimate solution for bloodless war. Mecha are cooler than any other vehicle (just my opinion), and in a computing environment where data and data processing are increasingly cheap there is no reason not to conduct warfare in virtual mechs as opposed to FPS or tank or sub/ship sims.

Just food for thought.
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Posted 3/20/17
I guess the BattleTech fanboys will get what they want.
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Posted 3/21/17 , edited 3/26/17

NillaWaferz wrote:

I don't really disagree with any of your analysis of the unsuitability of bipedal or even quadrupedal mechs for warfare. The only caveat is that your reasoning presumes the current paradigm for warfare is more or less permanent and the only valid template for war.

Suppose for a moment that the growing availability and presence of WMDs and a growing human population renders conventional methods of war too costly in terms of civilian lives that would be impractical to conduct anything resembling a battle without committing war crimes. Under such a circumstance, single combat to handle disputes might be a valid solution. Rules of engagement could make mecha the standard equipment for these practical and more humane engagements (although there is no reason a tank, plane, ship or even infantry could not also suffice).

We might even consider removing ourselves even further from conventional warfare by considering that even when reducing war to a sport could still result in collateral damage and injuries to the participants: VR combat provides the ultimate solution for bloodless war. Mecha are cooler than any other vehicle (just my opinion), and in a computing environment where data and data processing are increasingly cheap there is no reason not to conduct warfare in virtual mechs as opposed to FPS or tank or sub/ship sims.

Just food for thought.


Sure, but in that scenario, literally *any* competitive activity (and the associated tools and equipment) could be used. It would be equally valid to say that knights in armor, on horses, would be viable military technology, if the joust of war were to become the primary internationally accepted means of conflict resolution again. Or we could play checkers. Or literally any other game.

You may want to watch this totally legit documentary, by the way: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0102800/ https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/robot_jox
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Posted 3/21/17
Well a few things. One it's a motor vehicle so you'll need a special license to use it. Not to mention the regulation if it ever gets released in the states. If you bought whether you'd be even allowed to use it in public, cause you know 1 ton robot right next to you while you're on a walk with your dog sounds safe. That's not including the technical limitations. Battery's we're at a stand still in battery technology's. Assuming it were to get released within the next 5-3 years. Assume you had some sort of nuclear fusion the possible implications of that being released to the public. Hell thats the reason we dont have hydrogen powered cars now, widely available. Well that and feasibility. Back to feasibility. If it were released tomorrow the price would be insane. Especially for early adopters. i'm not talking millions i'm assuming 10's to 100's. Lets assume it does come out and you want one what bank would give you that kind of alone assuming it did. The battery life on that thing would be about 3 minutes unless you jack it into your house. I dont even want to think of the electrical bill, and it would be slow as all hell.

TLDR;
Potential problems
----------------------------
Shit battery life-- no mobility outside of being plugged in.
Price-- Literal millions assuming you'd even get a loan.
Wouldn't be able to drive it on the road or anywhere really.
Would be slow as hell.

Giant robot < any car or walking.

I mean if you're a multi millionaire and had the cash to burn sure. But if you're a multi millionaire with the cash to burn why would you waste it on a piece of shit robot? That you can't use anywhere and when you do use it, it'd have to be plugged in?
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