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Who Will Pay For The Border Wall?
Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17

eggrollsama wrote:

^^^ so you send me a link of a fucking Wikipedia article from over 11 years ago.
gtfo lol


I was actually trying to find out if any "walls" were made from the act, I ended up finding this image.



I'm pretty sure we are just getting second hand information from a Facebook meme. Especially since his post is almost verbatim from this image.
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Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17

KennethKenstar wrote:

*snips smug straw-manning*

.


You said:

There will never be a wall.

I pointed out that there already is.

Now you're adding in all sorts of bullshit that neither you nor I specified. But hey, way to kick the shit out of that straw man. He never saw it coming.
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Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17
hmmm okay, well...
Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17

karatecowboy wrote:


KennethKenstar wrote:

*snips smug straw-manning*

.


You said:

There will never be a wall.

I pointed out that there already is.

Now you're adding in all sorts of bullshit that neither you nor I specified. But hey, way to kick the shit out of that straw man. He never saw it coming.


You don't even know what a strawman is. I said you were trying to convince me a fence is a wall and you are doing exactly that right now.

Edit: My jokes suck and I haven't seen Wizard of Oz in decades.
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Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17

sundin13 wrote:


karatecowboy wrote:

Well, who payed for Obama's Border Wall?

That's right: OBAMA'S BORDER WALL

Back in 2006, then-senator Obama, Schumer, Reid, and Pelosi all voted in favor of building 700 miles of mixed wall and fence along the border.

Since then, most of it has been built.

Nobody has a problem with this.

Why? Has to do with that little letter before their last names "D" rather than "R".


Think about it this way.

Say you have a yard and you want to build a fence around it. So, you build a wooden picket fence around the yard. Then, a year later, you tear down that fence and put a chain-link fence in its place. Then a year later you put barbed wire over the chain link fence. Then a year later you install auto sentries on top of the fence. Then a year later, you dig a moat alongside the fence.

Now, lets apply your argument to this situation: You didn't complain when they built a picket fence, so why complain when they install auto sentries?

Do you see the difference? As you say, we already have a fence which focuses on the areas which it benefits most. On top of that, we have more knowledge now than we did 11 years ago. We know now that fences aren't really a cost effective (or effective in general) way of reducing illegal immigration. Continuing pushing the idea of "fences will save us" at this point is ignorant and a poor use of taxpayer money.


Truth be told: I'm in agreement with you about the effectiveness of barriers on the border. I'm been involved in sustainable immigration activism for a long time, and I'm happy to point out: most people who are here illegally actually come here legally, but then just overstay their visas. The situation was the same 11 years ago; we knew it wouldn't do so much to build the fencing and walls.

My take on a border wall/fence/whatever is that while it's a nice gesture, it's much better to go after the jobs magnet with things like E-Verify. The reason why I point out that Reid/Obama et al already built a bunch of wall is just to jam the whole partisan dickery.
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Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17
While I think we should be impartial to Obama's idea, it seems that the fence was hardly effective. Maybe it was because it was just a fence. However, the " Tu Quoque" argument accusation of bias does need to end. Yeah, a great deal of people probably judge more on Trump's conservative views, but specifically assuming it on anonymous forumers who criticize Trump over not acknowledging a deal over 10 years ago is a dumb and direct attack on the forumers credibility, rather then there their claims.

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Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17

eggrollsama wrote:

anyone can edit a wiki page smart one


I am pretty sure edit notices are only editable by the employees. Normal users can only get so much free reign. It is essentially the same argument with not deleting bank history.
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Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17

KennethKenstar wrote:


karatecowboy wrote:


KennethKenstar wrote:

*snips smug straw-manning*

.


You said:

There will never be a wall.

I pointed out that there already is.

Now you're adding in all sorts of bullshit that neither you nor I specified. But hey, way to kick the shit out of that straw man. He never saw it coming.


You don't even know what a strawman is. I said you were trying to convince me a fence is a wall and you are doing exactly that right now. That's not a strawman unless it turns out you have no heart, but I'd figure you more a tinman right now.


Oh OK well thank you for setting me straight. I thought I was trying to convince you that there is some 700 miles of physical barrier on the Southern border already, be it wall, fence, or a mixture ... and that wall vs fence is an insignificant detail not worth quibbling over. But, you have set me straight; truly, you know my own intent greater than I. TIL: I want to convince people that a fence is a wall, without even knowing it, regardless of the fact that it is not meaningful to me at all. KennethKenstar told me so.
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Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17
I'm surprised that there are still those who don't see that the wall thing was bullshit. That was like the biggest promise of Trump's campaign, the one he kept bringing up over and over and over and now over 100 days in office and we still haven't seen anything. I'm not expecting it to be fully erected already but it doesn't take a detective to realise that it's probably not happening at all with how there's been no plans, no schedule and nothing to even suggest that this is happening.
Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17
Kenneth did say this > There will never be a wall.- so umm your point?

But we already have a wall some areas of it need work hell yes.
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Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17

karatecowboy wrote:
My take on a border wall/fence/whatever is that while it's a nice gesture, it's much better to go after the jobs magnet with things like E-Verify. The reason why I point out that Reid/Obama et al already built a bunch of wall is just to jam the whole partisan dickery.


Yeah, but the problem with Trump's wall has always been the ludicrous scale of it. If he said, "lets spend a little bit of money to build a some more fences", no one would care. But that isn't what Trump proposed. Trump's proposal is a lot bigger and a lot more expensive than that. It is largely an irrelevant point to bring up the Secure Fence Act, because the problem was never "increased border security", the problem is specifically "Trump's wall", because it is an awful and expensive proposal.
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Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17

I am pretty sure edit notices are only editable by the employees. Normal users can only get so much free reign. It is essentially the same argument with not deleting bank history.


and I'm pretty sure, that you are pretty surest wrong because that pretty surest isn't the truth.
In one of my classes at school the teacher even edited the wiki page to show us how easy it is to change info and why he would not allow us to use it as a source.
so I'm pretty sure.
Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17

karatecowboy wrote:

Oh OK well thank you for setting me straight. I thought I was trying to convince you that there is some 700 miles of physical barrier on the Southern border already, be it wall, fence, or a mixture ... and that wall vs fence is an insignificant detail not worth quibbling over. But, you have set me straight; truly, you know my own intent greater than I. TIL: I want to convince people that a fence is a wall, without even knowing it, regardless of the fact that it is not meaningful to me at all. KennethKenstar told me so.


Gee, I'm just shocked you don't think the difference between wall and fence is significant. It's almost like you've reduced your political beliefs to hero worship and, with that, there will always be a convenient way for Trump to have not "actually" failed until you reach that breaking point where you feel betrayed by Trump even though he is a fraud and a conman.

Shocked.
Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17

PeripheralVisionary wrote:


eggrollsama wrote:

anyone can edit a wiki page smart one


I am pretty sure edit notices are only editable by the employees. Normal users can only get so much free reign. It is essentially the same argument with not deleting bank history.


Everyone can edit Wikipedia and even without accounts except on protected articles and times of high abuse.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbara_Bush

I just went ahead and edited the Barbara Bush article and replaced her picture with Darth Vader. But, the ease of changing things doesn't mean the information is bad or wrong and Wikipedia is said to be as accurate as several encyclopedias. In fact, my vandalism may be caught by the time you see this post.
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Posted 5/1/17 , edited 5/1/17

KennethKenstar wrote:


PeripheralVisionary wrote:


eggrollsama wrote:

anyone can edit a wiki page smart one


I am pretty sure edit notices are only editable by the employees. Normal users can only get so much free reign. It is essentially the same argument with not deleting bank history.


Everyone can edit Wikipedia and even without accounts except on protected articles and times of high abuse.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbara_Bush

I just went ahead and edited the Barbara Bush article and replaced her picture with Darth Vader. But, the ease of changing things doesn't mean the information is bad or wrong and Wikipedia is said to be as accurate as several encyclopedias. In fact, my vandalism may be caught by the time you see this post.


I meant the notices detailing the last edit time at least, if not where.
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