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Post Reply New Orleans is taking down Confederate monuments
Posted 8/16/17

octorockandroll wrote:


Sad you keep trying to pass that same baseless lie. Wait, what am I talking about? That's hilarious.


That's a three month old post you're responding to there. Sure took you a long time to reply to it.
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Posted 8/16/17
Guys, please don't do this shit again.
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Posted 8/16/17
Yayyy!
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Posted 8/16/17

Amyas_Leigh wrote:


False equivalence.
You've surely become a master of twisting anything to your perspective, haven't you?

Tearing down statues doesn't "remove history".
That's some backward logic there.
Even Robert E. Lee thought it was a bad idea to keep monuments of the Civil War.

Supporting Evidence:


Personal reminiscences, anecdoates, and letters of gen. Robert E. Lee
John William Jones, pg. 234

"I think it wisest not to keep open the sores of war, but to follow the example of those nations who endeavored to obliterate the marks of civil strife, and to commit to oblivion the feelings it engendered" - Robert E. Lee

We should be reminded of the feelings that come from such conflict and tribulations within a nation.
Not that we should keep the objects themselves.
History is never "erased".
The perspective of history will always change as generations are born.
History itself is always documented somewhere in a society.
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Posted 8/16/17

Amyas_Leigh wrote:


octorockandroll wrote:


Sad you keep trying to pass that same baseless lie. Wait, what am I talking about? That's hilarious.


That's a three month old post you're responding to there. Sure took you a long time to reply to it.


What was that you said about how stupid it is to equate people to nazis?
Posted 8/16/17 , edited 8/16/17

Cydoemus wrote:



Tearing down statues doesn't "remove history".
That's some backward logic there.

Yes, it does. Why do you think ISIS are doing it? For funsies?
No, they do it because one day, their children and their children's children will grow up in a world where the only history they learn is the word of Muhammed. Pesky ruins and monuments of great civilizations before will damage that.
Extreme leftists are the same in their logic, they don't even want them in museums.


Even Robert E. Lee thought it was a bad idea to keep monuments of the Civil War.

Bad Evidence:



"I think it wisest not to keep open the sores of war, but to follow the example of those nations who endeavored to obliterate the marks of civil strife, and to commit to oblivion the feelings it engendered" - Robert E. Lee


.

Funny that there wasn't a single mention of monument or statue in that quote.
"Upon the same principle he refused to attend the Gettysburg Identification Meeting and wrote a letter in which he said:
"I think it wisest not to keep open the sores of war, but to follow the example of those nations who endeavored to obliterate the marks of civil strife, and to commit to oblivion the feelings it engendered" "


Here is the full context and reason he wrote that

This quotation is found in the following CONTEXT in Chapter 6 of Rev. J. William Jones' book: Personal Reminiscences, Anecdoates, and Letters of Gen. Robert E. Lee:


“So careful was General Lee to observe scrupulously the terms of his parole and to avoid even the appearance of political entanglements of every kind that he refused to attend all public meetings which had any bearing upon the war or the political status of the country


At the Virginia Springs in 1869 a meeting was called to aid the scheme of Rev Dr W F Broaddus for the education of the orphans of Virginia soldiers General Lee sympathized most heartily with this enterprise and with the judicious manner in which it was conducted he had frequent conferences and correspondence with Dr Broaddus concerning it and was accustomed every year to make most liberal contributions to the object Yet he refused to attend this meeting assigning as a reason that he desired to avoid all public gatherings that had any thing to do with the war Upon the same principle he refused to attend the Gettysburg Identification meeting and wrote a letter in which he said I think it wisest not to keep open the sores of etc etc.





History is never "erased".
The perspective of history will always change as generations are born.
History itself is always documented somewhere in a society

History is very easy to erase, just ask an archeologist that spends their entire lives trying to piece together what might have happened to long gone civilizations.



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Posted 8/16/17

Amyas_Leigh wrote:
Yes, it does. Why do you think ISIS are doing it? For funsies?
No, they do it because one day, their children and their children's children will grow up in a world where the only history they learn is the word of Muhammed. Pesky ruins and monuments of great civilizations before will damage that.
Extreme leftists are the same in their logic, they don't even want them in museums.


No, it doesn't.
ISIL/ISIS does it for religious reasons; tearing down statues that give the impression of a polytheistic religion.
This includes the destruction of Catholic churches, Neo-Assyrian statues that indicate another religion, and text and books that are non-Islamic.
Tearing down political statues != tearing down religious statues.
Political statues are historical to the nation but can be explained elsewhere in society.
Religious statues remove contextual history that can expose an individual to outside ideas and religions.
ISIS destroys literature to destroy all context of a foreign religion.
Statues are not literature.
I have yet to see an "extreme leftist" destroy libraries that house documents that support that the Civil War ever happened.


Amyas_Leigh wrote:
Funny that there wasn't a single mention of monument or statue in that quote.


What's funny is that you didn't read that I provided all context surrounding the usage of the quote from the literature I quoted.
Ralph, please try to work on your reading skills.
It makes discussing anything with you rather difficult.

The lack of usage of "statues" is because it was based on the same context that you provided.
Having an identifier (le gasp, could that be linked to statues? ...Lordy, I'm getting the vapors) that leave the sores of war open isn't a wise idea (paraphrasing).
Nice try, turning things around to fit your agenda.
You have failed your people and your country in doing so.


Amyas_Leigh wrote:
History is very easy to erase, just ask an archeologist that spends their entire lives trying to piece together what might have happened to long gone civilizations.


There is a significant amount of difference between previous societies and our current one.
With history books, nonfiction novels that recount an individual's perspective on a war, historical documents being preserved in multiple formats ... history isn't ever "erased".
That's just that your far-off imaginary world that has you in a state of constant paranoia, Ralph.
Posted 8/16/17 , edited 8/16/17

Cydoemus wrote:

No, it doesn't.
ISIL/ISIS does it for religious reasons; tearing down statues that give the impression of a polytheistic religion.
This includes the destruction of Catholic churches, Neo-Assyrian statues that indicate another religion, and text and books that are non-Islamic.
Tearing down political statues != tearing down religious statues.
Political statues are historical to the nation but can be explained elsewhere in society.
Religious statues remove contextual history that can expose an individual to outside ideas and religions.
ISIS destroys literature to destroy all context of a foreign religion.
Statues are not literature.
I have yet to see an "extreme leftist" destroy libraries that house documents that support that the Civil War ever happened.

They do it for both reasons. Civilizations existing before muhammed is a great insult to them, like fossils for a creationist.


What's funny is that you didn't read that I provided all context surrounding the usage of the quote

Not all, and the little you did didn't stop you from taking the rest of it out of context and lying.

He was a broken man who lost his homeland and was trying his hardest to gain amnesty that was never given until the 1970s. That's all. He deserves to be honored. You should stop parroting leftist articles and actually look stuff up for yourself for once.


There is a significant amount of difference between previous societies and our current one.
With history books, nonfiction novels that recount an individual's perspective on a war, historical documents being preserved in multiple formats ... history isn't ever "erased".
That's just that your far-off imaginary world that has you in a state of constant paranoia, Ralph.

That's up for debate. Books rot, electronics rot, people die. Civilizations fall.
Stone and metal can last for millennia.

Also that bit you said about liberals never shutting down a museum? They have, in my state. All because some black county commissioner got butthurt about confederate flags at a museum.

https://www.facebook.com/NashFarmBattlefield/posts/1608056289213768


Public Statement from the Board of Friends of Nash Farm Battlefield, Inc.
May 23, 2017
The Board of the Friends of Nash Farm Battlefield, Inc. is sad to announce that the museum, located on Nash Farm Battlefield, which was funded and maintained by our group, will close effective June 1, 2017. The main reason is that the current District 2 Commissioner, Dee Clemmons, has requested that ALL Confederate flags be removed from the museum, in addition to the gift shop, in an effort not to offend anyone


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Posted 8/16/17
This just in:

Aug. 16, 2017 9:43 a.m. ET

BALTIMORE—The city of Baltimore removed several Confederate monuments overnight in a move that city officials didn’t announce ahead of time to avoid demonstrations.

By dawn, crews had removed three Confederate monuments from their pedestals. They also took down a statue of Roger B. Taney, a Supreme Court chief justice who, while not a Confederate himself, wrote the proslavery Dred Scott decision in 1857.
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Posted 8/16/17

DengekiFugu wrote:

This just in:

Aug. 16, 2017 9:43 a.m. ET

BALTIMORE—The city of Baltimore removed several Confederate monuments overnight in a move that city officials didn’t announce ahead of time to avoid demonstrations.

By dawn, crews had removed three Confederate monuments from their pedestals. They also took down a statue of Roger B. Taney, a Supreme Court chief justice who, while not a Confederate himself, wrote the proslavery Dred Scott decision in 1857.


Pretty fucking sad that cities have to do this under wraps to avoid violence.
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Posted 8/16/17

Amyas_Leigh wrote:

You should stop parroting leftist articles and actually look stuff up for yourself for once.


Take your own advice, you literally googled the Lee quote and and quoted the first FACEBOOK page on the topic you saw. Now you're defending it like you put some real research into it.
Posted 8/16/17 , edited 8/16/17

DengekiFugu wrote:


BALTIMORE—The city of Baltimore removed several Confederate monuments overnight in a move that city officials didn’t announce ahead of time to avoid demonstrations.




Wait, why? What happened to giving protestors a safe space to destroy?
http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2015/04/25/baltimore-mayor-gave-those-who-wished-to-destroy-space-to-do-that/
Is it because the people protesting the removal would not the be same race as the mayor? Sounds like it


rawratl wrote:

Take your own advice, you literally googled the Lee quote and and quoted the first FACEBOOK page on the topic you saw. Now you're defending it like you put some real research into it.


And I'm sure he looked up Robert E. Lee's letters all on his own and didn't totally see one of the dozens of leftist articles pushing this crap, right?
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Posted 8/16/17
What's sad is that even Supreme Court Justices who wrote unpopular decisions are not safe from this compounding tyranny.
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Posted 8/16/17
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Posted 8/16/17

Amyas_Leigh wrote:

And I'm sure he looked up Robert E Lees letters all on his own and didn't totally see one of the dozens of leftist articles pushing this crap, right?


What can I say, some people are rather well read, this can happen when you are literate. I remember reading a lot of those Lee quotes in high school. Even if an article sparked the argument for him, you can be damn sure it was better researched than a facebook page.
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