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Post Reply child abuse offensive to some
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70 / M / Berkeley, Califor...
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Posted 4/24/17 , edited 4/28/17
The series "Alice & Zoroku" in episode 3 contains a scene where
This is, IMO, way over the line. I have no problem with fantasy series in which children are depicted as active heros or heroines, even if they are in (fantasy) danger. But in a SF series with a present world backdrop, such a scene was too much for me, a parent of a daughter who was, naturally, once a young girl. If that sounds at all like you, then just give this series a miss.

IMO CR should not even carry material like this. But at a minimum they should place a prominent warning about the (possibly) offensive content in the series description.
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44 / M / Canada
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Posted 4/24/17 , edited 4/28/17
While I do understand your concearn, this series did show that there were dark aspects to the story from the very begining. From the first episode it was shown that children are being experimented on, starved and even killed by the evil organization.

At the same time the series is also about rescuing a young girl from such abuse. Of giving them a happy home life and the responsibility of adults to protect them.

While I certainly wouldn't expose young children to it, I actually think older children could benefit from the show's message that they can turn to adults for help against problems too big for them.

Ultimately that is our responsibility to make these judgements. We don't really have age approprite ratings here, likely do to the international nature of the site, so that makes it all the more important for us to make those judgements for our kids. Deciding that some shows aren't right for them is one option and a often a good one.

Another is watching it with them and talking about it, seeing what they think and letting them know what you think.

As for Alice & Zoroku


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Posted 4/25/17 , edited 4/28/17
ok stop watching then

just because you don't like it doesn't mean you should deny us the opportunity of watching it.
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Posted 4/25/17
I'm not going to say you're over reacting because we all react to things differently, some more than others.

How are we as a medium suppose to tell stories or any type of media if everything we make is going to offend someone? Sometimes a story calls for incredibly dark themes in order to progress the story.

IMO CR should not even carry material like this.

This^ is going overboard. I don't like shows where every person is a moe blob, does that mean CR should remove 95% of their catalog solely to cater to my needs? As others have said, if you don't like this, you're free to ignore it, but in the first 5mins of the show it tells you what type of World the anime takes place in.-.
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Posted 4/25/17
Was it established that's what was going on? Yes, and Minnie C's motivation was clearly stated that she only cared about seeing her dead husband again. She's also a soldier and that was her mission, and to accomplish said mission she was willing to do what was needed.

While the violence was excessive, it brought home the point of how dangerous these people really are. and made them a credible threat.
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Posted 4/25/17 , edited 4/25/17
While I'm not watching the anime in question so I can' be certain of the context, there is very rarely something in anime or any form of media that I would consider "over the line". I suppose I should ask does the scene actually encourage the viewer to commit acts of child abuse? Then yes it is over the line. But if some form of child abuse is shown as part of the story, and by the sound of the comments here that was the case, then it is part of the harsh reality we live in. I feel the way about racism and hate crime. An anime can have content that shows racism or a hate crime, but that is different from promoting either. You do no one any favors from pretending that reality doesn't exist. .
Posted 4/25/17 , edited 4/25/17

JohnDreher wrote:

The series "Alice & Zoroku" in episode 3 contains a scene where
This is, IMO, way over the line. I have no problem with fantasy series in which children are depicted as active heros or heroines, even if they are in (fantasy) danger. But in a SF series with a present world backdrop, such a scene was too much for me, a parent of a daughter who was, naturally, once a young girl. If that sounds at all like you, then just give this series a miss.

IMO CR should not even carry material like this. But at a minimum they should place a prominent warning about the (possibly) offensive content in the series description.


Its a anime. It is not real nor is it meant to be. It is a fantasy. But I have to say the shit is fucked. (but legal) nothing you can do. Also the story requires it to progress.
riem2k 
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Posted 4/25/17

JohnDreher wrote:

IMO CR should not even carry material like this. But at a minimum they should place a prominent warning about the (possibly) offensive content in the series description.


Anime has always been known for edgy content unlike its western counterparts, if you want shows guaranteed to not offend anyone then there's other sanitized venues like Disney and Nickelodeon.
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Posted 4/25/17
I think that sort of thing really is offensive to some? Most people watch anime and TV for sheer enjoyment. If these forms are more and more popularized, then the people would possibly unconsciously absorb it and thus be put in some sort of "societal trance"... It's good not to romanticize child abuse, pedophilia, and incest and such...

My advice would be to avoid such content if you feel like it's offensive. It's definitely a sign that you probably shouldn't be watching it. Things that get you on the wrong edge are best left behind.
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Posted 4/25/17 , edited 4/25/17
The easy solution to any of this is to just not watch the things you dislike or find upsetting, however you should not try to force your view on the majority by telling CR to not broadcast shows you dislike the content of. The anime itself gets around the issue by first presenting the idea that Sana isn't a human or really a child, this is just the form she created for herself to better fit in her environment and interact with others. it's still shocking to see a small defenceless person be tortured and gains sympathy from the viewer but in a following scene we see her heal all her injuries in a single thought.

This is presented as fantasy violence, and while graphic and not suitable for young viewers it's not really done in a realistic way that I'd say was extremely traumatic. It does provoke a reaction which is what it intends where you feel sorry for the main character and it shows the bad guys are really bad and willing to use violence to get what they want. Minnie C is presented as a person who is selfish and suffering from mental issues due to losing her husband in such a traumatic way so they show this by presenting her as lacking empathy and hurting others.
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Posted 4/25/17

JohnDreher wrote:

IMO CR should not even carry material like this.

So I and others should be denied the right to view something because you find it upsetting?

I wonder how little anime CR would have every season if each person were allowed to enforce their opinion.




heartlesspocki wrote:

If these forms are more and more popularized, then the people would possibly unconsciously absorb it and thus be put in some sort of "societal trance"... It's good not to romanticize child abuse, pedophilia, and incest and such...

While I haven't seen the series in question (I wait to view series once they are finished), I have seen clips of the scene in question. I very much doubt it was in any way "romanticized".

To be clear:

Romanticize: Deal with or describe in an idealized or unrealistic fashion; make (something) seem better or more appealing than it really is.

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Posted 4/25/17 , edited 4/25/17

bobland wrote:

ok stop watching then

That's what I did.

just because you don't like it doesn't mean you should deny us the opportunity of watching it.


I mainly would like a content warning in the description of the show. From the first episodes I felt uneasy with the premise, but was taken aback by the very explicit scene in ep.3, which was too brutally graphic, IMO, for any anime site other than a so-called hentai site. I have no objection to anyone watching whatever pleases them, but prior information is helpful. For example, on hentai sites I try to avoid material that includes sexual violence -- I'm much more likely to view "vanilla" porn when in the mood for sexual content. But that's just me -- I've noticed that many of the shows on such sites that are listed as popular are repellent to my sensibilities, so I avoid them. I don't mind that others have different tastes, even though I find it hard to imagine how anyone could enjoy shows that treat women as objects.

I can't answer all the concerns expressed one by one. I think the replies I've already posted should suffice to clarify and/or defend my personal opinion.


Series5Ranger wrote:

Was it established that's what was going on? Yes, and Minnie C's motivation was clearly stated that she only cared about seeing her dead husband again. She's also a soldier and that was her mission, and to accomplish said mission she was willing to do what was needed.

While the violence was excessive, it brought home the point of how dangerous these people really are. and made them a credible threat.


I watch anime to avoid the facts you stated. That's why I'd like a warning before running into graphic depictions of sociopathic behavior.

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Posted 4/25/17 , edited 4/25/17
Sorry, I've written more responses than I want to. I think they have covered most of the criticisms, so I'll just stop trying to answer the numerous criticisms one by one. This problem is exacerbated by a personal neurological problem that makes it somewhat arduous for me to type.

Also, I'm having difficulty with the reply system -- it's not clear to me if my replies are showing up where I thought they would. My apologies if confusion results.
Koda89 
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Posted 4/25/17 , edited 4/25/17
Honestly, what was shown in Alice & Zoroku is rather tame, extreme content wise.

There are many other shows on here with faaaaaaaar more graphic material, especially when it comes to some of the horror or seinen action series on this site.

If you want to be super safe, there is a mature filter built into the CR service that you have to turn on or off under your user settings, but that's really all you can do.

As of right now the only anime series I've seen on this site with any kind of content warning attached to it is the current Berserk anime, and well, that's basically because it is....well...Berserk. One of the most extreme anime/manga franchise around.
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Posted 4/25/17 , edited 4/25/17
I'm actually with you on this. That scene disturbed me too and really turned me off.

I'm probably going to drop the show. Not because of that scene but because the show isn't that good.
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