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Post Reply Having Acne or being Transexual will get you denied health coverage under Trumps new healthcare
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Posted 5/8/17

foraslan wrote:


gvblackmoon wrote:

I know drives me nuts when I hear someone say healthcare and what they are taking about is insurance.


It makes for a lot of misunderstandings, for sure.


gvblackmoon wrote:
Now a few years go by and you get cancer doesn't matter what type of cancer you are going to cost the insurance company money lots of it. So they go through your medical history they can do this since they have access to all your records. They see you had acne that required antibiotics to treat and failed to report it on the history form boom there goes your insurance.


I did wonder about this when I saw the article. Why is prior use of antibiotics to treat acne considered an issue?


gvblackmoon wrote:
So when someone says healthcare replace it with health insurance and it make more sense. This is what happens when health insurance is for profit.

This.


It isn't the fact that you had to have that level of treatment for acne it is the fact you failed to report it is what they are using the kick you off the insurance. So you had your tonsils out at age 3 that is a preexisting condition and could have been used against you. if you didn't report it correctly you could lose your insurance this was called rescission and was a very common practice back in the day. if you want to understand it better there is actually a fairly decent movie call the Rainmaker which shows how this was done and the lengths insurance companies will go to cut people off.

So yeah any preexisting condition that you fail to report when applying was grounds to kick you off your insurance and they didn't care what it was. All it takes is one thing you forget to put on the form and your insurance went goodbye. Didn't even take that back in the day you hit a life time cap and your insurance would kick you. High risk pools don't actually help with this because the pools are to small insurance works best when you have more people in the pool.
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Posted 5/8/17

AppleFart wrote:

Try getting auto insurance after you have a few accidents or a couple DUI's, I'm pretty sure those people have to pay a lot extra. Why should a health insurer have to charge someone with heart disease or a history of other severe medical issues the same premium as a healthy person?

I think that the President has said that there will be a high risk pool for pre-existing conditions will be partly subsidized to help out those who need help.

Our current health care system is collapsing and will leave everyone without insurance if it's not fixed. We can do nothing for another 8 years or make some changes. Trump can have his shot. He can't make it any worse at this point.

Hospital emergency rooms will never deny an patient emergency care because they have no insurance. Ever.


Yes it cost more because you screwed up you had control over that action you made the choice to go out drinking and driving or recklessly drive and getting into accidents. Things where you have control you pay the penalty. Cancer is not something you have control over diabetes is not something you have control over Alzheimer is not something you have control over. You appendix's blowing up is not something you have control over. You can minimize your risk at best for those things most you have zero control over.

Emergency rooms really that is your answer you know your earlier statement about how a rich man shouldn't have his money taken to pay for the poor man. That is what the emergency room does when the person can't pay for it everyone paid for it with higher premiums. You have no bloody clue as to what you are talking about you are spout talking points hoping no one actually understands the history of this subject.


qwueri 
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Posted 5/8/17 , edited 5/8/17

AppleFart wrote:

So we are supposed to spend trillions to keep people who contribute nothing to society alive? For what? Sorry, I'm not paying $1000 a month to keep some fat slob alive that can't leave his house without the assistance of a forklift. Nor will I pay to chop off some guys dick because he is feeling like a woman. If we have to have high risk pools paid for by the public, these people should be forced to eat properly, quit smoking, quit drinking, exercise and work for a living or lose coverage.

I'd rather that money be spent on the future well-being of children.


Either people buying insurance are paying for it or the cost gets passed onto the taxpayer. Or cripples the healthcare system through customers defaulting on bills. The cost doesn't go away.
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Posted 5/8/17

Ryulightorb wrote:

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/what-counts-pre-existing-condition-ahca-trump-obamacare-2017-5?r=US&IR=T

Seriously...how the fuck does that make any sense?
I'm really questioning how fucking stupid this man is.

If this is false and i have seen so many articles and sources to claim this as true and show enough evidence that it is please prove to me it's false because

Faith in humanity declining...
Most of the things in the list of banned things if not all of them should be impacted by healthcare not rejected.


Your OP makes my faith in humanity decline: if you actually read the article, it says that pre-existing conditions could have you declined OR pay more in premiums. Is there something unreasonable about this? It's a very normal thing; it's the nature of insurance. Going to a home insurance company and saying "my house already burned down" ... what would you expect? What would you do if you were running an insurance company? Seriously, stop and think about that.
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Posted 5/8/17

karatecowboy wrote:


Ryulightorb wrote:

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/what-counts-pre-existing-condition-ahca-trump-obamacare-2017-5?r=US&IR=T

Seriously...how the fuck does that make any sense?
I'm really questioning how fucking stupid this man is.

If this is false and i have seen so many articles and sources to claim this as true and show enough evidence that it is please prove to me it's false because

Faith in humanity declining...
Most of the things in the list of banned things if not all of them should be impacted by healthcare not rejected.


Your OP makes my faith in humanity decline: if you actually read the article, it says that pre-existing conditions could have you declined OR pay more in premiums. Is there something unreasonable about this? It's a very normal thing; it's the nature of insurance. Going to a home insurance company and saying "my house already burned down" ... what would you expect? What would you do if you were running an insurance company? Seriously, stop and think about that.


You are required by law to have home owners insurance for this types of problems or you don't get the loan. A child born with diabetes or an other of a dozen diseases has no choice. These are not the same it is a false equivalence the same with equating them to car insurance. I was using those as a means to explain how all insurance works since that is the same across the board weather or not you have a choice in the matter is either required by law and you can skip it in some cases when it comes to your life you can't.

What part of how insurance works do you people not understand and how inhuman are you? You know what is really fucking funny most of you ass hats that think like this claim to be christian really blows my mind when I hear people that think like this thump the bible and then turn around saying that the sick shouldn't be taken care of. which is it you follow the teachings of Christ or you don't can't have it both ways.

Want the problems with for profit insurance to go away move to a single payer system of Medicare for all and fix the problems with Medicare. The issue is the fact the companies get to tell you who lives and who dies the real death panels this is how it was before Obamacare. No really insurance companies have kills thousands by denying coverage. Want to go back to that they have a more complete picture of you health issues now and will be more than happy to see you die if you get something that will cost them to much money. Or you can cut the greedy bastard out of the mix and actually get real coverage that doesn't cost much. Your choice I know which one i would make.
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Posted 5/8/17

AppleFart wrote:

So we are supposed to spend trillions to keep people who contribute nothing to society alive? For what? Sorry, I'm not paying $1000 a month to keep some fat slob alive that can't leave his house without the assistance of a forklift. Nor will I pay to chop off some guys dick because he is feeling like a woman. If we have to have high risk pools paid for by the public, these people should be forced to eat properly, quit smoking, quit drinking, exercise and work for a living or lose coverage.

I'd rather that money be spent on the future well-being of children.


That is call civic responsibility chum you agree to it by living in the country you are in. Don't want it move some place where there isn't a society just be ready for the fact you can't survive there. I would suggest a nice third world country like Afghanistan. Again not pleasant to live there but hey you are only responsible for yourself.
Vinu64 
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Posted 5/8/17
Warning If you are a Liberal and are easily offended don't read it might be to much for you to handle. (Includes Facts)

If you believe that what that article says is true, you got problems. Let me explain.
First of all the hook title has the word "acne" in it. Now as far as I know he are talking about Healthcare right? Acne is stimulated by hygienic properties or the lack there of. Not only that but, it is also a VERY common skin condition an estimated 80 percent of all people between the ages of 11 and 30 have acne outbreaks at some point. Meaning that this would NEVER make it through congress. This is a thing that DATA EXPUNGED DUE TO FLAME-BAIT I mean some people do in our society. Keep that in mind next time you're reading.


Sources:
https://www.niams.nih.gov/health_info/Acne/acne_ff.asp (.gov so a GOVERNMENT Site)
https://g.co/kgs/PR5jYi (google database)
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Posted 5/8/17

gvblackmoon wrote:


karatecowboy wrote:


Ryulightorb wrote:

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/what-counts-pre-existing-condition-ahca-trump-obamacare-2017-5?r=US&IR=T

Seriously...how the fuck does that make any sense?
I'm really questioning how fucking stupid this man is.

If this is false and i have seen so many articles and sources to claim this as true and show enough evidence that it is please prove to me it's false because

Faith in humanity declining...
Most of the things in the list of banned things if not all of them should be impacted by healthcare not rejected.


Your OP makes my faith in humanity decline: if you actually read the article, it says that pre-existing conditions could have you declined OR pay more in premiums. Is there something unreasonable about this? It's a very normal thing; it's the nature of insurance. Going to a home insurance company and saying "my house already burned down" ... what would you expect? What would you do if you were running an insurance company? Seriously, stop and think about that.


You are required by law to have home owners insurance for this types of problems or you don't get the loan. A child born with diabetes or an other of a dozen diseases has no choice. These are not the same it is a false equivalence the same with equating them to car insurance. I was using those as a means to explain how all insurance works since that is the same across the board weather or not you have a choice in the matter is either required by law and you can skip it in some cases when it comes to your life you can't.

What part of how insurance works do you people not understand and how inhuman are you? You know what is really fucking funny most of you ass hats that think like this claim to be christian really blows my mind when I hear people that think like this thump the bible and then turn around saying that the sick shouldn't be taken care of. which is it you follow the teachings of Christ or you don't can't have it both ways.

Want the problems with for profit insurance to go away move to a single payer system of Medicare for all and fix the problems with Medicare. The issue is the fact the companies get to tell you who lives and who dies the real death panels this is how it was before Obamacare. No really insurance companies have kills thousands by denying coverage. Want to go back to that they have a more complete picture of you health issues now and will be more than happy to see you die if you get something that will cost them to much money. Or you can cut the greedy bastard out of the mix and actually get real coverage that doesn't cost much. Your choice I know which one i would make.

Cool. I never said home insurance is exactly the same as medical insurance, rather just pointing out something similar to reinforce a point about how insurance works. So yeah the false equivalence comes in you not understanding my point.

There is a lot on life that is unfair. Giving more power to the government is not a good idea. The nature of government is to corrupt people, and I want that nice and far away from my health. You bring up a good point about Medicare though. They've proven they can't handle even that, so government rationed care for all is out of the question
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Posted 5/8/17 , edited 5/8/17

I've got it and I don't see why healthcare should pay for it? There isn't one cure and what helps one person doesnt do shit for another. What happens when you have acne and the "approved" method doesnt work for you but a non-approved method works. Your paying for it but getting no benefits.

I'll stick with buying the medicine myself. Actually what would help more than anything is to release some of the medicine from behind the doctor paywall and allow big boxmart to carry it. Then it will get dirt cheap.
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☆Land of sweets☆
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Posted 5/8/17

Vinu64 wrote:
(Includes Facts)
...
[claim] Acne is stimulated by hygienic properties or the lack there of.

Acne has several causes, one of which is due to poor hygiene. But hygiene alone is not the only cause:



Certain medicines, such as corticosteroids or lithium, can cause acne to develop.
...
Sometimes newborns have acne because their mothers pass hormones to them just before delivery. Acne can also appear when the stress of birth causes the baby's body to release hormones on its own.
...
A few conditions of the endocrine system, such as polycystic ovary syndrome and Cushing's syndrome, can lead to outbreaks of acne.

source


Includes Facts

but apparently not all the facts.

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Hoosierville
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Posted 5/8/17

namealreadytaken wrote:


Vinu64 wrote:
(Includes Facts)
...
[claim] Acne is stimulated by hygienic properties or the lack there of.

Acne has several causes, one of which is due to poor hygiene. But hygiene alone is not the only cause:



Certain medicines, such as corticosteroids or lithium, can cause acne to develop.
...
Sometimes newborns have acne because their mothers pass hormones to them just before delivery. Acne can also appear when the stress of birth causes the baby's body to release hormones on its own.
...
A few conditions of the endocrine system, such as polycystic ovary syndrome and Cushing's syndrome, can lead to outbreaks of acne.

source


Includes Facts

but apparently not all the facts.



Fun fact. Genetic acne is caused by oily skin. Oily skin helps slow the aging of your skin. If you can manage to keep the acne under control you can look younger for decades longer than others. Source: my genetics.
Vinu64 
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Posted 5/8/17
Thanks for the reply! However, I never claimed that it was the only cause I said it was "stimulated".

Certain medicines, such as corticosteroids or lithium, can cause acne to develop.
...
Sometimes newborns have acne because their mothers pass hormones to them just before delivery. Acne can also appear when the stress of birth causes the baby's body to release hormones on its own.
...
A few conditions of the endocrine system, such as polycystic ovary syndrome and Cushing's syndrome, can lead to outbreaks of acne.

Also you mention things such as "plocystic ovary syndrome" and " Cushing's syndrome" which do not cause acne but induce it meaning that it is a side-effect and not a direct cause.

So I agree while poor hygiene is not the "stimulant" for acne what you mentioned isn't completely relevant to what I'm trying to explain.
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Posted 5/9/17 , edited 5/9/17

uncletim wrote:


Trump health care the rich get richer and the poor just die




the rich getting richer way before Trump was president ...give the credits to Obama



Inside Job (2010)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1645089/

there were those who died or committed suicide when their houses were foreclosed by the banks..




anyway.. where's the original link to the bill ? ? can someone point to the acne and transsexual section on the bill ?


i would like to read from the original link of the bill instead of some click bait type article

there are plenty of click bait articles from both side.. like this one

The Guy Who Lied About Obamacare Allowing You To Keep Your Doctor Now Blames Trump For Obamcare’s Failures
http://www.dailywire.com/news/16188/guy-who-lied-about-obamacare-allowing-you-keep-elliott-hamilton


after the infamous " you can keep your doctor" claim by Obama and having to sign up with a new insurance plan every year for the past 4-5 years .. i'm skeptical about all these health plans/laws by these politicians..


give me the facts!! the original link to the bill we are talking about ??

there should be a page similar to this for my state if the citizens would like to read about the proposed bills
http://www.azleg.gov/bills/

like most bills.. and this is a BIG IF.. it turns into a law.. i'm sure they will remove quite a few things from the bill..

i wish people would not just blindly picking sides.. they are both pieces of shit in my opinion.. trump or obama

when people are receiving things for free or only have to pay very little.. they will praise that person/law to no end.. but when they got those freebies taken away.. they will whine like a 5 year old

in the end it's just all about self interest that we are picking sides
mxdan 
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Posted 5/9/17 , edited 5/9/17

dulun18 wrote:



the rich getting richer way before Trump was president ...give the credits to Obama


Or, you know, just getting richer cause that's what they tend to do.

-facepalm-
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Posted 5/9/17 , edited 5/9/17

dulun18 wrote:
the rich getting richer way before Trump was president ...give the credits to Obama


You might wanna total up the net worth of Trump's administration. >.>




dulun18 wrote:
anyway.. where's the original link to the bill ? ? can someone point to the acne and transsexual section on the bill ?


https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/house-bill/1628/text?q=%7B%22search%22%3A%5B%22H.R.+1628%22%5D%7D&r=1

There is no strict list of pre-existing conditions but rather standards of what a pre-existing condition is. What standard an insurance company uses varies from state to state, company to company. The problem is that an insurance company can declare acne a pre-existing condition and use that to raise your premiums under Trumpcare.

Trumpcare does not allow insurance companies to deny people based on pre-existing conditions ( or rather, it doesn't now after amendments ) but it removes Obamacare's protections on cost caps. Meaning insurance companies under Trumpcare can charge whatever they like based on the pre-existing conditions they declare you have.

This is the bait and switch bullshit the GOP is using to say the bill covers pre-existing conditions. It technically does maintain access for people with pre-existing conditions but removes the protections that prevented insurance companies from jerking around people with pre-existing conditions. It technically maintains "access" but removes "affordability" if that makes sense.

Much like you technically have "access" to a brand new Ferrari because you could technically buy it. Whether or not you actually have the money to do so is a different matter.



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Posted 5/9/17

Ryulightorb wrote:

https://www.businessinsider.com.au/what-counts-pre-existing-condition-ahca-trump-obamacare-2017-5?r=US&IR=T

Seriously...how the fuck does that make any sense?
I'm really questioning how fucking stupid this man is.

If this is false and i have seen so many articles and sources to claim this as true and show enough evidence that it is please prove to me it's false because

Faith in humanity declining...
Most of the things in the list of banned things if not all of them should be impacted by healthcare not rejected.



Sounds rough
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