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Post Reply Here are some reasons as to why some people don't read as much.
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48 / M / Auburn, Washington
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Posted 5/24/17

qualeshia3 wrote:

For those people who wonder why more and more people don't read for leisure time, here are the reason why.



1. Because they don't want to.

END OF STORY

"Hey! How come you don't do what I like? Aren't you supposed to be just like me? You're not like me! You're defective! Fix it! BE LIKE ME"

No! Fuck you! Shut up and go home! My leisure time is mine and I can do whatever I want! YOU'RE NOT THE BOSS OF ME.

Seriously, it is such a waste of time explaining to people why you want what you want. You might want to explain logical reasoning about rational decisions. You might want to explain the subjective experiences underlying your beliefs. But explaining why you like what you like and want what you want is fucking pointless.
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Posted 5/24/17

cdarklock wrote:


qualeshia3 wrote:

For those people who wonder why more and more people don't read for leisure time, here are the reason why.



1. Because they don't want to.

END OF STORY

"Hey! How come you don't do what I like? Aren't you supposed to be just like me? You're not like me! You're defective! Fix it! BE LIKE ME"

No! Fuck you! Shut up and go home! My leisure time is mine and I can do whatever I want! YOU'RE NOT THE BOSS OF ME.

Seriously, it is such a waste of time explaining to people why you want what you want. You might want to explain logical reasoning about rational decisions. You might want to explain the subjective experiences underlying your beliefs. But explaining why you like what you like and want what you want is fucking pointless.


True. But I wanted to list other reasons why. To be honest, I don't even read books that much. I rather write stories.

You seem angry, dude.
Posted 5/24/17
I read about 2-3 books a day, depending on how busy work is and what I'm doing. Then read about 50-60 pages of whatever's on the nightstand (usually some mathematic books). Every year, there's a book sale from the county where they sell all donated books and such. I tend to walk away with 200-500 books depending on what's good. This year was kind of uneventful - but I did happen to grab some Japanese books to read.

But most people I've spoken to about this topic always have the same answers:

1. "I don't read as fast as you".
2. "There are other distractions that are more hands-on or interactive, like video games."
3. "Books put my ass to sleep."

To each their own. lol.
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48 / M / Auburn, Washington
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Posted 5/24/17

qualeshia3 wrote:

You seem angry, dude.


Is that somehow relevant?

I mean, I'm not, but what difference does that make? Would what I posted mean something different if I was angry? Would the definitions of words change? Would the grammar carry some sort of added implication?

Honestly, that never makes sense to me. What the fuck does my emotional state have to do with anything?

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Posted 5/24/17

cdarklock wrote:


qualeshia3 wrote:

You seem angry, dude.


Is that somehow relevant?

I mean, I'm not, but what difference does that make? Would what I posted mean something different if I was angry? Would the definitions of words change? Would the grammar carry some sort of added implication?

Honestly, that never makes sense to me. What the fuck does my emotional state have to do with anything?



Never mind. I just thought you were mad at me for posting something pointless. Sorry about that.
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Posted 5/24/17

qualeshia3 wrote:

Never mind. I just thought you were mad at me for posting something pointless. Sorry about that.


Oh, good God no. This is a good thread. Look at all the people talking about reading. This was a good thing you did, be proud.

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Posted 5/24/17

cdarklock wrote:


qualeshia3 wrote:

Never mind. I just thought you were mad at me for posting something pointless. Sorry about that.


Oh, good God no. This is a good thread. Look at all the people talking about reading. This was a good thing you did, be proud.



Oh, well thank you.
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Posted 5/24/17

cdarklock wrote:
Seriously, it is such a waste of time explaining to people why you want what you want. You might want to explain logical reasoning about rational decisions. You might want to explain the subjective experiences underlying your beliefs. But explaining why you like what you like and want what you want is fucking pointless.


I actually think that putting into words the things we take for granted is actually really interesting and enlightening. I think we often get into a place where we let our biases steer us away from things we might otherwise enjoy. For example, for the longest time I would say "I hate rap music", but I didn't really have any real reasoning behind it so when I was able to move past those assumptions I found a new genre of music to explore.

Finding the "why" behind your likes and dislikes can lead you to find new interesting things, expand your horizons, and possibly give you a newfound respect for the things you are experiencing.
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Posted 5/24/17

Flying_Sea_Turtle wrote:
2. If you have a reading disability, How the hell do you get through daily life without knowing what the signs around you say?


Seriously? Screw you.

My brother is dyslexic, and it really does make reading difficult for him. He can beat his way through something and understand it just fine, but it takes a hundred times the mental work to do it than it does for a normal person who enjoys reading. He can read the road signs and most signs are designed to be recognizable without needing to be able to read in the first place. Also, it has nothing to do with level of intelligence, because he is above average intelligence. Basically, reading trips him up, and spelling can be difficult. I suspect that I have a very mild form of dyslexia myself, though I have come up with a lot of little tricks to be a good speller. I am probably a below-average-speed reader, though.

It would be like having arms that are so weak they can only lift a handful of rice and then being told you have to move a 100lb bag of it. You can poke a hole in the bag and move the whole thing one handful at a time, while a person who moves those bags all day long at work can just flip it up on their shoulder and plop it down again where it goes. Now, are you going to make it a habit of moving those bags of rice? I wouldn't.
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48 / M / Auburn, Washington
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Posted 5/24/17

sundin13 wrote:

I actually think that putting into words the things we take for granted is actually really interesting and enlightening.


Agreed, except that's not something you do for other people. Doing it for yourself, yeah, you've nailed it. Has a lot of value. Understanding why you do things (or don't do them) is powerful.

But you don't have to justify yourself to anyone. If someone says "why aren't you like me?" the answer is "because I'm not you" and anything beyond that is pointless until they understand this foundation. Anyone who believes you are supposed to be them is an idiot, but somehow we have an awful lot of people walking the Earth believing everyone else is a defective version of themselves.

Meanwhile, you've said some interesting stuff that would be fun to talk about!


I think we often get into a place where we let our biases steer us away from things we might otherwise enjoy.


Absolutely. And the internet has made it very, very easy to "bubble up" in a world where we just plain don't see anything we don't like. We can put only our political and social allies into our Facebook friends, and follow only a few people on Twitter, and never even go to Tumblr, and block everyone who disagrees with us.

Which makes it really, really easy to just stop learning anything ever!

"Still didn't need to use algebra today, LOL"

That's kind of like driving a car around and saying "still didn't need to change a tyre today, LOL." Well, when you do, you can't. Then you have to go get someone else who can. But that's a moral value - "knowing things is good even if you don't need to know them" - that is worth literally nothing to anyone who doesn't share it. You can chase it down to the principle of a professional network, as well: if you wait until you need it, that's too late. It's the same with anything. When you need something now, it's too late to go get it.

There's this sort of critical problem in modern society where people are stupid and like being stupid. I'm not sure what can be done about it, but we should probably be doing something. Waiting until we need to do something is, you know, probably not a good idea.


Finding the "why" behind your likes and dislikes can lead you to find new interesting things, expand your horizons, and possibly give you a newfound respect for the things you are experiencing.


Which begs the question:

What good is finding the why behind someone else's likes and dislikes?

Once you've admitted and accepted that the simple fact someone likes or dislikes something means they must have a reason, what further value does it have to you when you know what that reason is?

There's a certain value in letting someone tell you the reason, because they will think you care about them and their opinions. There's a certain value in remembering what they said, because it proves you were listening when they told you. But what value does it have to know that reason?

I mean, even if they're lying to you, the rest of the benefits exist. If someone says "I like pizza because it's round," you will score points with them by listening and when you later remember that they said this. But if they actually like pizza because it's delicious, you don't actually know why they like it. So any benefits you might get from this are not benefits of knowing the real reason.

Incidentally, the primary benefit of explaining why you do something is that people stop asking you about it. But it doesn't actually matter whether you tell the truth. You can tell them anything at all, and just keep telling them different things until they shut up.

Which is the other side of the same question: what is the benefit to me if you know the truth?

De gustibus non est disputandum, you know. It's not like you could argue with me over why I really like something or what my reason for liking it ought to be. It's not even like you could find out whether I lied to you or not. I like things because I like them, for the reasons I make up in my head, and I can tell you any reason I damn well please just because that's the reason I want to tell you. Why should I tell you the truth? Why should I tell you anything?

These sorts of questions are interesting.
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Posted 5/24/17

cdarklock wrote:
What good is finding the why behind someone else's likes and dislikes? )


Well, I know I personally have had some very interesting conversations through trying to understand other people's likes and dislikes. You speak quite highly of learning (which is a good thing! Learning is good!) but learning about other people can still be important and beneficial, even if it holds little practical value. It can also help you to introduce others to things that they might like, even if it is outside of their comfort zone.

For example, back to rap music, I often ask people "why do you dislike rap music". Most commonly I usually get "because its crude and I don't like the lyrics". To someone who doesn't have a lot of experience in the genre, this may seem valid, but there is a lot of rap music that lacks those elements. Maybe by introducing them to some of that, they may find something new that they like, or maybe they will find that they still don't like it and come up with a new reason.

Either way, I think there is value in encouraging learning and development of tastes. When I say learning, I mean both for the other person and yourself. I don't think we should push aside the importance of learning how other people experience things like books or music (especially as a writer and a musician. Knowing other people's "why" is hugely important).

Basically, what I get out of it is twofold: first, I get the potential to introduce someone to something I love which I think is always a great feeling; and second, I get the potential to increase someone's knowledge on a subject which I think is always a good thing.
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Posted 5/24/17

sundin13 wrote:

learning about other people can still be important and beneficial, even if it holds little practical value.


Subjectively, yes. It matters to me why my wife or girlfriend doesn't read, and if I know why, maybe I can leverage my influence with her to generate some interest in reading. Or maybe not. My wife refuses to read nonfiction, ever, which makes literally zero sense to me. Here is a book that can teach you a thing you want to know. "Oh, HELL no! I'mma read Twilight again, it's more fun!" Okay... first of all, one bad decision at a time, mmkay?

But when some guy at the bus stop doesn't read, I don't give a shit. That's what confuses me. People will say "hey, do you like this and that?" and I'll say "no" and they say "WHY NOT?!" and I'm like... I don't even know you. We met in the hallway four minutes ago and you're following me. I get that conventions are a good place to meet people, but this is not a good way to do it.

Kind of like when people start a thread and say they don't like this or that popular anime. How do they think this is going to end? "Hey, crowd of people who mostly enjoy this thing - I can't stand it, because of reasons!" It's one thing to join a conversation about it, but it's quite another to just announce out of the blue that you hate something.


For example, back to rap music, I often ask people "why do you dislike rap music".


For music, it's usually predictive: they don't like it because they're unused to the patterns and tropes of the genre, which is primarily because they haven't listened to enough of it. So when they hear the buildup happening, they don't know a DJ break is coming up, and when the stripped-down beat dissolves behind a wall of record scratching and sampled gunshots... they just go "WTF" and decide they don't like it.

Similarly, dubstep builds the same kind of tension, but stretches the buildup an extra few measures past the usual sixteen to increase that tension before the drop. That can make it hard to dance to if you don't know the song, which is actually intentional - it's the artists saying "stop dancing to songs you don't know." That's a common value system they hold in that community. Dancing isn't just "feel the groove" to them, but "know the song and add to it artistically."

(Also a musician, btw. )


I don't think we should push aside the importance of learning how other people experience things like books or music


But you don't. You just learn what they tell you. You never actually know how they experience anything from what they say. You have to monitor their behaviour.

For example, Americans love shopping at Wal-Mart. They prefer Wal-Mart to all other retailers. Immediately, every American jumps up and yells "That's not true! We HATE Wal-Mart! We can't STAND shopping at Wal-Mart! Literally any other store but Wal-Mart!" and then you go look at actual statistics to find that Wal-Mart (a) sells more overall, (b) sells more per capita, and (c) has more traffic per store than literally any other retailer in the US. On the average, Americans spend more at Wal-Mart than any other store, and Wal-Mart sells to more people than any other store. There is absolutely no rational metric by which Wal-Mart is anything other than the single most popular retailer in the US.

Why?

We don't actually know. Because nobody admits to liking Wal-Mart in the first place, so you can't even get a straight answer about why they shop there. Let alone anything resembling the truth. My roommate used to come home from Wal-Mart and say "now, I almost never shop at Wal-Mart" until I trotted out the calendar with a little tick-mark on every day he came home with something from Wal-Mart. Three times a week, on the average. And can you guess his response?

He said I must be mistaken. That can't be right. He doesn't shop at Wal-Mart every other day. He almost never shops at Wal-Mart.

Because most ignorance is willful.

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Posted 5/24/17

cdarklock wrote:


sundin13 wrote:

learning about other people can still be important and beneficial, even if it holds little practical value.


Subjectively, yes. It matters to me why my wife or girlfriend doesn't read, and if I know why, maybe I can leverage my influence with her to generate some interest in reading. Or maybe not. My wife refuses to read nonfiction, ever, which makes literally zero sense to me. Here is a book that can teach you a thing you want to know. "Oh, HELL no! I'mma read Twilight again, it's more fun!" Okay... first of all, one bad decision at a time, mmkay?

But when some guy at the bus stop doesn't read, I don't give a shit. That's what confuses me. People will say "hey, do you like this and that?" and I'll say "no" and they say "WHY NOT?!" and I'm like... I don't even know you. We met in the hallway four minutes ago and you're following me. I get that conventions are a good place to meet people, but this is not a good way to do it.

Kind of like when people start a thread and say they don't like this or that popular anime. How do they think this is going to end? "Hey, crowd of people who mostly enjoy this thing - I can't stand it, because of reasons!" It's one thing to join a conversation about it, but it's quite another to just announce out of the blue that you hate something.


For example, back to rap music, I often ask people "why do you dislike rap music".


For music, it's usually predictive: they don't like it because they're unused to the patterns and tropes of the genre, which is primarily because they haven't listened to enough of it. So when they hear the buildup happening, they don't know a DJ break is coming up, and when the stripped-down beat dissolves behind a wall of record scratching and sampled gunshots... they just go "WTF" and decide they don't like it.

Similarly, dubstep builds the same kind of tension, but stretches the buildup an extra few measures past the usual sixteen to increase that tension before the drop. That can make it hard to dance to if you don't know the song, which is actually intentional - it's the artists saying "stop dancing to songs you don't know." That's a common value system they hold in that community. Dancing isn't just "feel the groove" to them, but "know the song and add to it artistically."

(Also a musician, btw. )


I don't think we should push aside the importance of learning how other people experience things like books or music


But you don't. You just learn what they tell you. You never actually know how they experience anything from what they say. You have to monitor their behaviour.

For example, Americans love shopping at Wal-Mart. They prefer Wal-Mart to all other retailers. Immediately, every American jumps up and yells "That's not true! We HATE Wal-Mart! We can't STAND shopping at Wal-Mart! Literally any other store but Wal-Mart!" and then you go look at actual statistics to find that Wal-Mart (a) sells more overall, (b) sells more per capita, and (c) has more traffic per store than literally any other retailer in the US. On the average, Americans spend more at Wal-Mart than any other store, and Wal-Mart sells to more people than any other store. There is absolutely no rational metric by which Wal-Mart is anything other than the single most popular retailer in the US.

Why?

We don't actually know. Because nobody admits to liking Wal-Mart in the first place, so you can't even get a straight answer about why they shop there. Let alone anything resembling the truth. My roommate used to come home from Wal-Mart and say "now, I almost never shop at Wal-Mart" until I trotted out the calendar with a little tick-mark on every day he came home with something from Wal-Mart. Three times a week, on the average. And can you guess his response?

He said I must be mistaken. That can't be right. He doesn't shop at Wal-Mart every other day. He almost never shops at Wal-Mart.

Because most ignorance is willful.



I like to think that we forum-goers are a little closer than a stranger at a bus stop. I mean, why do we come here but to interact and chat and learn about each other? I don't think that if everyone had purely selfish motives a forum like this would work. It is our desire to be social which drives us here.

The same can be said about making controversial threads or posts. They allow us to challenge other people's view points, and have our view points challenged. We can learn more about ourselves, each other and anime in general. I remember one of the best conversations I've had on here was about Kill la Kill. A forumer who sadly isn't around anymore was arguing that its fan-service was exploitative. I don't believe it is. I think it has the most justified use of fan-service in pretty much any anime and it is largely in service of feminist themes. I was able to learn about the other forumer, understand their viewpoint and learn more about Kill la Kill and the different interpretations of its themes. It is important to be able to vocalize your reasons though, but maybe you are making a thread just to help get your thoughts in order. I've done that too (not a thread, but a post). There are plenty of times where I go on a rant right after watching a show and hope to hear other opinions to help sort out the mess in my head.

As for whether or not you can learn things about people by what they say, I think you can. You have to have a real conversation with them and not just throw an opinion out as you walk by, but I don't think that is much of a barrier.

I think Wal-Mart is a little different because it involves money moreso than tastes. Money complicates everything. However, when someone hears a song, that same dissonance rarely exists. What you think is usually pretty honest (in my experience anyways) unless you really go in with a heavily held bias, but then challenging that bias is even more important.
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Posted 5/24/17

TipsyMacScotchslurpen wrote:


Flying_Sea_Turtle wrote:
2. If you have a reading disability, How the hell do you get through daily life without knowing what the signs around you say?


Seriously? Screw you.

My brother is dyslexic, and it really does make reading difficult for him. He can beat his way through something and understand it just fine, but it takes a hundred times the mental work to do it than it does for a normal person who enjoys reading. He can read the road signs and most signs are designed to be recognizable without needing to be able to read in the first place. Also, it has nothing to do with level of intelligence, because he is above average intelligence. Basically, reading trips him up, and spelling can be difficult. I suspect that I have a very mild form of dyslexia myself, though I have come up with a lot of little tricks to be a good speller. I am probably a below-average-speed reader, though.

It would be like having arms that are so weak they can only lift a handful of rice and then being told you have to move a 100lb bag of it. You can poke a hole in the bag and move the whole thing one handful at a time, while a person who moves those bags all day long at work can just flip it up on their shoulder and plop it down again where it goes. Now, are you going to make it a habit of moving those bags of rice? I wouldn't.


I apologize if I deeply offended you.
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48 / M / Auburn, Washington
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Posted 5/24/17

sundin13 wrote:

I like to think that we forum-goers are a little closer than a stranger at a bus stop.


Why?

I don't even know what you look like. If we met on the street, I wouldn't know it. I don't know your name or where you live or what kind of work you do. All I know is "24 / M" and I have no real evidence that either half of that is true.

In what way am I closer to you than I am to a stranger at a bus stop?


I mean, why do we come here but to interact and chat and learn about each other?


Dick-pulling. "Mine's bigger than yours." There's a lot of that about.


It is our desire to be social which drives us here.


Look around the General Discussion forum. How many threads open with a post including words like "SJW" and "butthurt" and "cuck" there?

It's very clear that a certain crowd isn't welcome on these forums, and doesn't get to socialise here. If they try, a tornado of shrieking trolls will descend on the thread and turn it into a carnival of shitposting.

You know. To not interact or chat or learn anything at all. Because that's not why they're here.


As for whether or not you can learn things about people by what they say, I think you can.


Sure! They can tell you the truth, or you can compare what they said to the truth, and then you learn stuff. Even if they lied.

But when the truth is not available to you, there's no way to know they're lying. So you don't learn anything. You just believe something.


You have to have a real conversation with them


You can't do that without their consent. If someone doesn't want to have a real conversation with you, then you can't have one. And if they don't want you to know it's not a real conversation, having a bullshit conversation that looks like a real one is trivial.


I think Wal-Mart is a little different


Wal-Mart is just an example of a thing people lie about. Would you like me to use a different example of something people lie about? It's not like there's a shortage.
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